List Mgmt. 2024 List Management discussion

[Tom14]

naughton is a horrible set shot.

i think his pressure for a tall isnt bad honestly.

Great contested mark and an underrated ground level player. Good field kick too.

The goalkicking is brutal though.

 

[Tom14]

Great contested mark and an underrated ground level player. Good field kick too.

The goalkicking is brutal though.

If Naughton ever got his goalkicking in order though... has had multiple seasons where he's had just under or above 4 shots per game.

Every season Joe played for us was around that mark (well above it the last two years). I miss Joey

 

[Johnny Bananas]

But think people are incorrect when they hope that Naughton could be got for cheap - clubs are so starved for key forwards that even if the dogs wanted him to go (which they don't) he's not going for less than two late first rounders.

Perhaps you're right when it comes to the demand for KPFs. I just can't imagine how the Bulldogs will manage to keep all these KPFs they have coming out of their ears. Even if they find space for all of them by moving one back (probably Naughton), so much of their cap will be put into the one position that they're going to be paying their midfielders peanuts. Something will have to give at some point. But perhaps not at the right time or price to benefit us.

 

[Tom14]

Perhaps you're right when it comes to the demand for KPFs. I just can't imagine how the Bulldogs will manage to keep all these KPFs they have coming out of their ears. Even if they find space for all of them by moving one back (probably Naughton), so much of their cap will be put into the one position that they're going to be paying their midfielders peanuts. Something will have to give at some point. But perhaps not at the right time or price to benefit us.

If bevo stays then all their money goes to the key forwards, Bont, ed richards and Sanders. He'll play 14 scubs from the VFL to fill out the team and wonder why they finish outside top 4 again.

 

[Elixuh]

I’m also not sold on the headband or astronaught gimmicks. I don’t think we need those distractions.

 

[Lace Out]

A ton of naught for mine.Pass.

Looked like anything first 2 years but now we know.

 

[Tom14]

I’m also not sold on the headband or astronaught gimmicks. I don’t think we need those distractions.

I agree but would 100% backflip if he ended up here. He seems weird enough to be a good vibes based add.

My watch with Allen is that he's clearly not weird enough to replace Joe. The man would probably buy property in Pullenvale rather than commute from NSW if he came to us.

 

[Section 5]

I am not that keen on Allen or Lewis and i doubt Naughton is going anywhere.
Unless we lose a decent player, we won't have draft capital either.
Season 2026 is a long way off.
At some stage we may have to pass on a highly rated academy player to fill a void on our list.

Let's see how we go with Hipwood, Morris, Day, Smith, Doedee, Gardiner, Lloyd, Ryan, Gallop

 

[Viceregal]

When people mention Joe for 2026, what is the mechanism that would be used to get him on the list?

 

[Clarkythelion]

TDK isn't a forward though

Forward and can Ruck or a Ruck that can play Forward.

 

[dlanod]

When people mention Joe for 2026, what is the mechanism that would be used to get him on the list?

A hovercraft most likely.

 

[LongLion]

His career average is at 52% for goal kicking.
A good set shot is not something I have ever associated with Naughton.
Good contested mark, I will give you that.
But I personally think Bevo needs to bite the bullet and put him back.

Naughton does not want to play back. Sees himself as a forward. Bevo might lose him if he plays him back. Good idea though. What do you reckon Bevo?

 

[dlanod]

Naughton does not want to play back. Sees himself as a forward. Bevo might lose him if he plays him back. Good idea though. What do you reckon Bevo?

Bevo: "That's my theme song!"

 

[mpal6]

I am not that keen on Allen or Lewis and i doubt Naughton is going anywhere.
Unless we lose a decent player, we won't have draft capital either.
Season 2026 is a long way off.
At some stage we may have to pass on a highly rated academy player to fill a void on our list.

Let's see how we go with Hipwood, Morris, Day, Smith, Doedee, Gardiner, Lloyd, Ryan, Gallop

By end of 2025 we'll hopefully be flush with options between Lloyd and Gallop.

 

[Perrip]

Gettable today:

• Twomey reckons Levi is a certainty to play OR/Rd. 1 if he recovers from his shoulder surgery alright.
• Brandon Starcevic is one of the biggest FAs next year. Twomey didn't specifically say anything, but mentioned him as one of the contract stories for next year.
• Who the Lions get as a key fwd will also be one of the major storylines of next year. Lions couldn't get a key fwd this year because of matching bids/Daniher retiring, but they will have time next year to attract a player. "Giving the Lions time is one of the most dangerous things in footy."
• "Not many FAs next year, so keep an eye on the contracted players." "If Sam Darcy goes bananas next year, will the Lions come knocking for JUH?"

 

[Section 5]

Out with the old: How much experience has your club lost?

Check out how many games of experience your club has lost heading into the 2025 campaign

www.afl.com.au

 

[mpal6]

Gettable today:

• Twomey reckons Levi is a certainty to play OR/Rd. 1 if he recovers from his shoulder surgery alright.
• Brandon Starcevic is one of the biggest FAs next year. Twomey didn't specifically say anything, but mentioned him as one of the contract stories for next year.
• Who the Lions get as a key fwd will also be one of the major storylines of next year. Lions couldn't get a key fwd this year because of matching bids/Daniher retiring, but they will have time next year to attract a player. "Giving the Lions time is one of the most dangerous things in footy."
• "Not many FAs next year, so keep an eye on the contracted players." "If Sam Darcy goes bananas next year, will the Lions come knocking for JUH?"

Jamarra always feels like the next Buddy for Sydney. Expecting him to move to Harbour city as part of next contract.

Sydney didn't even explore landing a Key Forward this year via draft or trade.

 

[twhowler]

Been mulling over a couple of things.

1. Getting a key forward will be hard. I was trying to think of those who have RECENTLY moved clubs who were the club's best key forward. Daniher and Lynch came to mind - both from struggling clubs and players who had been there for a while very keen for a move. Both free agents giving good compo to clubs. Jeremy Cameron similar story although Giants were a more solid club. Noteworthy that 2/3 were from the 2 smallest clubs to 2 of the bigger ones.

I was trying to think of others but struggling. McStay obviously but left as a 2nd / third best key tall. Go back a while to Franklin (and look what it took him to leave!) and Dixon (another from the small suns).

I am sure i have forgotten some but it says to me it's very hard to land a gun key forward. They are so rare that they are usually overpaid at the club they are at, hence it's hard for them to shift. So we would have to pay up big AND hope someone wants to leave for success AND probably make it a free agent. We also don't have that advantage or a Richmond or Collingwood or Geelong in offering off-field cash. We can offer the leave the fishbowl carrot which was a huge part of Joe coming.

2. I have previously been very focused on 30+ players - as in gee we don't want too many of them. I am starting to think the bigger issue is having too FEW of them.

Thinking of our crew from 2024:
Neale - awesome year, finals player of the year, should have won norm smith
Daniher - leading goalkicker, incredible semi, sneaky good granny
Cameron - not his best year but still took the best small defender and took his team-work to a new level. Crucial in the Prelim late
Oscar / Fort - Oscar had his best year, Darcy able to step up in the granny despite his lack of afl a big part of us winning
Lester - career best year, awesome last 2 finals
Zorko - AA year, turned back the clock, even in his poor semi kicks 2 goals by just attacking and refusing to give up
Lyons - fell further off the cliff
Linc - knee injury, was playing well before that

Looking at that cohort there is no way we get near the flag without them. Looking at Collingwood and Geelong the previous two years tells a similar story.

There is clearly a danger in having too many oldies - the main one is too many of them of them falling off the cliff at once. So you need to avoid carrying too many, and you obviously need enough of a balance to be bringing through younger players.

But when i see lists of the clubs with the most 30yos stating they are about to fall off the cliff, or a list with the best under 25s, i am somewhat skeptical. To me in the modern game, 30yo is still peak age - an age at which players can deliver consistency and have not yet slowed down. John Longmire retired at 28yo because he was beaten up! Doesn't really happen any more.

I would think it's more about how many 30yo do you have that are crucial to your side who might go downhill quickly?

We have some risk in that area but i think enough depth in each position

Neale - no sign of slowing down but let's see how the foot goes - plenty of gun mids coming through
Cameron - could be a big drop off i think BUT might have just had a down year off no pre season - again plenty of good smalls
Linc - no guarantee of anything coming off a knee, again plenty of smalls already
Zorko - probably our biggest risk given Kiddy is an unknown. Has to slow down one day! Could gun it again or his body could pack it in
Oscar / Fort - Both had delayed starts to the highest level so should be good for another year or two at least
Day - break glass

 

[blueiris]

Gettable today:

• Twomey reckons Levi is a certainty to play OR/Rd. 1 if he recovers from his shoulder surgery alright.
• Brandon Starcevic is one of the biggest FAs next year. Twomey didn't specifically say anything, but mentioned him as one of the contract stories for next year.
• Who the Lions get as a key fwd will also be one of the major storylines of next year. Lions couldn't get a key fwd this year because of matching bids/Daniher retiring, but they will have time next year to attract a player. "Giving the Lions time is one of the most dangerous things in footy."
• "Not many FAs next year, so keep an eye on the contracted players." "If Sam Darcy goes bananas next year, will the Lions come knocking for JUH?"

Great to see Twomey has My boy Hagan linked to the Lions

 

[Bucking Beads]

Jamara is happening

 

[mpal6]

Been mulling over a couple of things.

1. Getting a key forward will be hard. I was trying to think of those who have RECENTLY moved clubs who were the club's best key forward. Daniher and Lynch came to mind - both from struggling clubs and players who had been there for a while very keen for a move. Both free agents giving good compo to clubs. Jeremy Cameron similar story although Giants were a more solid club. Noteworthy that 2/3 were from the 2 smallest clubs to 2 of the bigger ones.

I was trying to think of others but struggling. McStay obviously but left as a 2nd / third best key tall. Go back a while to Franklin (and look what it took him to leave!) and Dixon (another from the small suns).

I am sure i have forgotten some but it says to me it's very hard to land a gun key forward. They are so rare that they are usually overpaid at the club they are at, hence it's hard for them to shift. So we would have to pay up big AND hope someone wants to leave for success AND probably make it a free agent. We also don't have that advantage or a Richmond or Collingwood or Geelong in offering off-field cash. We can offer the leave the fishbowl carrot which was a huge part of Joe coming.

2. I have previously been very focused on 30+ players - as in gee we don't want too many of them. I am starting to think the bigger issue is having too FEW of them.

Thinking of our crew from 2024:
Neale - awesome year, finals player of the year, should have won norm smith
Daniher - leading goalkicker, incredible semi, sneaky good granny
Cameron - not his best year but still took the best small defender and took his team-work to a new level. Crucial in the Prelim late
Oscar / Fort - Oscar had his best year, Darcy able to step up in the granny despite his lack of afl a big part of us winning
Lester - career best year, awesome last 2 finals
Zorko - AA year, turned back the clock, even in his poor semi kicks 2 goals by just attacking and refusing to give up
Lyons - fell further off the cliff
Linc - knee injury, was playing well before that

Looking at that cohort there is no way we get near the flag without them. Looking at Collingwood and Geelong the previous two years tells a similar story.

There is clearly a danger in having too many oldies - the main one is too many of them of them falling off the cliff at once. So you need to avoid carrying too many, and you obviously need enough of a balance to be bringing through younger players.

But when i see lists of the clubs with the most 30yos stating they are about to fall off the cliff, or a list with the best under 25s, i am somewhat skeptical. To me in the modern game, 30yo is still peak age - an age at which players can deliver consistency and have not yet slowed down. John Longmire retired at 28yo because he was beaten up! Doesn't really happen any more.

I would think it's more about how many 30yo do you have that are crucial to your side who might go downhill quickly?

We have some risk in that area but i think enough depth in each position

Neale - no sign of slowing down but let's see how the foot goes - plenty of gun mids coming through
Cameron - could be a big drop off i think BUT might have just had a down year off no pre season - again plenty of good smalls
Linc - no guarantee of anything coming off a knee, again plenty of smalls already
Zorko - probably our biggest risk given Kiddy is an unknown. Has to slow down one day! Could gun it again or his body could pack it in
Oscar / Fort - Both had delayed starts to the highest level so should be good for another year or two at least
Day - break glass

I think midfield is being replenished quickly and I was shocked at the level Ashcroft reached in finals. He was outdoing Neale and was pretty much our "follow me boys" leader in GWS final and Grand final. We'll have 2 Ashcrofts running around next year is an amazing feeling.

My biggest worry is small forward. Just like Gun KPF, we lucked out with Charlie wanting to come here and produce consistent 50+ goal seasons year after year. It's hard to replicate and Kai Lohmann could potentially do it, but takes a lot to maintain the level that Charlie did for us.

Henry Smith has to play next year and become our primary ruck by second half of the season. I believe Big O will do a half decent job playing deep forward/third tall ruck.

 

[buttermuffs]

I have it on good authority that I would enjoy getting JUH.


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[wantok]

I think midfield is being replenished quickly and I was shocked at the level Ashcroft reached in finals. He was outdoing Neale and was pretty much our "follow me boys" leader in GWS final and Grand final. We'll have 2 Ashcrofts running around next year is amazing feeling.

My biggest worry is small forward. Just like Gun KPF, we lucked out with Charlie wanting to come here and produce consistent 50+ goal seasons year after year. It's hard to replicate and Kai Lohmann could potentially do it, but takes a lot to maintain the level that Charlie did for us.

Henry Smith has to play next year and become our primary ruck by second half of the season. I believe Big O will do a half decent job playing deep forward/third tall ruck.

Can Henry Smith step into the Joe role? I believe he's got "it" and just needs time and building confidence. (I didn't think that watching his debut but 2nd game showed some nice moments). I'll trust Max Gawn who said when interviewed before the Granny. " Henry Smith,he's not ready for the Grannie but..he's the next big thing!"

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[Perrip]

Can Henry Smith step into the Joe role? I believe he's got "it" and just needs time and building confidence. (I didn't think that watching his debut but 2nd game showed some nice moments). I'll trust Max Gawn who said when interviewed before the Granny. " Henry Smith,he's not ready for the Grannie but..he's the next big thing!"

I'd have him as the eventual Big O replacement. When he did play at AFL level and replaced Oscar in the ruck, when Oscar was on the bench, he was significantly better than purely as a forward

 

[Saucery]

I think midfield is being replenished quickly and I was shocked at the level Ashcroft reached in finals. He was outdoing Neale and was pretty much our "follow me boys" leader in GWS final and Grand final. We'll have 2 Ashcrofts running around next year is an amazing feeling.

My biggest worry is small forward. Just like Gun KPF, we lucked out with Charlie wanting to come here and produce consistent 50+ goal seasons year after year. It's hard to replicate and Kai Lohmann could potentially do it, but takes a lot to maintain the level that Charlie did for us.

Henry Smith has to play next year and become our primary ruck by second half of the season. I believe Big O will do a half decent job playing deep forward/third tall ruck.

One of the things I hope to see next year is Linc return as the forward line general, mustering the troops and being the defensive small, allowing Charlie to go back to being less accountable but more creative. Charlie did a great job of taking on the defensive/mentoring roll in Linc's absence but let's face it, it affected his output. Theres no reason why Charlie can't return to his elusive, attacking best and drive back lines mad trying to deal with him.