List Mgmt. 2024 List Management thread - Trade Targets

[Docker82]

We started with 6, traded it to port for 11 and 19 then used those two picks to get Lobb and 14 from GWS iirc.

And two picks in 40s that we used to upgrade to a top 30 pick.

We basically downgraded pick 11 to pick 14 and pick 19 to pick 30 for Lobb who was okay at worst and then was traded for two second rounders.

He’s not likeable as a human being but he gave us decent service and the trade was decent.

 

[Bud]

I've heard a few times we should target a quality small forward, are there any that realistically available? its to early to read into this years draft crop but all the top picks seem to be midfielders at this stage

What about Zac bailey from the lions..clever forward with excellent defensive skills.. one of the lions best tonight and in the GF against the pies

 

[more_of_bito]

Who says he will kick 400?

It was in the quote I responded to. Go read again

 

[Dockeroo]

No we didn’t. We used the pick 6 from Neale to draft hogan. What were you watching? The other pick we used on lobb.

That Lobb trade was actually awful but it still looks ok in hindsight, on paper that it.
In reality it was a disastrous trade for the following reasons:

• everyone knew in Sept that year that 2018 was a superdraft. The entire AFL industry was salivating over the top 7 players in the draft who had gone out on their own as bonafide guns into a bracket that was rated well ahead of anything we normally see in the draft. Walsh, King x 2, Rozee, lukocius, Rankine and Bailey Smith were the 7 players in question. Most draft watchers felt any of the 7 would be a number one pick most other years.
• we had pick 6, brisbane had pick 5 and wanted Lachie Neale.
• therefore we effectively had the rights to two of the 7 players at the start of trade week. What a position to find yourself in.
• I can accept using one of the two picks on Hogan but to leave without using either of them was negligent.
• the problem was we’d committed to Lobb who was always a B grader at best. A second round pick was plenty for Lobb but we’d given that away the year before to get Wilson or someone across (another C grader)
• now for the most annoying part. Port Adelaide made the deal of the century to get one of our two golden tickets, all because of Rory Lobb and the fact we had committed to him. We split pick 6 with port, for a bag of chips in hindsight.

PORT ADELAIDE has completed an exchange of draft picks with Fremantle which will see it move up the order and have two picks inside the top 10.

The Power will receive the Dockers’ first-round pick, currently pick 6, and a future third-round selection in exchange for its current picks 11, 23, 30 and 49.

Port Adelaide list manager Jason Cripps says the trade strengthens the club’s position in the 2018 AFL National Draft and gives it an extra selection next year.

“Our objective was to improve our position in this draft, in particular the top end as we believe it to be the strongest group seen for many years,” he said.

Lobb. Rory bloody Lobb. The definition of mediocre and average and we had to split one of the most valuable draft assets in several years because a C grade key forward wanted to come to us.
Aaaagh still makes me ill. We gave away Conor Rozee because Rory Lobb fluttered his eyelids at us.

 

[go_the_dockers]

No we didn’t. We used the pick 6 from Neale to draft hogan. What were you watching? The other pick we used on lobb.

We traded pick 6 to Port for 11 and 23, 39 and change

Brisbane traded pick 5 for pick 6 and 25ish with Port
We traded pick 6, 23 for hogan

We swapped 11 and 17 for 14 and lobb.

All off memory, a few picks are off but top 10 are right.

 

[go_the_dockers]

That Lobb trade was actually awful but it still looks ok in hindsight, on paper that it.
In reality it was a disastrous trade for the following reasons:

• everyone knew in Sept that year that 2018 was a superdraft. The entire AFL industry was salivating over the top 7 players in the draft who had gone out on their own as bonafide guns into a bracket that was rated well ahead of anything we normally see in the draft. Walsh, King x 2, Rozee, lukocius, Rankine and Bailey Smith were the 7 players in question. Most draft watchers felt any of the 7 would be a number one pick most other years.
• we had pick 6, brisbane had pick 5 and wanted Lachie Neale.
• therefore we effectively had the rights to two of the 7 players at the start of trade week. What a position to find yourself in.
• I can accept using one of the two picks on Hogan but to leave without using either of them was negligent.
• the problem was we’d committed to Lobb who was always a B grader at best. A second round pick was plenty for Lobb but we’d given that away the year before to get Wilson or someone across (another C grader)
• now for the most annoying part. Port Adelaide made the deal of the century to get one of our two golden tickets, all because of Rory Lobb and the fact we had committed to him. We split pick 6 with port, for a bag of chips in hindsight.

PORT ADELAIDE has completed an exchange of draft picks with Fremantle which will see it move up the order and have two picks inside the top 10.

The Power will receive the Dockers’ first-round pick, currently pick 6, and a future third-round selection in exchange for its current picks 11, 23, 30 and 49.

Port Adelaide list manager Jason Cripps says the trade strengthens the club’s position in the 2018 AFL National Draft and gives it an extra selection next year.

“Our objective was to improve our position in this draft, in particular the top end as we believe it to be the strongest group seen for many years,” he said.

Lobb. Rory bloody Lobb. The definition of mediocre and average and we had to split one of the most valuable draft assets in several years because a C grade key forward wanted to come to us.
Aaaagh still makes me ill. We gave away Conor Rozee because Rory Lobb fluttered his eyelids at us.

Constantly trading future picks hurt us.

Players like Wilson were hopeless for a rebuilding side.

The mistake was not committing to a rebuild

 

[Carnthedockers]

Constantly trading future picks hurt us.

Players like Wilson were hopeless for a rebuilding side.

The mistake was not committing to a rebuild

Everything is easy in hindsight. You need to put some experience around the youth. Plus the pool of players WA clubs can attract is smaller. Look at WC, even Devon Robertson wouldn’t come.

 

[blue shark]

Constantly trading future picks hurt us.

Players like Wilson were hopeless for a rebuilding side.

The mistake was not committing to a rebuild

Really depends on the talent of that year and your position in the draft.
The 2025 draft long forecast is that there are more west Aussies than in 2024 in
the top 40.
So maybe this year we will try to add some experience rather than potential?
Taj Longmuir is the romantic pick for 2025, it’s a shame Troy didn’t play more
games with us.

As some one else brought up that super draft, well that’s twice now we have
missed generational players by being too clever.
When the talk is the top ten are that good maybe for once we can not trade it
away?

Hodge, Judd, even Rozee are going to be legends of the AFL. The trades or
the one draft hand we keep are lucky to play 100 games for us
That’s a poor return and you sometimes wonder if we had anyone with an eye
for talent?

Walls seems to be a winner and the days of Pitt over Darling appear over.
This club has had some serious issues with injuries derailing players so no
wonder we are forever rebuilding.

 

[freodog]

Everything is easy in hindsight. You need to put some experience around the youth. Plus the pool of players WA clubs can attract is smaller. Look at WC, even Devon Robertson wouldn’t come.

Robertson will go to WC in the future

 

[go_the_dockers]

Really depends on the talent of that year and your position in the draft.
The 2025 draft long forecast is that there are more west Aussies than in 2024 in
the top 40.
So maybe this year we will try to add some experience rather than potential?
Taj Longmuir is the romantic pick for 2025, it’s a shame Troy didn’t play more
games with us.

I don't mind if we trade 1 1st round this year, into a future pick if we can upgrade it e.g. swap collingwoods for carltons future 1st.

I think we have more holes on our list than we appreciate, and have less top end talent than we need to have a sustained top 4 run.

 

[Dockeroo]

As some one else brought up that super draft, well that’s twice now we have
missed generational players by being too clever.
When the talk is the top ten are that good maybe for once we can not trade it
away?

Hodge, Judd, even Rozee are going to be legends of the AFL. The trades or
the one draft hand we keep are lucky to play 100 games for us
That’s a poor return and you sometimes wonder if we had anyone with an eye
for talent?

That’s exactly right. Every man and his dog knew that 2018 draft Top 10 had some of the most valuable draft assets ever in the last 15 years or so and we some how messed them up.

Port Adelaide should have that pick swap that we did with them to give them Rozee framed on the wall at Alberton.

I could appreciate what we were trying to do with hogan. At least he was an A grade talent. We rolled the dice and it didn’t work but you could at least see the guy was a top player when his head was right and he could have made a huge difference to our forward line.
Lobb on the other hand was plodder and it’s pretty unforgivable really that a pick used to draft a generational player and possible future hall of famer was split up so we could trade in… Rory Lobb.
I’d say walls was fuming then as he would have known better than anyone the talent that was available then.

 

[WilloTree]

That Lobb trade was actually awful but it still looks ok in hindsight, on paper that it.
In reality it was a disastrous trade for the following reasons:

• everyone knew in Sept that year that 2018 was a superdraft. The entire AFL industry was salivating over the top 7 players in the draft who had gone out on their own as bonafide guns into a bracket that was rated well ahead of anything we normally see in the draft. Walsh, King x 2, Rozee, lukocius, Rankine and Bailey Smith were the 7 players in question. Most draft watchers felt any of the 7 would be a number one pick most other years.
• we had pick 6, brisbane had pick 5 and wanted Lachie Neale.
• therefore we effectively had the rights to two of the 7 players at the start of trade week. What a position to find yourself in.
• I can accept using one of the two picks on Hogan but to leave without using either of them was negligent.
• the problem was we’d committed to Lobb who was always a B grader at best. A second round pick was plenty for Lobb but we’d given that away the year before to get Wilson or someone across (another C grader)
• now for the most annoying part. Port Adelaide made the deal of the century to get one of our two golden tickets, all because of Rory Lobb and the fact we had committed to him. We split pick 6 with port, for a bag of chips in hindsight.

PORT ADELAIDE has completed an exchange of draft picks with Fremantle which will see it move up the order and have two picks inside the top 10.

The Power will receive the Dockers’ first-round pick, currently pick 6, and a future third-round selection in exchange for its current picks 11, 23, 30 and 49.

Port Adelaide list manager Jason Cripps says the trade strengthens the club’s position in the 2018 AFL National Draft and gives it an extra selection next year.

“Our objective was to improve our position in this draft, in particular the top end as we believe it to be the strongest group seen for many years,” he said.

Lobb. Rory bloody Lobb. The definition of mediocre and average and we had to split one of the most valuable draft assets in several years because a C grade key forward wanted to come to us.
Aaaagh still makes me ill. We gave away Conor Rozee because Rory Lobb fluttered his eyelids at us.

I had a 'pigs dinner' in 1991 up north that was basically mixes of off cuts, pig ears, snouts and come Kanga tails (bloody nice btw) and anything left lying around buried in the ground. I went and got a egg and lettuce sandwich,

It was fantastily juicy, fattey and great in a roll with the fat juices from the ground (I'm not kidding) and just wanted more.

It made no sense to me that we should be eating that. But it was magnificent.

 

[Docker82]

That’s exactly right. Every man and his dog knew that 2018 draft Top 10 had some of the most valuable draft assets ever in the last 15 years or so and we some how messed them up.

Port Adelaide should have that pick swap that we did with them to give them Rozee framed on the wall at Alberton.

I could appreciate what we were trying to do with hogan. At least he was an A grade talent. We rolled the dice and it didn’t work but you could at least see the guy was a top player when his head was right and he could have made a huge difference to our forward line.
Lobb on the other hand was plodder and it’s pretty unforgivable really that a pick used to draft a generational player and possible future hall of famer was split up so we could trade in… Rory Lobb.
I’d say walls was fuming then as he would have known better than anyone the talent that was available then.

I have no issue trading for Lobb or the value traded. We traded around a second rounder in value for him.

That trade with Port Adelaide never should’ve been done though and even if it was it should’ve been a lot harder for them and got us a lot more.

Anyway if we wanted Lobb and he was worth a second rounder we should’ve traded a second rounder.

I think the main issue some posters have is involving first rounders in the Lobb trade. I can see where they’re coming from even if I don’t agree with them constantly (probably purposely to suit their agenda) misquoting the trade making sound worse for Freo than it actually was.

 

[Superkoops]

We started with 6, traded it to port for 11 and 19 then used those two picks to get Lobb and 14 from GWS iirc.

19 we got in the trade from Brisbane for Neale. Nothing to do with the trade with Port.

I agree that the trade with Port was a s*#t call. Should have made Port trade up to top 10 before trading away 6.

The problem with some of the early pick trades is clubs think getting some picks will be sufficient to make a trade with another club but then get found out. Happened to GC when dealing with us for Weller (traded with WC to get a late first etc.)

I’m sure that trade with Port was done with a view to trade 23 for Lobb. Sadly the club obviously didn’t have a clear understanding on what was needed.

To downgrade 6 for 11 and other picks was terrible outcome.

6 for 9 plus picks would have palatable. We needed to make Port work harder for that golden ticket knowing how bad they wanted it.

Imagine the following hypothetical:
Neale > 5, 41
Wait for Port to get a higher pick
9, 23, 30, 43 > 5, 59
23, 30 > 19
19> Lobb or walk away
9 and a second round pick > Hogan

We still have pick 6.

Just a series of terrible mistakes that offseason.

 

[Taylor]

Lobb and Hogan were the exact type of players our side needed at that point, arguably we still need a Lobb style target for the long kick down the line.

The club needed to keep our sizable fringe support base on side and sell hope.

Didn't work. I don't want to overstate the importance of winning a final in 2022 in terms of player retention, but I don't think we get that chance in 2022 without Lobb and I'm not sure we have the players we do now committed if we didn't have that glimmer of hope for them.

 

[Dockeroo]

I have no issue trading for Lobb or the value traded. We traded around a second rounder in value for him.

That trade with Port Adelaide never should’ve been done though and even if it was it should’ve been a lot harder for them and got us a lot more.

Anyway if we wanted Lobb and he was worth a second rounder we should’ve traded a second rounder.

I think the main issue some posters have is involving first rounders in the Lobb trade. I can see where they’re coming from even if I don’t agree with them constantly (probably purposely to suit their agenda) misquoting the trade making sound worse for Freo than it actually was.

Yeah it’s the breaking up of R1 picks at the very pointy end of a superdraft for a player of Lobbs level that I hated.
And absolutely Port should have been made work harder for that prized pick 6. They even kept their future first rounder too which could have been used. The points system is irrelevant when a pick such high value is involved in the trade.
Ironically walls was crazy keen on Butters too in that draft but he also went to port at pick 12…
Man, * port. They conned us so badly in trades and pick swaps on more than one occassion actually. If they flopped this year and we have their r1 it might even the ledger a bit…

 

[Docker82]

Yeah it’s the breaking up of R1 picks at the very pointy end of a superdraft for a player of Lobbs level that I hated.
And absolutely Port should have been made work harder for that prized pick 6. They even kept their future first rounder too which could have been used. The points system is irrelevant when a pick such high value is involved in the trade.
Ironically walls was crazy keen on Butters too in that draft but he also went to port at pick 12…
Man, * port. They conned us so badly in trades and pick swaps on more than one occassion actually. If they flopped this year and we have their r1 it might even the ledger a bit…

Got a feeling we swapped Pick 15-18 for two picks around 27-30 tbh. Let’s remember there’s two extra picks at the end of the first round due to North priority picks so we have to be really bad for this years second to be inside pick 27 (they’ll be FA compensation picks added).

If Port finish the lower parts of the eight or lower it becomes a good trade for us.

 

[Superkoops]

Yeah it’s the breaking up of R1 picks at the very pointy end of a superdraft for a player of Lobbs level that I hated.
And absolutely Port should have been made work harder for that prized pick 6. They even kept their future first rounder too which could have been used. The points system is irrelevant when a pick such high value is involved in the trade.
Ironically walls was crazy keen on Butters too in that draft but he also went to port at pick 12…
Man, * port. They conned us so badly in trades and pick swaps on more than one occassion actually. If they flopped this year and we have their r1 it might even the ledger a bit…

Yep - had we made Port work harder for pick 6 we could have ended up with Butters.

To start with 6 and Neale and end up with 14 (17) as first pick along with Lobb and Hogan was not a good outcome.

At the very least make Port work harder and not trade as much for Hogan.

Make Port turn 11 to 8-10.
Only give up one pick 6, 8-10 for Hogan.
Fiddle fart with all the other picks to trade up to 18-21 for Lobb.

We then go to draft with say 9(11), second round pick and third round pick etc.

Butters, retaining an earlier second pick (we traded up for Valente) and Schultz.

Port and Melbourne made out like bandits.

The trade with Lobb was ok 11-14 and then 19 for a couple of picks in the 40’s (noting that they were essentially traded for 25 or thereabouts).

So 11>14 and 19>25 is a reasonable trade.

It is what we did before that with Port and then later with Melbourne that left us with our tail between our legs. Still to this day I have no idea why we traded 25 with pick 6 for Hogan. We knew the risks and that should have pushed down the trade value. Melbourne only needed 6 to pass onto GC for S. May.

 

[Taylor]

I think Port got us at the following year's draft too when we tried to trade for points after the Henry bid.

 

[Dockeroo]

I think Port got us at the following year's draft too when we tried to trade for points after the Henry bid.

That was even worse, that pick swap we did with Port when scrambling to match points for Henry. So much for getting “goodwill” in future trades with clubs when you given them a generous deal in an earlier trade… they absolutely shafted us when we had no leverage and were backed into a corner.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I think we forget what Hogan was at the time. A contracted young generational KPF with minor reported off-field issues and a foot injury that can ruin a season but isn’t career impacting.

He was always going to cost a mint and was arguably discounted at the price we got him (for those issues mentioned). Also have to remember we’d have been chasing him since Melbourne drafted him. I understand the good call at the time by some saying it has a stink about it but I also think that’s a very hard move to pull out of (you want to bet if he stays he kicks 50 goals a year still for Melbourne).

I go back and forth on this next part. I know he was bad off field and I blame him for completely falling off the wagon but I also think we didn’t give it a good enough go and could have tried harder to turn him around. Him with Jye would be elite.

Lobb I agree, you don’t break up top 10 picks for Lobbs, the strategy was get Lobb and Hogan and get a pick in each round still. That was wrong given the draft, the strategy should have been get Lobb and Hogan and keep a pick in the top 10 under all costs. Given how we top up depth now, I’m sure that would be the plan if the same thing happened again. To make it matters worse, we were heavily into Butters as well.

The ******* life of a Freo supporter hey, always looking back on past *-ups

 

[Rockmelon]

I don't think we ever fully committed to a rebuild until Neale left. we had a half decent list and wanted to capitalize on Fyfe and Neales prime years by going after players like Hogan and Lobb.

Hindsight is 20/20 but we probably should have bounced back up the ladder and made finals, definitely underachieved

 

[Docker82]

That was even worse, that pick swap we did with Port when scrambling to match points for Henry. So much for getting “goodwill” in future trades with clubs when you given them a generous deal in an earlier trade… they absolutely shafted us when we had no leverage and were backed into a corner.

I think the greater issue was not knowing when to walk away from Liam Henry.

He was always talked about as an early second round pick. Given the discounts and other BS that’s part of the bidding system matching a later first round pick would’ve been fine but we really should’ve walked away at Pick 9.

I think Chapman talent wise is fine but that pick also dropped back. I think we should’ve weighed up the cost on the following years first rounder and the future second rounder was actually worth it.

 

[arsesmart]

I think the greater issue was not knowing when to walk away from Liam Henry.

He was always talked about as an early second round pick. Given the discounts and other BS that’s part of the bidding system matching a later first round pick would’ve been fine but we really should’ve walked away at Pick 9.

I think Chapman talent wise is fine but that pick also dropped back. I think we should’ve weighed up the cost on the following years first rounder and the future second rounder was actually worth it.

There's an extremely finicky take on selections.

Using that logic regarding drafting Ben King... would that be a yes or no?

All the noise at the time was that he was a huge flight risk. While he's stayed at GC, doesn't guarantee he would've stayed here.

Further to that, GC picking him hasn't given them any massive boost to their success over us.

You really can tie yourself in knots trying to second guess everything and read the future.

 

[DaveLister]

How much would you pay for Shai Bolton

29

Shai Bolton

Age

25

Ht

176cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.3

3star

K

6.9

3star

HB

5.4

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

12.7

3star

K

9.2

4star

HB

3.5

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.7

4star

CL

1.8

4star

D

9.2

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

4.6

4star

M

2.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.0

1star

?
If Richmond were this bad all season, and he ‘wanted to come home’ would you pay 2 first rounders for him?which 2?
What about 3 firsts given he is contracted?

As a 1 for one upgrade on any of our smalls bar sonny, and Sonny’s long term replacement.
Shai would have to be the biggest list improvement we could achieve.
Far more impactful that McDonald instead of Treacy.

What’s the offer Richmond and Shai can’t refuse?