List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part IV

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 4

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
​

 

[chris_h_11]

Sing it with me....


Because we dont have the......

 

[BrutThough]

Soldo?!

So we've gone from categorically not trading Marshall to having a guy who failed our medical 12 months ago as our plan for when we do?

 

[Moquo]

Sing it with me....


Because we dont have the......

 

[Nomis2933]

The amount of people sucking on the teet of the AFL now is extraordinary. Every wannabe podcaster/ Franklins No Frills wannabe journo/ Pretend ITK looking for attention beating their chest in the hope of being re-tweeted is disturbing. It was bad enough when we had just a young Eddie and Hutchy sniffing bins in the lure of a story back in the 1990's. Now the media are actually IN the bins with phone cameras.

 

[phantom13]

Im not sure I understand how we could "walk away" from a deal on Marshall.

We have a contracted player. A club is trying to get him to leave (apparently for the second year in a row). They made us an offer (25 first round). We countered (F1). They said no and offered that pick to Carlton for Curnow. We said Marshall is staying, and we are happy to have him

How have we "walked away" here?

According to how its being reported (or at least discussed noting i dont see the reporting being done on this one that is on Aleer) the accepted convention is that club a (Geelong in this case) enquires about a player, player requests a trade to club a, club b (us in this case) accepts that request and agrees to try and facilitate a trade.

From their both club have the entirety of trade week to finalise that deal and its pretty rare that any club just gives up on that until the cowbell rings at the deadline. If we have "walked away" it implies that were just not even going to negotiate anymore, not that were playing hardball or miles apart on the deal, were just packing up, not to be discussed, Roma stays, **** his request and **** the cats.

You can absolutely argue Geelong is offering unders and were not accepting it but clubs dont generally "walk away" from discussions with 6 days to go in the trade period.

Thats the issue, thats what were copping it over the Aleer deal for, thats whats being conflated here.

 

[Yawkey way]

I can't believe there are people suggesting we have handled this well. Some even saying Aleer and the manager are the bad guys.

It's proof some fans will just back the club in no matter what. It's been really poorly handled and makes us look very unprofessional.

I’m not dancing on his grave but the narrative is twisted.

Yes it’s hardest on Aleer he’s missing out on $ and opportunities.

The flip side is this is afl trading, despite the narrative players miss out every year.

We’re being attacked because a guy talked about as a junk pick had a price put on his head by gws.

No one else gets to tell us who we need and the price we should pay . Maybe we were glad of the chance to walk away but if so big deal.

 

[phantom13]

McCartney acted like he cared about the player and we didn't. They just didn't care enough about him to give him playing time and a big contract his manager wanted. Again, it's business. No hard feelings. As they say, don't hate the player, hate the game (the game that is the nature of business dealings and uncertainty is always there until you signed the dotted line, even that's no worth the paper it's signed on these days which is dissapointing)

I have no idea how youve quoted me here, i never said anything about McCartney or that quote...

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Youre missing a couple of bits here

• We were reported prior to trade week to be the most difficult club to deal with (by a poll of the clubs)
• Its being assumed (if not reported) that we have walked away from the Roma deal as well

You could quite easily spin the story to the narrative youve presented and you wouldnt be wrong but right now its only saints that would do that.

We're so difficult to deal with that we are the club who has made deals with two other clubs in good faith.

Sounds like that poll was as accurate as recent political polling as been.

 

[stavro#4]

So we've gone from categorically not trading Marshall to having a guy who failed our medical 12 months ago as our plan for when we do?

Haven’t heard the audio yet. But apparently

 

[LuckyBounce!]

Any chance we can hear St. Kildas side of this?

 

[phantom13]

I’m not dancing on his grave but the narrative is twisted.

Yes it’s hardest on Aleer he’s missing out on $ and opportunities.

The flip side is this is afl trading, despite the narrative players miss out every year.

We’re being attacked because a guy talked about as a junk pick had a price put on his head by gws.

No one else gets to tell us who we need and the price we should pay . Maybe we were glad of the chance to walk away but if so big deal.

You cant really argue GWS were unreasonable unless you actually tried to make the deal happen, leaving negotations with a week to go isnt trying.

Thats the narrative, thats the story, thats why were copping it.

The facts may very well be that GWS were clear they wouldnt budge but we left the discussions, so its on us.

 

[phantom13]

We're so difficult to deal with that we are the club who has made deals with two other clubs in good faith.

Sounds like that poll was as accurate as recent political polling as been.

Its a survey from the others clubs, its accuracy is in the method.

We can disagree and scream all we like about how we think its happened and its all just a story right, but the details stack up the narrative.

 

[phantom13]

Haven’t heard the audio yet. But apparently

Christ i hope this isnt true.

The only upgrade Soldo is on Boyd is his partner.

 

[bird_man]

I’m not dancing on his grave but the narrative is twisted.

Yes it’s hardest on Aleer he’s missing out on $ and opportunities.

The flip side is this is afl trading, despite the narrative players miss out every year.

We’re being attacked because a guy talked about as a junk pick had a price put on his head by gws.

No one else gets to tell us who we need and the price we should pay . Maybe we were glad of the chance to walk away but if so big deal.

I'm not going to keep going round in circles, so this will be my last post on the matter.

There were still 6 days to go. Every single year a club puts a hiigher price on a player than what they end up taking.

The fact we walked away so early makes it very obvious we just got cold feet. The reason why we might never know but I'd say it's a mixture of landing SOS and Aleer performing below expectations in the back half of the year. Seems like we were just waiting for an excuse to jump off ship.

I've got no issues with not taking him as I've said all along he's been pretty poor, but we should have handled it better.

 

[AFaiL]

You cant really argue GWS were unreasonable unless you actually tried to make the deal happen, leaving negotations with a week to go isnt trying.

Thats the narrative, thats the story, thats why were copping it.

The facts may very well be that GWS were clear they wouldnt budge but we left the discussions, so its on us.

Why is it seen to be the norm to spend days and days haggling? That has been the issue with trade period the whole time

Make you case, and if nobody blinks, move on. People clearly dont understand how negotiating and sales works. The longer you stuff around, the less authority you have. Walking away is the ultimate power move

 

[billings2paddy]

McCartney acted like he cared about the player and we didn't. They just didn't care enough about him to give him playing time and a big contract his manager wanted. Again, it's business. No hard feelings. As they say, don't hate the player, hate the game (the game that is the nature of business dealings and uncertainty is always there until you signed the dotted line, even that's no worth the paper it's signed on these days which is dissapointing)

Ofcourse he did.
He's trying to control the narrative
GWS good guys
StKilda bad guys

 

[Enclosed_Animal]

According to how its being reported (or at least discussed noting i dont see the reporting being done on this one that is on Aleer) the accepted convention is that club a (Geelong in this case) enquires about a player, player requests a trade to club a, club b (us in this case) accepts that request and agrees to try and facilitate a trade.

From their both club have the entirety of trade week to finalise that deal and its pretty rare that any club just gives up on that until the cowbell rings at the deadline. If we have "walked away" it implies that were just not even going to negotiate anymore, not that were playing hardball or miles apart on the deal, were just packing up, not to be discussed, Roma stays, ** his request and ** the cats.

You can absolutely argue Geelong is offering unders and were not accepting it but clubs dont generally "walk away" from discussions with 6 days to go in the trade period.

Thats the issue, thats what were copping it over the Aleer deal for, thats whats being conflated here.

I get what your saying, but the onus is not on us to engage the other party. The onus is on Geelong. They want the asset. They started the conversation. If we walk out of the room, it is up to Marshall's manager and Geelong to speak to us

Its like saying St.Kilda "walked away" from negotiations with the Bulldogs on Wilkie. Thats not how it works

 

[Captain Paddy]

Dees have to take him back, hes contracted.

He might play at Casey all year and become the highest paid twos player in history but they cant do anything else unless he retires

Man I want to see Melbourne play hardball so badly here.

"He's contracted, we're willing to pay half his salary... you give us a 2nd rounder"
"We will only give you a third"
"And we will only pay a third of his salary"

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

According to how its being reported (or at least discussed noting i dont see the reporting being done on this one that is on Aleer) the accepted convention is that club a (Geelong in this case) enquires about a player, player requests a trade to club a, club b (us in this case) accepts that request and agrees to try and facilitate a trade.

From their both club have the entirety of trade week to finalise that deal and its pretty rare that any club just gives up on that until the cowbell rings at the deadline. If we have "walked away" it implies that were just not even going to negotiate anymore, not that were playing hardball or miles apart on the deal, were just packing up, not to be discussed, Roma stays, ** his request and ** the cats.

You can absolutely argue Geelong is offering unders and were not accepting it but clubs dont generally "walk away" from discussions with 6 days to go in the trade period.

Thats the issue, thats what were copping it over the Aleer deal for, thats whats being conflated here.

We are under no obligation to negotiate with Geelong at all. Contracted player, yada, yada, yada.

We don't have to walk towards them, let alone get chastised for walking away.

It's incumbent on Geelong to present something that entices us to even listen. It sounds like we have wasted our time even listening to them.

To be clear, this 'walking away' is actually just media BS. Clubs are speaking to each other every day... if Geelong decide to actually get serious then we'll listen.

Personally I think we're a better team next year with Ro.

 

[phantom13]

Why is it seen to be the norm to spend days and days haggling? That has been the issue with trade period the whole time

Make you case, and if nobody blinks, move on. People clearly dont understand how negotiating and sales works. The longer you stuff around, the less authority you have. Walking away is the ultimate power move

Fair question. I dont really agree on the power move thing, modern negotations dont work off 80s power business books.

Most people think you just look like a dickhead pulling that (unless you have all the leverage in which case you still look like a dickhead youll just likely win).

 

[stavro#4]

“I think stkilda have entered this bad boy era”
“I think stkilda will say to Rowan Marshall

19

Rowan Marshall

Age

30

Ht

201cm

Wt

105kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.4

4star

K

8.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

CL

3.4

5star

HO

20.2

5star

D

12.9

3star

K

9.3

4star

HB

3.6

2star

CL

2.8

4star

HO

17.8

5star

D

10.6

3star

K

5.8

3star

HB

4.8

4star

CL

1.0

3star

HO

7.8

5star

, nah not this year brother”

- Ollie

(Also says he doesn’t know what will happen)

 

[BrutThough]

Any chance we can hear St. Kildas side of this?

Gubby and SOS left for their summer holiday this morning.

 

[akaifu]

So we've gone from categorically not trading Marshall to having a guy who failed our medical 12 months ago as our plan for when we do?

Two different sources - Edmund was the one who 'categorically' ruled it out

Who knows how old Morris' news is - could be from when we were still negotiating with Geelong

 

[phantom13]

We are under no obligation to negotiate with Geelong at all. Contracted player, yada, yada, yada.

We don't have to walk towards them, let alone get chastised for walking away.

It's incumbent on Geelong to present something that entices us to even listen. It sounds like we have wasted our time even listening to them.

To be clear, this 'walking away' is actually just media BS. Clubs are speaking to each other every day... if Geelong decide to actually get serious then we'll listen.

Personally I think we're a better team next year with Ro.

I dont agree, if weve told Roma well sit with Geelong then we are under an obligation to him to do so.

Rest is probably fair, its just not the accepted protocol. I also think if it wasnt on the back of the Aleer thing it wouldnt be a story at all, both are conflating to make us look like were overly agrresive, mildly incompetent idiots.

I probably agree on the walking away being media BS but i think in the Aleer case it seems to be true.

I dont think you play 2 rucks in modern footy and Roma is a first choice ruck so i think he makes very little difference to our fortunes except as a back up.

 

[gringo2011]

Your hung up on “walking away.”

Walking away can be seen as a negotiating tactic to focus a few minds.

You can emulate Geelong in action. Narrative is the issue and you are buying in.

Their narrative is that they are elite at anything they do. They get caught cheating and claim it’s accounting errors. No one bats an eye. We highlight the significant issues with the draft and get belted on every form of media - to only be proven correct 12 months later.

Exactly we are still North Melbourne like in the eyes of the AFL world. People are confused by the muscle flexing display we are putting in. It’s got a lot of people wanting to keep us where we are or scared that we will jump them. Just keep flexing until they sit down.