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List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion

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martinson said:
Let's get some perspective.

How did we get where we ended up this year. Because guys on not much money stepped up and played a significant role when we were down for the count ,and those on good money are really motivated for success.

These young men are seeing money most young men would only dream of , but the smart ones want to play somewhere where they have camaraderie and inclusion and good prospects for success and all of the many benefits that flow from that.
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Not sure what you are implying about perspective.
Players don't play better because they are on less or more money than their teammates

What reason did Daniher, Neale and Dunkley leave their old clubs for?
What reason are Ah-Chee and Starcevich leaving the Lions for?
It is usually varied but money is very relevant for a move especially interstate.

Which guys on not much money stepped up and what is not much money anyhow.
Young draft picks are on a set wage plus bonuses for playing AFL games.
Their time for bigger contracts will come if they earn it.
All teams have players on varying contracts.
Clubs pay more money for good midfielders and KPF. That's been the case for ages

It also depends on when you come to the club.
The past few years saw a big increase to player payments so luring players with more money and resigning promising players already on our list was easier.
Things have now settled down except for when or if Tasmania are granted a license

There are too many things needed to go right to win a GF. From admin, players, coaches, medical etc etc.
Saying players on not much money stepped up is the reason "where we ended up this year" is not correct but it was just a part of the overall picture.
 
Wouldn't mind Jed Bews, happy for us to continue recruiting from our second academy - Geelong!
 

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I didn't know much about Jed Bews, but after reading his profile he looks like a good replacement for Starcevich.
Certainly comes from a professional winning culture.
The one concern is, at 31 years of age would he want to relocate. Hopefully the Qld lifestyle attracts him.
Secondly could he be guaranteed to play every games with a few other options there vying for the back pocket spot.
 
jfn said:
I didn't know much about Jed Bews, but after reading his profile he looks like a good replacement for Starcevich.
Certainly comes from a professional winning culture.
The one concern is, at 31 years of age would he want to relocate. Hopefully the Qld lifestyle attracts him.
Secondly could he be guaranteed to play every games with a few other options there vying for the back pocket spot.
Click to expand...
Andrew Bews ex Brisbane Bears player. Come on home son ;)
 
LongLion said:
Andrew Bews ex Brisbane Bears player. Come on home son ;)
Click to expand...
Bit of early background from 2011 on Jed. Was a Lions supporter for awhile.

www.afl.com.au

Bews keen on Cats' eyes

Recruit Jed Bews was desperate to impress Geelong, the one club who could take him as a father-son selection
www.afl.com.au www.afl.com.au
 
Section 5 said:
Not sure what you are implying about perspective.
Players don't play better because they are on less or more money than their teammates

What reason did Daniher, Neale and Dunkley leave their old clubs for?
What reason are Ah-Chee and Starcevich leaving the Lions for?
It is usually varied but money is very relevant for a move especially interstate.

Which guys on not much money stepped up and what is not much money anyhow.
Young draft picks are on a set wage plus bonuses for playing AFL games.
Their time for bigger contracts will come if they earn it.
All teams have players on varying contracts.
Clubs pay more money for good midfielders and KPF. That's been the case for ages

It also depends on when you come to the club.
The past few years saw a big increase to player payments so luring players with more money and resigning promising players already on our list was easier.
Things have now settled down except for when or if Tasmania are granted a license

There are too many things needed to go right to win a GF. From admin, players, coaches, medical etc etc.
Saying players on not much money stepped up is the reason "where we ended up this year" is not correct but it was just a part of the overall picture.
Click to expand...
You seem to have misinterpreted my post in a skewed way. My entire point was that no one played better because they were on more money.
 
So while we can't 100% know the accuracy of these reports on contract terms, let's just set some of the record straight.

McCluggage 950k p/y 7 years (according to cleary)
Neale current extension unknown, last contract 800k p/y 5 years (link)
Josh Dunkley 750k p/y 6 years (link)
Eric Hipwood ???k p/y 6 years
Joe Danniher 600k p/y @ 5 years (initially signed at 2m over 3 and was extended)
Tom Doedee 650k p/y 4 years (link)

Our FA signing speculation:
Oscar Allen 800k p/y 4 years (link)
Draper est 700k (band 2) 5 years (link)

The consensus for Starcevich from WC is 900k p/y 6 years (link) would make him out second highest paid player on our list.

You can argue that we overpaid for Doedee sure, it's looking like a risk that hasn't paid off. But you can see we have a CLEAR contract to team importance hierarchy going on and I appreciate us sticking to our guns about it.

Bailey is the one that will be interesting for next year. If he is getting offers of 1.3mil, I doubt we will be offering more then 1mil so he will have a significant choice to make. I assume our next big contract will be saved for Will Ashcroft.

People should also remember the Salary cap is only 18.4million, what teams like St Kilda are doing at the moment is going to absolutely tank their list management strategy.
 
Dany Daly said it a few days ago. We won't pay overs to keep players here; in fact, they will have to take unders (his exact words). You don't break your club's culture and rules for anyone. That doesn't mean that Bailey cannot get a lot of money, but it he has to take quite a bit less to remain here. The other point is that Ashcroft is out of contract next year. If we have to pick between giving Ashcroft or Bailey the mega contract, I would prefer Ashcroft. I do hope they both stay though.
 
After the Olympics, the Lions could be one of the most popular clubs in Australia, which should enhance outside opportunities significantly. For a city as big as Brisbane and surrounds, there should be plenty of money for the Lions and Broncos (and maybe the Dolphins).
 
St Kilda obviously have a lot of space in the cap right now so it is not as bad as it looks and they are probably banking on the next wage negotiations to go up, so 1.3m for a top liner maybe the norm. We always throw our arms in the air at these bigs deals but 2-3 years later everybody is doing it....or St Kidla are just shit šŸ˜†.
 

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Nuggo said:
St Kilda obviously have a lot of space in the cap right now so it is not as bad as it looks and they are probably banking on the next wage negotiations to go up, so 1.3m for a top liner maybe the norm. We always throw our arms in the air at these bigs deals but 2-3 years later everybody is doing it....or St Kidla are just shit šŸ˜†.
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It's a big gamble for them, but after 1 premiership over 50 years ago, they needed to try something.
 
It looks to me the Saints are continuing down the same path trading wise since 2019.
On paper their best haul but that left them with just pick 52 and 64 in the national draft

2019: Dan Butler, Brad Hill, Dougal Howard, Zac Jones, Paddy Ryder, Ryan Abbott
2020: Jack Higgins, Brad Crouch, James Frawley, Shern McKernan, (Paul Hunter Mason Wood PSS), (Max Heath, Cooper Sharman MSD)
2021: Tom Campbell, (Jack Hayes, Jarrod Lienert PSD)
2022: Zaine Cordy, (Liam Stocker PSS)
2023: Liam Henry, Paddy Dowe
2024: Jack Macrea, Jack Carroll

2025; Jack Silvagni, Tom de Koning

They are consistent in bringing in another Jack
 
I saw someone mention that (due to front loading) St Kilda only paid 83% of the cap last season, so now can go over the total by 5% in one year? (Not sure of the validity of that but remember there was a system that allowed over paying if you underpaid the previous year).

1.3mil still equates to 7% of the total salary cap and 2.6% of the playing list (1/38 roughly). What is more alarming is NWM getting 2mil which equates to 10% of their entire salary cap on one player.

They have gone down the Carlton model of a massive top end set of players and hoping that they can fill the rest of the list with solid B Graders around them making 300k per year. It's a flash in the pan type strategy that can work, it's pretty similar to what Richmond did, but it's not long term sustainable if you want to consistently compete at the top, also evident in Richmonds sharp decline.
 
Sanchez365 said:
I saw someone mention that (due to front loading) St Kilda only paid 83% of the cap last season, so now can go over the total by 5% in one year? (Not sure of the validity of that but remember there was a system that allowed over paying if you underpaid the previous year).

1.3mil still equates to 7% of the total salary cap and 2.6% of the playing list (1/38 roughly). What is more alarming is NWM getting 2mil which equates to 10% of their entire salary cap on one player.

They have gone down the Carlton model of a massive top end set of players and hoping that they can fill the rest of the list with solid B Graders around them making 300k per year. It's a flash in the pan type strategy that can work, it's pretty similar to what Richmond did, but it's not long term sustainable if you want to consistently compete at the top, also evident in Richmonds sharp decline.
Click to expand...
I thought there was a set minimum spend re the salary cap.
 
M Malice said:
I thought there was a set minimum spend re the salary cap.
Click to expand...
There is and it's 95% but you can front load existing contracts to get to that number and then you end up with left over space. We would be doing similar things.

The risk is when those big guys get into those last few contract years where they have already made most of the money, they then get itchy feet.

If I was Marshall and they front ended my contract, then used that money to overpay a replacement that they had never offered me, I would jump ship too lol. (This is speculation)
 

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McIvor said:
Whatā€™s his hair got to do with it; your words not mine. Never liked him and his antics and the fact he makes stupid calls like bagging another club and a massive exodus of players which in the year he said didnā€™t happen.

Give me the attitude if 01-03 boys any day of the week and wanting to stick together instead of putting themselves before the club.
Click to expand...
you do realise we received extra money which helped us retain players

They've also changed salary cap rules to allow teams to go hard after players, you are comparing apples to oranges
 
McIvor said:
Whatā€™s his hair got to do with it; your words not mine. Never liked him and his antics and the fact he makes stupid calls like bagging another club and a massive exodus of players which in the year he said didnā€™t happen.

Give me the attitude if 01-03 boys any day of the week and wanting to stick together instead of putting themselves before the club.
Click to expand...
Youā€™re going pretty hard on a team and a club who have just won back to back premierships and played in the last 7 finals series mate.

I get it, it sucks to lose players but thatā€™s the nature of the beast, especially when youā€™re continually at the pointy end, there has to be tough decisions about to who to prioritise and perhaps who we can afford to lose. This applies to targeted recruits also.

Does that make it better for fans? Obviously not, but the club has given us a pretty good run the past 7 years, think we can cut em a bit of slack and trust they know what theyā€™re doing, until they prove otherwise.
 
Surly Boy said:
Mitch Cleary reporting the Draper paperwork lodged.

Welcome to the Lions Sam!
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Sad Joe Biden GIF by GIPHY News
 

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