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List Mgmt. 2025 List Management II 📃
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gab213
Brownlow Medallist
- Aug 29, 2013
- 10,091
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- Ophidian Old Boys SFA
Not since Adrian Hickmott, which is approaching 30 years ago.
Mansfield
gab213
Brownlow Medallist
- Aug 29, 2013
- 10,091
- 43,748
- AFL Club
- Carlton
- Other Teams
- Ophidian Old Boys SFA
He was a good player, but I think Hickmott was better at Carlton.
Carltonfc9
Senior List
- Sep 13, 2017
- 194
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Just get someone good that is ready to go for the next 4 years to partner weits make the kids earn there spot with out being rushed, when they are ready and good enough they will play
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Ciccio
Team Captain
I think you are forgetting about a certain Frank the Tank !!! Originally drafted by Geelong and then let go.
Haha yes but I meant dealing directly with them …
Psychochook
Team Captain
- Sep 12, 2014
- 449
- 1,507
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2015 pick swaps?
From memory only, but I see the cats doing us a solid through the brain fog.
If anyone is less lazy than me and wants to check?
From memory only, but I see the cats doing us a solid through the brain fog.
If anyone is less lazy than me and wants to check?
Liam Jones for a year,anyone? Wants to leave Bulldogs an play at another team
Viable option. Plug & play.Liam Jones for a year,anyone? Wants to leave Bulldogs an play at another team
A bit late to get him back now. Should never have let him go. Good match with Weiters.Liam Jones for a year, anyone? Wants to leave Bulldogs an play at another team
Weiters is burning out so Carlton needs to do something.
We all know it's gonna happenLiam Jones for a year,anyone? Wants to leave Bulldogs an play at another team
Yep. No one - and I’m mean no one - screws Carlton eight times in a row !!
- May 1, 2002
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Conditional footballer that doesn’t do the team things.
The Blue Weirdo
Premiership Player
If Jonesy passes the medical he'd be a reasonable type of temporary plan.Liam Jones for a year,anyone? Wants to leave Bulldogs an play at another team
I wasn't comfortable with offering JSOS a 4 year deal with HOF and (hopefully) Dean raring to go in 2027.
You know it just makes sense.
Come back home Jonesy !!!
When teams like Geelong want a star player to elevate them they just get them. Dangerfield, Cameron, Smith. Where do we stand? We aren't North Melbourne who noone good will go to. But we aren't up there with the best. We have attracted some good talent, but noone genuinely elite. If Geelong were in our situation, had dropped out of finals, they would be hitting hard with cleaning out some older and lesser players and bring in a few elite guns, as we have seen. What if Geelong wanted Butters? 100% they get him.
It will be interesting to see what we do. Can't help but feel it will be kids and cheap gets who have a positive impact but nothing massive. That is what we are used to. The thing with us, we need to step up. What the top sides do in these situations, get back into finals, become a serious contender.
Our list isn't too bad. Our best team is pretty good and IMO is a bees dick away from not just finals but a top 4 place if we ace this draft and trade period.
I keep seeing from changes in game style to changes in the types of players we are now targetting that the penny has dropped for Voss. It took far too long and I am royally pissed about that but I am for the first time comfortable with him there, pending on how we proceede list management, team selection and game plan wise. But signs are there that the penny has dropped in regards to finally embracing modern football. New assistant coaches, this surely brings a positive change in coaching.
History has proven that spending too much time outside the 8 is bad for everything. Culture, motivation, list management etc. It's toxic, so we need to get back into the 8 soon enough. The value of bottoming out just is not there.
Our issues are spread over the field. Midfield is the main one which needs a rebuild. Pace and agility. Our wings aren't great and we are a couple of onballers short. Smith coming in fixes one main issue but he is light weight and hasn't played AFL yet so expectations need to be tempered. Butters if we can do a Geelong and land a top level player who we want and need would elevate us into finals. He and Walsh would run riot while Smith as a plus 1 off a flank or playing as a winger would also be outstanding. Finally we would have a modern midfield. If we run with Walsh, Cerra, Hewett, Smith, Cripps next year we are going to struggle. The running capacity and defensive capacity of that group is crap. That group gets murdered by the top 4 and any up and coming sides above us would dine out on it as well.
Our backline is developing and is in good shape. It's a real blow about O'Farrell but Dean is a good one. Weitering and Young were ok at the back end of last season and they are good enough to carry us. A player out of the VFL which we don't have to use draft picks to sign is probably on the cards for backup or perhaps Liam Jones for 1 year. Our smaller defneders are quality, no need to recruit there. I don't want us using good currency on the backline after Dean, our defence is setup for a good while and we do not need list clogger defenders.
Our forward line has issue, no doubt, but midfield must remain a focus, this needs to be rebuilt and we need to do a Geelong and add an A Grader in the middle. Walsh and Cripps are our only top quality in the midfield and that's an issue. Happy to trade Cerra or Hewett if we absolutely have to but our main problem is here and the lack of pace, agility and kicking skills is a real issue. Our biggest issue is our midfield. Onball and wings followed by our forward flanks.
We should have two picks in the first round from free agency compensation. We have players we are trading so we will have later picks as well. The currency should be there.
Reidy will be handy ruck backup. Chesser will be a really good get. Smith will be like a new recruit but don't expect him to be a ready made star. I am bloody hoping we can land a gun for the middle and that the Butters rumours are correct. A player like Ison would fit in really well with us, we need these young midfielders coming through.
Trade period will be fun. It's a shame we could not trade more. Long contracts to B and C grade level players and lower. I am hoping Wright sorts this out. I am sure we are talking to plenty of names. Don't rule out obtaining later picks. Third round picks and even second round picks are going to be worth a bit if we are looking to bring in players from the fringes of other clubs.
Binns being looked at is huge for us if we can get a pick for him. The difference between the top clubs and the next wrung down, us, is when the lose players, they get a pick, when we lose players we delist them. Not always obviously but moreso. If Binns is worth a pick from another club then Hollands, McGovern, Acres etc should net something. I think if we are trading Curnow then we definitely must be bringing in that A grade midfielder.
I would not be waiting to do it either. Teams like Geelong and Collingwood, teams who can get things like this done and generally will beat us to players like this will be looking for A grade midfielders as soon as this season. Dangerfield, Pendlebury, Sidebottom will retire or be retired and they will be replaced with top level mids from other clubs so we don't want to be competing with them when that happens.
I hope we are aggressive and we aren't all about slow burn. If the opportunity presents itself then we need to get back into the 8 and start playing finals again next year.
It will be interesting to see what we do. Can't help but feel it will be kids and cheap gets who have a positive impact but nothing massive. That is what we are used to. The thing with us, we need to step up. What the top sides do in these situations, get back into finals, become a serious contender.
Our list isn't too bad. Our best team is pretty good and IMO is a bees dick away from not just finals but a top 4 place if we ace this draft and trade period.
I keep seeing from changes in game style to changes in the types of players we are now targetting that the penny has dropped for Voss. It took far too long and I am royally pissed about that but I am for the first time comfortable with him there, pending on how we proceede list management, team selection and game plan wise. But signs are there that the penny has dropped in regards to finally embracing modern football. New assistant coaches, this surely brings a positive change in coaching.
History has proven that spending too much time outside the 8 is bad for everything. Culture, motivation, list management etc. It's toxic, so we need to get back into the 8 soon enough. The value of bottoming out just is not there.
Our issues are spread over the field. Midfield is the main one which needs a rebuild. Pace and agility. Our wings aren't great and we are a couple of onballers short. Smith coming in fixes one main issue but he is light weight and hasn't played AFL yet so expectations need to be tempered. Butters if we can do a Geelong and land a top level player who we want and need would elevate us into finals. He and Walsh would run riot while Smith as a plus 1 off a flank or playing as a winger would also be outstanding. Finally we would have a modern midfield. If we run with Walsh, Cerra, Hewett, Smith, Cripps next year we are going to struggle. The running capacity and defensive capacity of that group is crap. That group gets murdered by the top 4 and any up and coming sides above us would dine out on it as well.
Our backline is developing and is in good shape. It's a real blow about O'Farrell but Dean is a good one. Weitering and Young were ok at the back end of last season and they are good enough to carry us. A player out of the VFL which we don't have to use draft picks to sign is probably on the cards for backup or perhaps Liam Jones for 1 year. Our smaller defneders are quality, no need to recruit there. I don't want us using good currency on the backline after Dean, our defence is setup for a good while and we do not need list clogger defenders.
Our forward line has issue, no doubt, but midfield must remain a focus, this needs to be rebuilt and we need to do a Geelong and add an A Grader in the middle. Walsh and Cripps are our only top quality in the midfield and that's an issue. Happy to trade Cerra or Hewett if we absolutely have to but our main problem is here and the lack of pace, agility and kicking skills is a real issue. Our biggest issue is our midfield. Onball and wings followed by our forward flanks.
We should have two picks in the first round from free agency compensation. We have players we are trading so we will have later picks as well. The currency should be there.
Reidy will be handy ruck backup. Chesser will be a really good get. Smith will be like a new recruit but don't expect him to be a ready made star. I am bloody hoping we can land a gun for the middle and that the Butters rumours are correct. A player like Ison would fit in really well with us, we need these young midfielders coming through.
Trade period will be fun. It's a shame we could not trade more. Long contracts to B and C grade level players and lower. I am hoping Wright sorts this out. I am sure we are talking to plenty of names. Don't rule out obtaining later picks. Third round picks and even second round picks are going to be worth a bit if we are looking to bring in players from the fringes of other clubs.
Binns being looked at is huge for us if we can get a pick for him. The difference between the top clubs and the next wrung down, us, is when the lose players, they get a pick, when we lose players we delist them. Not always obviously but moreso. If Binns is worth a pick from another club then Hollands, McGovern, Acres etc should net something. I think if we are trading Curnow then we definitely must be bringing in that A grade midfielder.
I would not be waiting to do it either. Teams like Geelong and Collingwood, teams who can get things like this done and generally will beat us to players like this will be looking for A grade midfielders as soon as this season. Dangerfield, Pendlebury, Sidebottom will retire or be retired and they will be replaced with top level mids from other clubs so we don't want to be competing with them when that happens.
I hope we are aggressive and we aren't all about slow burn. If the opportunity presents itself then we need to get back into the 8 and start playing finals again next year.
A broader list management thought, not specific to Carlton but relates right now to Charlie and his situation. I wonder if we'll see a reduction of super long contracts in the coming years after the recent struggles of Petracca, Curnow and now Merrett. The idea that's been discussed a couple of times was the agents thought that "We'll sign the long-term contract but just force a trade if we end up wanting to move", but clubs are having none of that, which is fair.
My initial thoughts were long term deals were great for players, less so for clubs, as players would be secure regardless of form. Instead, it seems to have flipped, and clubs are benefitting while players who wanted to lock up security are finding out clubs will actually make them honour that contract.
I wonder, if the contracts continue, whether we'll start to see something of an Americanisation (and somewhat European) form of hold-out, where players refuse to return to the clubs and sit out instead. It's a fairly nuclear move right now given we only have a trade week, so it's a huge threat for the player to make and follow through on. If there's mid-season trading, I could see it being more likely.
In any case, players trying to have their cake and eat it too isn't working. I wonder what the fallout will be in the coming years.
My initial thoughts were long term deals were great for players, less so for clubs, as players would be secure regardless of form. Instead, it seems to have flipped, and clubs are benefitting while players who wanted to lock up security are finding out clubs will actually make them honour that contract.
I wonder, if the contracts continue, whether we'll start to see something of an Americanisation (and somewhat European) form of hold-out, where players refuse to return to the clubs and sit out instead. It's a fairly nuclear move right now given we only have a trade week, so it's a huge threat for the player to make and follow through on. If there's mid-season trading, I could see it being more likely.
In any case, players trying to have their cake and eat it too isn't working. I wonder what the fallout will be in the coming years.
- Nov 27, 2016
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I don't think we'd ACTUALLY do it. Just thinking that would be the reasoning.
Just like that fella (forgotten his name) from GWS that had to sit out a year before getting to Freo.
Sometimes it's a no win situation and you make sure the other mob don't get a win at your expense either.
Longer contracts allow players more freedom to purchase a house, invest in businesses etc, they've also got the risk of being injured at any given moment hovering over their heads.
Clubs will also want more negotiating power should their managers go full D'Orazio, don't see it changing too much
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Simply because we drafted our elite talent, and with the salary cap, there's a limit to how many superstars you can have.
Here's a thought, we go supre aggressive trading this season.
I am all about keeping Curnow but. I think he and McKay are one of the better combinations in the game, it's just our ball movement and forward structure is poor so we don't get the best out of them. HOWEVER. One of our issues going forward is that Curnow and McKay are the same age. So are our midfielders.
The beauty of our defence is that we have Weitering but also Dean and O'Farrell so there will be a seamless succession there when Weitering retires.
We want to get back into the 8 and contend but we also want to be a good side for the next 10 or 15 years.
Trades
Curnow + Pick 34, Pick 44 - Walters, Pick 6, Pick 14, Pick 32
Hollands = Chesser
McGovern = 3rd Round pick
Binns = 4th round pick
Dekoning = Pick 9ish
Silvagni = Late 1st round pick.
SO we now have roughly Picks 6, 9, 14, 17, 32, 44, 49, 65
Chesser I think is a very good player and your prototype modern AFL player, has high level pace, chases and has the skills. He's not injury prone, he has had an ankle injury which has mucked him around for an extended period. Great get, great fit.
Walter actually really reminds me a hell of a lot of Curnow. He's a very rare athlete to be that size and have that skillset, leap and his pace for someone that size is unreal. It could be a trade we regret not doing for the next decade. But we will have to make them pay of course.
Pick 6, 9 - Butters
Pick 14 - ? Hopefully poach an Elite small forward.
Pick 17 - Dean
Pick 32 - Ison
Pick 44 - Reidy
Pick 62 - ?
Pick 65 - VFL key defender
2026 Best 22 (including Injuries)
B: Newman Weitering Dean
HB: Cowan O'Farrell Carroll
C: Haynes Cripps Cerra
HF: Smith Kemp Williams
F: Walter McKay Moir
OB: O'Keefe Walsh Butters
IC: Hollands Chesser Hewett Motlop?
SUB/EMERGANCIES FROM: Saad Wilson Lord Evans Young Cottrell Young Charleson Ison B Camporeale Reidy Pittonet Acres?
That is a really good team and a talented young group of players, particularly when you factor in Cody Walker coming into it next season. I still think that 2027 is the year we aim at when becoming a contender.
Reserves best 22
Charleson ? Boyd
Wilson Young Saad
Camporeale Camporeale Acres
Evans ? Cottrell
White Reidy Young
Pittonet Ison Lord
Monahan Fogarty Duffy ?
I think if we can get some bigger names to agree to come to us, we will probably trade aggressively. I think we are doing a very good job of not showing our hand, making out we really want to keep these players who are "gettable".
I am all about keeping Curnow but. I think he and McKay are one of the better combinations in the game, it's just our ball movement and forward structure is poor so we don't get the best out of them. HOWEVER. One of our issues going forward is that Curnow and McKay are the same age. So are our midfielders.
The beauty of our defence is that we have Weitering but also Dean and O'Farrell so there will be a seamless succession there when Weitering retires.
We want to get back into the 8 and contend but we also want to be a good side for the next 10 or 15 years.
Trades
Curnow + Pick 34, Pick 44 - Walters, Pick 6, Pick 14, Pick 32
Hollands = Chesser
McGovern = 3rd Round pick
Binns = 4th round pick
Dekoning = Pick 9ish
Silvagni = Late 1st round pick.
SO we now have roughly Picks 6, 9, 14, 17, 32, 44, 49, 65
Chesser I think is a very good player and your prototype modern AFL player, has high level pace, chases and has the skills. He's not injury prone, he has had an ankle injury which has mucked him around for an extended period. Great get, great fit.
Walter actually really reminds me a hell of a lot of Curnow. He's a very rare athlete to be that size and have that skillset, leap and his pace for someone that size is unreal. It could be a trade we regret not doing for the next decade. But we will have to make them pay of course.
Pick 6, 9 - Butters
Pick 14 - ? Hopefully poach an Elite small forward.
Pick 17 - Dean
Pick 32 - Ison
Pick 44 - Reidy
Pick 62 - ?
Pick 65 - VFL key defender
2026 Best 22 (including Injuries)
B: Newman Weitering Dean
HB: Cowan O'Farrell Carroll
C: Haynes Cripps Cerra
HF: Smith Kemp Williams
F: Walter McKay Moir
OB: O'Keefe Walsh Butters
IC: Hollands Chesser Hewett Motlop?
SUB/EMERGANCIES FROM: Saad Wilson Lord Evans Young Cottrell Young Charleson Ison B Camporeale Reidy Pittonet Acres?
That is a really good team and a talented young group of players, particularly when you factor in Cody Walker coming into it next season. I still think that 2027 is the year we aim at when becoming a contender.
Reserves best 22
Charleson ? Boyd
Wilson Young Saad
Camporeale Camporeale Acres
Evans ? Cottrell
White Reidy Young
Pittonet Ison Lord
Monahan Fogarty Duffy ?
I think if we can get some bigger names to agree to come to us, we will probably trade aggressively. I think we are doing a very good job of not showing our hand, making out we really want to keep these players who are "gettable".
So Geelong simply break the salary cap and don't get caught?
A bit of that.
That was a hell of a lot of typing to suggest that Gold Coast will give up 2561 points this year in a trade for Curnow.
Why?
Regarding Motlop. I come from the school of "hard arse" but what has he done in the last 2 years to justify the circa 500k he was on? Motlop should see the offer in front of him is reasonable and should be motivated to prove himself. Our contract offers are testing the character of our players for the first time in 30 years and will leave us a list of players who prioritise performance and premierships
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