Player Watch #5: Caleb Daniel

[The Nostradamus]

just imagine we never did this trade

having both whitlocks developing on our list

Fisher offers more than Daniel as at least he has pace

 

[Possession]

just imagine we never did this trade

having both whitlocks developing on our list

Fisher offers more than Daniel as at least he has pace

Brady should be gone already because of this trade. Clarko not far behind if he insists on glueing him to the whiteboard.

 

[perplexed]

Brady should be gone already because of this trade. Clarko not far behind if he insists on glueing him to the whiteboard.

I want Brady gone too, but this trade is on Clarko.

 

[Clarke is King]

Contracted until end of 2028!!!!!! WTF

 

[koshari]

Contracted until end of 2028!!!!!! WTF

only about 1000 days

 

[Shinboner Supremacy]

just imagine we never did this trade

having both whitlocks developing on our list

Fisher offers more than Daniel as at least he has pace

Having both Whitlocks would have been the smartest drafting a club has done in the past 10 years.

 

[Possession]

I want Brady gone too, but this trade is on Clarko.

I reckon it is too, but at the end of the day Brady is the list boss and the one leading negotiations for these deals. Giving up a second rounder for Daniel falls on him TBH, if he can't hold his ground against crazy Clarko then I worry about the rings that other list managers are running around him. He's had enough time.

Clarko will be more difficult to dislodge, but that will have to come too at some point.

 

[King Corey]

I want Brady gone too, but this trade is on Clarko.

You can tell that from the outside with 99.99% accuracy I reckon.

The senior coach is allowed the occasional recruitment captain's call but the B&F placing and continual position of responsibility in defence for Daniel is an indictment on Clarkson.

I can see why Kennett watched the Clarkson of late 2010s and started succession planning.

He was building a conga line of shit trades by then.

 

[El Capuano]

Caleb kicking little short ones that never hit me in the chest is my sleep paralysis demon

 

[shimaburnsgrieg]

just imagine we never did this trade

having both whitlocks developing on our list

Fisher offers more than Daniel as at least he has pace

And Clarko has the gall to come out and say the draft doesn't really work anymore....he's a hint Clarko - don't trade out your 1st and 2nd rounders ......use the draft the way it is intended!

 

[King Corey]

And Clarko has the gall to come out and say the draft doesn't really work anymore....he's a hint Clarko - don't trade out your 1st and 2nd rounders ......use the draft the way it is intended!

Great point.

As nostra said we could've easily taken both Whitlocks and be laughing.

Instead...

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

You can tell that from the outside with 99.99% accuracy I reckon.

The senior coach is allowed the occasional recruitment captain's call but the B&F placing and continual position of responsibility in defence for Daniel is an indictment on Clarkson.

I can see why Kennett watched the Clarkson of late 2010s and started succession planning.

He was building a conga line of shit trades by then.

He has it stuck in his mind that the concept he envisions ‘should’ work.

Bottom line is, empirical evidence confirms it ****ing doesn’t.

 

[ferball]

You can tell that from the outside with 99.99% accuracy I reckon.

The senior coach is allowed the occasional recruitment captain's call but the B&F placing and continual position of responsibility in defence for Daniel is an indictment on Clarkson.

I can see why Kennett watched the Clarkson of late 2010s and started succession planning.

He was building a conga line of shit trades by then.

This is a list of Clarkson's "shit trades" at Hawthorn in the late 2010s.

2016 - Tom Mitchell, Jaeger O'Meara, Ty Vickery (RFA) Ricky Henderson (DFA).
2017 - Jarman Impey, Changkuoth Jiath (Unregistered player pick).
2018 - Tom Scully, Chad Wingard, James Scrimshaw.
2019 - Jon Patton, Sam Frost, Harrison Pepper (Zone selection???)

Maybe three failures (Patton, Pepper and Vickery) from 11 players in that period and if Patton wasn't a creep he might have played well for them.

 

[King Corey]

This is a list of Clarkson's "shit trades" at Hawthorn in the late 2010s.

2016 - Tom Mitchell, Jaeger O'Meara, Ty Vickery (RFA) Ricky Henderson (DFA).
2017 - Jarman Impey, Changkuoth Jiath (Unregistered player pick).
2018 - Tom Scully, Chad Wingard, James Scrimshaw.
2019 - Jon Patton, Sam Frost, Harrison Pepper (Zone selection???)

Maybe three failures (Patton, Pepper and Vickery) from 11 players in that period and if Patton wasn't a creep he might have played well for them.

Fair call. Scully and Patton were fresh in mind as fails. The rest bar Vickery are decent.

I honestly have no idea who Harrison Pepper is.

I wouldn't give him credit for Jiath, he would've been a recruiting call imo.

 

[FlyHigh18]

I get that he's a premiership player and knows what it takes in terms of commitment and training. Two things we've been severely lacking but it finally getting better thanks to the inclusion of him, JD and Parker.

But can't he still provide that mentorship without being part of game day?

 

[hilly]

Pick 25!

 

[ferball]

Fair call. Scully and Patton were fresh in mind as fails. The rest bar Vickery are decent.

I honestly have no idea who Harrison Pepper is.

I wouldn't give him credit for Jiath, he would've been a recruiting call imo.

Fair enough. I just included everyone who wasn't in some draft, atho Jiath is the type Clarkson liked. No idea who Pepper is either (apart from one of my kids' guinea pigs.)

I dunno if Clarkson was cooked or not at Hawthorn or how much of the issues they faced was due to the the culture (Ie racism and snobbery) and the toxic relationship between him and Jeffed.com.

Reality is he scraped into 2013 and 2014 gfs by less than a goal and lost the 2015 QF in Perth by over five goals to the WC (who they eventually beat in the GF.)

Still has four flags to his name tho.

 

[perplexed]

This is a list of Clarkson's "shit trades" at Hawthorn in the late 2010s.

2016 - Tom Mitchell, Jaeger O'Meara, Ty Vickery (RFA) Ricky Henderson (DFA).
2017 - Jarman Impey, Changkuoth Jiath (Unregistered player pick).
2018 - Tom Scully, Chad Wingard, James Scrimshaw.
2019 - Jon Patton, Sam Frost, Harrison Pepper (Zone selection???)

Maybe three failures (Patton, Pepper and Vickery) from 11 players in that period and if Patton wasn't a creep he might have played well for them.

Not as bad as I thought. Especially Impey and Scrimshaw, they have been big wins. But I think you are being generous with the O'Meara and Wingard trades. Their output at Hawthorn didn't come close to matching the cost.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

Not as bad as I thought. Especially Impey and Scrimshaw, they have been big wins. But I think you are being generous with the O'Meara and Wingard trades. Their output at Hawthorn didn't come close to matching the cost.

Thats the key point.

Output relative to cost.

 

[ferball]

Not as bad as I thought. Especially Impey and Scrimshaw, they have been big wins. But I think you are being generous with the O'Meara and Wingard trades. Their output at Hawthorn didn't come close to matching the cost.

O'Meara was 10 and f2 (pick 26 became Liam Ryan.) At the same time he got 130+ coaches votes and 40+ Brownlow votes over that time and was pretty good in Clarkson's last year. He was probably worth a pick 10 anf f2 across that time. I think it was a reasonable trade. O'Meara is still playing good football.

You're probably right about Wingard tho. At the same time when he was traded he was a quality player. Just never achieved much at Hawthorn. Pretty expensive I spose.

 

[ferball]

Thats the key point.

Output relative to cost.

Relative to the cost of all those trades Clarkson wins from 2016 - 2019 inclusive. Easily.

Mitchell, O'Meara, Impey, Scrimshaw were good - Scully (traded for a F4), Frost, even Patton (r4 pick) weren't costly and provided at least equivalent value imo.

Wingard didn't.

That's the Hawthorn trades from 2016-19.

Some of those players are still playing good footy at Hawthorn nearly a decade later, others won a Brownlow, AFLPA MVP, multiple B&Fs and AAs and were crucial players for years (Mitchell, O'Meara, Frost). They also provided draft capital and players like Meek when on traded.

Scully and Patton for 4th rounders - meh worth a shot. Only Wingard is a fail.

 

[ferball]

In 2020 he traded a F4 for Kyle Hartigan

28

Kyle Hartigan

Age

34

Ht

194cm

Wt

101kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.8

3star

K

6.8

3star

HB

5.0

4star

M

4.6

4star

T

1.3

3star

MG

111.0

2star

D

9.3

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.3

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.3

2star

MG

111.0

2star

D

18.2

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

8.6

5star

M

7.4

5star

T

0.6

3star

.

Again meh...

 

[Its a Process]

This is a list of Clarkson's "shit trades" at Hawthorn in the late 2010s.

2016 - Tom Mitchell, Jaeger O'Meara, Ty Vickery (RFA) Ricky Henderson (DFA).
2017 - Jarman Impey, Changkuoth Jiath (Unregistered player pick).
2018 - Tom Scully, Chad Wingard, James Scrimshaw.
2019 - Jon Patton, Sam Frost, Harrison Pepper (Zone selection???)

Maybe three failures (Patton, Pepper and Vickery) from 11 players in that period and if Patton wasn't a creep he might have played well for them.

I was positive that Karl Amon was one of his as well, could be wrong.

 

[TennisPlayerAndy]

I was positive that Karl Amon was one of his as well, could be wrong.

FA wasn’t he?

 

[speedy]

First step to turning this thing around is dropping Caleb. Even if we have to sack the coach to do it.
They got to own up to their mistakes before they can correct this thing.