List Mgmt. Affirmative action approach required with our recruitment?

Remove this Banner Ad

swoop42

Norm Smith Medallist
Sep 29, 2014
6,590
16,051
The 18
AFL Club
Collingwood
If I recall correctly the names of Stack and Pickett were identified as potential recruitment targets by the likes of Snoop Dog and Knightmare long before they were drafted. They came with a few queries attached and like 17 other clubs we decided to overlook both.

Richmond though were prepared to give them a chance with Hardwick even going the extra mile by hosting Stack at his home like he had previously done with Rioli. He should be congratulated on this.

We don't have to like Richmond but to their credit I think we can learn a thing or two about fostering indigenous talent as our history is rather embarrassing in this area with Davis our only real success story when it comes to developing from within.

Personally I like the idea of creating a position within the club that is focused on the welfare and development of indigenous talent and those from other minority groups.

By all reports Varcoe and Wells are already seen within our ranks as great mentors to our young players so extending their abilities to this role would seem a natural progression for one of them.

Take this step though then I feel we need to take an affirmative action approach with recruitment.

Now that doesn't mean we overlook a far more talented footballer in favour of someone simply because they're indigenous or other minority but if it's a close call or it involves the use of a speculative selection like a 4th round or rookie pick then I'd like to see us weight more decisions in favour of them across the decade.

My thinking here with indigenous recruitment in particular is somewhat in line with the philosophy that Brisbane have taken in recent seasons where they've looked to take players in a draft that have some form of connection whether that be because they played junior football against each other or come from country regions.

Recruiting one indigenous kid then following that up spasmodically is not the way to improve our ability to nurture the talent available within this community IMO. We need to take multiple indigenous players in the one draft and/or across successive years as it's not unreasonable to suggest that young players settle and thrive in a new environment easier when confronted with more people they can easily identify with.

While I don't believe we have any racist intent in our drafting I don't feel we're as prepared as some clubs to take on as many players who might come with added baggage attached because of a disadvantaged background.

While my viewpoint might be controversial to some after 120 years of existence for the Collingwood Football Club don't you wish we had more examples of success to show when it comes to developing indigenous footballers?

I do and it's time to make a concerted effort to improve in this area.
 
i've said a couple of times here that i thought the recruitment of wells would mean that we would recruit further young indigenous players so he could mentor them. Wells is gone and Varcoe will be gone next year maybe.... I'm not even sure why we have that section of the NT that we visit each year....
 
i've said a couple of times here that i thought the recruitment of wells would mean that we would recruit further young indigenous players so he could mentor them. Wells is gone and Varcoe will be gone next year maybe.... I'm not even sure why we have that section of the NT that we visit each year....
Wells will be staying with the club in some sort of role.
 

Log in to remove this ad.

The one is Bennell realistically. Comes with a history, but so did Stack and Pickett.

We've done it previously with Krakouer and that worked out pretty well I reckon.

Otherwise, I'm all for backing in our culture to develop indigenous talent. I think we lack some good indigenous talent on our list.
 
Joely06 posted that wells had been appointed to a list management role in the Wells thread though I don’t think there’s been a formal announcement by the club.
Hope it’s true and hope Varcs has an opportunity to continue with us in a similar role.
I think the club under Bucks and Eddie would be a good place to nurture some young indigenous talent. Our netball and AFLW, VFLW and Wheelchair athletes teams also provide an opportunity to develop some positive relationships with indigenous communities.
 
If I recall correctly the names of Stack and Pickett were identified as potential recruitment targets by the likes of Snoop Dog and Knightmare long before they were drafted. They came with a few queries attached and like 17 other clubs we decided to overlook both.

Richmond though were prepared to give them a chance with Hardwick even going the extra mile by hosting Stack at his home like he had previously done with Rioli. He should be congratulated on this.

We don't have to like Richmond but to their credit I think we can learn a thing or two about fostering indigenous talent as our history is rather embarrassing in this area with Davis our only real success story when it comes to developing from within.

Personally I like the idea of creating a position within the club that is focused on the welfare and development of indigenous talent and those from other minority groups.

By all reports Varcoe and Wells are already seen within our ranks as great mentors to our young players so extending their abilities to this role would seem a natural progression for one of them.

Take this step though then I feel we need to take an affirmative action approach with recruitment.

Now that doesn't mean we overlook a far more talented footballer in favour of someone simply because they're indigenous or other minority but if it's a close call or it involves the use of a speculative selection like a 4th round or rookie pick then I'd like to see us weight more decisions in favour of them across the decade.

My thinking here with indigenous recruitment in particular is somewhat in line with the philosophy that Brisbane have taken in recent seasons where they've looked to take players in a draft that have some form of connection whether that be because they played junior football against each other or come from country regions.

Recruiting one indigenous kid then following that up spasmodically is not the way to improve our ability to nurture the talent available within this community IMO. We need to take multiple indigenous players in the one draft and/or across successive years as it's not unreasonable to suggest that young players settle and thrive in a new environment easier when confronted with more people they can easily identify with.

While I don't believe we have any racist intent in our drafting I don't feel we're as prepared as some clubs to take on as many players who might come with added baggage attached because of a disadvantaged background.

While my viewpoint might be controversial to some after 120 years of existence for the Collingwood Football Club don't you wish we had more examples of success to show when it comes to developing indigenous footballers?

I do and it's time to make a concerted effort to improve in this area.
Great post and completely agree with you, hopefully it begins this year in the draft
 
If I recall correctly the names of Stack and Pickett were identified as potential recruitment targets by the likes of Snoop Dog and Knightmare long before they were drafted. They came with a few queries attached and like 17 other clubs we decided to overlook both.

Richmond though were prepared to give them a chance with Hardwick even going the extra mile by hosting Stack at his home like he had previously done with Rioli. He should be congratulated on this.

We don't have to like Richmond but to their credit I think we can learn a thing or two about fostering indigenous talent as our history is rather embarrassing in this area with Davis our only real success story when it comes to developing from within.

Personally I like the idea of creating a position within the club that is focused on the welfare and development of indigenous talent and those from other minority groups.

By all reports Varcoe and Wells are already seen within our ranks as great mentors to our young players so extending their abilities to this role would seem a natural progression for one of them.

Take this step though then I feel we need to take an affirmative action approach with recruitment.

Now that doesn't mean we overlook a far more talented footballer in favour of someone simply because they're indigenous or other minority but if it's a close call or it involves the use of a speculative selection like a 4th round or rookie pick then I'd like to see us weight more decisions in favour of them across the decade.

My thinking here with indigenous recruitment in particular is somewhat in line with the philosophy that Brisbane have taken in recent seasons where they've looked to take players in a draft that have some form of connection whether that be because they played junior football against each other or come from country regions.

Recruiting one indigenous kid then following that up spasmodically is not the way to improve our ability to nurture the talent available within this community IMO. We need to take multiple indigenous players in the one draft and/or across successive years as it's not unreasonable to suggest that young players settle and thrive in a new environment easier when confronted with more people they can easily identify with.

While I don't believe we have any racist intent in our drafting I don't feel we're as prepared as some clubs to take on as many players who might come with added baggage attached because of a disadvantaged background.

While my viewpoint might be controversial to some after 120 years of existence for the Collingwood Football Club don't you wish we had more examples of success to show when it comes to developing indigenous footballers?

I do and it's time to make a concerted effort to improve in this area.
D3B9165D-2B33-48F1-B34D-7D9B2E6E804B.jpeg
Surely we are heading in that direction with an Indigenous Board member.
I agree we need to do more regarding recruiting, development & understanding, with a splash of risk taking.
 
Joely06 posted that wells had been appointed to a list management role in the Wells thread though I don’t think there’s been a formal announcement by the club.
Hope it’s true and hope Varcs has an opportunity to continue with us in a similar role.
I think the club under Bucks and Eddie would be a good place to nurture some young indigenous talent. Our netball and AFLW, VFLW and Wheelchair athletes teams also provide an opportunity to develop some positive relationships with indigenous communities.

Well Reef McGinnis has indigenous blood in him
 
Wells will be staying with the club in some sort of role.

I read that thing on the afl site. Mentoring would probably work better if he was training alongside, dont you think? I dont want to sink the boot into crocker because he's a good kid but that selection should have been an indigenous kid... something more speculative.
 
Well Reef McGinnis has indigenous blood in him

I think the indigenous bit is only half the story. This kid goes to Scotch College, maybe under some kind of scholarship but it's still Scotch so he's moving on the right side of the tracks. The thing about Stack and Pickett is not only were they indigenous, they didn't qualify as "coming from a good family" as the recruiters say. Some clubs avoided them even though they had obvious talent. I dont think Reef is in that box. He'll get drafted if he has the goods.

So the trick is to get an indigenous player at a lower end draft pick, who might have been overlooked because he's seen as a bit risky in his private life..... I dont think anyone questioned whether stack or pickett had footy talent.
 
I think the indigenous bit is only half the story. This kid goes to Scotch College, maybe under some kind of scholarship but it's still Scotch so he's moving on the right side of the tracks. The thing about Stack and Pickett is not only were they indigenous, they didn't qualify as "coming from a good family" as the recruiters say. Some clubs avoided them even though they had obvious talent. I dont think Reef is in that box. He'll get drafted if he has the goods.

So the trick is to get an indigenous player at a lower end draft pick, who might have been overlooked because he's seen as a bit risky in his private life..... I dont think anyone questioned whether stack or pickett had footy talent.

I remember we did that in 2008 with Jamie Bennell and that did not work out and something like Kirk Ugle
 

(Log in to remove this ad.)

lots of players dont work out. Josh Daicos mightnt work out.... it doesnt mean we should stay away from father sons ....or guys with greek ancestors....

True but I am pointing it does not always works out
 
The fact you think Davis was our only success story sums up our Club IMO in Grand Finals.....it is either a Freadiun slip or this thread needs to be disintegrated.
 
Daicos is Macedonian, calling him Greek could be quite dangerous

I always thought the family were greek macedonian which means that they are greek but from the northern parts that was part of macedonia years ago. But if I'm wrong, I publicly apologise and will issue a statement to be read out on SBS
 
I always thought the family were greek macedonian which means that they are greek but from the northern parts that was part of macedonia years ago. But if I'm wrong, I publicly apologise and will issue a statement to be read out on SBS
I was only joking but these days with Macedonia having it's own country it's a little more sensitive for some people as I found out a few times in the past
 
I reckon we should go with the revolutionary strategy of not being concerned about race when we're recruiting. Then employ support staff who can assist transition and offer ongoing support for our players, regardless of race. That way we're less likely to have guys who are struggling emotionally like some of our guys have talked about recently - our indigenous kids Treloar, Mayne and Beams. Diversity of our staff will help and yes, support may require bringing in some cultural experts at times, but do we really need to allocate a staff member to solely look after the emotional needs of what is currently 2% of our playing list and may become 10-15% in the future.
 
The one is Bennell realistically. Comes with a history, but so did Stack and Pickett.

We've done it previously with Krakouer and that worked out pretty well I reckon.

Otherwise, I'm all for backing in our culture to develop indigenous talent. I think we lack some good indigenous talent on our list.

Fair bit of difference with history between Bennell and those 2.

I don't think we need affirmative action plan as that usually dictates giving indigenous a role regardless of their qualification to hold the role which is what happens in many work placements.

I do however think we need to increase our drafting of indigenous players if they possess the talent, note there is a difference, as I feel the club see them as a higher failure risk and if 2 players of similar talent are available we will pick the "safer" option.

Have a look at Derrek Hines drafting record with indigenous youth and you will find his initial 7 years at the club was very proactive in the area then he had a philosophy change and rarely drafted them there after preferring to trade senior indigenous talent in instead.


Hines reign started end of 04:
*Chris Egan
(2005)
*Brad Dick
(2007)
*Shannon Cox
(2007 rookie)
*Sharrod Wellingham
(2008 rookie)
*John Bennell
(2008 rookie)
Anthony Corrie
(2009)
*Kirk Ugle
(2011)
Andrew Krakouer
(2011)
*Peter Yagmoor
(2012)

End of 2012 Matt Rendell joins pies team after support from Dekka around the 1 white parent or good family background discussion. The next 7 years our indigenous recruiting has vastly less drafted and more focus on senior talent.

Tony Armstrong
(2014)
Travis Varcoe
(2015)
*Kayle Kirby
(2016 rookie)
*Mitch Mcarthy
(2016 Rookie
Daniel Wells
(2017)


Clearly a change in philosophy from Hines initial years to his later years, propensity towards trading in indigenous talent over hitting the draft board especially with nominal draft picks (not rookie).

Now I don't think they are racist but I do think they deem the risk too high on new young talent and have looked at minimising it by trading in senior players over the draft and development route.

Hopefully we start to see a change in attitude soon as I think we have missed some good small fwd talent due to it.
 
Fair bit of difference with history between Bennell and those 2.

I don't think we need affirmative action plan as that usually dictates giving indigenous a role regardless of their qualification to hold the role which is what happens in many work placements.

I do however think we need to increase our drafting of indigenous players if they possess the talent, note there is a difference, as I feel the club see them as a higher failure risk and if 2 players of similar talent are available we will pick the "safer" option.

Have a look at Derrek Hines drafting record with indigenous youth and you will find his initial 7 years at the club was very proactive in the area then he had a philosophy change and rarely drafted them there after preferring to trade senior indigenous talent in instead.


Hines reign started end of 04:
*Chris Egan
(2005)
*Brad Dick
(2007)
*Shannon Cox
(2007 rookie)
*Sharrod Wellingham
(2008 rookie)
*John Bennell
(2008 rookie)
Anthony Corrie
(2009)
*Kirk Ugle
(2011)
Andrew Krakouer
(2011)
*Peter Yagmoor
(2012)

End of 2012 Matt Rendell joins pies team after support from Dekka around the 1 white parent or good family background discussion. The next 7 years our indigenous recruiting has vastly less drafted and more focus on senior talent.

Tony Armstrong
(2014)
Travis Varcoe
(2015)
*Kayle Kirby
(2016 rookie)
*Mitch Mcarthy
(2016 Rookie
Daniel Wells
(2017)


Clearly a change in philosophy from Hines initial years to his later years, propensity towards trading in indigenous talent over hitting the draft board especially with nominal draft picks (not rookie).

Now I don't think they are racist but I do think they deem the risk too high on new young talent and have looked at minimising it by trading in senior players over the draft and development route.

Hopefully we start to see a change in attitude soon as I think we have missed some good small fwd talent due to it.
Looking at that list, despite being cautious, we've still had a pretty abysmal hit rate with indigenous kids.

Hine has really changed his approach to the rookie list. Whereas he used to use it to chase exciting types with a high ceiling like Shannon Cox, he now uses it for depth and hard working types.
 

Remove this Banner Ad

Back
Top