Society/Culture Alex Pearce supports Palestine/promotes terrorism depending who you ask

[EconomicDecline]

I would love to entertain your “ackshewally” hot take on whether the Nazis were bad guys but I really can’t be ****ed

Sorry. I just took out one piece instead of seeing you were referring to WW2

Yes. A nation carrying out a genocide against a populace is inherently evil. Glad we are in agreement about past and current events.

 

[Harlott]

The atrocity that was committed on October 7th was reprehensible and those who participated in the unlawful killing of civilians should be brought to justice. This is my steadfast opinion and it has not wavered.

Over to you...

You should know this wanting to acknowledge two sides of the situation doesn’t work on genocidal apologists.

 

[ElectricG]

It's literally the definition of censorship.

No it absolutely, categorically is not.

As for the first question. Do you disagree that the Israeli government are engaging in unlawful conduct which would be considered terrorist activity if it wasn't being conducted by a nation state?

Not really. Russia has killed a lot of innocent people in Ukraine, but I would still say that what they’re doing is a war, not “terrorism”. I think Israel’s presence in Gaza is more justifiable than Russia’s in Ukraine, if that helps to answer your question.

 

[Harlott]

No it absolutely, categorically is not.

Not really. Russia has killed a lot of innocent people in Ukraine, but I would still say that what they’re doing is a war, not “terrorism”. I think Israel’s presence in Gaza is more justifiable than Russia’s in Ukraine, if that helps to answer your question.

“Presence” big farken lol

 

[Carn The Berries]

No it absolutely, categorically is not.

Not really. Russia has killed a lot of innocent people in Ukraine, but I would still say that what they’re doing is a war, not “terrorism”. I think Israel’s presence in Gaza is more justifiable than Russia’s in Ukraine, if that helps to answer your question.

So you don't believe someone is being CENSORED if they're made to apologise for having an opinion?

Israel-Gaza war in maps and charts: Live tracker

The latest death toll stands at 62,614 Palestinians and 1,139 people killed in Israel since October 7, 2023.

www.aljazeera.com

That's justified is it?

 

[jannissary]

the dictionary defines censorship as: the action of preventing part or the whole of a book, film, work of art, document, or other kind of communication from being seen or made available to the public, because it is considered to be offensive or harmful, or because it contains information that someone wishes to keep secret, often for political reasons.

I think in this case, calling for Alex Pearce

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Alex Pearce

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to censor and apologise for simply having an opinion that YOU disagree with is, at it's core, censorship.

 

[Carn The Berries]

You don’t see the same celebrating of civilian casualties on the other side of the aisle. When that happens I’ll happily agree that it’s bad.

The atrocity that was committed on October 7th was reprehensible and those who participated in the unlawful killing of civilians should be brought to justice. This is my steadfast opinion and it has not wavered.

Over to you...

No it absolutely, categorically is not.

Not really. Russia has killed a lot of innocent people in Ukraine, but I would still say that what they’re doing is a war, not “terrorism”. I think Israel’s presence in Gaza is more justifiable than Russia’s in Ukraine, if that helps to answer your question.

Yeah... Didn't think you would...

 

[Harlott]

Electric G will be asking for apologies from everyone saying “Free Palestine” soon

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/benjamin-netanyahu-compares-shooters-cry-of-free-palestine-to-yelling-heil-hitler/news-story/c13f6245a9572e5a0ffc93e023e3c66a

 

[ElectricG]

So you don't believe someone is being CENSORED if they're made to apologise for having an opinion?

Me being here, on bigfooty, saying I think he should apologise. No, there is no reality in which that is censorship.

That's justified is it?

Look I can give you my full take, but you’re not gonna like it.

Israel and Palestine are countries which both have a right to exist. What Israel is doing is the result of its stated goals:

• elimination of Hamas
• bolstering it’s security following oct 7
• retribution for oct 7

And also its unstated or less stated goals:

• further displacement of the Palestinian population (genocide)
• opportune expansion of its borders

So to support Israel is to support the defensible, the indefensible, or some combination of the two. Someone might see civilian casualties as a sad reality of a justified war, or the primary objective of Israel’s actions. I.e., is this the bombing of Dresden, or is Israel just doing its own larger version of October 7?

Hamas, on the other hand, is a political and religious project dedicated to an undying, racist hatred of Jews and wanting them dead. They want maximal civilian death of the Jews, and maximal civilian death of their own people. If they had the same military as arsenal they would be doing much, much worse things. You can’t accuse them of war crimes, because the things they set out to do are the same things we call war crimes.

So I think Israel is a country which is doing some defensible things and a lot of bad things. Hamas is a purely evil and racist entity which is best eliminated.

Saying you support Israel or Palestine is defensible in that you may simply sympathise with the plight of its people. To support Hamas is not something that can be defended, imo.

 

[Carn The Berries]

Me being here, on bigfooty, saying I think he should apologise. No, there is no reality in which that is censorship.

Look I can give you my full take, but you’re not gonna like it.

Israel and Palestine are countries which both have a right to exist. What Israel is doing is the result of its stated goals:

• elimination of Hamas
• bolstering it’s security following oct 7
• retribution for oct 7

And also its unstated or less stated goals:

• further displacement of the Palestinian population (genocide)
• opportune expansion of its borders

So to support Israel is to support the defensible, the indefensible, or some combination of the two. Someone might see civilian casualties as a sad reality of a justified war, or the primary objective of Israel’s actions. I.e., is this the bombing of Dresden, or is Israel just doing its own larger version of October 7?

Hamas, on the other hand, is a political and religious project dedicated to an undying, racist hatred of Jews and wanting them dead. They want maximal civilian death of the Jews, and maximal civilian death of their own people. If they had the same military as arsenal they would be doing much, much worse things. You can’t accuse them of war crimes, because the things they set out to do are the same things we call war crimes.

So I think Israel is a country which is doing some defensible things and a lot of bad things. Hamas is a purely evil and racist entity which is best eliminated.

Saying you support Israel or Palestine is defensible in that you may simply sympathise with the plight of its people. To support Hamas is not something that can be defended, imo.

Now we're getting to the crux of it... I knew we'd get there eventually.

You absolutely cannot support Hamas (which I entirely agree with) because they only do bad things.

You absolutely CAN support Israel because, despite the overwhelming evidence they they are engaging in genocide and trying to displace Palestinians who have every right to be where they are, they do some things that might be ok.

 

[EconomicDecline]

Me being here, on bigfooty, saying I think he should apologise. No, there is no reality in which that is censorship.

Look I can give you my full take, but you’re not gonna like it.

Israel and Palestine are countries which both have a right to exist. What Israel is doing is the result of its stated goals:

• elimination of Hamas
• bolstering it’s security following oct 7
• retribution for oct 7

And also its unstated or less stated goals:

• further displacement of the Palestinian population (genocide)
• opportune expansion of its borders

So to support Israel is to support the defensible, the indefensible, or some combination of the two. Someone might see civilian casualties as a sad reality of a justified war, or the primary objective of Israel’s actions. I.e., is this the bombing of Dresden, or is Israel just doing its own larger version of October 7?

Hamas, on the other hand, is a political and religious project dedicated to an undying, racist hatred of Jews and wanting them dead. They want maximal civilian death of the Jews, and maximal civilian death of their own people. If they had the same military as arsenal they would be doing much, much worse things. You can’t accuse them of war crimes, because the things they set out to do are the same things we call war crimes.

So I think Israel is a country which is doing some defensible things and a lot of bad things. Hamas is a purely evil and racist entity which is best eliminated.

Saying you support Israel or Palestine is defensible in that you may simply sympathise with the plight of its people. To support Hamas is not something that can be defended, imo.

So Operation Cast Lead was indefensible, right?

 

[ElectricG]

You absolutely cannot support Hamas (which I entirely agree with) because they only do bad things.

By conceding this point, does this mean you’ve come around to the notion that kneecap have done a bad thing by promoting them, and at the very least, Pearce was imprudent in reposting them?

 

[Carn The Berries]

By conceding this point, does this mean you’ve come around to the notion that kneecap have done a bad thing by promoting them, and at the very least, Pearce was imprudent in reposting them?

Not unless you've come around to the notion that by saying things like "Israel's presence in Gaza is justified" is tacit support for Genocide??

 

[ElectricG]

Not unless you've come around to the notion that by saying things like "Israel's presence in Gaza is justified" is tacit support for Genocide??

Why does you thinking one thing hinge on me thinking something else

 

[Carn The Berries]

Why does you thinking one thing hinge on me thinking something else

Some of Kneecap's behaviour should absolutely be called out (the latest thing with the flag is dumb and best and deliberately provocative).

Should Pearce be hung, drawn and quartered for re-posting an innocuous post about the genocide that is happening in Gaza? Absolutely not

If he were to post supporting what has happened in the last 24 hours that would be a different story.

There's my thinking. Time to hear yours.

Not unless you've come around to the notion that by saying things like "Israel's presence in Gaza is justified" is tacit support for Genocide??

 

[ElectricG]

Some of Kneecap's behaviour should absolutely be called out (the latest thing with the flag is dumb and best and deliberately provocative).

Should Pearce be hung, drawn and quartered for re-posting an innocuous post about the genocide that is happening in Gaza? Absolutely not

If he were to post supporting what has happened in the last 24 hours that would be a different story.

There's my thinking. Time to hear yours.

lol hung drawn and quartered are your words not mine.

For the other question. I think Israel have a moral duty to its citizens to eliminate Hamas, and that inevitably involves a presence in Gaza. Given Hamas are embedded in the population, the number of civilian casualties was never going to be zero. So somebody could say that Israel have a right to enter Gaza and not support genocide. It’s the numbers emerging since then that are harder to defend.

I dunno if you are frustrated that I’m not giving a straight answer. But as I’ve stated previously I maintain that the Israel Hamas war is a struggle between the bad and the worse. I am not above the human impulse to “pick a side” and I don’t think any of us here are, and I would always lean towards the mixed bag rather than the purely evil.

 

[Carn The Berries]

lol hung drawn and quartered are your words not mine.

For the other question. I think Israel have a moral duty to its citizens to eliminate Hamas, and that inevitably involves a presence in Gaza. Given Hamas are embedded in the population, the number of civilian casualties was never going to be zero. So somebody could say that Israel have a right to enter Gaza and not support genocide. It’s the numbers emerging since then that are harder to defend.

I dunno if you are frustrated that I’m not giving a straight answer. But as I’ve stated previously I maintain that the Israel Hamas war is a struggle between the bad and the worse. I am not above the human impulse to “pick a side” and I don’t think any of us here are, and I would always lean towards the mixed bag rather than the purely evil.

You say the numbers are harder to defend, yet haven't said a single word to suggest that Israel should change tactics or reduce their military presence in the area.

You also don't have to "pick a side" Hamas are bad... What the state of Israel is doing in response to that is bad... You can actually condemn both of them (see... I just did).

 

[Carn The Berries]

lol hung drawn and quartered are your words not mine.

For the other question. I think Israel have a moral duty to its citizens to eliminate Hamas, and that inevitably involves a presence in Gaza. Given Hamas are embedded in the population, the number of civilian casualties was never going to be zero. So somebody could say that Israel have a right to enter Gaza and not support genocide. It’s the numbers emerging since then that are harder to defend.

I dunno if you are frustrated that I’m not giving a straight answer. But as I’ve stated previously I maintain that the Israel Hamas war is a struggle between the bad and the worse. I am not above the human impulse to “pick a side” and I don’t think any of us here are, and I would always lean towards the mixed bag rather than the purely evil.

It's not "harder to defend"... It's impossible to defend unless you believe that the forced relocation of an entire populace and the killing of tens of thousands of civilians are "necessary" actions for a country to "defend itself".

 

[ElectricG]

You say the numbers are harder to defend, yet haven't said a single word to suggest that Israel should change tactics or reduce their military presence in the area.

You also don't have to "pick a side" Hamas are bad... What the state of Israel is doing in response to that is bad... You can actually condemn both of them (see... I just did).

Come on man. You’ve all picked your side, in spite of you being the only one to finally admit that terrorist organisations are bad. One other bloke on here wouldn’t even come around to the idea of Hamas being terrorists.

I condemn Israel’s genocide against the Palestinians! See! Easy! It’s just not that simple.

It's not "harder to defend"... It's impossible to defend unless you believe that the forced relocation of an entire populace and the killing of tens of thousands of civilians are "necessary" actions for a country to "defend itself".

I’m not going to argue with that. Out of curiosity what do you think Israel should’ve done following October 7?

 

[neko]

Getting back to the topic of Alex Pearce

25

Alex Pearce

Age

30

Ht

201cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.6

3star

K

5.2

2star

HB

5.4

4star

M

3.4

3star

T

1.8

4star

MG

106.3

2star

No current season stats available

D

11.0

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

6.0

4star

M

4.4

4star

T

0.8

3star

MG

103.2

2star

and his social media activity, supporting Palestine isn't a problem. The way you support Palestine matters, though. Kneecap seem to me to be broadly provocative, if I were to describe them charitably. There are ways to express support for Palestinian civilians without directly endorsing terrorists and/or displaying their flags. If I was Pearce and had shared the post without knowing anything about Kneecap, I would be embarassed and apologise after it, unsurprisingly, blew up.

 

[Carn The Berries]

Come on man. You’ve all picked your side, in spite of you being the only one to finally admit that terrorist organisations are bad. One other bloke on here wouldn’t even come around to the idea of Hamas being terrorists.

I condemn Israel’s genocide against the Palestinians! See! Easy! It’s just not that simple.

I’m not going to argue with that. Out of curiosity what do you think Israel should’ve done following October 7?

Here's a couple of things, just off the top of my head.

• Not put a complete ban on aid under the pretense that Hamas are keeping it all for themselves
• Not attacked a clearly marked aid convoy
• Not entered a hospital dressed as Doctors
• Not wiped out nearly every residential building on the Gaza strip
• Actually entered good faith negotiations to facilitate the release of hostages (my personal opinion is that the Israeli government are quite happy for Hamas to keep the hostages, as it gives their actions "legitimacy")
• Not attacked any refugee camps

 

[Carn The Berries]

Getting back to the topic of Alex Pearce and his social media activity, supporting Palestine isn't a problem. The way you support Palestine matters, though. Kneecap seem to me to be broadly provocative, if I were to describe them charitably. There are ways to express support for Palestinian civilians without directly endorsing terrorists and/or displaying their flags. If I was Pearce and had shared the post without knowing anything about Kneecap, I would be embarassed and apologise after it, unsurprisingly, blew up.

But, as has been discussed in this thread, that's holding Pearce to a different standard. There have been posters in here who are happy to say that they support the Israeli military action is necessary to defend their country, but try to argue that that doesn't mean they support the genocidal tactics being used to do so.

That is why it matters.

 

[ElectricG]

Here's a couple of things, just off the top of my head.

• Not put a complete ban on aid under the pretense that Hamas are keeping it all for themselves
• Not attacked a clearly marked aid convoy
• Not entered a hospital dressed as Doctors
• Not wiped out nearly every residential building on the Gaza strip
• Actually entered good faith negotiations to facilitate the release of hostages (my personal opinion is that the Israeli government are quite happy for Hamas to keep the hostages, as it gives their actions "legitimacy")
• Not attacked any refugee camps

I mean, you’re really writing your own script if you’re starting with “negotiate with terrorists” and “don’t conduct a conspiracy to get your own hostages killed”.

 

[Carn The Berries]

I mean, you’re really writing your own script if you’re starting with “negotiate with terrorists” and “don’t conduct a conspiracy to get your own hostages killed”.

Care to comment on more than just one dot point?

 

[ElectricG]

Care to comment on more than just one dot point?

I largely agree with those. But I think your actual position is to just cop October 7 on the chin and not start a war in the first place.