Beyond the GF – Why the MCG Contract doesn’t pass the Stink Test

[ItsAllAboutMe]

That is what the contract extension is about!!

The MCC will upgrade the Southern Stand in necade, and the $1+billion debt will be lumped with them. They then use the MCC fees to pay this off

That is the entire point of the extension, AFL gets it main stadium upgraded and it is MCC not the tax payers in Vic that pay it off.

The Vic government has always been prepared to step in and contribute, I am not sure the appetite is there mooring forward particularly with the debt we will be left after COVID.

AFL will more focussed on improving its own asset at docklands so won’t be hurrying to tip into the MCG. Vic has also missed out on hosting anything of significance at the Women’s Workd Cup so won’t be any money coming as a result of that.. The Andrew’s government has really dropped the ball on events and taken for granted that ‘we are the sporting city in the world’..

 

[Carringbush2010]

Why should we just accept when something is inequitable... particularly if it can be improved?

It would be a ordinary world if people just stood by & accepted all inequities & did nothing...

Because this league is a business and the market dictates the best practice economically is to have the championship game at the G and more broadly favours the largest market share. Regardless if it's a result of a dodgy government and mcc members, money is king.

Of course you don't have to accept what is, you could abandon it or continue to complain in futility. Your choice

 

[Noidnadroj]

Where is the US masters played? Augusta. Why? Tradition. Where does every professional golfer want to play the US masters? Augusta.

Where is the England Tennis major held? Wimbledon. Why? Tradition. Where do players want it played? Wimbledon.

Where is the AFL Grand Final played? MCG. Why? Tradition. Where do the actual players want the GF to be played? MCG.

Non-Vic teams more regularly get lead in finals advantage as it’s almost never neutral. Vic teams most often play lead in finals against co-tenants so get no advantage.

Vic clubs have to suck-up the neutral finals, and non-Vic teams have to suck up the GF at the MCG.

And let’s look at MCG GF performance by interstate teams:

1992 Eagles: Win
1994 Eagles: Win
1996 Swans: loss
1997 Adelaide: Win
1998 Adelaide: Win
2001: brisbane: win
2002: Brisbane : Win
2003 Brisbane: win
2007 Port: Loss
2012 Sydney : Win

So interstate teams against Vic teams won 8 of the first 10 MCG grand finals (Sydney and Port were big outsiders in each losing GF) So was there something they put into the water that magically introduced a disadvantage? Or maybe, just maybe, in a GF the best team wins.


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[ItsAllAboutMe]

World Cup, Super Bowl, Champions league.. all shared around the globe.

 

[Rich01]

AFL will more focussed on improving its own asset at docklands so won’t be hurrying to tip into the MCG.

How are the AFL tipping into the MCG as part of the agreement?

 

[GhostofJimJess]

How many teams does new york have in the nfl

A city with the population of australia?

Just as well it wasn't me who was claiming that number of teams needs to be correlated with a city's population then, isn't it. The bloke I was responding to thought Melbourne wasn't big enough to accommodate nine firmly established and traditional teams who have all shown they can pull pretty decent TV audiences and live crowds when successful, but then wants new franchises in cities smaller than 250k. How does that make any sense?

 

[kranky al]

Tassie should have a team in front of Gold Coast, GWS, Melbourne and North.

Canberra if it keeps growing in size could have a team. Both Rugby and the NRL got the headstart and have had a generation, even 2 generations of lost hearts and minds.

I dont think Darwin is viable. The population is too small and transient.
I also think Far North Queensland is a pipe dream.

The perfectly balanced league would be:
7 Melbourne
1 Geelong.
2 NSW
2 QLD
2 WA
2 SA
1Tas
1 ACT

Dont jnow how a team would go in canberra - even in the aussie rules clubs if you went to watch the footy you would be in a corner with a small screen and no volume.

Just as well it wasn't me who was claiming that number of teams needs to be correlated with a city's population then, isn't it. The bloke I was responding to thought Melbourne wasn't big enough to accommodate nine firmly established and traditional teams who have all shown they can pull pretty decent TV audiences and live crowds when successful, but then wants new franchises in cities smaller than 250k. How does that make any sense?

how many of those firmly established teams are on permadrip.

Last i checked we have a footy dept cap

 

[doppleganger]

World Cup, Super Bowl, Champions league.. all shared around the globe.

They arent a real comparison to AFL.

As noted earlier, the NFL has 32 stadiums and all are 60k+. And it isnt shared around equitably, 3 cities have hosted over half of the Superbowls. The NFL would never bother with a Superbowl in any AFL stadium except the G according to their own selection criteria.

Champions League isnt a national event, so why is it even a comparison?? Majority of soccer competitions all stage their national Cup Final at the biggest stadium in the major city. German final is at Olympic Stadium in Berlin, Hertha's home ground. Coppa Italia when a single final is at Roma's stadium in Rome.

World Cup, whether it be football, cricket, rugby...it is a global event that take entire counties who bid to host, again not really a comparison to an annual domestic competition. When Australia has hosted the cricket World Cup where has the final been every time, the MCG. Australia is hosting Twenty20 world cup for the first time this year, it will be at the MCG.

That isnt fair or equitable, and cricket fans in WA who want to attend will have to fly if they want to watch in person....but it is the solution that benefits the majority and maximises attendance.

It really isnt surprising, the MCG is clearly the standout stadium in Australia and has been for close to 100 years. If you want to maximise club members attending there is only 1 venue to host the event....anything else isnt an improvement as you are preventing fans the ability to access tickets.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

How are the AFL tipping into the MCG as part of the agreement?

They always do with every MCG Reno, or at least lobby Vic government, this won’t be the focus anymore

 

[GhostofJimJess]

Dont jnow how a team would go in canberra - even in the aussie rules clubs if you went to watch the footy you would be in a corner with a small screen and no volume.

how many of those firmly established teams are on permadrip.

Last i checked we have a footy dept cap

Luckily for the Eagles they're not on any form of perma- or even temporary drip as far as I know. They're loaded with cash and corporate sponsorship, fill their home stadium on a regular basis, and are batting at twice the league average for flags over their relatively short stint in the AFL. I really don't think they've got too much to worry about. Even Freo don't appear to be in any existential strife - although the last thing they should be concerning themselves with, after nearly 30 years and only one GF to their name, is where the grand final gets played.

To address your first sentence, it was clear the new franchises in western Sydney and the Gold Coast were a dual-prong attempt to 1) capitalise on a couple of huge population growth areas, and a little cynically 2) stifle the otherwise unchecked growth of soccer, perhaps at the expense of Aussie Rules. I'm no demographer, but I doubt Canberra has the growth capacity, certainly in the short term, that would provide a worthwhile investment for the AFL. And as romantic as it would be to all of us footy tragics, Victorian and otherwise, unfortunately Tassie and the NT don't either.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

It really isnt surprising, the MCG is clearly the standout stadium in Australia and has been for close to 100 years. If you want to maximise club members attending there is only 1 venue to host the event....anything else isnt an improvement as you are preventing fans the ability to access tickets.

This is just not true.. Perth and Adelaide stadiums are far superior to the MCG, Brisbane after comm games is likely to join them.. MCG has gone around as a myth of being the best in the world.. because it’s big.. The viewing experience from anywhere other than level 2 and on the wing is so bad most spectators spend the majority of the game watching the screen.. bigger isn’t always better. The atmosphere at these packed tight stadiums is far superior to that of the MCG and before you throw in the modern day gimmicks like light shows and lasers.

 

[kranky al]

Luckily for the Eagles they're not on any form of perma- or even temporary drip as far as I know. They're loaded with cash and corporate sponsorship, fill their home stadium on a regular basis, and are batting at twice the league average for flags over their relatively short stint in the AFL. I really don't think they've got too much to worry about. Even Freo don't appear to be in any existential strife - although the last thing they should be concerning themselves with, after nearly 30 years and only one GF to their name, is where the grand final gets played.

To address your first sentence, it was clear the new franchises in western Sydney and the Gold Coast were a dual-prong attempt to 1) capitalise on a couple of huge population growth areas, and a little cynically 2) stifle the otherwise unchecked growth of soccer, perhaps at the expense of Aussie Rules. I'm no demographer, but I doubt Canberra has the growth capacity, certainly in the short term, that would provide a worthwhile investment for the AFL. And as romantic as it would be to all of us footy tragics, Victorian and otherwise, unfortunately Tassie and the NT don't either.

Id not bother with canberra - theres more league heads there - tassie is heartland and will over acheive compared to its size.

Victorians continually underestimate other heartland states love for footy.

They think they have some kind of monopoly on loving the game

 

[doppleganger]

This is just not true.. Perth and Adelaide stadiums are far superior to the MCG,

No shit...a stadium built into the 90s doesnt measure up to stands built in the 2010s from a viewing comfort perspective.

Brisbane after comm games is likely to join them.. MCG has gone around as a myth of being the best in the world..

The point of extending the GF contract is that it gives the MCG and therefore MCC enough content to borrow the $1b+ they will require to upgrade the Southern Stand...

because it’s big.. The viewing experience from anywhere other than level 2 and on the wing is so bad most spectators spend the majority of the game watching the screen.. bigger isn’t always better.

Agree the GSS nosebleeds arent the best, but for a GF bigger is better....you dont want 40k watching the biggest event on the football calendar and stopping many club members getting a chance to see their team win live.

The atmosphere at these packed tight stadiums is far superior to that of the MCG and ore you throw in the modern day gimmicks like light shows and lasers.

Agree again, atmosphere of 45k at the G compared to 45k at Etihad or AO is poorer....because the G aint even half full.

Atmosphere at ANZAC dAY, big finals and GFs when the joint is heaving with close to 100k packed in cant be beat.

 

[Del28562]

He is not a Victorian, he is a South Australian, so unless you don't want to be called out when you stuff up, do your homework before you say something.

My original post inferred outside, meaning outside of the AFL system, the last 2 appointments in demitrou and Gil were internal appointments, I fully understand where gils from

 

[The_Wookie]

How are the AFL tipping into the MCG as part of the agreement?

Actually raises an interesting question Ive not considered before.

Up until the most recent extension the AFL was paing more than 5m a year towards the 2004 Northern Stand development. I havent seen anything that suggests that will apply to the Southern Stand when it happens even though its in this deal extension.

 

[ams4crows]

So if every state had a 100k seat stadium would you be fine with the GF moving around?

 

[kranky al]

So if every state had a 100k seat stadium would you be fine with the GF moving around?

The goalposts would be moved faster than scomo pisses off overseas in i crisis

 

[LoungeLizard]

So if every state had a 100k seat stadium would you be fine with the GF moving around?

I'm fine with it moving around now, wouldn't worry me one iota.

I am just laughing at the sooks who come running to every one of these threads, same sook, same arguments.

And they will answer with, "well if we don't say nothin, nothin will be done"
LMAO, yep, the powers that be are all here reading this.

 

[ItsAllAboutMe]

No sh*t...a stadium built into the 90s doesnt measure up to stands built in the 2010s from a viewing comfort perspective.


The point of extending the GF contract is that it gives the MCG and therefore MCC enough content to borrow the $1b+ they will require to upgrade the Southern Stand...

Agree the GSS nosebleeds arent the best, but for a GF bigger is better....you dont want 40k watching the biggest event on the football calendar and stopping many club members getting a chance to see their team win live.

Agree again, atmosphere of 45k at the G compared to 45k at Etihad or AO is poorer....because the G aint even half full.

Atmosphere at ANZAC dAY, big finals and GFs when the joint is heaving with close to 100k packed in cant be beat.

Agree, however the post i was replying to headined with a statement that the MCG is the clear standout stadium in the country.. Which you are now agreeing is not correct. The Perth & Adelaide stadiums hold 60k, not the 40k you quote and I suspect if they had the carrot of hosting a GF every 5 years or so they would have expanded closer to 70k. Atmosphere for prelims regardless of if they are in Western Sydney, Melbourne, Adealide, Perth etc are always far superior to that of the GF.. Anzac Day meh.. Last post is moving, opening bounce roar is good then it fizzes out fairly quickly.

 

[Kwality]

Where is the US masters played? Augusta. Why? Tradition. Where does every professional golfer want to play the US masters? Augusta.

Where is the England Tennis major held? Wimbledon. Why? Tradition. Where do players want it played? Wimbledon.

Where is the AFL Grand Final played? MCG. Why? Tradition. Where do the actual players want the GF to be played? MCG.

Non-Vic teams more regularly get lead in finals advantage as it’s almost never neutral. Vic teams most often play lead in finals against co-tenants so get no advantage.

Vic clubs have to suck-up the neutral finals, and non-Vic teams have to suck up the GF at the MCG.

And let’s look at MCG GF performance by interstate teams:

1992 Eagles: Win
1994 Eagles: Win
1996 Swans: loss
1997 Adelaide: Win
1998 Adelaide: Win
2001: brisbane: win
2002: Brisbane : Win
2003 Brisbane: win
2007 Port: Loss
2012 Sydney : Win

So interstate teams against Vic teams won 8 of the first 10 MCG grand finals (Sydney and Port were big outsiders in each losing GF) So was there something they put into the water that magically introduced a disadvantage? Or maybe, just maybe, in a GF the best team wins.


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Its not simply the disadvantage of travel as any genuine examination would reveal.

 

[Kwality]

I'm fine with it moving around now, wouldn't worry me one iota.

I am just laughing at the sooks who come running to every one of these threads, same sook, same arguments.

And they will answer with, "well if we don't say nothin, nothin will be done"
LMAO, yep, the powers that be are all here reading this.

& unsurprisingly, the same old privileged types run the same old ... 25,000 GF tickets to the cricket club leaving 75k for the footy fans.

 

[LoungeLizard]

& unsurprisingly, the same old privileged types run the same old ... 25,000 GF tickets to the cricket club leaving 75k for the footy fans.

Same old, only because it's always the same with you, you get told, then 3 months later you're back with the same crap, how many times does it take?

The contract is signed, nothing said here will change it, and I bet not one of you has done a thing about it, if you want something done, do something, boycott the AFL.

 

[Kwality]

Same old, only because it's always the same with you, you get told, then 3 months later you're back with the same crap, how many times does it take?

The contract is signed, nothing said here will change it, and I bet not one of you has done a thing about it, if you want something done, do something, boycott the AFL.

I wrote to Richard Goyder, not c/ HQ. I made the point that he ok'd the sleazy meeting of the encumbents behind closed doors.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I wrote to Richard Goyder, not c/ HQ. I made the point that he ok'd the sleazy meeting of the encumbents behind closed doors.

Did you get a reply?

Try get a petition next time, send that and tell them you are fed up and leaving the AFL if nothing is done, because IMHO, they don't give a crap and unless you do something, you will never know.
How many of you have said they just do stuff for Victorias benefit?

Have you thought about why?

It's a Victorian comp, they nearly went broke, they do this for money, they don't care about a few sooks on the internet, you need a boycott that is going to cost them money.

 

[Kwality]

Did you get a reply?

Try get a petition next time, send that and tell them you are fed up and leaving the AFL if nothing is done, because IMHO, they don't give a crap and unless you do something, you will never know.
How many of you have said they just do stuff for Victorias benefit?

Have you thought about why?

It's a Victorian comp, they nearly went broke, they do this for money, they don't care about a few sooks on the internet, you need a boycott that is going to cost them money.

No.
I sent it to his farm not long after the decision was made public. I wasnt rude or personal.

All of the AFL admin live in Melbourne, say no more. Why would they want any event not held in Melbourne.