Big Changes Ey?

[tommahawk]

i cant believe how at the end of the season brian cook came out and said there are going to be big changes, we have sacked one assistent coach and advertised for a football operations manager. i really can not believe that we did not get involved in one trade, a couple of days ago steven wells said in the paper we have the list to be a top 4 side, obviously we dont. i am truly concerned about what is really going on down at our club we all love dearly? tom hawkins is not going to come in and make a huge difference straight away. love to know your thoughts on all of this? cheers

 

[Metallica_Man]

I was also disappointed, punishment should have been dealt. Although delistings are yet to come, so maybe a few players will get cut.

 

[Catman]

i cant believe how at the end of the season brian cook came out and said there are going to be big changes, we have sacked one assistent coach and advertised for a football operations manager. i really can not believe that we did not get involved in one trade, a couple of days ago steven wells said in the paper we have the list to be a top 4 side, obviously we dont. i am truly concerned about what is really going on down at our club we all love dearly? tom hawkins is not going to come in and make a huge difference straight away. love to know your thoughts on all of this? cheers

Your not alone. I and many others worry that the club think that this year was just an abberration and that we'll magically turn it around next year. The review covered very little on the issues that concern most supporters supports this.

BTW, we didn't sack Andy Lovell, we just decided not to renew his contract. Hardly a hard decision.

 

[burto]

Your not alone. I and many others worry that the club think that this year was just an abberration and that we'll magically turn it around next year. The review covered very little on the issues that concern most supporters supports this.

BTW, we didn't sack Andy Lovell, we just decided not to renew his contract. Hardly a hard decision.

Did you conduct the review?

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

Our midfield was a problem, so they're getting rid of the midfield coach.

Leadership was a problem, so they have given the job to onr of the clubs most respected and team orientated players.

Fitness was a problem, so they are revamping the whole fitness area.

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

Moving heaven and earth was not the solution. Perhaps some of you should start trusting Cook's decisions, after all, he is the expert.

 

[chapmanmagic35]

Did you conduct the review?

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

Our midfield was a problem, so they're getting rid of the midfield coach.

Leadership was a problem, so they have given the job to onr of the clubs most respected and team orientated players.

Fitness was a problem, so they are revamping the whole fitness area.

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

Moving heaven and earth was not the solution. Perhaps some of you should start trusting Cook's decisions, after all, he is the expert.

Agree 100%!!!!!!!!!!

 

[TGTOA]

People, come on!!! Just because there hasn't been obvious changes at the club (ie massive changes to the playing list) does NOT mean no changes have been made. The areas of need which can be addressed, are being addressed.

There's only one thing I want to see change, and that's our results. So let's just see if that changes next year as a result of the changes that are being made now before going off the deep end about a whole raft of changes we should make.

 

[Big Nasty]

Did you conduct the review?

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

Our midfield was a problem, so they're getting rid of the midfield coach.

Leadership was a problem, so they have given the job to onr of the clubs most respected and team orientated players.

Fitness was a problem, so they are revamping the whole fitness area.

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

Moving heaven and earth was not the solution. Perhaps some of you should start trusting Cook's decisions, after all, he is the expert.

agreed mate

 

[Dont you hate pants?]

Did you conduct the review?

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

Our midfield was a problem, so they're getting rid of the midfield coach.

Leadership was a problem, so they have given the job to onr of the clubs most respected and team orientated players.

Fitness was a problem, so they are revamping the whole fitness area.

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

Moving heaven and earth was not the solution. Perhaps some of you should start trusting Cook's decisions, after all, he is the expert.

Yep…totally agree. The worst thing we could do now is have wholesale changes. If anyone on this forum believes in the ‘premiership clock’ then we are at the point of no return. Our best chances as I see it will be in the next few years (hopefully we havent passed it), we have bought together a list that SHOULD contest for the cup and after one very ordinary season the white flag has come up with calls for dumping nearly a dozen players that at the start of the year many would have rated crucial to our team. The majority of the problems identified in the review are been taken care of as stated by burto above. And one thing reported in the media that pricked my ears up is supporters response to Costa’s business plan that was pitched 6 or 7 years ago. It was along the lines of us building a team up, give the kids time and by 2006 promising to have a premiership delivered to us etc. From what I have read, some people are a little agro towards Costa and Co saying that and not giving us a premiership this season. If you are one of these people…you are one big sucker! You cannot promise or guarantee a premiership in football. On paper, in theory all the ingredients are there. It’s an entirely different thing to make the leap to reality. Of course Costa would have said that, he was campaigning for the GFC leadership. Would people have voted for him had he come out and said ‘Well, we hope to languish at the bottom of the ladder for a few years, make knee jerk reactions when things don’t go well, I’m not sure we will make a bloody dollar for a while and yeah…if we play our cards right we might scam a premiership along the way…Vote for me!’ I think not. Nothing can be promised in AFL, all we can do is get it all together on and off the field, put out the best team possible and let the rest take care of itself. Cheers

 

[catempire]

There was no need for wholesale changes. The squad was good enough to get to a Prelim in 04 and a Semi in 05. There isn't a whole lot wrong with the team (that's not to say there aren't areas where serious improvement would be required for us to win the flag).

A combination of factors in 06, not least of which was a horrible effort by the coaching staff (which IMO, should have lead to BT's sacking), meant that the capable list we have did not perform anywhere near the level required.

If any tough decision was needed it was the sacking of BT. However, once the decision was made to keep BT, then there wasn't a whole lot else that needed to be done, aside from cutting Lovell and cutting some dead wood (Koula, McCarthy to join KK and Ricco) over the next two weeks.

 

[rickster]

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

..................

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

How would Bomber have been able to coach better against Collingwood when we were beaten by 100 points?

And against Adelaide by 93 points?

He basically came out after those games and said he didn't know what happened and it was just 'one of those days'.

You can't tell me that they had 'Directors of Football Operations' in 1990 when Leigh Matthews was coaching. He has managed to win 4 premierships and I'm sure he wasn't complaining about how he had too much to do!

 

[tommahawk]

but surely we should of been more agressive in the trade period to try and get some leg speed or a better forward line? after bradshaw signed for brisbane we didnt hear another thing about geelong in the trade!

 

[CF]

I agree that the club has done what needs to be done. I also agree that some of Bombers statements after games this year kind of indicated that he had NFI about what was happening. Bomber is the real worry. He has a lot to prove next year if he wants to coach on in 2008 (and hopefully not at GFC).

 

[Catman]

Did you conduct the review?

There is no need for unnecessary changes.

Never said there was. There was no mention of fixing the inherent problems currently at the club though or the deeper issues that are festering.

Our midfield was a problem, so they're getting rid of the midfield coach.

Agreed. But he was only let go because he was out of contract. If he was still contracted, there's no way he'd have been sacked. How else do you explain Hinkley staying?

Leadership was a problem, so they have given the job to onr of the clubs most respected and team orientated players.

Verdict pending on that one. Harley has said all the right things so far, but will he fix the widening gap between the senior players and the younger players? Will he clamp down on those responsible for this? The leadership is the problem because those in the group are a problem. Thompson has given these guys too much power and now the review has determined that they'll have more. That's a huge concern.

Fitness was a problem, so they are revamping the whole fitness area.

The only problem is that they didn't work hard enough and my sources (and they are as reliable as you can get) is that the coach was/is the problem. Will this change?

It was no surprise to see all our fitness staff leave to join Loris at the Bulldogs. So far we have no fitness staff and we're three weeks away from the beginning of pre-season.

Bombers coaching was a problem, so they are hiring an operations manager so he can focus more on his coaching.

Bomber's coaching has always been a problem. All that was in there was that he is doing too much administrative work. What is this admin work? If he had that much work, why didn't get go to Cooky and ask for some respite? Seems to be nothing but a cop out. How about a tactician for Thompson? Someone like a Robert Shaw wouldn't go astray.

Moving heaven and earth was not the solution. Perhaps some of you should start trusting Cook's decisions, after all, he is the expert.

In football matters or financial matters? Anyway, Cook should never have done the review. There was a clear COI in him doing a review on a coach he's unashamedly supported from day one. We needed an independent assessment IMO.

 

[burto]

I see where your coming from in some of those posts

Agreed. But he was only let go because he was out of contract. If he was still contracted, there's no way he'd have been sacked. How else do you explain Hinkley staying?

I heard somewhere that he has been the major one responsible for the growing confidence in Nath

Verdict pending on that one. Harley has said all the right things so far, but will he fix the widening gap between the senior players and the younger players? Will he clamp down on those responsible for this? The leadership is the problem because those in the group are a problem. Thompson has given these guys too much power and now the review has determined that they'll have more. That's a huge concern.

Yep, big problem, but I think Harls is the right man for that.

The only problem is that they didn't work hard enough and my sources (and they are as reliable as you can get) is that the coach was/is the problem. Will this change?

It was no surprise to see all our fitness staff leave to join Loris at the Bulldogs. So far we have no fitness staff and we're three weeks away from the beginning of pre-season.

Hopefully Cook is addressing this and just not publicised it

 

[burto]

but surely we should of been more agressive in the trade period to try and get some leg speed or a better forward line? after bradshaw signed for brisbane we didnt hear another thing about geelong in the trade!

There really wasn't much on offer that we could afford. Nobody wants Kingsley or any of the hacks we want to get rid of. I would have loved to go after Eagleton but what do we have that the bulldogs would accept? Not much player wise, and im sure we wanted to keep our picks.

 

[DanA]

Off the feild I am pretty happy with what has happened. I just hope that they make the players act more professionally.

Our list frustrates me though

It is too slow with too little drive out of the backline, not enough pace in the center, too little midfeild depth, too top heavy, and lacks players with damaging foot skills.

These probablems should have been addressed by making some trades or drafting a lot of kids. I am hoping that losing Kingsley and Riccardi gives us enough roome to draft 6 players and paying out Gardiner & Spencer's contract.

This is probably the last year that the players we draft will be damaging in our premiership window.

I am praying for 9 delisting:

Riccardi (retired)
Kingsley
Gardiner
Spencer
McCarthy
Sheringham
Batchleor
Koulouriotis
Slade


If Geelong do this I am very happy with what the administration has done.

 

[catempire]

For those who were suggesting we should have been more active in the trade period, can I make a suggestion?

Think of the trade(s) you would have liked to have seen take place then go to the BigFooty board(s) of the clubs in involved and pose the question to them: would you accept this trade?

The point of this exercise is to get you to realise that we had nothing to offer that clubs would be willing to trade for. This is a strong draft and clubs want to hang onto their picks. Nobody wants the players we are going to end up delisting. Nobody wants Johnson's ankles. Nobody is willing to give up a top 25 pick for Kelly.

 

[Partridge]

Bomber's coaching has always been a problem. All that was in there was that he is doing too much administrative work. What is this admin work? If he had that much work, why didn't get go to Cooky and ask for some respite? Seems to be nothing but a cop out. How about a tactician for Thompson? Someone like a Robert Shaw wouldn't go astray.

We don't need a tactician - I thought that was one of the skills a senior coach usually possesses. I can remember at least 5 onfield disasters Bumbler Thompson came up with this year, and that's without too much thought. He is tactically clueless, totally uninspiring, far, far, FAR too soft on the players and a walking excuse machine quite content to finish 7th. The sooner this idiot is out of the club and a real coach installed the better.

 

[worthogs]

i cant believe how at the end of the season brian cook came out and said there are going to be big changes, we have sacked one assistent coach and advertised for a football operations manager. i really can not believe that we did not get involved in one trade, a couple of days ago steven wells said in the paper we have the list to be a top 4 side, obviously we dont. i am truly concerned about what is really going on down at our club we all love dearly? tom hawkins is not going to come in and make a huge difference straight away. love to know your thoughts on all of this? cheers

GET OVER IT TOSSER.
What do you want. We are playing a game on the weekend and some of the guys playing will be chopped, they wont do anything before then.

Did you even read the letter from Cook, or didnt you get one!!! If you didnt get one dont comment dont comment till you pay up for the club.

If you did get one read it.

Most of the changes will come on the track, player management (internally) allowing the Coaching staff to coach rather than Manage and improve the support in the Football dept to fix the error that was 2006.

All you 12 year olds that sook that the coach was not sacked, that we didnt get 4 new trades that we didnt sack 15 senior players GROW UP!!!!!!!!

For those who want to ditch 10, 6 or even 8 players and pay out contracts Thank God you dont have to make real business decisions as you may last 2 minutes in a Job.

Remember COOK is the best CEO in the business and I prefer to listen to him than any of you. If it proves that he is wrong then the whole board will go as a result (yet again)

I AM ALSO SICK TO DEATH OF YOU TOOLS THAT SAY OUR WINDOW OF OPP IS CLOSING, IT HAS NOT EVEN OPENED YET

 

[Billy Ryan]

but surely we should of been more agressive in the trade period to try and get some leg speed or a better forward line? after bradshaw signed for brisbane we didnt hear another thing about geelong in the trade!

Can you suggest who else we should have gone for? Of the players that were going to move none wanted to come to Geelong. Tarrant stated he was going west or nowhere at all, Aker was a done deal before the week even started, and after that there was not much on offer that was going to improve the side. Except maybe Birss.....

 

[jim boy]

We don't need a tactician - I thought that was one of the skills a senior coach usually possesses.

Theres only two skills I want the senior coach to possess

1. Knowing what his own strengths/weaknesses are.
2. Being able to identify and work with those people who are strong in the areas where you are weak.

Anything less and failure ensues.

 

[DanA]

For those who want to ditch 10, 6 or even 8 players and pay out contracts Thank God you dont have to make real business decisions as you may last 2 minutes in a Job.

Actually I do have to make real business decisions. Every sucessfull investor knows you hold on to your winners and drop your losers. If it adds no value to your business but is using valuable resources what do you do?

There is a limited number of spots on the list. Wasting a spot on someone you know is incapable of being successfull at AFL level is rediculous to me.

Gardiner & Spencer are not going to be successfull in the AFL, drop them.

 

[Asty]

Actually I do have to make real business decisions. Every sucessfull investor knows you hold on to your winners and drop your losers. If it adds no value to your business but is using valuable resources what do you do?

There is a limited number of spots on the list. Wasting a spot on someone you know is incapable of being successfull at AFL level is rediculous to me.

Gardiner & Spencer are not going to be successfull in the AFL, drop them.

IMO you have an over simplified view of how business/Football Club should be run and you are refusing to look at the business from all angles. You are looking at it from a on field angle rather than from a financial aspect as well. As an investor surely your main priority would be for the business to increase revenue as this generally will equate to higher share prices and more profit for the investor. In the cats case this profit would equate to debt reduction, better facilities and the opportunity to invest to ensure the future of the club. (No one wants to be like Carlton and relying on hand outs or even worse like Fitzroy and no longer in existence).

Yes on field success does bring greater profits but does dumping every player not in our top 22 get us that success. It probably doesn't unless we can draft players that are going to be able in that top 22 and realistically there is no way you are going to pick up 10 players in one draft that will suddenly catapult you into a premiership. Basically if you can get 2-3 quality youngsters each draft you are doing well. Add to that that we would be carrying extra player payments each year (for dumped contracted players) so how would we pay those top 5 players in our side?

If we were going to dump 10 players we may as well call seasons 2007/8 rebuilding years and finish bottom to get draft picks. Most of our team would still be around in 2009/10 for a tilt at the flag anyway of course I would be frustrated with losing (I would hate to have been a hawks/carlton supporter for the last few years)

 

[worthogs]

IMO you have an over simplified view of how business/Football Club should be run and you are refusing to look at the business from all angles. You are looking at it from a on field angle rather than from a financial aspect as well. As an investor surely your main priority would be for the business to increase revenue as this generally will equate to higher share prices and more profit for the investor. In the cats case this profit would equate to debt reduction, better facilities and the opportunity to invest to ensure the future of the club. (No one wants to be like Carlton and relying on hand outs or even worse like Fitzroy and no longer in existence).

Yes on field success does bring greater profits but does dumping every player not in our top 22 get us that success. It probably doesn't unless we can draft players that are going to be able in that top 22 and realistically there is no way you are going to pick up 10 players in one draft that will suddenly catapult you into a premiership. Basically if you can get 2-3 quality youngsters each draft you are doing well. Add to that that we would be carrying extra player payments each year (for dumped contracted players) so how would we pay those top 5 players in our side?

If we were going to dump 10 players we may as well call seasons 2007/8 rebuilding years and finish bottom to get draft picks. Most of our team would still be around in 2009/10 for a tilt at the flag anyway of course I would be frustrated with losing (I would hate to have been a hawks/carlton supporter for the last few years)

BINGO

 

[DanA]

IMO you have an over simplified view of how business/Football Club should be run and you are refusing to look at the business from all angles. You are looking at it from a on field angle rather than from a financial aspect as well. As an investor surely your main priority would be for the business to increase revenue as this generally will equate to higher share prices and more profit for the investor. In the cats case this profit would equate to debt reduction, better facilities and the opportunity to invest to ensure the future of the club. (No one wants to be like Carlton and relying on hand outs or even worse like Fitzroy and no longer in existence).

Yes on field success does bring greater profits but does dumping every player not in our top 22 get us that success. It probably doesn't unless we can draft players that are going to be able in that top 22 and realistically there is no way you are going to pick up 10 players in one draft that will suddenly catapult you into a premiership. Basically if you can get 2-3 quality youngsters each draft you are doing well. Add to that that we would be carrying extra player payments each year (for dumped contracted players) so how would we pay those top 5 players in our side?

If we were going to dump 10 players we may as well call seasons 2007/8 rebuilding years and finish bottom to get draft picks. Most of our team would still be around in 2009/10 for a tilt at the flag anyway of course I would be frustrated with losing (I would hate to have been a hawks/carlton supporter for the last few years)

Firstly putting on these kids is not going to negatively affect on feild performance. The players I named made minimal impact in 06 and I would expect them to have less impact going forward.

Secondly I named 9 players not 10. Considering one of the rookies (Hunt) I think should be promoted that leaves 8, two of the rest are rookies that means 6. I think we should consider leaving one spot for the preseason draft that means 5 in the draft. It certainly isn't unprecedented to use a 5th round draft pick. Why not take advantage of our "Bottoming out" this year by drafting an extra kid.

Thirdly (assuming we will use our full salary cap regarless) there is actually zero impact to profitability. Unless you are saying the players delisted will attract more members than the new players signed.

The only decent argument you have (IMO) is that the opportunity cost of paying a top player more this year is more than taking a chance on a couple of late round draft picks. Fair enough valid argument, I personally think our team has some glaring flaws and would perfer the kids.