Brock Mclean, is he up to it?

[Weiterbot23]

I wasnt referring to you mate!

Unless SOSOOSOS is your alias?



We locked horns a few years back re JR, and I tried to tell you then to give him some time.



Again Im pretty sure the point was to give him some time.



Mcleans output (when uninjured and settled) and his impact on the rest of the team (freeng up Murph and Juddy) will be worth pick 11.

Just give him some time.

Opps I just assumed that I would be in the gun.

Yes, you were correct on both accounts, regarding JR and YAZ.

I know it's early, just saying at this stage I don't think his been worth pick 11, but that is only half way through the year. I agree we won't know for a few years who has gotten the better of the trade or if it does turn out to be a win win.

 

[40yearBLUE]

Opps I just assumed that I would be in the gun.

Yes, you were correct on both accounts, regarding JR and YAZ.

I know it's early, just saying at this stage I don't think his been worth pick 11, but that is only half way through the year. I agree we won't know for a few years who has gotten the better of the trade or if it does turn out to be a win win.

I accept that you have moderated your claim with "it is only half way through the year" implying McLean has time to redeem himself in your eyes. But..

I still dont understand exactly what criteria you base this on? What exactly is it that pick 11 would have that McLean does not display for you "so far"? For a trade to be not worth it, there must be something in that pick 11 that you need that BM does not fill. What is it?

 

[Weiterbot23]

I accept that you have moderated your claim with "it is only half way through the year" implying McLean has time to redeem himself in your eyes. But..

I still dont understand exactly what criteria you base this on? What exactly is it that pick 11 would have that McLean does not display for you "so far"? For a trade to be not worth it, there must be something in that pick 11 that you need that BM does not fill. What is it?

There are alot of exciting youngsters around that pick that now in "hindsight" I would prefer to have. eg. Jetta, Gysberts, Griffiths. I believe their potenial is worth more than what Mclean is currently producing. I am aware that we all love what he does as an inside mid, but think that Hadley or pherhaps Ball or even tuck could do that job, maybe less effectivley, but they would have been much cheaper.

My opinion could change if Mcleans form improves, which it may well do depending on how much his injuries have been affecting his pace.

 

[Salaryman]

You do appreciate that a bloke has to want to come to your club and you have to negotiate a deal and offer something the other club will accept??

It's not a wonderful magical process like Homer Simpson might imagine??

Right??

 

[Go_Blues!]

Opps I just assumed that I would be in the gun.

Yes, you were correct on both accounts, regarding JR and YAZ.

I know it's early, just saying at this stage I don't think his been worth pick 11, but that is only half way through the year. I agree we won't know for a few years who has gotten the better of the trade or if it does turn out to be a win win.

Look, I think it is great that you have admitted that you were wrong on a couple of occassions and embraced some of our boys that you did not think would make it. I also think it is great that you have the balls to express your opinion even if it is not popular. However, I think that Russell was a key part of our team a long time before the last half of last year since he was so tactically smart, positioned well, and used his pace well in the negating roles he was given. I also always loved the way he protected the space at the stopages (which he does less of now due to a changed role in the team). I think, like Russell was, Mclean is also playing a vital role that is a bit subtle but nonetheless, important. Look at how he sets up, look at where he positions at the stopages and look how he runs ahead of the ball at the restart. Pretty much clearing a path for ball carriers. He does not have much pace but he is tactically asstute and understands where the ball carrier will run - you can't teach that. He also gets the odd hard-ball and lays a few tackles. It is a team game and you will see from the b&f voting, that he is really fulfilling his role in the team.

 

[40yearBLUE]

There are alot of exciting youngsters around that pick that now in "hindsight" I would prefer to have. eg. Jetta, Gysberts, Griffiths. I believe their potenial is worth more than what Mclean is currently producing. I am aware that we all love what he does as an inside mid, but think that Hadley or pherhaps Ball or even tuck could do that job, maybe less effectivley, but they would have been much cheaper.

My opinion could change if Mcleans form improves, which it may well do depending on how much his injuries have been affecting his pace.

Again someone mentioning Ball, forget Ball, he was never available to us instead of BM and we could have picked him up in the draft if he was genuinely available to us, instead of Lucas. But we all know the reality meant he was not actually available to anyone but Collingwood. And it is debatable he is a better fit for us even if he were remotely an option. And to follow your argument to its logical conclusion, we ought to trade established players for draft picks because the likely pick ups would have "potential" ignoring the fact that potential is an intangible that is nearly as likely to not happen as it is to happen. You ought to look up the success rates of AFL draftees, I think it is about 1 in 4 make it but I stand to be corrected.

You still have not answered my question though. What have any of the players you mentioned done (not what potential they might have but what they have actually done) that a) we need and b) BM does not do equally well. For example you mention Jetta? You think Jetta compares to BM? Jetta compares to a player like Garlett not BM. If we had Jetta we would still be one good inside mid short.

Its all very well saying draft pick players have potential, but so too does BM, but on top of that "potential" he is actually fulfilling the role for which he was recruited. I recall the potential that Edwards and Hartlett had. Potential is a word bandied around when one struggles to justify with fact a position.

It would be more convincing if you just came out and said. "I dont like him, I dont know why, I just dont". Potentially we already have a premiership team. If only potential translated to flags automatically.

 

[Weiterbot23]

At this point in time, I think we would be better off Developing someone like a Ben Griffiths or another youngster that could develop into an A grader and using Hadley in Mcleans role. IMO atm Mclean is only slightly better than hadley and even browne could mature into the same role.

Your 1 in 4 ratio is off the mark considering Pick 11 is a pretty high pick and with the extra time spent scouting these days they don't often get the high picks wrong, I reckon WH could have got us a very decent young gun with that pick as there was quaility players like kane lucas still on the table at that stage.

 

[Silvagnis]

Someone is cutting MCB's lunch and looking for attention...

Clueless.

Just look at your rants about gay footballers.

There are alot of exciting youngsters around that pick that now in "hindsight" I would prefer to have. eg. Jetta, Gysberts, Griffiths. I believe their potenial is worth more than what Mclean is currently producing

Didn't we pass on two of these players to draft Lucas?

They sound pretty hard to pass up.

I believe we would have passed on Gysberts if he was there too.

The fact that five clubs (Carlton, Collingwood Brisbane, Hawthorn and Essendon) were willing to part with first round picks suggests that the draft wasn't as strong as you believe.

If Mclean was in the draft, we would have drafted him if we had kept pick 11.

No contest.

Move on.

 

[Stamos]

At this point in time, I think we would be better off Developing someone like a Ben Griffiths or another youngster that could develop into an A grader and using Hadley in Mcleans role. IMO atm Mclean is only slightly better than hadley and even browne could mature into the same role.

The problem with Hadley was he could only manage 17 games in 2 years. You can't have only one guy on the list who can do a certain job, when that guy plays less than 40% of games due to various injuries.

 

[Quazza]

since he's been with us, I dont think I've ever seen Judd have so much room, and run so openly, than last weekends match. Even the commentators picked up on it

That to me, is no doubt because of McClean's inside and under work. If he can save Judd from getting smashed every game, it was well worth pick 11 for me

 

[40yearBLUE]

At this point in time, I think we would be better off Developing someone like a Ben Griffiths or another youngster that could develop into an A grader and using Hadley in Mcleans role. IMO atm Mclean is only slightly better than hadley and even browne could mature into the same role.

Your 1 in 4 ratio is off the mark considering Pick 11 is a pretty high pick and with the extra time spent scouting these days they don't often get the high picks wrong, I reckon WH could have got us a very decent young gun with that pick as there was quaility players like kane lucas still on the table at that stage.

You make a very good point regarding top 20 picks, it is rare for them to not fulfill at least some potential, unless you are talking Tiger recruiting, and I agree wholeheartedly that WH is more likely than not to get us value with his picks.

I guess the question becomes an issue of timing. When, when will a pick 11 in last years draft (and it does not have to be Gysbert, it can be any that came between Lucas and Davies or Kerr, I forget which came first) deliver his potential and will it occur in line with when the majority of the rest of the list delivers theirs. If you think as some do, that our window is just opening and could well be open this year, then perhaps they will not deliver soon enough, as I am sure BM can and is.

Nevertheless you have expressed an open mindedness that allows for BM to deliver and I believe he will, and in the hard, close, tight games that finals often throw up, he may well get his chance to shine on the MCG when it really matters.

 

[Stamos]

If he can save Judd from getting smashed every game, it was well worth pick 11 for me

McLean may well actually extend Judd's career by a year or two, let alone giving him more freedom on the field. Pick 11 in what is thought to be a weaker draft is well worth that.

 

[Weiterbot23]

You make a very good point regarding top 20 picks, it is rare for them to not fulfill at least some potential, unless you are talking Tiger recruiting, and I agree wholeheartedly that WH is more likely than not to get us value with his picks.

I guess the question becomes an issue of timing. When, when will a pick 11 in last years draft (and it does not have to be Gysbert, it can be any that came between Lucas and Davies or Kerr, I forget which came first) deliver his potential and will it occur in line with when the majority of the rest of the list delivers theirs. If you think as some do, that our window is just opening and could well be open this year, then perhaps they will not deliver soon enough, as I am sure BM can and is.

Nevertheless you have expressed an open mindedness that allows for BM to deliver and I believe he will, and in the hard, close, tight games that finals often throw up, he may well get his chance to shine on the MCG when it really matters.

Lets hope so!

 

[gbatman]

Mclean was ok on the weekend, looks to have trimmed down a fair bit, wasn't much between him and Hadley. At this stage I really don't know who you would have in the side if one misses out. I'm not sure if having both is a good idea, sure against poor side's who have a slow midfield it works well but against better sides with pace and a better midfield I am not so sure.

 

[chaser1]

Mclean is a good pick up, question is will he be worth pick 11 and be fit enough to produce his best week in week out? The thing is you don't want him playing one game and then being out for 2 -3 weeks. Look there seems to be concerns over his body, as was at Melbourne. The SUN today commented on he has hip and soreness problems, whether this is true or not i don't know.

But one thing i do know you cannot go into AFL matchess being laboured or injured. In Mcleans case if he is not close to 100 percent fit DONT play him. He can be exposed bc of this. I would not play MCLean and Hadley this week against Melbourne , they are a young quick side that can expose Mclean and Hadley for pace! Especially on the big open spaces of the MCG.

 

[BlueYoss]

You do appreciate that a bloke has to want to come to your club and you have to negotiate a deal and offer something the other club will accept??

It's not a wonderful magical process like Homer Simpson might imagine??

Right??

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds...e=Simpsons&quote=okbrain.txt&file=okbrain.mp3

 

[Salaryman]

something like that

 

[Silvagnis]

I would not play MCLean and Hadley this week against Melbourne , they are a young quick side that can expose Mclean and Hadley for pace! Especially on the big open spaces of the MCG.

Are Moloney, Jones, McDonald, Bartram, Morton, Bruce and Gysberts quick?

They might have to worry about stopping the likes of Judd, Murphy, Simpson, Walker, Houlihan, Russell, Carrazzo, Garlett, Gibbs, Robinson, Betts, Kreuzer, Waite and Scotland from having an influence.

I could be wrong though.

 

[thylacine60]

something like that

Did you say 'genre' just then?

 

[Silvagnis]

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds...e=Simpsons&quote=okbrain.txt&file=okbrain.mp3

"According to this, snakes hear by sensing vibrations in the ground. So if we play something with a lot of bass after Wayne Hughes overlooks a group think favourite, MCB will be in here like Oprah on a baked ham."

 

[Weiterbot23]

How come Brock was dropped for the game against his old side?

Poor form or injury??

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Shouldn't you be out celebrating one of your team's players getting dropped? Bound to be better than seeing them succeed.

 

[The Panther]

They're still welcome to Ball who can't kick forty metres and hit a target

He had no troubles finding the target against Carlton.

 

[SOSSOSSOS]

Are Moloney, Jones, McDonald, Bartram, Morton, Bruce and Gysberts quick?

They might have to worry about stopping the likes of Judd, Murphy, Simpson, Walker, Houlihan, Russell, Carrazzo, Garlett, Gibbs, Robinson, Betts, Kreuzer, Waite and Scotland from having an influence.

I could be wrong though.

You are a joke General!

Let me guess - he's secretly injured!

Now, is an omitted midfielder worth pick 11?

Can't wait for your optimistic spin on why he is still worth pick 11.

I though he is the best "blocker" for the likes of gibbs, murph, judd etc!

It's time you admit the truth and that is wayne hughes and our recruiting/trade staff are just not up to AFL standard.

 

[Silvagnis]

The season is more than one game...

No one cares for your trolling.

Go fap over the recruiting of Reid, Wood, Fraser, Jolly, Thomas and Ball on your board.

TradeDraft is wiser than you.