Can Hawthorn succeed while ignoring the elite end of the draft? - Part 2

[WWSD]

Matt Kennedy might be too young, but would be a reasonable target for the Hawks.

He’s slow with bad footskills which is a pre-requisite for getting a game in Hawthorn’s midfield, and was a former high draft pick so they would continue to not ignore the elite of the draft if they brought him in.

Pick 4 and Will Day would be a decent starting point.

Hawthorn don’t recruit Carlton players.

 

[HairyO]

Reality is starting to hit Hawthorn supporters hard.

As long as we arent okay with a "Whatever it takes" plan we will be firmly set in reality.

 

[Priddis Is Done]

I tell you one thing I'd be dirty if I was a Hawks supporter,

Drop kicking out the loyal one club servants, with 1 to 3 years of playing careers left.

 

[Pessimistic]

I tell you one thing I'd be dirty if I was a Hawks supporter,

Drop kicking out the loyal one club servants, with 1 to 3 years of playing careers left.

‘it’s worked well for birch. More games this year than the last three years

 

[Sonny Hayes]

I tell you one thing I'd be dirty if I was a Hawks supporter,

Drop kicking out the loyal one club servants, with 1 to 3 years of playing careers left.

Ah yes we are far too old and need more young talent but also should have kept 3 more 30+ year olds.

 

[La Dispute]

Hawthorn don’t recruit Carlton players.

Explains why they haven’t gone after Murphy and Kreuzer despite being over-the-hill former Pick 1’s.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Ah yes we are far too old and need more young talent but also should have kept 3 more 30+ year olds.

You pissed off the good ones and kept the Puopolo’s of the world.

 

[Sonny Hayes]

You pissed off the good ones and kept the Puopolo’s of the world.

I mean he was very good for us in 2017 and heck even being cooked since still was one of the only ones with any leg speed. Having those 3 would not have helped and we absolutely could not keep playing both Lewis and Mitchell in the same midfield anymore.

 

[Pessimistic]

You pissed off the good ones and kept the Puopolo’s of the world.

do you really need the reason?

 

[Pessimistic]

You’re right.

Your list management gurus would much prefer to pay the big money for Giants rejects who are already on big deals (Scully, Patton) and then brag to everybody about “how you got them so cheap” at the trade table.

Then the same list management gurus sit back and wonder why the Giants now have enough freed up cap space to sign their gun OOC players that you were trying to poach like Coniglio and Whitfield.

so we get our giant rejects direct not via carlton

not sure it was ‘bragging’ just saying not necessarily at the expense of draftees, when accused of wasting draft picks essentially

 

[C4[2]Yo`DooR]

so we get our giant rejects direct not via carlton

Well played. Will pay that.

 

[Scotland]

Once you've been there for so long I think it's assumed you get a great deal of power to direct the list management and recruiting. Even a coach in his first season should have an input on the type of players he wants and where the list is at, after 4 flags surely you're driving those decisions. And it's not like the Hawks failures have been in missing on a stack of draft picks, they just haven't had any. If Clarko isn't ticking off on the recruitment of experienced players then why isn't he?

Graham Wright's head of footy and has been the list manager, he's been at the Hawks for ages, it wouldn't make a lot of sense to me if he and Clarko aren't on the same page and if they weren't surely Clarko would be the one to keep.

Adam Simpson might be the List Manager but surely it wasn't a surprise that he put Brady Rawlings in that job when it opened up and I'd imagine Darren Glass isn't overruling Simpson when it comes to trades.

Don't want to derail the thread away from the topic but WC has long been a boys' club and Simpson is a relative newbie. While the senior coach should have a big say in recruiting decisions if for some reason there was a power struggle at the club my money would always be on Trevor Nisbett or someone in his camp to win.

Different clubs have different public perceptions. Everyone knows Ed, Kochie, Jeff Kennett etc. Does anyone know who our chairman is? Or that we have a chairman and not a president? Ross Lyon has his foot soldiers, Crazy Clarko/Vossy made moves that raised eyebrows, 'Wellsy' unearths gems with 2nd and 3rd round picks, Dodoro is difficult to deal with and not all that useful. I've never heard anyone talk about Adam Simpson's list management, and Buddy Franklin's 10 year contract isn't a John Longmire thing. If Hawthorn signed Jeremy Cameron to a massive long term deal it would definitely be seen as a Clarkson thing.

 

[blockman155]

Explains why they haven’t gone after Murphy and Kreuzer despite being over-the-hill former Pick 1’s.

Nah leaving them for Adelaide to pick up for x2 first rounders.

 

[Boxhead_31]

Hawthorn actually has pick 4, not 5 because of Fremantle’s points deficit, plus pick 21.

No F/S selections for Hawthorn this year, but Connor Downie (NGA) will likely be bid on inside the top 25.

FIRST-ROUND INDICATIVE DRAFT ORDER
1. Adelaide
2. North Melbourne
3. Sydney
4. Hawthorn
5. Adelaide (tied to Greater Western Sydney's pick)
6. Fremantle (down two spots due to draft-point deficit)
7. North Melbourne (tied to Melbourne's pick)
8. Carlton
9. Essendon
10. Western Bulldogs
11. Geelong (Gold Coast's on-traded mid-first round priority pick)
12. Geelong (tied to West Coast's pick)
13. Gold Coast
14. St Kilda
15. Geelong
16. Richmond
17. Collingwood
18. Brisbane
19. Brisbane (tied to Port Adelaide's pick)

How a little known clause could give Crows two top-five picks

They appear destined for their first wooden spoon. But this is how Adelaide could take two picks inside the top five

www.afl.com.au

Crows will get pick 2 when Crouch leaves

 

[master bate]

Don't want to derail the thread away from the topic but WC has long been a boys' club and Simpson is a relative newbie. While the senior coach should have a big say in recruiting decisions if for some reason there was a power struggle at the club my money would always be on Trevor Nisbett or someone in his camp to win.

Different clubs have different public perceptions. Everyone knows Ed, Kochie, Jeff Kennett etc. Does anyone know who our chairman is? Or that we have a chairman and not a president? Ross Lyon has his foot soldiers, Crazy Clarko/Vossy made moves that raised eyebrows, 'Wellsy' unearths gems with 2nd and 3rd round picks, Dodoro is difficult to deal with and not all that useful. I've never heard anyone talk about Adam Simpson's list management, and Buddy Franklin's 10 year contract isn't a John Longmire thing. If Hawthorn signed Jeremy Cameron to a massive long term deal it would definitely be seen as a Clarkson thing.

Agree totally about the power structure within clubs being largely unknown and having all sorts of perceptions for various clubs. Still strange to me that clubs don't have proper GM's of footy who take responsible for the recruiting and list like in US sports. I sense it's heading that way.

Football Directors on the Board are the ultimate wildcard. Dunstall hired Clarkson and always made sure Jeff's bite was never as big as his bark, yet at the same time Dunstall is clearly one of the smarter footy minds. Now it's Richie Vandenberg which is an interesting dynamic, hard to see him having authority and directors view over Clarko when he was captain under him.

And on that topic add Mark Ricciuto right towards the top of your list of publicly perceived movers and shakers.

 

[WWSD]

Crows will get pick 2 when Crouch leaves

No team will offer Crouch a huge contract that would net the Crows pick 2.

 

[Cotchins Hair Piece]

You know you’re struggling when you’re excited about Will Day.

 

[WWSD]

You know you’re struggling when you’re excited about Will Day.

What’s wrong with being excited about the potential of Will Day? He was a high first round pick. That’s something the Hawks haven’t had since Melbourne last won a final!

 

[Boxhead_31]

No team will offer Crouch a huge contract that would net the Crows pick 2.

Won't have to be huge. The AFL will use their magical formula to ensure a quick turn around for the Crows

 

[Sonny Hayes]

You know you’re struggling when you’re excited about Will Day.

He’s a good young player, competing well despite having the body of an under developed 13 year old boy. Plenty to like about him.

 

[matey]

You know you’re struggling when you’re excited about Will Day.

Tell you what struggling is ..... when a club has two picks before another club has its first!

 

[Burtman]

Had a Western Bulldog fan do that to a lot of Swans users a month or so ago. Sent about a dozen of us a picture of feces in a toilet. A classy guy all round.

It’s the same bloke, he sent the same picture to a few of us. Real boring life this bloke must have

 

[RAPPA]

No team will offer Crouch a huge contract that would net the Crows pick 2.

If his manager works like the way Crouch plays, he'll generate a lot of wasted dollars to that contract.

 

[Kanga Commando]

Nah the Tigers also have one... Who is yet to play a game

The lovely chap you responded to decided the Hawks had headfu**ed him enough to create a new account and add a whole heap of Hawk fans in to a messge group to try and troll us.

Poor fella.

Seriously headf***ed...

And a coward.

Creating a troll account because he ( it ) doesn't have the courage to voice it's p|ssant opinion publicly... They must feel like they have a very flimsy case... or brain...

 

[old55]

Agree totally about the power structure within clubs being largely unknown and having all sorts of perceptions for various clubs. Still strange to me that clubs don't have proper GM's of footy who take responsible for the recruiting and list like in US sports. I sense it's heading that way.

Josh Mahoney does a good job at Melbourne.

In the trade period it seems the football department as a whole decide on needs e.g. Lever, May, Langdon then Josh manages convincing the player to join and then gets the deal done without fuss. I think Jamie Elliott is the only player we have targetted but didn't land.

In the draft it seems that Jason Taylor alerts Mahoney to special opportunities that require picks and he goes out and secures them e.g. Clayton Oliver, Kossie Pickett.