List Mgmt. Carlton's 2018 Draft Thread (cont. in Part 2)

[ParapMarkets]

Are you suggesting that over his opponents, he will tower, Eiffel?

This post is particularly good when read in a "Yoda" voice.

 

[HARKER]

I think short term needs were spot on in that article

Long term needs
Carlton cannot overcomplicate this draft. Don’t worry about trades or draft points or anything other than taking Geelong Falcons midfielder Sam Walsh at number one.
If they are of the belief that Walsh is the best midfielder in this draft and the best fit for them, then take him.

........but not so much so, the long term needs?

The above notion just hits the mark with me, but I understand it may not with others.
I don't think that internally the club would be thinking that what it really needs.......is more kids.

Have lesser choice now for Shiel not working out, but we have to keep that next years first now and deal with that when it needs to be dealt with and not be seduced for todays talent, other than a wise choice with the first pick.

 

[ParapMarkets]

if SOS trades pick 1, must be for 2&6 and not 3&6

still want Walsh but if pick 1 is gone, then Rankine @ 2 and best mid at 6 (hoping for Bailey Smith)

Rankine would be there at 3 though. If we can end up with 2 top 6 picks (I'm still dubious that it can happen), I would love to see us take Rankine as one of those picks.

 

[Soapy V]

What did you not agree with, within the article Soapy?

Best 22, need for a number of Key Defenders and its a short puff piece based on Bigfooty. If you are going to bother at least bring something that any supporter with an IQ above 20 doesn't already know.

I've been mentioning Blakey for months

NEEDS are depth all over the park and another pure small forward would be handy

 

[Arr0w]

Long term needs
Carlton cannot overcomplicate this draft. Don’t worry about trades or draft points or anything other than taking Geelong Falcons midfielder Sam Walsh at number one.
If they are of the belief that Walsh is the best midfielder in this draft and the best fit for them, then take him.

........but not so much so, the long term needs?

The above notion just hits the mark with me, but I understand it may not with others.
I don't think that internally the club would be thinking that what it really needs.......is more kids.

Have lesser choice now for Shiel not working out, but we have to keep that next years first now and deal with that when it needs to be dealt with and not be seduced for todays talent, other than a wise choice with the first pick.

"If they are of the belief" We will soon find out.

As for not investing in kids, we have just added players in the vital age bracket that the club stipulated they wanted to target, Fasolo, McGovern, Newman.

What SOS has done to this point, is what a rebuild should look like, the hard work starts now.

"I don't think that internally the club would be thinking that what it really needs.......is more kids."

Now starts the next phase, the critical phase of targeting FA's, while still investing in the draft. We should not burn our ongoing success by over capitalizing on mature age players for the now. Target FA's next year, Coniglio, Cunningham, Ellis, Newnes, rather than paying overs for just one Josh Kelly. It allows us to improve our list for FREE, while still targeting the best talent in the draft

 

[Arr0w]

Best 22, need for a number of Key Defenders and its a short puff piece based on Bigfooty. If you are going to bother at least bring something that any supporter with an IQ above 20 doesn't already know.

I've been mentioning Blakey for months

NEEDS are depth all over the park and another pure small forward would be handy

We are short in depth in KPD's short term, that was the point I was highlighting

 

[HARKER]

Best 22, need for a number of Key Defenders and its a short puff piece based on Bigfooty. If you are going to bother at least bring something that any supporter with an IQ above 20 doesn't already know.
I've been mentioning Blakey for months
NEEDS are depth all over the park and another pure small forward would be handy

How can needs be 'all over the park' when we have as many players in the squad as for any other team.

I see our squad is quite balanced even at this stage, although maturity is somewhat at the lower level of things.

 

[Soapy V]

How can needs be 'all over the park' when we have as many players in the squad as for any other team.

I see our squad is quite balanced even at this stage, although maturity is somewhat at the lower level of things.

IMO we need depth options especially some mature bodies that will be an example at reserves level whilst putting on pressure for the best 22.

I see "potential" depth and "potential" balance. Not a criticism at all, just and observation of where we sit. at the end of 2019 I expect it to be much more advanced

 

[Blutopia]

Agreed.

If I was chief there would be two options only:

- we keep pick 1
- we trade pick 1 for 3 & 6

No touching our 2019 1st round pick to equalise a trade with GC. If GC trades it needs to be weighted heavily in our favour.

I would take Walsh at 1.
With 3 & 6 I would take Smith and Caldwell.

Couldn’t agree more. Would take Smith and Caldwell for sure but unlikely the trade will be there. Happy with Walsh if trade doesn’t come about

 

[Soapy V]

We are short in depth in KPD's short term, that was the point I was highlighting

I don't see it as an issue plus I count H.Goddard although I would have kept Rowe over Casboult as he can cover forward and back

 

[HARKER]

"If they are of the belief" We will soon find out.

As for not investing in kids, we have just added players in the vital age bracket that the club stipulated they wanted to target, Fasolo, McGovern, Newman.
What SOS has done to this point, is what a rebuild should look like, the hard work starts now.

"I don't think that internally the club would be thinking that what it really needs.......is more kids."

Now starts the next phase, the critical phase of targeting FA's, while still investing in the draft. We should not burn our ongoing success by over capitalizing on mature age players for the now. Target FA's next year, Coniglio, Cunningham, Ellis, Newnes, rather than paying overs for just one Josh Kelly. It allows us to improve our list for FREE, while still targeting the best talent in the draft

We've added Fasolo, McGovern and Newman at the same time we've lost or let go of Wright, Byrne, ASilvagni, Rowe, Kerridge, Graham.....etc.
Yes, the rebuild does have the right flavour about it, although we missed on that senior mid we wanted this year. That happens.

Next year should be the year we put the right cherries on top. We did well this year, but just didn't hit every target, although it wouldn't have made that much difference in the long run. I feel we now have everything in place that will tell us who is in and who will be out next year.

2019 really will be the big year for us...........I think.

 

[HARKER]

IMO we need depth options especially some mature bodies that will be an example at reserves level whilst putting on pressure for the best 22.

I see "potential" depth and "potential" balance. Not a criticism at all, just and observation of where we sit. at the end of 2019 I expect it to be much more advanced

Mature bodies? Absolutely.
One year into our current crop and the right targets hit next year and we're off and running.

 

[Soapy V]

Even if we didn't have Pick 1 this year I reckon our midfield looks awesome. So much potential.

The reason SOS won't trade Walsh is if he becomes elite we don't need anyone else. We don't need foot soldiers we want elite

Cripps Kennedy Dow SPS Setterfield Fisher Curnow could be as good as any sides midfield. Then we add Walsh

I haven't even included LOB Cuningham Polson Lang or even Charlie

 

[Soapy V]

We've added Fasolo, McGovern and Newman at the same time we've lost or let go of Wright, Byrne, ASilvagni, Rowe, Kerridge, Graham.....etc.
Yes, the rebuild does have the right flavour about it, although we missed on that senior mid we wanted this year. That happens.

Next year should be the year we put the right cherries on top. We did well this year, but just didn't hit every target, although it wouldn't have made that much difference in the long run. I feel we now have everything in place that will tell us who is in and who will be out next year.

2019 really will be the big year for us...........I think.

I reckon Newman will prove to be an absolute steal and will play 22 very good games in our defence

 

[HARKER]

Even if we didn't have Pick 1 this year I reckon our midfield looks awesome. So much potential.
The reason SOS won't trade Walsh is if he becomes elite we don't need anyone else.
Cripps Kennedy Dow SPS Setterfield Fisher Curnow could be as good as any sides midfield. Then we add Walsh
I haven't even included LOB Cuningham Polson Lang or even Charlie

Which makes for perfect sense, but should GC seriously be dangling a #2 & #6........gee, it makes it tough.
I'd be right on the fence and very happy for either outcome.

The reason I like Walsh is because the way I see it, he'd add value to his peers by way of attitude, professionalism etc.
We have two extremely wonderful captains now with Cripps & Docherty, but then to have an 18 year old book-ending that same mindset for all the other players sandwiched in between.......Sounds good to me.

 

[Soapy V]

Which makes for perfect sense, but should GC seriously be dangling a #2 & #6........gee, it makes it tough.
I'd be right on the fence and very happy for either outcome.

Then the question is does SOS believe Smith & M.King (for example) are as good a chance to be elite or is Walsh just a lock to be that player?

I don't know?

 

[HARKER]

Then the question is does SOS believe Smith & M.King (for example) are as good a chance to be elite or is Walsh just a lock to be that player?

I don't know?

This is where i don't like doubling up.

If Max King comes in, does it spell a possible end for McKay. I know some will say no, but not both will be able to play, given we have CCurnow and McGovern involved.....so what now? Re-train some to other posts? we know how that often ends up.

I don't care whether it's the draft or recruiting; Add value to where it's required.
When you do the numbers you'll find this is a very practical way to go.

 

[Soapy V]

The reason I like Walsh is because the way I see it, he'd add value to his peers by way of attitude, professionalism etc.

And that's the bit that is hard to judge for us amateur recruiters. The interviews, getting to know family & teachers etc are absolutely vital. From the outside it seems he has all those qualities and will never let the club down

 

[Soapy V]

This is where i don't like doubling up.

If Max King comes in, does it spell a possible end for McKay. I know some will say no, but not both will be able to play, given we have CCurnow and McGovern involved.....so what now? Retrain some to other posts?

I don't care whether it's the draft or recruiting; Add value to where it's required.
When you do the numbers you'll find this is a very practical way to go.

If it was me I wouldn't pick either Kings. I would in order pick Smith Caldwell Hatley Rozee & Stocker. What we need, will step in quickly and develop with our group. IMO picking a tall early and having to develop isn't worth it

 

[HARKER]

And that's the bit that is hard to judge for us amateur recruiters. The interviews, getting to know family & teachers etc are absolutely vital. From the outside it seems he has all those qualities and will never let the club down

It is next to impossible to judge, but I like getting to the ground and watch the guys in warm-ups and then try and get a read on who they may be.

The VFL is a wonderful place to play this game and watch players run onto the field and then try and 'guess' what sort of game they'll have before they've even had a kick. It's surprising just how often one gets things right, picking up those that are tuned in and those that aren't.

Walsh looked a beauty to me last year, let alone this year.
I guess once that takes hold in your mind, it's hard to let go. Question is though; Who has got into SOS's mind?

 

[bmaurizio]

If it was me I wouldn't pick either Kings. I would in order pick Smith Caldwell Hatley Rozee & Stocker. What we need, will step in quickly and develop with our group. IMO picking a tall early and having to develop isn't worth it

Ordinarily I’d agree but Lukosius is a very special KPP, tantalizingly so, a heart ache to leave him for another team.

 

[Soapy V]

Ordinarily I’d agree but Lukosius is a very special KPP, tantalizingly so, a heart ache to leave him for another team.

Just go home factor is not what we need and I'm not 100% convinced what type of player he is

 

[Soapy V]

It is next to impossible to judge, but I like getting to the ground and watch the guys in warm-ups and then try and get a read on who they may be.

The VFL is a wonderful place to play this game and watch players run onto the field and then try and 'guess' what sort of game they'll have before they've even had a kick. It's surprising just how often one gets things right, picking up those that are tuned in and those that aren't.

Walsh looked a beauty to me last year, let alone this year.
I guess once that takes hold in your mind, it's hard to let go. Question is though; Who has got into SOS's mind?

Walsh is the no brainer No.1. No doubt BUT until we see them in the AFL none of us really know. If the bits of information I have been given are true it's Walsh first and daylight second for SOS

 

[HARKER]

It's a real pleasure chatting to all in here, whether we agree or disagree.

Just the way it should be. Thanks.

 

[bmaurizio]

Yes it’s a retention issue , flight risk is high the SA scene is insular and a frenzy at least 3 guns , Lukosius Rankine & Rozee are revered.
Obviously family and friends too, it’s very understandable they are young and immature.
These same issues apply to any other team.