Changes v Carlton

[The Punter]

I preface this thread by stating that a settled side would be desirable, and the boys did the job on the weekend, and should be commended.

However, we could possibly have five regular best-22 players fit for the Carlton game:

Steven Baker
Adam Schneider
Michael Gardiner
Xavier Clarke
Lenny Hayes

Firstly, I would like some feedback on where these guys should come back in, AFL or VFL.

Secondly, for everyone who comes back into the senior side, who would come out?

Personally, if all five were included, my suggestions would be James Gwilt, Andrew McQualter, Charlie Gardiner, Jarryd Allen and Robert Eddy. All except Gardiner were good on the weekend, but the guys replacing them would certainly be a skill upgrade if not an effort upgrade in some cases.

I think C Gardiner is the only one who personally deserves to be "dropped" (I didn't have him in for this week's game, preferring to keep McEvoy), but the other four would be victims of better players returning from injury.

On the other hand, only Lenny Hayes would definitely demand a return directly into the senior side. King and Kosi worked well in the ruck on Saturday night, Baker and X Clarke haven't played much football this year and Adam Schneider wasn't exactly setting the world on fire before he got injured.

Thoughts?

 

[CHBench]

IN: Baker Gardiner Hayes
OUT: McQualter C. Gardiner ???

It would be dissapointing if the 5 came straight back in. We would be going back to our old ways by playing with a team full of senior players with not many developing. Gwilt has been good as has Eddy and McQualter. Allen has been providing a bit of bash and crash and another target up forward. Gardiner had an average game on the weekend so he could possibly be on the out. This week would be a perfect oppurtunity to play McEvoy, playing against another first year ruckman but because Gardiner and Kosi fit and firing it won't be happening.

IMO baker is a must. Leaves Judd for dead every time. I would like to see schneider in but he has been playing very average football and Clarke i have no idea who would have to make way for him. Perhaps a stint in the 2's to get some game time back into his body.

 

[Squizz]

Lyon has spoken about Hayes and Baker, so they are straight in.

If Gardi is fit, he'll be straight in too.

X and Schneider should go through Casey, but I think Schneider might be given different treatment?

No room for Birss again?

If you look at the guys who played against North, there are very few who you would even think of leaving out of the team.

Chucky and Mini definitely. Eddy might be unlucky. Gwilt for mine (should never have been in) but won't happen.

Would leave Allen in, as we have to have another tall if Riewoldt is going to do "the Richo". I thought he created plenty and gave us structure.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

For me:
X in for Eddy ( Eddy was good but showed his inexperience at times ).
Schneider in for C Gardner
Lenny in for Mc Qualter
Baker in for Geary or Gwilt.

I am a bit undecided about whether we should use two Rucks. Both have proven to be able to play a whole game OK. It would be OK for example if M Gardner could play in the forward line when not rucking but at this stage we don't know if it would work.
Hard to find room on the team for the Two rucks and Kosi and Allen.

 

[Squizz]

King needs support before he gets another soft tissue injury. Would think the two rucks would rotate off the ground.

Riewoldt to float and Allen/Kosi to provide badly needed forward line structure.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

King needs support before he gets another soft tissue injury. Would think the two rucks would rotate off the ground.

Riewoldt to float and Allen/Kosi to provide badly needed forward line structure.

Yeah I know what you mean about Kingy, it just seems a bit of a waste to have two players with only 50% gametime each, though Armitage who relieves the midfield players ( http://www.saints.com.au/tabid/5315/Default.aspx?newsid=62397 ) dosn't seem to get much more time than this either.
Would it be an alternative to rest king completely and have Gardiner in instead?

 

[Squizz]

I reckon they combine pretty well, King because he controls the ruck contests and floats into defence and Gardi as he runs pretty aggressively and gives an option (also pinch hits as a forward).

Watching Kosi's tap-work, I'd rather the two first choice rucks play in the same team. It also gives insurance against injury as we saw with King against Essendon and Gardiner against Sydney.

If you bring Gardiner in, arguably it gives King a rest of sorts on the bench.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Blues dont have the greatest ruck duo remember. And I for one would love to see Macca take on Kreuzer! But I know we may have to wait another year for that to happen.

Baker, Hayes and Gardi straight back in. X and Schneids a run with Casey.

Unlucky: McQ, Allen and Eddy

 

[Kildonan]

I think we need to see more players top up their fitness with a short stint at Casey. Xavier Clarke is the goal kicking midfielder we have been missing most of the season, but his performances do relate very closely to his fitness. Adam Schneider has been inconsistent for us this year - with only one truly inspiring performance - against a disheartened Melbourne. Baker hasn't played since the Richmond match - his second game of the season. Michael Gardiner came back from injury once already this season and only really played out the first quarter before being cotton-wooled for the remainder of the match.

Hayes is match fit - he can come staraight back in, but questions should be raised as to the fitness of the others.

Birss is fighting fit.

Another I would consider is Luke Miles - hes had a few games at Casey now and really looks the goods.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

Fair points about match fitness. Birss could def come in instead of Baker, and I'd rather that because Birss is probs in the best form of his career.

Miles is a rookie, and I dont think hes been promoted. So he cant play... But I think we've only promoted 2 rookies (Eddy and McQualter) so that leaves one more a possibility. I think they might be leaving it open for Attard to make a quick recovery.

But Miles is def looking promosing, from the small glimpse we got all those months ago against Richmond, to hearing about him kicking 5 goals in 2 matches from the back pocket just recently.

 

[Squizz]

I think Mini came up for Goose and Eddy for LJ, so Miles will have to stay on the rookie list until Fraser makes up his mind. (looks like Armo2Roo has beaten me for pace)

He's got the attributes, but is still building his fitness base. At 21, he still has time on his side. Would be very disappointed if he was not elevated at end of year (onto senior list).

 

[Otiman]

In: Birss (HFF), Hayes (C), M. Gardiner (R)
Out: Allen (FF), C. Gardiner (HFF), +1.

M. Gardiner is essentially relieving Koschitzke to play FF, meaning Allen is not required. Birss in for C. Gardiner, and someone else to exit for Hayes. Mini perhaps? Eddy?

Baker - Been out too long, suspension, an injury then reinjured has been out for 6 weeks, and has only played 2 games this year.

X - As above, been out for too long, and his form was down when injured too.

Schneider - Was a candidate to be dropped with Milne and Dal, should come through the VFL to prove himself in a similar vein.

Another change, should the club wish to do so, is Miles in for Gwilt. Not sure what purpose this would prove as Gwilt has been servicable and is on the improve.

 

[Kildonan]

Fraser interviewed on Sunday (I think) - said he was still a long way from getting back - if he does get back at all

 

[CHBench]

Fingers crossed Gwilt isn't dropped. He's one of a very few backmen developing at the club and i feel that he is improving everyweek. One thing that i will criticize him on is he dosen't pay attention to the play, there have been quite a few instances where the ball has spilled out and has been a bit slow to react to it. But if he can improve that area of his game he will be very handy.

 

[HoldenMCaulfield]

Baker in for Geary or Gwilt.

VFL (Geary) or AFL (Gwilt) for Baker ? (apologies for being a smart arse...)

On topic, I would not be surprised or too unhappy if there will be one change only with Hayes coming back in for Charlie Gardiner (with Armitage taking Gardiners role and hopefully getting more game time - he played almost the entire game for Casey a few times this year and seemed okay...).

Michael Gardiner should only come back in if fit and Baker and X Clarke should be tested with Casey (have been out for quite some time). I would give McQualter another go, I liked the way he fought himself into the Boomer Harvey contest and finally got the better of him in the end. Gilbert played a lot better this weekend and is regaining his fitness.

Not sure about Schneider - from what I remember, he's had only one really good game (and that was against Melbourne), so why not give him the Casey experience, too. On the other hand, Lyon likes him, so he may be in. In that case I would expect Allen or Gwilt (with Allen moving back) to be out.

I guess that we will know more (or at least have more to talk about) once the team for Casey this weekend (top of the table clash against Williamstown !) will be announced (possible test especially for Clarke and Baker).

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Blues dont have the greatest ruck duo remember. And I for one would love to see Macca take on Kreuzer! But I know we may have to wait another year for that to happen.

Baker, Hayes and Gardi straight back in. X and Schneids a run with Casey.

Unlucky: McQ, Allen and Eddy

I'd bet that Kruezer and McEvoy would love to have a shot at each other, but at our current level in the ladder we are much better having Kingy smash them in the ruck.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I think Mini came up for Goose and Eddy for LJ, so Miles will have to stay on the rookie list until Fraser makes up his mind. (looks like Armo2Roo has beaten me for pace)

He's got the attributes, but is still building his fitness base. At 21, he still has time on his side. Would be very disappointed if he was not elevated at end of year (onto senior list).

Aren't we able to temporarily elevate a rookie when a player is on the long term injury list?

With plenty of players vying for a spot, and Miles in his first year as a Rookie they may make him wait out the year. It is great though, having a first year rookie that we would like to play!
Some of our players seem to be able to get straight back into it, and I think that Baker is one of them, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him come back in. I agree that Schneider may be a bit dubious though.
Just hope that X doesn't hurt himself playing for Casey. I am pretty sure Attard will play for Casey a bit before geting a Saints game.

I believe that RL is trying to give some of the past underachievers a last chance before crunch time at the end of the year, and that Gwilt and McQualter will stay in next round. Good luck to them both.

 

[Otiman]

In that case I would expect Allen or Gwilt (with Allen moving back) to be out.

Allen will never play back for us. Too slow and easily exploited.

 

[TassieSaint]

In: Hayes Birss M. Gardiner
Out: Allen C. Gardiner Eddy
Casey: Baker, Clarke, Schneider

Bakes, X and Schneiderman to have a spell in the magoos to earn their selection next week. Charlie Gardiner has had his chance, Eddy and Allen aren't yet AFL ready (although I've been impressed by Allen and think he'll make it). Hayes obviously should be straight back, Gardiner is very important and Birss shouldn't have been dropped in the first place.

 

[CHBench]

Early prediction anyone?

Saints by 23

 

[siamang]

Yeah, saints should and will win by about 40.

They are our bitches and we are still much better than them.
We don't deserve to play finals if we lose against the tankers, especially considering our current injury list.

 

[Look2Me4Guidance]

Hayes would definitely come back in for me. I would suggest for McQualter (he seems to get knocked off the ball far too easily, but he does put his body in). Eddy and Allen had done enough to warrant another game for mine. Charlie Gardiner is a bit of a worry, so if Michael Gardiner is fit I'd bring him in to really help exploit our ruck advantage. Kosi should have ample opportunity to ply his craft on the extra space of the G as will Riewoldt. Schneider must come back through the VFL, ditto X Clarke. Baker is a tricky one. He would be an extremely valuable inclusion to take on Judd, especially after Judd won't be 100% due to his groin complaints. Very difficult to find a spot for him though.

 

[MIDDO]

Lyon has spoken about Hayes and Baker, so they are straight in.

If Gardi is fit, he'll be straight in too.

X and Schneider should go through Casey, but I think Schneider might be given different treatment?

No room for Birss again?

If you look at the guys who played against North, there are very few who you would even think of leaving out of the team.

Chucky and Mini definitely. Eddy might be unlucky. Gwilt for mine (should never have been in) but won't happen.

Would leave Allen in, as we have to have another tall if Riewoldt is going to do "the Richo". I thought he created plenty and gave us structure.

Wondering if Allen is a chance to kick a goal in the near future ?? Alright providing a target but has to make an impression on the scoreboard.

 

[MIDDO]

Hopefully only two mabye three changes,Hayes in for Mini , Baker in for C.Gardiner and bring in Gardiner for Allen. Is it just me or does Allen have alot of fans on this site ,seems to me he really needs to show a hell of alot more than just putting his body in.A pack mark or mabye a couple of goals hmmm well one would do for a key position player . Think Kosi is the answer down forward as he attacks and gets his hands on plenty of footy,might be ready to blossom Sammy Fisher on the ball really got us moving against the Roos,match winnig move !!!!!

 

[ChrisFooty]

Schender and Xavier Clarke should return through the VFL. They will lack match fitness and form, so getting a game or two would be the better option.

Baker comes in, does McQualter play the shut down role as well? (assuming they are both in the same team) Or does he go trying to win as much of the footy as possible? McQualter and Gwilt do not derserve to be dropped, although you would say that for Birss (no room it seems currently, very unlucky)

Charlie Gardnier will be dropped. Plays one very good game (Sydney) then follows with two very ordinary performances. Unfortunley that is not going to benefit St.kilda. Eddy probabaly will go back with Casey.

Allen might stay in the team because we need that third tall option.