Collard and Silvester Rookied!

[Calcium Man]

Very happy with all of that.

Gourdis certainly is very athletic and could be a good forward but should be a good defender if he fails up forward.

Collard is an amazing talent, obviously has mental issues which could become worse with a move away from home or improve dramatically.

Silvester is an important pick up. People complain about it being a bit of a waste but it'll allow Rance and Gourdis time to develop. Neither will play much in 08 or 09 so if thursty goes down he will be next in line.

Cartledge is very important for Putt and graham's development as well. Didnt cost a lot so a wise choice that gave us a back up ruckmen and Gourdis.

Howat, while i think he is a bit of a dud at AFL level has an amazing work ethic on the training track and was almost certainly picked up as a leader for our young players on the training track. Dont think he will play for us again but if his influence spreads across our young team will be worth every penny.

 

[jezza]

happy to claim gourdis and collard - but the rest is a bit disappointing IMO.

in reality we could have claimed Gourdis, Collard, Arrowsmith, Kangra's, Dunn

that would have been brilliant - Cartledge reeks of the "genuis" of terry and miller -that same genuis that claimed "Humm" as a intelligent pick up

Silvester is back up i guess, and continues the loyalty to coburg thing - which i think is important.

Howat - well, he has another chance - by no means our worst fella this season - but i would have preffered a "new face" in Dunn.

7/10 for me lose a point for each of the last three picks - but to get collard especially was great IMO

Haven't liked at all what I have read about Arrowsmith and Kangars, not disappointed they aren't at Richmond.

 

[astro_toby]

Haven't liked at all what I have read about Arrowsmith and Kangars, not disappointed they aren't at Richmond.

perhaps - but they are things that young players can work on - their real worth is a mystery until they play a match.

I think with Cart & howat - we know what we are getting, the chances of them improving a huge amount is minimal - and it would have to be an absolute miracle for either one to still be on an AFL list in 3-4 years - we have seen them at this level, and they aren't really up to it.

Kangra's, arrowsmth - who knows - could be duds, or could work their asses off and be potential long term players - its planting another two seeds, and hoping they sprout.

howat and Cart will really struggle to bear fruit, and we all pretty much know that.

 

[Wally Matera]

Whether Silvester produces any return or not, l think its a fantastic approach by the richmond football club always reward a Coburg player. It will force the team to work hard and try to win games of football... it gives everyone the incentive for minimal costs.

 

[Calcium Man]

I think with Cart & howat - we know what we are getting, the chances of them improving a huge amount is minimal - and it would have to be an absolute miracle for either one to still be on an AFL list in 3-4 years - we have seen them at this level, and they aren't really up to it.

Kangra's, arrowsmth - who knows - could be duds, or could work their asses off and be potential long term players - its planting another two seeds, and hoping they sprout.

I know what your saying here. But looking at from another angle Cartledge will be protection for Graham, Putt and to a lesser extent Pattison and allow them to blossom instead of having them thrown to the wolves.

Howat can be looked at as a player who works so hard on the train track and gets his rewards it could influence our younger kids to train harder. It would certainly be a worthwhile investment if that happens.

Yes we sacrificed 2 potential long term players but we did it to hopefully benefit of our other young kids long term

 

[Darth_Tiger]

Whether Silvester produces any return or not, l think its a fantastic approach by the richmond football club always reward a Coburg player. It will force the team to work hard and try to win games of football... it gives everyone the incentive for minimal costs.

this time last year who would have thought jake king would have the impact he did this year. silvester might just come on in leaps and bounds.

 

[Ruanaidh]

this time last year who would have thought jake king would have the impact he did this year. silvester might just come on in leaps and bounds.

Watching the way McGuane and Sylvester combined together at Coburg gives me hope for the duo (and Thursty) at the AFL level. It could be an inspired move.

 

[hognogger]

Howat can be looked at as a player who works so hard on the train track and gets his rewards it could influence our younger kids to train harder. It would certainly be a worthwhile investment if that happens.

I don't post on here very much... but this is a savvy point.

Some of our young players on the fringe will look at guys like Howat, and be pushed to match him. If it were only up to determination and effort, Howat would be picked every week.

 

[hognogger]

this time last year who would have thought jake king would have the impact he did this year. silvester might just come on in leaps and bounds.

Another excellent point. Obviously, the guy has something... you just never know... there are always surprises every year...

Who would have thought Foley would have blossomed like he did in 07? No one on this board picked *that* one, as far as I remember.

 

[astro_toby]

I know what your saying here. But looking at from another angle Cartledge will be protection for Graham, Putt and to a lesser extent Pattison and allow them to blossom instead of having them thrown to the wolves.

Howat can be looked at as a player who works so hard on the train track and gets his rewards it could influence our younger kids to train harder. It would certainly be a worthwhile investment if that happens.

Yes we sacrificed 2 potential long term players but we did it to hopefully benefit of our other young kids long term

i understand the policy with it, but don't agree with it. I actually believe that it works in the opposite.

Last year, due to a near freak amount of rucking injuries, Pattison was thrown to the wolves and blossomed to a level which we were all surprised with. Simmonds, Graham, Pattison, Putt & then Polak as a possible 5th back up is a suitable Rucking combination - it definitely will probably need another young prospect in next years draft somewhere as well - but i would have preferred Kangra's to Cartledge - he still would have been a "if worsts comes to worst" option - but very well could have some real development and tools to work with. Tristan doesn't really appear to be much of a player at all - and will only be used if probably 4 or even all 5 of these above ruckmen get injured.

don't get me wrong - i'd rather us to it "this way" if we HAVE to do it - instead of taking Richards in the PSD, and missing out on Gourdis. I just think sometimes, in football, and in the world in general - people react too quickly in the aftermath of a freak disaster. sure, learn from it - but it doesn't mean you have to change your whole course of thinking.

Howat may be the fricking "James Brown" in the training business - but he will be Vanilla ice at best on an AFL field - surely there is better ways to inspire our players to work harder on the track? ( for example - hire assitant coachs who have been brilliant hard working players on the track - Buckley, Craig Bradley etc )

 

[Calcium Man]

i understand the policy with it, but don't agree with it. I actually believe that it works in the opposite.

Last year, due to a near freak amount of rucking injuries, Pattison was thrown to the wolves and blossomed to a level which we were all surprised with. Simmonds, Graham, Pattison, Putt & then Polak as a possible 5th back up is a suitable Rucking combination - it definitely will probably need another young prospect in next years draft somewhere as well - but i would have preferred Kangra's to Cartledge - he still would have been a "if worsts comes to worst" option - but very well could have some real development and tools to work with. Tristan doesn't really appear to be much of a player at all - and will only be used if probably 4 or even all 5 of these above ruckmen get injured.

don't get me wrong - i'd rather us to it "this way" if we HAVE to do it - instead of taking Richards in the PSD, and missing out on Gourdis. I just think sometimes, in football, and in the world in general - people react too quickly in the aftermath of a freak disaster. sure, learn from it - but it doesn't mean you have to change your whole course of thinking.

Dont completely agree with it either, but i can understand where those selections came from.

Got to remember not all kids flourish when the are just chucked out there or it could effect them with future injuries and longevity and rucking is probably the worst position to throw a kid to the wolves. Josh Fraser is a player i always look at, never reached is full potential and has been cut down by injuries and i dont think he will play out a full career.

Howat may be the fricking "James Brown" in the training business - but he will be Vanilla ice at best on an AFL field - surely there is better ways to inspire our players to work harder on the track? ( for example - hire assitant coachs who have been brilliant hard working players on the track - Buckley, Craig Bradley etc )

I dont believe hiring those kind of coaches will make players train harder as i reckon its very much a visual thing. Judd and Kerr said watching cousins train as hard as he did inspired them to train as hard as possible. It might not be as effective with Howat because his performance isnt reflected on the field. But if you can get guys like Hughes and Meyer to increase their training output by 25% you have two very talented players who could be stars. That makes howats rookie listing worth it.

 

[Madtiger2006]

Sylvester and Cartledge will probably be the first delisting at the end of next season

 

[Ruanaidh]

i understand the policy with it, but don't agree with it. I actually believe that it works in the opposite.

Last year, due to a near freak amount of rucking injuries, Pattison was thrown to the wolves and blossomed to a level which we were all surprised with. Simmonds, Graham, Pattison, Putt & then Polak as a possible 5th back up is a suitable Rucking combination - it definitely will probably need another young prospect in next years draft somewhere as well - but i would have preferred Kangra's to Cartledge - he still would have been a "if worsts comes to worst" option - but very well could have some real development and tools to work with. Tristan doesn't really appear to be much of a player at all - and will only be used if probably 4 or even all 5 of these above ruckmen get injured.

don't get me wrong - i'd rather us to it "this way" if we HAVE to do it - instead of taking Richards in the PSD, and missing out on Gourdis. I just think sometimes, in football, and in the world in general - people react too quickly in the aftermath of a freak disaster. sure, learn from it - but it doesn't mean you have to change your whole course of thinking.

Howat may be the fricking "James Brown" in the training business - but he will be Vanilla ice at best on an AFL field - surely there is better ways to inspire our players to work harder on the track? ( for example - hire assitant coachs who have been brilliant hard working players on the track - Buckley, Craig Bradley etc )

Great post And funny too

 

[astro_toby]

Dont completely agree with it either, but i can understand where those selections came from.

Got to remember not all kids flourish when the are just chucked out there or it could effect them with future injuries and longevity and rucking is probably the worst position to throw a kid to the wolves. Josh Fraser is a player i always look at, never reached is full potential and has been cut down by injuries and i dont think he will play out a full career.



I dont believe hiring those kind of coaches will make players train harder as i reckon its very much a visual thing. Judd and Kerr said watching cousins train as hard as he did inspired them to train as hard as possible. It might not be as effective with Howat because his performance isnt reflected on the field. But if you can get guys like Hughes and Meyer to increase their training output by 25% you have two very talented players who could be stars. That makes howats rookie listing worth it.

i think we are pretty much on the same opinion, just slightly difference strengths in that opinion. The issue with Josh Fraser was very different. They actually intended and chose to throw him "to the wolves" from day one. To me that was not a good idea, especially with a ruckman. With Pattison, we had no other choice - he was a 3rd year player, and was intended as a back up - which is what he did when we needed back up.

This season i think we have three mature bodied ruckmen who can handle the "hustle and bustle" of 1st grade rucking duties - Simmo, Patto and Gus. Putt's body is probably even more developed than Tristans. getting a reject "mature age" rookie recruit whose body is not really that developed (91kgs?) - just a bit of a waste to me - kangra's would have been just as worthy to "fill the void" of 6th available ruckman.

With Howat, I don't like slagging him off, as i like him - works hard and etc. But he just isn't that talented. We did well to cut some deadwood this year, that in the past we would have probably offered new contracts to - Knobel, hartigan, Krakour - to resort back to it with our last rookie spot, when again, we could have claimed Dunn - and injury prone, but still young talented player (who also would have been pretty happy to come back home to melbourne ), just seemed like the club just can't quite let go of completely "the old ways"
which have held this club back for 27 years.

Not sooking overall though - very happy with the delistings, the trades (mcMahon im warming to, but still think we payed WAY too much) and all the AFL listed selections. just a bit disappointed that we couldn't quite let go of old habits - and in my eyes, wasted a few selections right near the end