News Coronavirus (COVID-19) Discussion Thread IV

[koshari]

That applies to the courts and has no relevance whatsoever outside of the courts.

Your argument is used to shut down debate. If people are always innocent before being proven guilty, how can they ever be bought to trial?
After all they are innocent of any and all crimes, you just said so.

Now that my friends is a logical takefown.....

 

[Tas]

Your image there doesn't show any cases where the spreader is wearing a mask.
See this one? Top right?
View attachment 1301904
That's why we wear them. The only time a decent quality mask is effective is to reduce risk to others, not to protect oneself.

As far as I can make it out, from the report, the blue bar represents the droplets, and the brown bar represents the amount of the virus that passed through. Even if you stop all the droplets, you still get infected. BTW, their N95 testing involved having masking tape around the edges.

I think the bottom set of figures was with a larger viral load, I had to stop reading because I was in a fit of laughter imagining people walking around with head full of tape.

Most of the punters who are out there who are wearing masks are just using a simple single ply cotton mask which is loosely fit, take that into consideration when thinking if a mask mandate is going to be effective.

 

[Themanbun]

I find it disappointing that so many people can't make a point about this without having a dig at someone's faith. I love you all but I do wish our dialogue could be better at times.

 

[Tas]

Masks definitely help but I think what can't happen is another lockdown.

They were a great help against alpha and beta.

As to future lockdowns, a lot depends if we get a future variant that is going to kill a lot of people and cripple our health system.

Too many people have made the sacrifices already and the thing is, if you get COVID, live with it. That's basically it. Get the vaccine booster (if you feel comfortable) so it gives you the best chance of limiting the symptoms. People are dying, but more permanent mental barriers are being planted on those that live.

I think these statements need a bit more nuance, we can live without lockdowns with Omicron but until the pandemic is over the goal posts keep moving. I think with these two new covid treatment drugs, hopefully it will be a game changer, in the west of course that can afford it.

As much as it sounds radical (to stay open despite the quick transmission of Omicron) from that perspective, it is honestly the only option from here. Boosters or not, re-developed vaccines or not, give people the freedom they deserve. They followed the restrictions, did what they had to do, and I think it should stop there. I was for-lockdowns but man, it really does drag you down.

We shouldn't have needed to lockdown had we not botched quarantine... multiple times. I think it goes to show we are ill prepared for anything that is far more dangerous with literally no plan of action at all. When it comes to the next election, become active and make sure you vote for someone who promises to bring in some competent people to prepare us for the next pandemic. Because we were warned in advanced something like covid was coming and we were apparently prepared for it.

Bring back masks yes, but don't take their freedoms away. We have already suffered beyond the limit mentally. Myself included. I want people to enjoy themselves.

Omicron is airborne, unless we are out in hazmat suits, we aren't going to stop the spread with masks. We might cop less of the virus, if your vaccinated immune system can't handle it then I doubt it matters how much you are exposed to it.

I am still gobsmacked that after two years, there has been not one government press conference with health advice that could help save lives, like try and lose some weight if you are morbidly obese, make sure you get plenty of vitamin d, go out in the sunshine for however long depending on your skin colour, make sure you get plenty of zinc in your diet... some useful s**t that can save lives. s**t that doesn't need a lockdown.

It was painful to just go to work (get a antigen test beforehand and hope you weren't positive), wait in the car, get your result, go to work, realise you are going straight home after, and repeat. It was torture to see how much it was having an impact on everyone. I don't think anyone slept all that well. It was just horrific. You need free time to think, breathe and restart. How do you do that stuck indoors basically isolated from families, friends (if you don't work with them) and other close people?

Yeah, sick of the lockdowns too. Despite more than 6000 new cases in NSW today, in the last week hospitalisations went from 227 to 388, ICU 28 to 52, those on Ventilators 10 to 14 and from what they have said in the media, the vast majority of serious infections are unvaccinated people. We saw South Africa cases numbers go down after about a month.

Whether we like it or not, hospitalisations will happen and increase. All that is required is to wear masks and get a booster if you are comfortable with that.

Just stop screwing around with people's schedules, plans, basically their lives. We have suffered enough.

So far the numbers look manageable.

 

[blackshadow]

Yesterday I booked for my booster on Dec 30.

 

[Tectonic]

Yesterday I booked for my booster on Dec 30.

Got mine walk-in at the cohealth on Victoria street yesterday.
In and out, once the 15 min wait after the shot was done.

Arms bloody sore today lol

 

[Ligma]

Lol I can’t believe I just watched Trump own Candice ‘Hitler wanted to make Germany great again’ Owens on the vaccine mandate.

HAHAHAHA

and also masks in retail are elite, when dealing with Karens and Kevin’s you can mouth s**t to them and they won’t even know.

 

[Tas]

"Health Minister Greg Hunt announced on Friday the government would bring forward boosters from five months to four months from January 4 and to three months from January 31."

Greg "lucky ******* dip science" Hunt.

 

[ferball]

"Health Minister Greg Hunt announced on Friday the government would bring forward boosters from five months to four months from January 4 and to three months from January 31."

Greg "lucky ******* dip science" Hunt.

Do you have a problem with monthly booster shots?



On CPH2069 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Val Keating]

Watch this


Nek minit

 

[ferball]

1.57 in - Your sumple choice (bro.)

 

[Val Keating]

1.57 in - Your sumple choice (bro.)

The most cringeworthy thing is when he says at the end “I’ve been in heaps of fights”. What an absolute tosser.

 

[ferball]

The most cringeworthy thing is when he says at the end “I’ve been in heaps of fights”. What an absolute tosser.

Don't be disrespectful - he's a freedom fighter Val.

These guys are greater than the ANZACs.

 

[TruRoos7]

Don't be disrespectful - he's a freedom fighter Val.

These guys are greater than the ANZACs.

One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist/anarchist

 

[ferball]

One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist/anarchist

Terrorists and anarchists aren't the same thing.

 

[TruRoos7]

Terrorists and anarchists aren't the same thing.

At what point did I say they were!!!
Your interpretation of my statement is completely based on a falsehood..
Merely pointing out that a freedom fighter can be either or doesn’t mean they are the same.

 

[ferball]

At what point did I say they were!!!
Your interpretation of my statement is completely based on a falsehood..
Merely pointing out that a freedom fighter can be either or doesn’t mean they are the same.

Usually when people write something like "this/that" the slash means this and that are similar or the same, whereas saying this or that makes it clear they are different. So to me you said they are the same thing when you wrote "terrorist/anarchist" instead of "terrorist or anarchist".

Its cool tho its just a misunderstanding.

And when I used the term "freedom fighter" in this case I specifically meant:

dickhead who isn't really fighting for anything/attention whore.

Altho "annoying * wit" is probably a fair call as well.

 

[Hojuman]

Hoj & Mrs.H. test -neg.

Xmas tomorrow ( goodbye isolation )

 

[Tas]

New South Plaguelands has had 33,143 new cases this week. In the same time hospitalisations increases by 231 to 458, ICU +24 to 52 and those on Ventilators by +5 to 15.

It is reported by the ABC that "More than 70% of cases in some Australian states are the omicron variant of the coronavirus but New South Wales does not routinely carry out genome testing to identify the variant." On the assumption that NSW is 70% or higher, which seems logical given their cases numbers flatlined before Omicron, it doesn't look like we should become over-taxed by this variant if we follow a similar pattern to South Africa and see numbers start to decline after about a month or so.

Here in Plaguetoria we had 11,597 new cases this week and have seen Hospitalisations -18 down to 374, ICU -4 down to 77 and Ventilators +2 to 43. We had far more delta cases prior to Omicron coming here for a summer holiday so I think our system still has a bit of a delta backlog we are working through which is why we are seeing some declining hospital numbers.

I think as long as we make some effort to test when sick and isolate when sick we should prevent a South African type surge. So far it seems even with our extremely hasty vaccination regime which has left many people with a weaker efficacy than those vaccinated at the recommended interval, it still seems good enough to mitigate a very bad outcome.

We still have roughly 10% of the population not vaccinated, unsure how many of those are unable to be vaccinated, I doubt it would be 2.5m people. Rather than witch hunt these people I think the evidence should be presented to them about the danger of being unvaccinated a long with a warning that we are not going back to restricting movement so in the future you will have a significantly greater probability of getting covid and this is what it looks like for unvaccinated people. Those who actually can't be vaccinated for medical reasons should be given the option to be isolated/looked after, perhaps regionally somewhere we can control exposure, until the worst of this pandemic is over. Because they will be at much greater risk as this variant spreads rapidly.

It might be more of a shock to the system for states that have mostly avoided the pandemic to date, we have probably had a significant chunk of the population in NSW and Victoria exposed to other variants and it seems our natural immunity response provides a better level of protection than just vaccination, something to do with better protection in the nasal/mucus ducts where the infection first arose, which doesn't seem to be triggered by vaccination alone.

 

[Reagan Smash]

Omicron: bleak new year or beginning of the end for the pandemic? — Guardian Australia

Scientists are cautiously optimistic that the variant may be a sign the virus is losing its power, despite the high infection figures

apple.news

 

[Sillygit]

Rather than witch hunt these people I think the evidence should be presented to them about the danger of being unvaccinated a long with a warning that we are not going back to restricting movement so in the future you will have a significantly greater probability of getting covid and this is what it looks like for unvaccinated people

That information is already readily available to them. And they deny the reality of it.

 

[Ry009]

That information is already readily available to them. And they deny the reality of it.

Further to that, I don't understand the logic of going out of our way to placate people who at this stage are no chance to change their mind, and quarantine people who legitimately can't get vaccinated.

I am not disputing the fact Victoria has endured some lengthy Lockdowns that have resulted in heavy financial and mental burdens for us all....that none of us want to, or believe should return.

But with that being said, the loud minority will always find something to be angry about, despite the fact that outside of lockdowns, mandates have been loosely enforced.

Would be an utterly pointless excerise trying to get through to people at this stage.

 

[Tas]

That information is already readily available to them. And they deny the reality of it.

Well, I said what we should do is say this is the path we are going on and if you feel you want to roll the dice with your health then good luck with that, we hope you don't die... but we aren't going to lockdown any longer for something that we can manage, like Omicron.

But, we are also doing nefarious s**t like trying to exclude people from services, require a vaccination passport, etc when these people don't represent a threat to us. You can and mostly will get covid from another vaccinated person because over 90% of us are now vaccinated and can still spread covid. Some of the people that refuse to vaccinate have already caught covid and it gives them a better immune response than the vaccine. There is like no nuance in the way we handle this and there should be nuance particularly if you are going to implement authoritarian restrictions on movement or access to services.

We do nothing to stop antivaxxers from not vaccinating their kids to horrific s**t like measles, mumps, whooping cough and chicken pox then travel to parts of the world where it is more common and then bring this s**t back here causing outbreaks. I think if we want the government to have more involvement on what you should do with your body, what you can and can't have access to, etc. It should at least be a platform they run on for an election so the public can decide if they want to be lead by a party that is that invasive.

At this point in time, there are no laws requiring anyone to take a vaccine, it is voluntary. The only exception is for residential aged care workers due to the vulnerability of their patients. Some states include some others like various frontline workers, medical staff, etc. But there is no law requiring the general public to do so and the intention is for vaccinations to be voluntary. It isn't voluntary if you are coerced.

I'm fine if society decides it shouldn't be voluntary, but the people should make that call. I think if the unvaccianted represented a threat to the rest of society then you can understand them taking this route, however, I think it is an overreach and they have abused their power during this pandemic, from locking up poor people in housing commission flats to these massive long-lasting city/state-wide lockdowns that have hurt poorer people whilst at the same time being totally incompetent when it comes to the quarantine and border security. He wont take any accountability for his *ups and glacial speed of shutting the border to NSW every time they * up, yet he expects the disadvantaged to suffer through untold misery. I can understand why people have had a gutful. I think it is easier to just take the vaccine and move on but who am I to piss on them, if I was going to be financially crippled by these string of mistakes and illogical decisions I probably would have lost my sanity too.

 

[Tas]

Further to that, I don't understand the logic of going out of our way to placate people who at this stage are no chance to change their mind, and quarantine people who legitimately can't get vaccinated.

The government should go out of their way to placate people when they are pissing all over their rights.

I am not disputing the fact Victoria has endured some lengthy Lockdowns that have resulted in heavy financial and mental burdens for us all....that none of us want to, or believe should return.

But with that being said, the loud minority will always find something to be angry about, despite the fact that outside of lockdowns, mandates have been loosely enforced.

I think it is important to empathise with people, even if you disagree with what they are doing. It is important we do not lose our humanity in a crisis.

Would be an utterly pointless excerise trying to get through to people at this stage.

I think it is important we try, and try and be more understanding and sympathetic. This government lied to their face that we just had to tough it out until we got to 75%, 80%, 85% and eventually 90% to reach herd immunity and we could go back to life as normal.

He knew, or should have known, herd immunity was never going to happen, we knew that six months ago when vaccinated people passed on covid and caught it multiple times yet he persisted with this lie to string along people until we could get to some vaccination level he plucked out of his arse that would allow everyone to go back to normal. Then he imposed some horrific restrictions on those who remained unvaccinated.

It is just senseless and cruel to people who have endured so much already. I know a lot of them are illogical and would just be easier to just get jabbed and moved on, but it has really lacked human empathy to treat people this way. He could have extended an olive branch, he knows we are on the precipice of approving two covid treatments. Is this what weary Victorians needed, a heavy-handed leader after all this misery?

Where is the empathy for these people?

 

[Ry009]

The government should go out of their way to placate people when they are pissing all over their rights.



I think it is important to empathise with people, even if you disagree with what they are doing. It is important we do not lose our humanity in a crisis.



I think it is important we try, and try and be more understanding and sympathetic. This government lied to their face that we just had to tough it out until we got to 75%, 80%, 85% and eventually 90% to reach herd immunity and we could go back to life as normal.

He knew, or should have known, herd immunity was never going to happen, we knew that six months ago when vaccinated people passed on covid and caught it multiple times yet he persisted with this lie to string along people until we could get to some vaccination level he plucked out of his arse that would allow everyone to go back to normal. Then he imposed some horrific restrictions on those who remained unvaccinated.

It is just senseless and cruel to people who have endured so much already. I know a lot of them are illogical and would just be easier to just get jabbed and moved on, but it has really lacked human empathy to treat people this way. He could have extended an olive branch, he knows we are on the precipice of approving two covid treatments. Is this what weary Victorians needed, a heavy-handed leader after all this misery?

Where is the empathy for these people?

Does the messaging need to be better? Absolutely. Are people tired of Andrews tone? Understandably yes.

For the record, I have no issue with people who are vaccine hesitant and are not conflating any excessive hatred with government or big pharma. All for the government to improve on the messaging too.

All for solutions that keep a healthy balance of people's freedom and safety. It's still an ongoing shitty balancing act at the moment. I sincerely feel for everyone whether it's for physical health, financial or mental health reasons.

I just merely pointed out that I didn't get your suggestion of isolating people who can't get vaccinated to allow the loosening of mandates. Don't understand the logic of it, nor the logistic of where it would even be feasible.

Would like to think my posts in this thread including the one your replied to were fairly balanced, not sure if your proposal was balanced or even empathetic to people stuck through no choice of their own. If I misunderstood, I'm happy to be corrected.