COVID-19 / Coronavirus

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Gralin said:
He's just a sh*t communicator
He had a shitty road map and he's already deviating from it and now he's spruiking some changes but not telling us which are even being looked at.

Same sh*t different day he's not been interested in giving anyone any idea of what's coming since the start and looka like he's back to that again
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Don’t forget he was forced into providing a road map. No one said it was accurate.
 
hebog said:
Don’t forget he was forced into providing a road map. No one said it was accurate.
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I didn't agree with the road map as written but at least we had some steps and measure. Most of it was fluff anyway.

He should have been forced to provide some ******* detail to the plans.

There should have been a framework put in place during the first lock down. NZ managed to put together a list of stages very early on to tell people what to expect and then follow through and update it.

We had every state go off on their own, different levels of public engagement different levels of communication, different definitions of what things mean.

We had ages where he'd say I'll go to stage 4 if I have to but I won't tell you what that means or what that could mean, just know that I will do it.

That's using fear to try and drive compliance.

Then he's like hold on a little longer and I will let you do things again but I won't tell you what, that's dangling the unknown treasure in front of people

It's manipulative behaviour and frankly the way he talks about nothing have been decided because it depends on the numbers either means they really aren't planning anything in advance and have no internal framework they are using or that they just don't want to share any of that with us.

Either way its poor communication and something he should be held accountable for. He's basically refusing to have an adult conversation with the people in the state he runs and acting like we don't need any clarity or understanding of their process.

Plans can change, things can be delayed or brought forward or changed but there is literally no consultation with the public, no narrative about how we get from a to b or what it will look like

But yeah he's open and transparent........
 
This is exactly what I am talking about with how he "answers" questions

Can we, and should we, be able to live with 10 cases as an average?
That's the question put towards Daniel Andrews.

On the issue of zero, five, 10, all of those things, I have always tried to be clear with people that we have targets and modelling based on those targets are.

The best upper public health advice was those targets cannot be achieved. Questions will become over what period, and if it will take an unacceptably long time, to get to those numbers, I have always tried to be clear.
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Where as this in relation to questions about changing dates I think is fair


People were very keen to have targets and to have a clear sense of what we were aiming for and to have dates alongside those targets so we have tried to provide that, but at no point have I ever sought to guarantee that we would be able to deliver an outcome on a day.

That isn't the nature of this fight, I'm afraid. I wish I could. Much like I wish I could look down the camera and tell every Victorian all the different things I hope to announce on Sunday.

At no point have I said to people that these are a stone tablet and on this date we will take the following step. It has always been heavily cavated to say subject to how much virus there is and how much narrative sits behind those cases.

Perhaps I have not been as clear as we could have been.
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How long is a piece of string?
I've tried to be clear, it is a piece of string...
How long is the piece of string?
Well, exactly, I mean, how long is a piece of string?
Yes, how long is the piece of string?
Clearly, it's a piece of string.
But how long is this piece of string?
Perhaps I haven't been clear enough...
 
If Victoria can't operate in any capacity after having a sustained period of 10-15 cases, then I sure hope we have a vaccine that's safe effective and ready to go by January.
 
Lots of people doing it very tough out there at the moment.
Ive been so lucky being able to work right through .

In the past month Ive had around 5-6 clients almost plead with me to stay an extra 5 minutes , just so they had company or someone phyically to talk too.

Dont know what the answer is but what is happening now cant be .
 
HODGEYROAD said:
If Victoria can't operate in any capacity after having a sustained period of 10-15 cases, then I sure hope we have a vaccine that's safe effective and ready to go by January.
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Sure, but that’s not the risk the government is trying to mitigate.

It’s unlikely we stay at that rate without restrictions. Once restrictions are lifted and “normal” life resumes then the one infected person can potentially infect many more than we saw in the Chadstone cluster. With heavy restrictions in place, one bad choice led to 30+ infections.
 
Messenger said:
Sure, but that’s not the risk the government is trying to mitigate.

It’s unlikely we stay at that rate without restrictions. Once restrictions are lifted and “normal” life resumes then the one infected person can potentially infect many more than we saw in the Chadstone cluster. With heavy restrictions in place, one bad choice led to 30+ infections.
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All I'm asking for at this point is for our government to handle the virus like NSW is handling it.
 
HODGEYROAD said:
All I'm asking for at this point is for our government to handle the virus like NSW is handling it.
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Raw numbers say NSW has had 110 cases over the last two weeks and we've had 127 but 60 of those cases in NSW are from Hotel Quarantine.

So they've had 50 cases out in the community and we've still had 127

When you dig into the actual numbers it's not as black and white as those pointing to NSW being open would like you to believe
 
Gralin said:
Raw numbers say NSW has had 110 cases over the last two weeks and we've had 127 but 60 of those cases in NSW are from Hotel Quarantine.

So they've had 50 cases out in the community and we've still had 127

When you dig into the actual numbers it's not as black and white as those pointing to NSW being open would like you to believe
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NSW government have put our government to shame in terms of handling the virus.
 

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Tried to keep off in general as most would realise I'm not happy with the deaths in Victorians of the aged community. But now we have Sutton being basically called a liar by the hotel inquiry.

Jeff said why if you own a business and people die, why do you get charged for industrial manslaughter and governments who do exactly the same do not?

I think with Daniel and now Brett it is a fair question. A question that should not hold political lines, because I'm quite happy to put Morrisson up there as the aged care owner.

People are dead because of them, but the departments that could hold them accountable are actually accountable to Daniel. So won't do it. (And probably Scomo too)

It's not right. If it was your parents or grandparents you'd think its not right. But it's probably not your grandparents or parents, so your indifferent like most of us because it doesn't affect you. Which is in some ways like modern society. So... it is what is what it is.

But if one of you complain in the future about the same sort of thing happening to you, while I will once again be disgusted as I am now by this.

I don't think I can actually say that you didn't see this coming by everything you were ambivalent too previously. So I'm not saying anyone deserved it, no one does, but you were prepared for it to happen to others as long as it wasn't you.

That to me that is poor. I won't hold back on that. Sorry.
 
Jeff is being a dickhead and really starting to piss me off

Re: deaths in nursing homes
  1. Ownership of deaths lies with the owners of the homes. Even putting Covid aside they have failed in their duty of care and failure to implement RC recommendations
  2. Federal govt and their casualisation of the workforce. Full time jobs would of prevented the need for workers to move between sites
 
Sutton claims he didn't read the email about security.

Sutton told DHHS in September he didn't think they needed to provide the email to the Inquiry as he hadn't read it.

www.theage.com.au

For Sutton, this inquiry cannot end soon enough

The Chief Health Officer might have been better off if the Health Department produced the those emails when it was asked.
www.theage.com.au www.theage.com.au
 
Strapping Young Lad said:
Yeah, fancy waiting 24 hours for all the results of the tests from a known outbreak to land before committing to a rollback of restrictions. 🤪


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He could have told us yesterday that was happening. Yesterday they were still spruiking announcements.

And again he said it wasn't safe to talk about easing restrictions today. Not actually easing them. They'd already said today wasn't going to be about easing restrictions immediately just providing information about what was going to happen.

Why is it too dangerous to talk about the plan?
 
Gralin said:
He could have told us yesterday that was happening. Yesterday they were still spruiking announcements.

And again he said it wasn't safe to talk about easing restrictions today. Not actually easing them. They'd already said today wasn't going to be about easing restrictions immediately just providing information about what was going to happen.

Why is it too dangerous to talk about the plan?
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He was probably quite hopeful that the results would be known by this morning, but they weren't.
 
Strapping Young Lad said:
He was probably quite hopeful that the results would be known by this morning, but they weren't.
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Not buying it. And no this isn't a conspiracy just the view that he's a s**t communicator.

They had multiple opportunities to say that today wasn't likely to happen and didn't.

Despite that this idea that we can't be told the next steps until they are ready to happen is also a terrible idea especially when they spend the week hinting at what could happen.

And know I don't by the PMs comments about not being able to cope with NSW numbers. They are pretending 9 cases in hotel quarantine is the same as 7 from a community cluster.

And no I'm not really we should be opening up tomorrow. I'm saying don't make promises you know you won't keep while asking us to trust you
 
Gralin said:
Not buying it. And no this isn't a conspiracy just the view that he's a sh*t communicator.

They had multiple opportunities to say that today wasn't likely to happen and didn't.
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I feel like we've already gone through this.
You're upset with him for not outlining the next steps without them actually being ready to be taken, just like he did not do today, which is the very reason he's been reluctant to commit to them before time. I can understand why he won't commit to the steps ahead of time, when so many people are already prepared to do as they please.

Today I read people complaining that we are under the 5 case average, when he's said for weeks that it's not just pure numbers, but the stories behind those numbers. We can't have unknown cases in large numbers, and this Preston outbreak puts that at risk.

Anyone that was paying attention to the Preston outbreak should have been well aware that any announcement of a rollback of restrictions was going to hinge on how quickly they could define and act on the cases in that region of Melbourne.
 
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