Mega Thread Dayne Beams trade (Its over, thread closed)

[dansa]

I keep reading a lot of bluster from Collingwood supporters saying we are in the position of power with the Beams trade.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
History shows that when a good player wants to leave and names a destination club there is rarely (if ever) true and fair compensation.

Of course we can refuse to trade but I see that as most unlikely due to a few reasons:
The club will be portrayed very poorly by the media for not being compassionate.
We hardly need another player unhappy to be at the club.
We could lose him next year for nothing.

I would suggest lowering expectation in order to avoid disappointment.
My guess is we will get pick 4 and a ordinary player but I'd much prefer two draft picks. As many have said we are rebuilding, so we don't need list cloggers.

 

[gutsroy]

IIRC Buckley was the first to talk about specific requirements, or maybe Pert. Warren didn't even weigh in til yesterday.

Not that it really matters "who started it".

Buckley did make some mention of what we might consider 'good weight' on Grandstand on the weekend, and that just plugging in 18-year olds wasn't going to considered sufficient as we wanted part of the compensation to be ready-made. Don't know if he mentioned specific picks / players.

 

[MarkT2]

People are confused by the fact that the team was young and therefore they think it should have continued to improve. The reality is the core was ageing and other teams have gone past us. While our mature core has declined Hawthorn's has just kept going strong with Hodge, Jewis and Mitchell the top three on the weekend.

Swan is NOW ageing and that’s only become visible in an injury affected year 4 years after the GF win. He’ll be very good for a couple of years yet. Cloke, Pendlebury & Thomas were in their prime and Beams & Sidebottom approaching that point rapidly. The ageing "core" was actually the periphery bar Jolly who should have been a target for specific replacement in the short term (over and above drafting Grundy and having Witts for the longer term solution).

 

[12kilos]

I keep reading a lot of bluster from Collingwood supporters saying we are in the position of power with the Beams trade.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
History shows that when a good player wants to leave and names a destination club there is rarely (if ever) true and fair compensation.

Of course we can refuse to trade but I see that as most unlikely due to a few reasons:
The club will be portrayed very poorly by the media for not being compassionate.
We hardly need another player unhappy to be at the club.
We could lose him next year for nothing.

I would suggest lowering expectation in order to avoid disappointment.
My guess is we will get pick 4 and a ordinary player but I'd much prefer two draft picks. As many have said we are rebuilding, so we don't need list cloggers.

Beams said he wants a trade to QLD becouse of his father ie cancer, The pies would not be doing there job properly if they dont talk to the Lions and Suns even if it means paying part of Beams wages to the suns at 2015 2/ Fudge Connors! he has to learn just like Collingwood had to compromise , Connors and his Client ie Beams might have to do the same also! If the Lions want to guarantee a deal it has to be pick 4 and Aish simple

 

[Old Spice]

Is Looneyberger still a required player at Brisbane? If not might be able to work into GWS trade with Gorringe leaving.

 

[eddiebankbalance]

My guess is we will get pick 4 and a ordinary player but I'd much prefer two draft picks. As many have said we are rebuilding, so we don't need list cloggers.

I will rather he stand down for 12 months as the AFL is a corporation and Beams being an employee.

 

[dansa]

Beams said he wants a trade to QLD becouse of his father ie cancer, The pies would not be doing there job properly if they dont talk to the Lions and Suns even if it means paying part of Beams wages to the suns at 2015 2/ Fudge Connors! he has to learn just like Collingwood had to compromise , Connors and his Client ie Beams might have to do the same also! If the Lions want to guarantee a deal it has to be pick 4 and Aish simple

Collingwood must get GCS involved in the bidding if we are to get anywhere near market value for Beams.

 

[Robroy22]

I keep reading a lot of bluster from Collingwood supporters saying we are in the position of power with the Beams trade.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
History shows that when a good player wants to leave and names a destination club there is rarely (if ever) true and fair compensation.

Of course we can refuse to trade but I see that as most unlikely due to a few reasons:
The club will be portrayed very poorly by the media for not being compassionate.
We hardly need another player unhappy to be at the club.
We could lose him next year for nothing.

I would suggest lowering expectation in order to avoid disappointment.
My guess is we will get pick 4 and a ordinary player but I'd much prefer two draft picks. As many have said we are rebuilding, so we don't need list cloggers.

When was the last time a player of Beam's calibre (who was still contracted) was in this situation?
Can you illuminate me on the history so that I can get a better take on the matter?

 

[Hollow Knight]

Is Looneyberger still a required player at Brisbane? If not might be able to work into GWS trade with Gorringe leaving.

Gorringe is at the Suns.

But hard to say Re: Leuey. Most Brisbane supporters floating him in trade scenarios last week were based on Ryder coming here which he isn't. If we traded Leuenberger now and with Trent West out till mid-season with an ACL, we'd be one Stefan Martin injury away from having to play 19 year old basketball convert Archie Smith. That would be ugly.

 

[Lockyer24]

I think it's time to rebuild now, well and truly.

I would trade Beams for two first round draft picks and add them on top of pick 8 which will be used for Moore, pick 22 for Lumumba and we have pick 28. That would be 5 picks in the top 28, not bad for a side rebuilding.

While draft picks are exciting, as Dekka said we still have a handful of blokes like Pendles and Cloke entering their prime. He talks a lot about planning and age profile and really the young guys we got recently was to top up our fringe areas. I don't think we planned on going even more youth, but now that Beams has walked out its almost been forced on us. UNLESS we demand experienced talent in return which is what they seem to be trying. (3 way deal most likely way to achieve that)

 

[Snoop Dog]

Its got interesting today and in some ways us losing out on Clark I think will strengthen the resolve of Eddie, Hine and Bucks to either chase a gun or commit to a rebuild. Before they do anything now that is the question.

We can talk about 2 first rounders for Beams or maybe a 2nd round? I'd rather an Aish or Crisp and if we had to toss something back then lets do it but unless they are A grades I'll take picks / kids.

If they choose to hunt some stars then I think Hine needs to find a way of getting Levi Greenwood, Luke Shuey to the table. I'd love one of those two to some how come into it.

I'm still not convinced the Suns cant be in the mix but sounds like Swann is preppinig all parties that a deal can be done.

 

[robertg22]

I think we need to look at players with excellent footskills, Greenwood doesn't really fit that mould. Good footballer, bad kick..

 

[Snoop Dog]

I think we need to look at players with excellent footskills, Greenwood doesn't really fit that mould. Good footballer, bad kick..

yeah I think that is fair comment.

 

[Lord Wilberforce]

I think we need to look at players with excellent footskills, Greenwood doesn't really fit that mould. Good footballer, bad kick..

Yep, I think Hawthorn is a good example for us in that area.

They carve you up on the edge of the 50 with small accurate chips. All of a sudden they having a shot on goal with another player who is also an accurate kick. Death by a thousand cuts!

 

[BEEG]

I think we need to look at players with excellent footskills, Greenwood doesn't really fit that mould. Good footballer, bad kick..

Would fit in great at Collingwood then

 

[dansa]

When was the last time a player of Beam's calibre (who was still contracted) was in this situation?
Can you illuminate me on the history so that I can get a better take on the matter?

Of course every situation is different.
But the key points in this instance are that we have a player who wants to leave due to his father being seriously ill. Yes he is still under contract for one more year but I don't believe that holds as much leverage as it would normally.

I don't believe when push comes to shove that Collingwood will force him to stay at the club for another season for the the 3 reasons I listed in the previous post.
- We don't want to be seen as preventing son moving closer to ill father.
- We don't want to keep players at the club if they are not happy.
- We lose him for nothing next year.
And I assume Brisbane are thinking the same thing.

Time will tell but I would be absolutely shocked and over the moon if we could get pick 4 and another first round pick or pick 4 + Aish (or equivalent) from where things stand now. Brisbane's first 2 picks (or similar) is about all I could hope for. That changes if GCS get involved.

This is a big blow for the club but I am still generally positive about our future.

 

[robertg22]

Would fit in great at Collingwood then

Yes, and that's not a good thing!

 

[robertg22]

yeah I think that is fair comment.

O'Rourke was rated as an elite kick as a junior wasn't he? Haven't seen a huge amount of it at AFL level but the base is there.

 

[76woodenspooners]

How dare Ed hint this isn't solely to do with his father's health

Agree, it is a very very bad idea to say stuff like that when sitting at the negotiating table.

 

[Snoop Dog]

O'Rourke was rated as an elite kick as a junior wasn't he? Haven't seen a huge amount of it at AFL level but the base is there.

yep he was. Elite runner and kick. I just havent seen him that aggressive with his kicking.

 

[Old Spice]

Gorringe is at the Suns.

But hard to say Re: Leuey. Most Brisbane supporters floating him in trade scenarios last week were based on Ryder coming here which he isn't. If we traded Leuenberger now and with Trent West out till mid-season with an ACL, we'd be one Stefan Martin injury away from having to play 19 year old basketball convert Archie Smith. That would be ugly.

Yes I realise Gorringe is at the Suns, which is why I'm wondering if Looneyberger is required. If not then he could go to GWS and we might offer pick 4/5 to them plus Looney for Shiel. You guys can grab Currie.

 

[Horaceg]

Agree, it is a very very bad idea to say stuff like that when at the negotiation table.

There is probably a lot more to do with this, Dayne can use all tha extra money on medical bills, treatments whatever he wants, I'd take that type of a salary increase in my job to move.

At the end of the day why he wants to leave shouldn't matter, he wants to leave. Get the best deal done and deal with it. We should concentrate on building a champion team and building loyalty.

All the best Dayne Beams wishing your Dad a full recovery, thanks for the service, always a Collingwood Premiership Player.

With all due respect I hope we flog Brisbane next year, twice if the schedule allows. Go Pies

 

[76woodenspooners]

There is probably a lot more to do with this, Dayne can use all tha extra money on medical bills, treatments whatever he wants,...

Irrespective of whether it's true or valid or not, it's a bad idea to question the motives in a public forum of the person you're trying to negotiate with. Any professional negotiator will tell you that.

I'd take that type of a salary increase in my job to move.

Really? When I was 24, and if I were being paid $kazillions, and somebody offered me $kazillions + a little bit more to move ... Yeah, I would have moved, but it wouldn't have had anything to do with the money.

At the end of the day why he wants to leave shouldn't matter, he wants to leave.

It matters in so far as he is seeking to renegiate his contract. Why bother having contracts if people (on all sides) can just walk out of them at will?

It also matters in so far as understanding if there are any incidious issues causing him to want out. We (the fans) don't need to know about that, but it's important for the club to understand them.

Get the best deal done and deal with it. We should concentrate on building a champion team and building loyalty.

Indeed. But we shouldn't just get a deal done at any cost.

All the best Dayne Beams wishing your Dad a full recovery, thanks for the service, always a Collingwood Premiership Player.

Indeed

I always imagined he'd be captain of Collingwood one day

 

[Albert Ross]

How dare Ed hint this isn't solely to do with his father's health

Brisbane > Byron Bay by road = 165km or about 2 hours by car?

Jetstar ex-Tullamarine to Byron Bay at 8.25am every morning = flight time 2 hours.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Yes I realise Gorringe is at the Suns, which is why I'm wondering if Looneyberger is required. If not then he could go to GWS and we might offer pick 4/5 to them plus Looney for Shiel. You guys can grab Currie.

Now that Clark is completely gone I'd almost take Looneyberger and pick 4 for Beams. I think The Berger is one of the best ruckman I've seen. It probably pushes Witts out though. I don't think Brisbane are going to be giving us Aish or Mayes thats for sure.