Arts & Humanities Death: What, and how often, do you think about it?

[dales.girl38]

For some reason two nights ago the thought of death just hit me and for the next 20 minutes or so it was all I could think about, just imagining an eternity of nothingness. I got a bit disoriented and teared up a bit.

I really, really want to believe in some sort of afterlife - it would certainly provide a lot of comfort, but I just don't think it's real. Heaven would have to be one crowded place.

 

[HARKER]

I really, really want to believe in some sort of afterlife - it would certainly provide a lot of comfort, but I just don't think it's real. Heaven would have to be one crowded place.

Not enough of us worthy to make the journey and all those millions of light years squared to work around in.
Think heaven may be just fine.

 

[fairdinkum]

Both just nothingness, or, variations on nothingness. I can't remember my pre-birth so it's certainly a type of existence/non-existence different to my current state. I personally think that's all death is.

You can't remember any experience of 'prebirth' yet you take it for granted that you did experience it?

 

[Call Me Cake]

How you feel after death is the way you were feeling before you were born.

 

[fairdinkum]

Odd experience today.

I was helping a mate from uni inspect sharehouses to move into (as he doesn't have a car so I offered to drive him around to his inspections). We were looking at a house not far from my own, currently lived in by a tiny, lovely old Vietnamese lady. She was showing us around the place and straight away I noticed the numerous photos of what I took to be her daughter. Gorgeous girl; in every photo she looked cuter than the photo before, and I guessed she was about my age, maybe a bit younger. In every photo she had a big, beaming smile. You can just tell some people are happy people and this girl was one of them. I figured I had nothing to lose if I were to casually ask about this beautiful girl but the lovely old lady was busy selling the good points of her place to my mate, so I decided to hold off until there was an opportunity to speak.

I walked into the living room and there were even more photos of the young lady, as well as one of those big picture/message things people make for milestones. You know the things, like a big poster, decorated with lots of photos of a person at different ages, that people write messages on like 'besties 4 eva - Sarah' etc and give as a gift. Not sure what you call them but you know what I'm talking about. Anyway, this one was apparently for her 21st, and in the centre of this one it said 'Cindy'. Aha, I thought, I would ask about this Cindy. She had obviously moved out of home since the old lady lived by herself, so I wondered where she had moved to. Hopefully nearby, I thought. Then I noticed something odd: below 'Cindy' it said '1988 to 2009'. Naturally my first reaction was along the lines of, 'what, is she... dead?'. But then I realised that maybe the years were there simply to signify her 21 years alive (the years from which all of the photos had come, of course), and whoever made the big thing clumsily failed to realise that the text kind of looked like a date-of-birth-and-death.

I decided to take a closer look at the messages to see if they were to reveal anything, but figured it was best to be subtle just in case. The first message I read was along the lines of 'Hey Cindy, I'll never forget [whatever thing they did together], [persons name]', which was inconclusive. So I read the next one: 'Hey Cindy, you were the best friend I ever had, I really miss you'. Maybe she moved away, I thought, and that's why she missed her friend. I decided to read one more: 'We all really miss you and your beautiful smile'.

It became clear that she was dead. I was basically looking at a shrine. Christ, I was practically in a shrine.

I didn't say anything, we soon left, and my mate wasn't keen on the place. But now I am really curious about how this young girl died. Some part of me has this odd feeling that it happened in that very house. Don't ask me why. But this poor old lady now lives all alone in a house filled with photos of her dead daughter smiling at her. I felt even worse for her when she mentioned that her business had been flooded as part of the QLD floods and she had never been able to recover enough money to restart. She called me tonight to ask if my mate wanted to move in, she mentioned that she really liked him (he is a nice Taiwanese kid), was so keen for him to be her new housemate that she was happy to lower her price for the room. I didn't have the heart to tell her that my mate thought the bedroom was too cramped and gloomy.

My brain is always a little scrambled after a night of heavy drinking but that moment where I went from admiring this gorgeous young lady and hoping she was my neighbour to realising she had died young was trippy as. Been thinking about it all day. That poor old lady.

 

[HARKER]

Beautifully told story, fairdinkum.
Felt as though I was walking through that property with you.

 

[mike262]

For some reason two nights ago the thought of death just hit me and for the next 20 minutes or so it was all I could think about, just imagining an eternity of nothingness. I got a bit disoriented and teared up a bit.

I really, really want to believe in some sort of afterlife - it would certainly provide a lot of comfort, but I just don't think it's real. Heaven would have to be one crowded place.

Basically if you can prove the existence of ghosts/spirits then you can approve the existence of an afterlife so there is hope.

With the countless amount of ghost stories in the world there is hope

 

[Silent Alarm]

It's been a while, but I'm again having one of those periods. I can't stop thinking about this Chris Brahney bloke.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-18814971

Long story short. He went to one of the massive Stone Roses reunion shows, lost his phone, exited the gates with his mates and then went back in to find his phone. They lost one another, and he was found in a Manchester canal the other day.

He was 22, right into his music, white, skinny, and pretty normal. I just can't help see myself in him. How pedestrian is going to a gig with your mates? It's just... it's really getting me down. I go on his facebook and see his friends, see the photos he was tagged in, and it's like... he's so normal. Two months ago, someone uploads a photo of him on the brews with his mates. Now he's dead. I can't stop thinking about the poor bloke and how he died. And I can't help but have another of those realisations that anything could happen to me at anytime.

 

[Tassieboy]

As with most, I of course don't want to drift off into oblivion, but needless to say, it doesn't really worry me too much.

 

[fairdinkum]

Just read about a fascinating book entitled The Top Five Regrets of Dying by a palliative care worker who got to know a number of people in their final days and decided to write about what she learnt.

I have already added it to my 'to read' list.

Apparently, these are the top five according the book's author:

http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/life/common-regrets-of-the-dying-20120716-224y2.html

1. I wish I'd had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me

2. I wish I didn't work so hard
This came from every male patient that I nursed.

3. I wish I'd had the courage to express my feelings

4. I wish I had stayed in touch with my friends

5. I wish that I had let myself be happier

http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/life/common-regrets-of-the-dying-20120716-224y2.html

More detail is given in the article.

Amazingly, I'd say I am only on track to regret number four of that list. Had 'I wish I hadn't have drunk so much grog in my twenties' or 'I wish I did better rehab to get back into footy sooner' or 'I wish I had traveled more in my twenties' made the list then I would have been on track to have those regrets, but alcoholism didn't even make the top five which genuinely surprises me.

 

[Silent Alarm]

I've seen that list before. It looks pretty stock.

When I first read it, I actually felt happy with myself. I know we all like to think we live as we truly want to, but I'm content with who I am. I'm never one to conform for the sake of it and it probably cost me plenty of friends. I don't regret it, because the things I'm into make my life worth living. I'm also pretty lazy and unemployed, tell most people what I think of them, and I'm a happy kid. I plan on staying like this 'til I'm ground down into the suburban sprawl and the city commute.

I reckon I'll regret my current laziness with footy, but it's been a bit meh for me lately. I'll get 100% into it next season, as I always like joining a new club. But meh. I just hope to make the next 10 years of my life to be all about travel and good times. Eh, I guess that's the naive hope of every 18-year old.

 

[Matthew2708]

Well I'll be thinking of it a lot more during the next week. One of Pa's brothers died yesterday. Still 7 left, started off with 13.

 

[DT_fanatic]

I'm not religious, and don't really believe in the whole hell/heaven stuff. That hasn't necessarily led to any conclusions about what will happen after death though. I mean, it's interesting that people's opinions are generally divided as a result of the difference in religious and scientific beliefs. But who's to say that the possibilities eventuating from those theories are the only ones that exist? What I'm saying is that there is no freaking way anyone of us will ever know what happens after death, and that anything we believe is mere conjecture.

Apologies if the above sounds like I'm debunking any beliefs or whatever, that's not my intention. I just wanted to make the point that whatever happens after death is a complete mystery to myself, and something that I have occasionally thought of. On some occasions, it is kind of scary. Sometimes I wonder that when I were to die, I would hate myself if it came with a whole load of regret. I hope it won't be like that, but its almost inevitable, really. The whole 'life flashing before eyes' thing, I imagine will remind us of a lot of stuff that we wished we could have done differently, I think. That scares me a little. If I am lucky enough to live until 75-80, or until whatever age people consider 'death's doorstep', I fear being in that state of mind.

On other occasions, the thought of death is exciting, in a way. I mean, it is the greatest mystery. Nobody knows what happens next. When it happens, I imagine part of me would be eager to find out. Hopefully it's not so bad!

 

[Silent Alarm]

On other occasions, the thought of death is exciting, in a way. I mean, it is the greatest mystery. Nobody knows what happens next. When it happens, I imagine part of me would be eager to find out. Hopefully it's not so bad!

Although I'm pretty into living right now, I feel the same. And I reckon that's a bit of a normal reaction. By the time we hit 70, our parents are gone, our friends are going, and partner/wife/husband might be as well. And after that long, maybe we just tire of living? It's not that we get depression, it's just that we've experienced all that we could. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but maybe it's something that's started to exist through evolution. The chemical release during birth and death – even adrenaline when you cross the road at the wrong time – all help to make a possibly unpleasant experience to be... less unpleasant? It makes death less intimidating.

Also, does anyone else laugh about the YOLO stuff? I mean, is Drake the most influential, biggest advocate of existentialist philosophy in 2012? Did people really not think about this 'fact' more often? I also love how it's become this sign of stupidity: Like living once is an alibi for dropping out of school to sink piss at 9am.

 

[fairdinkum]

Also, does anyone else laugh about the YOLO stuff? I mean, is Drake the most influential, biggest advocate of existentialist philosophy in 2012? Did people really not think about this 'fact' more often? I also love how it's become this sign of stupidity: Like living once is an alibi for dropping out of school to sink piss at 9am.

What the hell are you talking about?

 

[Silent Alarm]

I'm guessing you're a bit older. But as I'm 18, there are plenty of people on Facebook who talk about 'YOLO.' This is an acronym 'thought up' by Drake, a rapper, and it stands for 'you only live once.' People between the ages of about 16-19 refer to it as some way to live. The song is called "the Motto" (I think?) and so, it's almost become a motto for some people.

 

[fairdinkum]

I see.

Apparently I'm a bit older.

 

[I bleed Blue]

What accronym do buddhist people use instead of YOLO?

 

[Baldur]

You cease to exist. You may as well never have existed.

I think about it far too often.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

Sounds to me like the OP needs to find himself a passion in life. Perhaps a good cause to which he thinks he can contribute meaningfully. Something to keep him focused on his own positive personal development and optimistic about the future.

Anyhow I stumbled upon this article about the rise of the 'Death Cafe' movement. The basic idea is that people get together over tea and nibblies to discuss a topic that seldom gets much deep discussion in our society: death.

Would anybody here be interested in attending such an event? I would, if for nothing else than to mix with people who think about something other than which bill they next need to pay or which contestant on So You Think You Can Cook they hope gets voted off the island in tonight's episode.

 

[nicky]

I wouldn't be interested in that SB. I'm not a "group joiner" - perhaps because i'm quite shy and just hate being apart of a new group.

Also, i don't feel like i miss out on talking about deep "stuff". I have a brother who is a philosophy academic, he lectures in ethics. I have friends who are existential atheists and believe their true purpose in life is to align to their true self. Some friends are extremely hippy shake - they believe in past lives and it is conceivable that i may have to apologise to one in particular from time to time for cheating on her in a past life . Then i have other friends who are quite spiritual and believe in some interesting stuff.

I'm not sure i'd be that keen to talk about death anyway - it kinda freaks me out. Luckily there are other interesting things to discuss beyond water bills etc.

My advice is to find good friends you trust and learn about what they believe.

 

[Stratton_Gun]

 

[radiojake]

My grandmother passed away only just last week and her funeral was on Monday -

She had a decent innings of 86 years - I saw her last in April just gone - My brother and I were back in the old town for a cousin's wedding (other side of the family to this grandma) but the two of us stopped by to see her in her unit between the ceremony and reception; we stayed and chatted for nearly two hours with her. She was in good spirits then, though she was planted right in her reclining chair that she rarely left, I think she slept in the chair half the time. I think I always saw the best of her because she perked up alot when we would turn up... As we had been at a wedding, my brother and I were dressed rather sharp, which was something out of the ordinary - I kind of like that the last that she saw of the two of us we were all dressed nicely...

The funeral was a little sad, as you'd expect, but it was a bit of a relief too - She'd dropped away a lot in the 6 months since I'd seen her last - Had a fall, broke her hip - couple of weeks in hospital, moved into an actual nursing home as opposed to her unit; then only 6 weeks ago a stroke, which rendered her with borderline dementia... apparently she didn't really recognise her own kids anymore... It's much better that she went when she did, rather than continue on but with declining quality of life...


She was a big cigarette smoker and my mum/uncle/aunties estimate she had close to 3 quarters of a million sticks over the journey - and I don't even think the cigarettes even actually killed her....


On the other side of the coin, a friend I knew from Sydney also passed away just a fortnight ago - However she was only 27 - I didn't know her that well, we had met through friends, but I knew her enough to know she was an awesome person - we used to crash at their house quite often if our band played in Sydney/travelled up the East Coast - When we met her about 6 years ago, she was in the latter stages of chemotherapy - Eventually she went into remission and the cancer dissapeared. Every 3 months she'd go back in a check whether it had come back, and for two or so years, it stayed clear.
However nearly 18 months ago on one of the checks, the scans showed it had come back -It gradually took over again and she eventually lost the battle -

These two deaths in just the past fortnight couldn't be more further apart from each other in their tragicness, but they both had equal impact in about me thinking about death, and our limited time --

I guess I don't actually have anything profound to add to the discussion, but it's been on my mind of late for obvious reasons...

 

[Gasometer]

I am 45 now and I remember a kid we knew in Year 7 who died...he would have been 13 yrs old.

Its only now that I truly appreciate all these years later what a life he missed out on.

 

[Suspense]

owl cafe > death cafe