stephen_bayne
Club Legend
You're preaching to the choir. I'm not a fan either.
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Depp to be The Riddler?
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You're preaching to the choir. I'm not a fan either.
- Banned
- #27
Yeah you're probably right, they would have had to sow the seeds a bit earlier than the third film.
Riddler it is then. If Depp can't come to the party, what would everyone think of Hugo Weaving? He is pretty much the way I picture the Riddler, and in a lot of roles he's been able to convey a real intelligence in his characters, whilst remaining really creepy.
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- #28
I must admit I prefer the "younger" touch we've seen thus far with Ledger and Murphy. I know Depp isn't young, but aesthetically he can definetely pull it off.
haha, i just saw Bane on wikipedia, and i seriously doubt any real actor could play him, unless they hit the 'roids
and i dont know much about any of the villains, so i dont really care who they use.. as long as a 3rd instalment is coming out, then its all good
and i dont know much about any of the villains, so i dont really care who they use.. as long as a 3rd instalment is coming out, then its all good
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- Banned
- #30
that's true, but the problem with using a guy like Depp is that you get that whole sense of 'I'm watching Johnny Depp play The Riddler' thing. With Ledger as The Joker, in spite of all the baggage and Oscar talk, you just thought "i'm watching a psycopathic clown who is blowing up a city and killing people for fun"
Murphy was really, really, good as Scarecrow, because he just nailed the part and I hadn't seen him in much else. (he'd make a terrific Riddler as well imo).
Maybe they need to go for something from left-field, in the same way Eckhart and Ledger were considered quite odd picks for their characters (and obviously turned out to be really good choices).
probably not going to be popular with this,but im a huge batman fan and have felt that OVERALL the begins series has been well below my expectations,
so in saying that, the first 10 minutes of the dark knight (the bank robbery) was probably some of the best cinema i had seen in the last 10 years maybe longer, and if they were to introduce the riddler, the movie really needs to have that sort of feel, where the audience has no idea what is happening double cross galore, henchmen being knocked off randomly and constantly and the super villain in total control,
the females in this current series in my opinion have been terrible, and they are better off not wasting time on one and just letting batman and the villain go toe to toe
the villains in this series with the exception of ledger (who i thought was outstanding, but not in it enough) have been ordinary, ledger had two things going for him, A - his performance was outstanding B - his character is a big name great villain
i think they need a big villain in the final one, one they dont have to do a big back story explaining to the audience how they came about, the riddler would be my pick, everyone gets it and let him mess with everyones head
i think they need a depp like actor who isnt going to just take a paycheck but can immerse himself in the character, ledger has taken the "crazier than crazy" role so thats out, the riddler works because he thinks hes smarter than everyone and the right actor can have a blast being a smug aarogant bastard
so in saying that, the first 10 minutes of the dark knight (the bank robbery) was probably some of the best cinema i had seen in the last 10 years maybe longer, and if they were to introduce the riddler, the movie really needs to have that sort of feel, where the audience has no idea what is happening double cross galore, henchmen being knocked off randomly and constantly and the super villain in total control,
the females in this current series in my opinion have been terrible, and they are better off not wasting time on one and just letting batman and the villain go toe to toe
the villains in this series with the exception of ledger (who i thought was outstanding, but not in it enough) have been ordinary, ledger had two things going for him, A - his performance was outstanding B - his character is a big name great villain
i think they need a big villain in the final one, one they dont have to do a big back story explaining to the audience how they came about, the riddler would be my pick, everyone gets it and let him mess with everyones head
i think they need a depp like actor who isnt going to just take a paycheck but can immerse himself in the character, ledger has taken the "crazier than crazy" role so thats out, the riddler works because he thinks hes smarter than everyone and the right actor can have a blast being a smug aarogant bastard
I'd read somewhere that David Tennant (Dr Who) was being considered for The Riddler.
Riddler would be a sentimental favourite...I'm just not sure if he is a strong enough character for a Batman movie. A small role maybe but not the main bad guy.
I still think there is a place for a female villian, Talia al ghul being the best bet. With her Dad dead she could be a bit more ruthless, combine some elements of Catwoman and Lady Shiva with her and you could have a great villain.
I think they should bite the bullet and re cast The Joker. I cant see how you can reconcile what happened in TDK without him. I'd like to see Joseph Gordon-Levitt have a run at it.
Riddler would be a sentimental favourite...I'm just not sure if he is a strong enough character for a Batman movie. A small role maybe but not the main bad guy.
I still think there is a place for a female villian, Talia al ghul being the best bet. With her Dad dead she could be a bit more ruthless, combine some elements of Catwoman and Lady Shiva with her and you could have a great villain.
I think they should bite the bullet and re cast The Joker. I cant see how you can reconcile what happened in TDK without him. I'd like to see Joseph Gordon-Levitt have a run at it.
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
I could see Edward Norton playing an oustanding Riddler.
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- #35
Yeah, I could see that.
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- #36
Noway man, that Joker was a one in a million, saviour it and leave it as is never to be tampered with.
But how much did it erk you he was called "Raz" and not Raish? Seriously I wanted to scream out loud in the cinema.
How about Scarface? Has the complexity of the joker with the required menace while being a completely different character.
On Bane though, Batman is a superhero. Sooner or later he has to come up against a super powered villain. Realism or not. Get a good actor, make the story, and use CGI if you have to. Bane is perfect for this.
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
The Rock as Bane? He can act and has the required stature for Bane.
Yep. Get Quinn in there already!
a little OT,what was the plan before ledger's death? was the joker going to return?
Upgrayedd
A Vote for Clive is a Vote for Justice
Yeah, most solid blokes cannot act
Kevin Durand has some size on him
Kevin Durand has some size on him
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- #42
Didn't they cut a scene with the Joker being dragged away in a body bag because it was too contreversial? I've interpreted it that he and Two- Face were killed off.
ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
The scene in question was in the movie. It was when the mobsters carry the bodybag in saying they've killed The Joker. And then he pops out and kills the gang leader.
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- #44
Are you sure that is it? I know there is that scene but I suspected there was another at the end where he was actually 'dead' and thy deemed it out of taste I suppose you could say.
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ManWithNoName
TheBrownDog
That was the scene in question. I remember reading about it "A scene where the Joker hides himself in a bodybag to fool a gang leader".
Plus The Joker was never going to die. He can't be killed, that's what makes him Batmans greatest enemy.
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- #46
Cheers for clarifying that.
- Banned
- #47
Nah there wasn't any other scene, it was just local media making a story up out of nothing based on the scene early in the movie.
The Dark Knight really explained The Joker just so perfectly, he is the Yin to Batman's Yang and will always be there. If Batman was to ever kill The Joker, then The Joker would have won. It would have been beside the point to have him killed, so I'm not sure if he was ever planned to come back for the third, but I'm certain they didn't want to have him killed
My favourite method they used to explain the Batman/Joker relationship was the killing of Rachel Dawes. In that scene Joker basically made Batman choose to put his cause first and save Harvey, or be selfish and save Rachel. Batman's whole justification for donning the suit and being a vigilante, was that he was doing what the cops couldn't, and doing whatever it took to 'do the right thing' - but in that moment of the film, The Joker proved to Batman that they really were no different, and that Batman's motivation was just as selfish as anyone elses, and the Joker punished him for it by killing Rachel - if Batman had of stuck to his cause he would have saved her. In doing so Joker not only proved Batman had selfish motivation, and was not above putting HIMSELF before the good of the city (i.e. Harvey was much more important to Gotham than Rachel was), but that Batman's entire justification for his actions was a lie.
That's why Batman realised he had to step even further across the line if he wanted to stop The Joker.
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- #48
True. Good analysis.
Heath Ledger's Joker I would place atop my mantle for all time favourite movie characters, no doubt. And Nolan and the scriptwriters deserve a great deal of credit for twisting the character in the manner they did, so it maintained the essence of what it mean't to be The Joker but at the same time formed something that was so completely original. And whoevers decision it was to cast Ledger is a genius, because he melted into the role like no actor I've seen.
I am no die- hard Batman fan, but I had never been so keen to see a film as I was The Dark Knight largely thanks to the appeal of the direction Nolan had taken The Joker and it did not disappoint. I can't remember an occassion when I've been so mesmorized by a depiction, just eagerly awaiting every time he'd come onto the screen. It was phenomenal.
Tough job following that up.
- Banned
- #49
And when Ledger was announced as The Joker, most people (me included) really didn't think he could pull it off. But Nolan obviously made an amazing decision in casting him.
That's why I won't be surprised if we get somebody totally from left-field to play the antagonist in the next one.
That's why I won't be surprised if we get somebody totally from left-field to play the antagonist in the next one.
stephen_bayne
Club Legend
It has been said there is enough footage left over to have him at least make an appearence in the 3rd film. Aaron Eckhart has also said he'd come back for the 3rd movie if he was asked. Speaking of which...
I was doing some digging today and come across a article about the proposed plot to the sequel of Batman and Robin in which Harley Quinn is The Joker's daughter and joins forces with The Scarecrow to force Batman to face his worst fear. The return of The Joker. I was thinking that would be a better plot for the next Batman film considering how much more of a destructive force The Joker was in The Dark Knight than the 1989 Batman movie. Instead of his daughter I'd cast her as a fanatic who is hell bent on releasing The Joker from Arkham and joins forces with The Scarecrow.
As someone else said I think the best idea is to have more than one or two villains as it will most likey going to be the last one and it has to be the ultimate challenge. You could have Quinn/Scarecrow, Two-Face so Batman and be eventually cleared of all the crimes he took credit for as well as two or three more to go with the chain reaction theory James Gordon spoke of in the first film. Apparently it's also said Nolan hasn't signed on for a third film and Christian Bale will only come back if Nolan directs so god knows what's going to happen with this series.
