Doping Thread

[Vader]

Interesting article on CyclingNews today, with the Tan Man diplomatically questioning Wiggins about doping in light of the doping arrest on the rest day. Part of his response is quoted below:

I understand it from certain parts of the media but I don’t think I should sit here and justify everything I have done to the world. I’m not some shit rider who has come from nowhere. I’ve been three times Olympic champion on the track. I think people have to realise what kind of engine you need to win an Olympic gold medal as an Olympic pursuiter.
"I’ve been six times world champion, I’ve been fourth in the Tour de France, third in the Vuelta last year, it’s not like I’ve just come from nowhere. I’ve got an incredible pedigree behind me, junior world champion and an incredible rise through the ranks and so I don’t feel like I lost my cool, I just said what I think.

The reality is that he IS a very good rider, who could and definitely should be riding in the top 5 on GC. Unfortunately, as I see it, he's gone on the juice in order to put himself over the top as the #1 rider, in order to win the coveted Tour. Sorry Wiggo, I just don't buy it - I know you're a damn good rider and I know you've worked incredibly hard.. but that doesn't even go close to explaining the outrageous & blatant cheating that we all saw on that Stage 9 TT. Even at your very best, you're not as good at the TT as Cancellara, so how does a "clean" Wiggins annihilate him by close to a minute? Sorry, it just doesn't add up.

Wiggo, you could have been remembered as a great rider on the strength of your track record alone. Your record in road racing has always been good as well. But why did you have to ruin it all by going on the juice to get that extra 5% required to put you over the top of all your less-juiced competitors?

 

[Vader]

Interesting article on CyclingNews today, with the Tan Man diplomatically questioning Wiggins about doping in light of the doping arrest on the rest day. Part of his response is quoted below:

I understand it from certain parts of the media but I don’t think I should sit here and justify everything I have done to the world. I’m not some shit rider who has come from nowhere. I’ve been three times Olympic champion on the track. I think people have to realise what kind of engine you need to win an Olympic gold medal as an Olympic pursuiter.
"I’ve been six times world champion, I’ve been fourth in the Tour de France, third in the Vuelta last year, it’s not like I’ve just come from nowhere. I’ve got an incredible pedigree behind me, junior world champion and an incredible rise through the ranks and so I don’t feel like I lost my cool, I just said what I think.

The reality is that he IS a very good rider, who could and definitely should be riding in the top 5 on GC. Unfortunately, as I see it, he's gone on the juice in order to put himself over the top as the #1 rider, in order to win the coveted Tour. Sorry Wiggo, I just don't buy it - I know you're a damn good rider and I know you've worked incredibly hard.. but that doesn't even go close to explaining the outrageous & blatant cheating that we all saw on that Stage 9 TT. Even at your very best, you're not as good at the TT as Cancellara, so how does a "clean" Wiggins annihilate him by close to a minute? Sorry, it just doesn't add up.

Wiggo, you could have been remembered as a great rider on the strength of your track record alone. Your record in road racing has always been good as well. But why did you have to ruin it all by going on the juice to get that extra 5% required to put you over the top of all your less-juiced competitors?

 

[crazyman27]

Wiggo talking the talk. Really setting himself up for a big fall if he tests positive now!

 

[Papa Juggs]

Biggest cheat since the Muss.

Sky should pull out of the tour.

They have to realise a stopwatch is an effective doping test these days.

1000s of riders have been pushed to their limits over and over on the same roads.

When somebody produces a boosted performance everybody can see it.

 

[Furn]

Where was this thread last year when Cadel was all of a sudden the best rider ?

 

[bisazc887]

Where was this thread last year when Cadel was all of a sudden the best rider ?

No Cadel was always a damn good mountainbiker and in the TT's was around about the middle of the pack, unlike this guy who has gone from been a decent TT to blowing away the best (yes a freak time trialer himself!!) by minutes and not the greatest climber to sitting on the seat easy as you like up some serious mountains and staying constantly at the front. Of course Most Aussies want Cadel to win but what you see in Nbali looks fair and square trying like Cadel last year but what you see in this guy stinks

 

[Slacker]

It is an interesting issue. Imagine this hypothetical: Sky have got their hands on some new designer gear that is not captured by the current tests. They can use it with impunity and demolish the opposition.
All the competitors are on the gear too, but they only have the old stuff that the tests can capture. They are constantly trying to stay clean for the tests so the gear is only partly effective.

So, in the hypothetical, Sky's main crime is have better gear than the others. Morally their is no difference between the teams, just one has a better chemist.

 

[Donakebab]

Where was this thread last year when Cadel was all of a sudden the best rider ?

Only start following cycling last year?

 

[Furn]

No Cadel was always a damn good mountainbiker and in the TT's was around about the middle of the pack, unlike this guy who has gone from been a decent TT to blowing away the best (yes a freak time trialer himself!!) by minutes and not the greatest climber to sitting on the seat easy as you like up some serious mountains and staying constantly at the front. Of course Most Aussies want Cadel to win but what you see in Nbali looks fair and square trying like Cadel last year but what you see in this guy stinks

in 2008 Cadel was 1:40 behind Cancellara and 2:05 off the winner. In 2011 he's 1:40 up on Cancellara and 7 seconds off the winner and its a great sporting moment.

A couple of British riders show similar improvement and its a clear case of doping. Double standards of the highest order.

 

[bisazc887]

in 2008 Cadel was 1:40 behind Cancellara and 2:05 off the winner. In 2011 he's 1:40 up on Cancellara and 7 seconds off the winner and its a great sporting moment.

A couple of British riders show similar improvement and its a clear case of doping. Double standards of the highest order.

Yes 7 seconds off the winner not suddenly 1 minute + ahead alonfg with a teamate and one of his own asking him the question before any of that. 2008 was a loooooong way off 2011 btw, if you are even serious?

 

[Extortion Threat]

in 2008 Cadel was 1:40 behind Cancellara and 2:05 off the winner. In 2011 he's 1:40 up on Cancellara and 7 seconds off the winner and its a great sporting moment.

A couple of British riders show similar improvement and its a clear case of doping. Double standards of the highest order.

You fail to mention Cadel came 1st & 2nd in the two time trials in the 2007 TdF. Plus wasn't Cancellara recovering from injury in last years TdF?

 

[LeverPuller]

You fail to mention Cadel came 1st & 2nd in the two time trials in the 2007 TdF. Plus wasn't Cancellara recovering from injury in last years TdF?

And Cadel still lost to Martin, while Wiggins has blown Martin away a couple of times this year all of a sudden.

 

[Furn]

You fail to mention Cadel came 1st & 2nd in the two time trials in the 2007 TdF. Plus wasn't Cancellara recovering from injury in last years TdF?

Yet was 8th in 2006 nearly 4 mutes back. Must have been doping in 2007 right?

 

[Papa Juggs]

Cadel was doping last year just didn't make himself look like a blatant cheat and that is the problem.

Some juice is ok. Too much and the crackdown happens.

If they can't catch them with testing they'll search everybody connected to Sky just to make sure there's no juice around.

 

[Extortion Threat]

Yet was 8th in 2006 nearly 4 mutes back. Must have been doping in 2007 right?

Geez, has a sook. I'm not saying Cadel is definitely clean or anything. Just pointing out that your post was misleading. As was this one:

Where was this thread last year when Cadel was all of a sudden the best rider ?

If you don't want to read about this stuff may I suggest not opening this thread.

 

[Sigwald]

Lettuce be real here. Everyone on the Tour is juiced.

David Moncoutie. Gaumont, the utter scumbag that got VDB hooked on stillnox, once wrote that Moncoutie was the only person during his time at Cofidis who wouldn't touch a thing. He is generally regarded as clean.

And since Paul Kimmage has put his support behind Garmin (after he spend a Tour embedded in their team) I am inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt as well. Interestingly enough, when the following year Kimmage asked Sky if he could do a piece on their Tour as well, this was declined. On specific request of one B. Wiggins.

 

[IAMJUNGLEMUFFIN]

Only start following cycling last year?

I heard he upped his dose purity levels from 25%, 50%, 75%, 75%, then finally got the mix rixt last year and cleaned up at the tour...

 

[LeverPuller]

Look at them. They've just shattered a peleton and don't even look bothered.

They're completely invincible, and everyone else is just being demolished because of it.

 

[blue gunslinger]

Look at them. They've just shattered a peleton and don't even look bothered.

They're completely invincible, and everyone else is just being demolished because of it.

marathon runners run 4 min miles for an entire marthon these days. A thing that was impossible is now sub standard. And those African lads are clean as

 

[Papa Juggs]

Much better today.

Sky is under pressure bottled up in the mountains. No juicing.

 

[Sigwald]

Sky is under pressure bottled up in the mountains. No juicing.

You are being sarcastic, right?

This stage just about sealed it for me.

• EBH doing an entire HC col while keeping the breakaway at only 2 min... okay
• Evans attacks, Rogers reels him back in. The group of the yellow jersey was only 7 riders for a while there, 4 of which were Sky... right...
• Froome & Wiggo lose all the climbers early on the last climb, and then Froome takes of like a rocket, gapping everyone as if he's Ricco, and needs to be told that Wiggo can't keep up... come on...

 

[Papa Juggs]

Yeah once Froome took off on his 2nd wind as if by magic the suspicions started to creep back in.

 

[blackcat]

Froome WTF?! On the mega gear.

alll
at
pointy
end
are
on
gear

 

[blackcat]

Yeah, nah. Up until recently with Sky, Wiggins lost time in all time-trials over 20 or so kms. Froome, no one had even heard of before last year's Vuelta. Now he's the best climber and the second best time-trialer of the Tour so far. Surrrrrrrrrre.

Wrong.

I posted this on cyclingnews forums.

http://twist.future.net.uk/showthread.php?s=8cd2815260b76b039b9a9ed32ed99e10&t=15116
u wanna ask me questions, go ahead

No one knows Froome. He could always ride,
could always climb AND tt.

Few other could always do both. Evans is one. Andy S another. Contador manifeslty so.

33rd in the first chrono in the 2008 Tour.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tou...tage-4/results

16th in the final 2008 Tour chrono
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tou...age-20/results

31st in the Queen Stage of the 2008 Tour with Barlo, was he working for Consta Sioutsou? Probably.
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/tou...age-17/results

Brailsford thought in 2009 he could be a GC rider for the Tour.

Only few can naturally do both from the gun. He is one of the few who can chrono and climb.

_________, and change nationality, under come under Brailsford's evil orbit.

here is what I posted in another thread:

Quote:
actually Froome is not a surprise. Came second to a very high calibre Chinese chrono rider MA Haijun in the B worlds in about 2005 or 06. Rode two very good chronos in the 2008 Tour, or might have been 2009. Was the final Barlo tour.

Came top 20 in both.

There is an ignorance about Wiggins tt ability. They call him a specialist. But even when he was a trackie, even riding chronos in u23, he never was on a worlds podium, never winning. He has won some 2.1 French chronos, like Dunkirk or something. Wiggins was never a chrono rider. He could not even beat Kloden in the 8km tt in London Tour prologue. Canc put about 20 seconds into him.

Go back and see Froome's first Tour de France. Manifest ability and potential.

Dare say if he rode the u23 World tt, that year, think he was only 22, he would have podiumed, or perhaps won, pending the cours.e

Guy can ride a chrono if u know your race results for the past decade. Aus pundits like Keenan and McKenzie dont know. Keeno easily best Anglophone knowledge, but he would not be au fait with Frroomes first Tour, even tho he probably was working then for the Tour. Think Froome came top 20 in both chronos. I had researched it years back.

Apart from all the Wiggins propaganda. Brailsford has two hopes, perhaps 3 for GC, cos he has seeen and knows by ROTE their ergo results, and blood results for lactic etc.

Dimspace wont know this.

It is not the Kennaugh bro elder. But he is my third option above.

It is Froome and G.

Thomas and Frrome. See about 3 years back, when Froome wanted to change his nationality for UCI purposes to GB.

See Brailsford's comments. He said words to the effect of GC Tour.

And I know a coach of a rider on Sky. He said ALL EYES TO G.

Thomas and Froome are the riders. Kennaugh is the option at the end of this decade.

Tour is won on the nub of the needle. Even seeing what Papp writes, and saying Rumsas was SOOOO talented in grandfondos. Sure. They ALL are that talented. But the doctor and the alchemist make a rider into a Tour winner.

Evans always had the talent, and was one of the few riders in the peloton with that natural ability of pro peloton bell curve end. But. He had to up his program, and roll the dice. Finally.

G Thomas.
Froome.
6 years Kennaugh.

Dont go to Dimspace. He does not have the inside mail from Brailsord. This is their commercial inconfidence planning. I dont know it. I only used a few tenuous bites to piece it together.

 

[The Falcon Strike]

Froome is the one for me

As Wiggins has said himself, it's not like he has done a "chinese swimmer" and come from the clouds.

However Froome's TT smashing FC and still dominating the mountains smells very fishy