List Mgmt. Draft thread - 2025 (remaining picks: 29, 34)

[Keys]

Live draft hand
R1: 1 (Duursma), 4 (CDT), 19 (Lindsay)
R2: 29, 34
RD: 1

Draft picks pre-draft
R1: 1, 2, 13
R2: 34, 41
RD: 1

List spots available
Main list: 2 (includes Duursma, CDT, Lindsay)
Cat A Rookie list: 1 (expecting Robertson, Macrae and Schoenberg to join as SSP signings)
Cat B Rookie list: 1

Draft order

Spoiler

Draft prospect video highlights (thanks to noobermensch)

Rookie Me Central 2025 Draft Guide

2025 AFL Draft Guide

online.fliphtml5.com

Matthew Clarke on Gettable 17/11

Spoiler

Cal Twomey’s Phantom Draft

Spoiler

 

[maverick001]

There are 3 clubs needing to manoeuvre for early bids on players.

Lions - Annables likely top 5 pick
View attachment 2458722

Suns - Uwland and Patterson both likely top 6 picks
View attachment 2458723

Blues - Dean likely top 10 pick
View attachment 2458724

Summary:

Lions will sell off 17 and 23 on the night and will therefore make a profit and should have sufficient points. Will 100% match Annables as they can go into a slight deficit even if bid on at 1. They have Caylen Murray and Matt Owen as Academy prospects but at best, I rate them R1 to R2 in a very early assessment.

Suns
Will also sell off 15 18 and 24 on the night for a profit. If we bid early on both Patterson and Uwland, they will have enough points even if they have to trade in futures. They will likely lose more prospects next year so they will not worry about being in deficit. Their Academy best prospect is Archie Hill and I have a mid to late R2 on him.

Blues
The most intriguing. I think they were big winners in the trade period. They have 2 x R1 picks for 2025, 2026 and 2027. Dean is a FS expected to go in top 8 in R1 and Ison more like 20 to 20. I suspect they will want to move 9 or 11 to 2026 for Walker and happy to split the other pick for a points. Will they try to play smart with getting a pick in before Dean?

A simple deal with Blues of 13 + 33 + 41 is more than enough premium to entice pick 9. (yes, I know we would need to play games on 41 as they dealt it to us). We could get multiple clubs involved - Norf might want 25 + 26 for 13!

Carlton won’t trade 9 though ahead of the draft. They’ll wait for a bid and if it doesn’t come by 9 then they’ll use that pick themselves and then use futures to trade and match a bid when it does come

 

[bradz]

From a needs perspective I think this needs to be our draft hand:

1. Duursma
2. Sharp or Cumming

Sharp is probably of greater need than Cumming, but I think Cumming will offer a higher ceiling with a pretty damn good floor. He just looks very good. The eye test doesnt really lie with this one. If we could split Pick 2 and still get Sharp and Cumming that would be perfect I think. Could be hard to achieve.

The more I see of Robey, the more I see his weaknesses. Not saying he is a bad player. He looks like a brute of a player. Great hands, but his field kicking doesn't look great. Not to say I wouldn't love it if we pick him, just not in place of either of the other 3...unless.......

Now hear me out....Perhaps trading both 1 and 2 may have some merits for the right numbers if we can achieve the following. Just hear me out.

Getting Cumming, Robey and Sharp in that order could actually be feasible. Would likely also net us some extra picks. That draft haul feels very satisfying. Now jump down my throat and explain why I have completely missed something.

 

[Jukes]

This would be a waste of picks 1 and 2.

That would mean the only proven full time midfielder we take in the draft is Banfield as a discounted F/S.

Whilst I love Harley in the list, I suspect he is best used in a role like Petracca, Dangerfield, Dusty and Heeney. He is best used as a burst player that does not need to be the aerobic king and a full time mid. We need players like Sharp and Cumming to be the full time mids.

Looking through the other mids we have: -
Hewett - I believe he is best used as a high half forward. He is better at general stoppages and less effective at Centre Clearances.
Gross - Difficult to say as he did not have the tank yet. I hope he will address that over the next 2 summers and come in as a FT mid.
Allan - not a great 1st year for him but is he a winger, a HBF or a mid?
Hall - looks to be decent WAFL depth that can fill in when required but not core to an elite midfield



My main concern is that I cannot predict where either Duursma or CDT would play IF they develop well and become elite players. I am OK in taking 1, but to take both is a mitigated disaster. Have we a developing set of midfielders that we have absolute confidence will be in our next premiership charge?


So I see 2 options.

1. We use pick 2 for a full time mid. Sharp has the track record and it has been a long time since we recruited someone with his skill set (Thank you Pieman ). I personally think Cumming would be a good option (and yes some will call stretch) but he is the most skilled that I see. Robey has come in late.

2. We split the CDT pick 2 with Dons and go 2+13 for 5+6. Hell, I would be OK throwing in one of 34 or 41 if push comes to shove. Not extracting full value but that is how bad CDT would be at 2. At 5 and 6, there will be 2 players that can better fit our need. Pick 2 from Robey, Sharp, Cumming or Grlj.

Given the delisted players we have been linked with are all midfielders (Dev, Schoenberg, Macrae, Blaimires), it seems we’re going for a stop gap midfield for now around Harley, Hewett and Yeo/Kelly/Graham.

I’ve been an advocate of drafting Sharp/Cumming but I can get onboard with the Duursma/CDT strategy only if we project that there will be more highly touted midfielders at the top of the next couple of drafts. The annoying reality is that even if we got Sharp and/or Cumming in this draft, they probably wouldn’t get much opportunity in 2026 anyway.

Therefore, banking the “unique” talents with high ceilings in Duursma and I guess CDT (if the “experts” end up being correct) is probably the move for this year.

 

[Farmer Lister]

Ideal draft:

Pick 1: Duursma
Pick 2: Robey
Pick 13: Dovaston

Banfield, Williams, Evans and Curtain with later picks/rookie spots.

Cumming looks good too, not sold on Sharp.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

What we do not know is what players to be exact are on the rookie list. We also do not know what is happening with Cripps and Livingstone. We also do not know who we have (if anyone) earmarked to be pushed down to the rookie list as that comes with giving them UFA status every time they come out of contract.

In an ideal world, we still have Hutchinson and Maric on the rookie list even though they have been extended (that is allowable). We would also be dropping Johnston to the rookie list even though in contract. I am not seeing a best 23 in him and at best, I see a depth player that can fill in if we have a role player injured.

I would like to think we keep 6 senior spots open - 3 open pool picks and 3 for NGA or F/S or a slider becomes available.

Banfield is a must
Williams looks well ahead of Walley (Wes would be lucky to be Cat B based on 2025 production)
Evans injury year will scare off many but will still have clubs watching on and I would like to have a spot for him.


In fact, the rookie list is redundant. Minimum contract periods should be linked to the range a player is picked. 1 to 20 is 3 years. 21 to 50 is 2 years. All other is 1 year. Retain Cat B and give them more spots and more time.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

Carlton won’t trade 9 though ahead of the draft. They’ll wait for a bid and if it doesn’t come by 9 then they’ll use that pick themselves and then use futures to trade and match a bid when it does come

While the Dons hold picks 5 and 6 (by then they will be 8 and 9), I cannot see a world where Dean will still be there at the Blues pick 9 (which will be 12). Melbourne hold picks 7 and 8 and have a track record of bidding.

Agree it will likely happen on the night but they might just lock away one of the picks as a F1 prior to the draft.

 

[WCEswift]

Ideal draft:

Pick 1: Duursma
Pick 2: Robey
Pick 13: Dovaston

Banfield, Williams, Evans and Curtain with later picks/rookie spots.

Cumming looks good too, not sold on Sharp.

i agree

 

[Mr Q]

It's bullshit that a 1 win team can be tight for list spots.

In a year we seem to have decent FS/NGA prospects no less.

Not really.

The reason we're so tight (and realistically it's not that tight), is that we're not at the start of a rebuild, we're a couple of years in, and a huge number of our list spots are held by young players who are definitely not at the point where you'd be considering delisting them. We don't have a pile of older players to retire/delist, because most of them are already gone.

We do have a small number of players that could be moved back to the rookie list which would make up more main list spaces.

 

[WCE777]

This would be a waste of picks 1 and 2.

That would mean the only proven full time midfielder we take in the draft is Banfield as a discounted F/S.

Whilst I love Harley in the list, I suspect he is best used in a role like Petracca, Dangerfield, Dusty and Heeney. He is best used as a burst player that does not need to be the aerobic king and a full time mid. We need players like Sharp and Cumming to be the full time mids.

Looking through the other mids we have: -
Hewett - I believe he is best used as a high half forward. He is better at general stoppages and less effective at Centre Clearances.
Gross - Difficult to say as he did not have the tank yet. I hope he will address that over the next 2 summers and come in as a FT mid.
Allan - not a great 1st year for him but is he a winger, a HBF or a mid?
Hall - looks to be decent WAFL depth that can fill in when required but not core to an elite midfield



My main concern is that I cannot predict where either Duursma or CDT would play IF they develop well and become elite players. I am OK in taking 1, but to take both is a mitigated disaster. Have we a developing set of midfielders that we have absolute confidence will be in our next premiership charge?


So I see 2 options.

1. We use pick 2 for a full time mid. Sharp has the track record and it has been a long time since we recruited someone with his skill set (Thank you Pieman ). I personally think Cumming would be a good option (and yes some will call stretch) but he is the most skilled that I see. Robey has come in late.

2. We split the CDT pick 2 with Dons and go 2+13 for 5+6. Hell, I would be OK throwing in one of 34 or 41 if push comes to shove. Not extracting full value but that is how bad CDT would be at 2. At 5 and 6, there will be 2 players that can better fit our need. Pick 2 from Robey, Sharp, Cumming or Grlj.

Have to agree, option 2!
Not drafting a genuine mid with 1 or 2 would be silly with our draft hand.

 

[stallon]

Carlton supporter coming in peace. How would you feel about this trade:

Carlton give: Pick 9, Pick 11, Sydney 2026 F1, Carlton 2027 F3
West Coast Give: Pick 13, 41, 53, West Coast 2026 F1

Gives you Picks 1, 2, 9, 11, 34 going into the draft instead of a bunch of backend picks that you won't be able to use (after you've filled out your 5 slots). Gives us enough to match our F/S this year, our NGA this year, and makes it easier for us to match our Top 3 F/S next year. The points roughly even out, if you come 16th next year and Sydney comes 3rd.

Probably still in Carlton's favour, but something of this general shape...thoughts?

so to break it down a bit:
pick 11 for 13+41+53 roughly
Then pick 9+Swans f1(likely between 14-18) for wce f1(likely top 3)
Theres a random f3 pick thrown in

Remembering that the 2026 draft looks a lot stronger than this years draft, there is just no way id entertain it.
Its just not close.

If it was Carlton f1 instead of the Sydney one then maybe, but not the Sydney f1

 

[squashface]

2 and 13 for 5 and 6 is a no brainer if Essendon are keen and want CDT.

Coming away with Duursma, Sharp and Cumming would finally set our midfield up.

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

The Blues situation is interesting.

Hypothetically if that 13/33/41 for 9 deal happened… then Dean was bid on at pick 7... Carlton would match with pick 11 and have about a 180 point remaining deficit that would slide pick 13 down to pick 17 right? Or can they match the 180 point deficit with a later pick?

On the run - that is close to the maths. The complication in the maths is that the the bids on the 3 QLD talents will happen and all picks thereafter are impacted. I believe it is closer to a 275 point slide which would take the pick back a little bot further if I use Cal's latest rankings.

 

[BluesForEternity]

so to break it down a bit:
pick 11 for 13+41+53 roughly
Then pick 9+Swans f1(likely between 14-18) for wce f1(likely top 3)
Theres a random f3 pick thrown in

Remembering that the 2026 draft looks a lot stronger than this years draft, there is just no way id entertain it.
Its just not close.

If it was Carlton f1 instead of the Sydney one then maybe, but not the Sydney f1

Yeah I actually forgot that we could trade the Carlton F1 (lol) - would people be open to this trade then if it was 9+11+Carlton F1 2026 instead? A bit of a silly 2026 viewing experience for fans - we'd all be death riding each other haha...!

 

[Bacchus]

Picking CDT would be devastating.

What position would he play? hff?

A luxury/experiment we cannot afford with a makeshift, non-existent midfield.

 

[stallon]

Yeah I actually forgot that we could trade the Carlton F1 (lol) - would people be open to this trade then if it was 9+11+Carlton F1 2026 instead? A bit of a silly 2026 viewing experience for fans - we'd all be death riding each other haha...!

Less against it, im sure a lot of people dont rate Carltons chances next year and expect them to slide a little bit if not stay the same.
I dont think you guys need to chase our F1 anyway? you have what you need or near enough for Walker as it is with your 2 f1s dont you?

Id imagine itd make more sense for you guys to trade up with Richmond or Essendon to get ahead of a Dean bid while making sure to keep enough points to match Dean, then keeping next years picks as they are

 

[stallon]

Id prefer we dont take CDT, like many.

I get it if we do and wont have a melt as I think his ceiling is huge, but he doesnt have a defined role or a typical role for a tall player - a bit like Dan Curtin in some ways tbh but with CDT being an excellent athlete and ground ball player for his size. Those combine results were pretty insane.
Tbh I dont rate hitouts that highly, if he was excellent around the ground the ground while just competing for hitouts, breaking even most weeks I think he would be ok.
Easy enough to start him as a ruck/fwd, id like to see him paired with Archer.

CDT could start forward then follow the ball around the ground as a high CHF type, doing rucking in the front half while Archer does the rest of the rucking and positions himself a kick behind the ball like a typical ruckman would.
I can see it working.

Its a shame the mids around the 10-13 areas arent really there, would have been a nice combo to get Duursma, CDT and a more balanced/inside mid with our current picks.

 

[Elite Pete]

Trade period is done and dusted for another year so our full attention now turns to the National Draft to be held in just under 5 weeks time over November 19 (R1), 20 (R2 onwards) and 21 (Rookie draft and PSD)

Our draft hand is now set, although it remains possible for clubs to trade draft picks up to and during the draft.

The picks we currently hold are :

• R1- 1,2,13
• R2- 34,41
• R3- 53,58

We can only take into the draft the same number of picks as we have vacant list spots. Matthew Clarke has said we have 5 open spots on the main list and 4 rookie list vacancies courtesy of the AFL list concessions we were given.

That may change pending new contracts being given to Jamie Cripps, Malakai Champion and Coen Livingstone who remain uncontracted- at least publicly since no formal announcement has been made. Livingstone looms as a possible delisting whilst Cripps and Champion have both reportedly been offered contracts.

The club has also committed to adding Deven Robertson to the squad as either a DFA or (more likely) a SSP signing which would allow him to be added to the rookie list

Players can also be moved from the main list to the rookie list by delisting them and redrafting them in the RD if more main list spots are needed, although there’s been no indication from the club they intend doing this

Normally the PSD is a non event but with Brisbane and Adelaide failing to settle on a trade for Callum Ah Chee, he will now likely be available in that draft. West Coast have pick 1 giving us the opportunity to add Ah Chee at no trade cost albeit on contract terms that he can/will stipulate. However, that option has all but been ruled out by Clarke which will disappoint some posters

Heading into the draft, West Coast also have the ability to match bids on our Father/Son (Charlie Banfield- son of Drew) and three NGA players (Tylah Williams, Koby Evans and Wes Walley). Matching bids requires the following:

• Picks 1-18: Points value of the pick less 10% discount
• Picks 19-36: Points value of the pick less an 84 point discount
• Picks 37+: The next available pick held
• For NGA players who don’t receive a bid, the club can add them to the Cat B rookie list at the conclusion of the main draft

In an interview post trade period (link below), Clarke has said we intend to use a minimum of 4 draft picks, are unlikely to split either pick 1 or 2 and will look to consolidate our later picks to improve our position further

How might things play out then:

• Picks 1 and 2 we intend to keep, although we are likely to receive offers for those with Essendon (who hold picks 5 and 6) and/or Melbourne (holding picks 7 and 8) the best placed to grab our attention
• Pick 13 might be used with our later picks to move higher up the order although Carlton with picks 9 and 11 appear the only possibility
• Picks 34,41,53,58 - at this stage with only 5 vacant list spots, picks 53 and 58 are surplus and will vanish unless we either create an additional spot or trade those 4 picks to move up the draft this year or for future picks
• Matching bids - it’s unknown exactly when bids will come although there’s speculation Williams could attract a late R1 bid which would be somewhere in the mid twenties. As it stands picks 34 and 41 hold enough points value combined to match a bid from pick 23 onwards. A bid for Banfield earlier than pick 37 seems unlikely so there should be no issue matching should we choose. Evans might receive a late bid but probably needs to be overlooked for us to add him as a Cat B rookie as we may not have an available list spot to match a bid. Walley probably gets through the main draft without a bid so could be added as a Cat B
• We will also hold pick 1 in the rookie draft which would give us the opportunity to add a player to the rookie list depending on list strategy
• Any remaining spots to be filled signing players as SSP options possibly following a train on period to assess candidates

In summary, to complete our list based on available spots:

Main list:
• 3x R1 picks
• 2x matched bids - Williams and Banfield

Rookie list:
• Robertson
• NGA additions - Evans and/or Walley if no bids received
• Balance of list to be filled by up to 2 mature aged players via pick 1 in the RD and/or SSP signings

Matt Clarke interview

Who do you currently think is the 4th one on our rookie list? We have Brock, Newton and McCarthy?

Dev will be the 5th. I reckon Tom Berry with also join, one for our NGAs/FS if they get through and one will be left open for a couple of train ons.

 

[TheBudgies]

Saints delisting Arie Schoenmaker is interesting. I really liked him in 2023, wonder if we look at him for a rookie spot if we have space post draft as an SSP. Thoughts?

 

[stallon]

Saints delisting Arie Schoenmaker is interesting. I really liked him in 2023, wonder if we look at him for a rookie spot if we have space post draft as an SSP. Thoughts?

as long as there are no attitude/non footy issues im all in

 

[mattyc75]

Saints delisting Arie Schoenmaker is interesting. I really liked him in 2023, wonder if we look at him for a rookie spot if we have space post draft as an SSP. Thoughts?

Is he the guy with the off field stuff in his draft year?

 

[Patron]

Listening to Clarke it really does just sound like we have a very specific strategy and positions in mind to fill.

We all know ruck is one of those positions and with the general consensus pick 2 being a ruck it's hard to see us not taking CDT tbh.

Sounds like he might be willing to give up F2's to move up the order as well.

 

[Mr Q]

Who do you currently think is the 4th one on our rookie list? We have Brock, Newton and McCarthy?

Dev will be the 5th. I reckon Tom Berry with also join, one for our NGAs/FS if they get through and one will be left open for a couple of train ons.

Livingston it would seem (moved from cat B to make way for Champion last year)

 

[TheBudgies]

Is he the guy with the off field stuff in his draft year?

Yea, drunk at a football camp IIRC.

 

[Elite Pete]

Livingston it would seem (moved from cat B to make way for Champion last year)

I thought that was Dewar? Plus Livingston still waiting a deal as well?

Draft guru has it as you suggested though.

 

[eaglevision]

Yea, drunk at a football camp IIRC.

That was one thing but it’s far more than that. He has the talent and size so I would assume it’s either attitude or he couldn’t build a tank.