Forward Coach

[Square Peg]

None of those players had the professionalism to play AFL.

That's missing the point
We moved them on and didn't replace them. In a forward line already one of the worst in the league.

 

[eastfreo75]

That's missing the point
We moved them on and didn't replace them. In a forward line already one of the worst in the league.

With who?

Chapman, O'Driscoll, Western, and Walker as pretty good drafting.

Treacy was an awesome pick.

Sometimes its the picks you have and what players toy can choose from.

 

[gotterdamerung]

this is kind of a ridiculous comment because during those years we just didn't have the picks. Teams at the top of the leader always have a hole in their list 8-9 years later. Just look at the hawks.

We had a very high pick in 2016. It was traded for Cam McCarthy and we drafted Logue. McCluggage went at our pick.

 

[Lach72]

We had a very high pick in 2016. It was traded for Cam McCarthy and we drafted Logue. McCluggage went at our pick.

thats fine but if you didn’t do that trade you can’t have Luke Ryan or Sean Darcy either

 

[Docker82]

this is kind of a ridiculous comment because during those years we just didn't have the picks. Teams at the top of the leader always have a hole in their list 8-9 years later. Just look at the hawks.

Teams at a similar level have more than 4 players still playing for them. The four we have weren’t even from particularly good draft picks either. Two second rounders, two rookies.

It was poor drafting no matter how you look at it.

 

[Square Peg]

With who?

Chapman, O'Driscoll, Western, and Walker as pretty good drafting.

Treacy was an awesome pick.

Sometimes its the picks you have and what players toy can choose from.

So don't move them all on.
We chose to give Bailey Banfield a new contract over keeping Jesse Hogan who had a year to run. Are you seriously saying we'd be worse off if we'd done the reverse?

 

[eastfreo75]

So don't move them all on.
We chose to give Bailey Banfield a new contract over keeping Jesse Hogan who had a year to run. Are you seriously saying we'd be worse off if we'd done the reverse?

Hogan was a cap dump.

Banfield should have been cut and we could have 3 or 4 forwards fight for a spot in preseason.

Scott from the Dogs and Waterman from the bombers were sign ons in the preseason.

McDonald for the Blues.

The club needs to look at the Tigers should have used the preseason trial to Mansell, and Stack.

Hunter, Murray and Wood have played a few games as well.

 

[Docker82]

Hogan was a cap dump.

Banfield should have been cut and we could have 3 or 4 forwards fight for a spot in preseason.

Scott from the Dogs and Waterman from the bombers were sign ons in the preseason.

McDonald for the Blues.

The club needs to look at the Tigers should have used the preseason trial to Mansell, and Stack.

Hunter, Murray and Wood have played a few games as well.

I don’t necessarily disagree but you’re not helping your argument by listing spuds like Paul Hunter and Mason Wood.

 

[eastfreo75]

I don’t necessarily disagree but you’re not helping your argument by listing spuds like Paul Hunter and Mason Wood.

Hunter was a good insurance.

Wood I agree.

Plus it's St Kilda.

 

[Bring back Drum]

View attachment 1142295

If they gave points for out on the full we’d be on top with a percentage of 200.

 

[Docker82]

Hunter was a good insurance.

Wood I agree.

Plus it's St Kilda.

I find it hard to believe there wasn’t better options out there than Hunter and Wood tbh.

I’d probably list Ryan Abbott and Matt Parker before Hunter and Wood who were delisted by St Kilda in the first place. Jonathan Marsh as well.

 

[88mph]

We must get JK down as a coach or consultant.

 

[Scham]

WC, Syd, Geel and Rich have the best scoring this season, Adelaide up there too. If it’s down to coaching as so many of you think, then we need to be going hard to poach a forwardline coach from one of these clubs and the problem will be fixed. Easy.

 

[wayToGo_]

WC, Syd, Geel and Rich have the best scoring this season, Adelaide up there too. If it’s down to coaching as so many of you think, then we need to be going hard to poach a forwardline coach from one of these clubs and the problem will be fixed. Easy.

C'mon you are better than that. Don't try and make it a black and white argument. I certainly, and I don't think anybody else either, has said it is limited to just coaching. I think three things could solve our forward line problems:
(1) a new forward line coach that actually has proven experience and success coaching a forward line - not just someone who has played as a forward before.
(2) stop trying to trade in saviours - someone without baggage who wants to come home or a talented youngster who wants more opportunity, sure. We have to have the advantage at the trade table with any trade from now onward imo. Anything else, socially distance considerably from.
(3) invest properly in the draft - spend high draft picks on some tall forwards this year (and maybe next), get one or two more medium forwards on the list (over the next 3 years), and get one or two actual goal kicking small forwards (not more high half forward types - we have too many already).

I'm curious to know what you've seen (like anything at all) over the past 6 years that makes you think Hale is the man for the job? I'm honestly a bit confused why you are defending him so vehemently. Is he a family friend/relative?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Our issue is clearly both talent and coaching right? I know it’s talent because I reckon Sturt, Walters and Henry are the the only forwards on our list with natural forward craft or creativity. I know it’s a coaching issue because like wayToGo_ said, the most optimistic supporter in the world couldn’t look at our forwardline live and tell you it works.

Excited for what Motlop might bring in a few years as a genuine goal sneak, excited for what Williams/JVR bring in a few years as actual top end KPF talent (if we pass on them I might have a stroke). Get some actual forwards in there and give someone else a go at making the forwardline coherent.

 

[arsesmart]

C'mon you are better than that. Don't try and make it a black and white argument. I certainly, and I don't think anybody else either, has said it is limited to just coaching. I think three things could solve our forward line problems:
(1) a new forward line coach that actually has proven experience and success coaching a forward line - not just someone who has played as a forward before.
(2) stop trying to trade in saviours - someone without baggage who wants to come home or a talented youngster who wants more opportunity, sure. We have to have the advantage at the trade table with any trade from now onward imo. Anything else, socially distance considerably from.
(3) invest properly in the draft - spend high draft picks on some tall forwards this year (and maybe next), get one or two more medium forwards on the list (over the next 3 years), and get one or two actual goal kicking small forwards (not more high half forward types - we have too many already).

I'm curious to know what you've seen (like anything at all) over the past 6 years that makes you think Hale is the man for the job? I'm honestly a bit confused why you are defending him so vehemently. Is he a family friend/relative?

It's a bit to do with the speed we're transitioning the ball as well (maybe most of all). We are a bit ponderous at times with our ball movement, which gives the opposition more opportunity to structure up and make it a more complex task of scoring. You see how lightning quick the Swans were on so many occasions against us and it made scoring look easy when they did. It helped they had an on fire Buddy, but often he was kicking at goals with an uncluttered forward line, which assists goal kicking confidence.

When we hit the kick that opens up the play quickly and with precision, it's beautiful to see. Talent is part of that. Mundy Cerra, Crowden, Wilson, Walters are more prone to do that and we can hope Young, Henry, Sturt, Chapman etc will add to those stocks in the shorter or slightly longer term. This also hints to it being a developmental thing too, that hopefully Longmuirs' plan is aimed at executing faster that players will progressively get better at... and the chip-chip safety first is not the end game.

 

[Eski3]

We had a very high pick in 2016. It was traded for Cam McCarthy and we drafted Logue. McCluggage went at our pick.

I'm convinced if we'd have kept pick 3 we were taking SPS. Brisbane had pick 2 and wanted McLuggage, he only went pick 3 cos GWS were hell bent on Taranto after trading up to 3 from us, and Brisbane saw no downside in going from 2 to 3.

Logue, McCarthy, Hamling and Ryan versus SPS is a very good outcome

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

Not sure that's fair when there are massive concerns over the professionalisms of them. Cam, Hogan, Matera are all extremely talented but their mentality doesn't let it show like it should. Kersten I also suspect wasn't at the level either.

It's like if you only buy DVDs from the $5 clearance bin at JB-HiFi, don't be surprised when the movies you watch are bombs.

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

So don't move them all on.
We chose to give Bailey Banfield a new contract over keeping Jesse Hogan who had a year to run. Are you seriously saying we'd be worse off if we'd done the reverse?

I would have preferred moving Bailey on and speculating with another young 18 year old forward

 

[Joao]

I would have preferred moving Bailey on and speculating with another young 18 year old forward

I reckon the Pearls saved him.

 

[nurries]

I reckon the Pearls saved him.

cunning move by his family. Will only delay the inevitable.

 

[Scham]

C'mon you are better than that. Don't try and make it a black and white argument. I certainly, and I don't think anybody else either, has said it is limited to just coaching. I think three things could solve our forward line problems:
(1) a new forward line coach that actually has proven experience and success coaching a forward line - not just someone who has played as a forward before.
(2) stop trying to trade in saviours - someone without baggage who wants to come home or a talented youngster who wants more opportunity, sure. We have to have the advantage at the trade table with any trade from now onward imo. Anything else, socially distance considerably from.
(3) invest properly in the draft - spend high draft picks on some tall forwards this year (and maybe next), get one or two more medium forwards on the list (over the next 3 years), and get one or two actual goal kicking small forwards (not more high half forward types - we have too many already).

I'm curious to know what you've seen (like anything at all) over the past 6 years that makes you think Hale is the man for the job? I'm honestly a bit confused why you are defending him so vehemently. Is he a family friend/relative?

I know you’re not (blaming the issue entirely on the coach) but plenty are mate. Plenty.

 

[Docker82]

Our issue is clearly both talent and coaching right? I know it’s talent because I reckon Sturt, Walters and Henry are the the only forwards on our list with natural forward craft or creativity. I know it’s a coaching issue because like wayToGo_ said, the most optimistic supporter in the world couldn’t look at our forwardline live and tell you it works.

Excited for what Motlop might bring in a few years as a genuine goal sneak, excited for what Williams/JVR bring in a few years as actual top end KPF talent (if we pass on them I might have a stroke). Get some actual forwards in there and give someone else a go at making the forwardline coherent.

Agree with your assessment regarding lack of talent. For me Treacy looks like a natural forward, it’s just most key forwards his age don’t play AFL. He’s playing atm as we have no one else.

For that exact reason I don’t blame the coaching as much as others.

In fact the fact we’ve made decent forwards out of Taberner and Schultz who looked close to useless in their early days makes me think the coaching isn’t too bad. It’s obviously worked for some maybe not for others.

Like a lot of rebuilding teams we’re playing one or two mids that aren’t ready forward (Frederick, Crowden) which doesn’t help the situation at all.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Agree with your assessment regarding lack of talent. For me Treacy looks like a natural forward, it’s just most key forwards his age don’t play AFL. He’s playing atm as we have no one else.

For that exact reason I don’t blame the coaching as much as others.

In fact the fact we’ve made decent forwards out of Taberner and Schultz who looked close to useless in their early days makes me think the coaching isn’t too bad. It’s obviously worked for some maybe not for others.

Like a lot of rebuilding teams we’re playing one or two mids that aren’t ready forward (Frederick, Crowden) which doesn’t help the situation at all.

Treacy is a decent one to add, I want to
see him really improve his field kicking and decision making before I put him in the natural forward bracket. His kicking looks like it has the potential to be Hawkins like but he second guesses himself at the moment and takes too long to decide. I’ve also not got to see his leading live which I think is pretty important for KPFs.

Given the general improvement in entries this year, I do think it might be more a talent issue than coaching but I can’t get those images of watching our forwardline function without thinking there has to be SOME sort of coaching issue there

 

[ROGS]

I reckon the Pearls saved him.

Bailey is a good competitor and just needs to be played as a run with player in the midfield, in my opinion has better skills than Blakely