Good on ya Nat!

[OnTheRocks]

The thing is Barrett is presenting himself as the top journalist in the industry, which would only be enhanced if he was able to admit when he got something wrong and do an analytical deep dive into the reasons.

It's not like Kane Cornes, who despite possessing a good football mind, actively plays the heel role as his schtick. If Barrett wants to be the AFL's top journalist he needs to be capable of acting objectively, which doesn't mean "backpedalling"; it means having the ability to identify trends and analyse why they change over time, what factors influence this, etc.

That and crawling out from under Gils desk

 

[arupist]

That and crawling out from under Gils desk

Pretty hard to do if he still has a mouthful.

 

[pd_89]

Look at this flog with his glasses and holding his pen like he's working on some magnificent thesis for science and speaking like he's some professor whose just discovered something new in this world.

Mate, you commentate on a sport...and you suck at it.

 

[Yardie]

View attachment 1712819

Caro was chest deep in that hole and had the good sense to get out.

 

[peetoo]

Imagine if Lewis Day Sicily don’t miss games

Or Sicily day lewis

 

[Kuuz]

 

[Buzz Hawk]

I don't have to watch his crap to understand what the very tiny purple grub is up to. It's in his little beady rat like eyes that display his disingenuous nature.
He is to be ignored and avoided.

He is a grub.
It’s a slur on our great club, “oh no, not the players, they’re not tanking, but the club may have”.
He is a campaigner.

 

[Dewnior]

Don't get worked up, he's just a puppet. Not a real human being.

 

[smeltitdeltit]

The irony is that there's no shame in holding your hands up and admitting that you got a call wrong. It's inevitable; as a pundit, you're not going to get every prediction right - and he wasn't the only pundit to suggest it.

But he is now the only one doubling down - and he can't see that he's looking increasingly foolish by doing so.

His problem isn’t that he made an incorrect call.
It’s that he rode that horse like Damian Oliver during cup week. Every week.


Also his argument that list decisions that don’t absolutely make you better in the immediate term is a “form of tanking” is ridiculous on its face.

If the Cats traded Mitch Duncan or Danger for pick 1 (Harley Reid), according to Bellends logic that’s a tank.

Basically he’s an idiot. A floggish one at that.

 

[tommyk72]

Don't get worked up, he's just a puppet. Not a real human being.

Makes sense. Talks and behaves like he has someones hand shoved up his bum.

 

[The hands of stone]

How can you tell Barrett is making a goose of himself ? ....his lips move .

 

[Symons]

It’s that he rode that horse like Damian Oliver during cup week. Every week.

Yeah, he absolutely did - but the media has a short memory; if he just cops his whack for getting it wrong, the wider AFL (i.e. non Hawthorn) viewership completely forgets about how much he went on about it.

By doubling down, he's inviting the other pundits to bait him. Frankly, I hope they keep it up - the longer they rib him about it, the more irritated he gets, which is fun.

 

[SJT76]

His problem isn’t that he made an incorrect call.
It’s that he rode that horse like Damian Oliver during cup week. Every week.


Also his argument that list decisions that don’t absolutely make you better in the immediate term is a “form of tanking” is ridiculous on its face.

If the Cats traded Mitch Duncan or Danger for pick 1 (Harley Reid), according to Bellends logic that’s a tank.

Basically he’s an idiot. A floggish one at that.

No, every single trade or delisting to enable recruitment of a player that will not be better than the outgoing player in the first year is a tank. If you traded, you tanked

 

[peetoo]

2 wins behind the 2022 premiers and 1 win behind the runner ups

 

[Argy]

As an aside, the aim of tanking is to get a premiership in the shortest possible time frame within the broader rules of the game. Even back in the Melbourne tanking days I wondered why the AFL thought that was cheating.

 

[naysayer]

Please guys, let's be fair. He said it only represented a form of tanking.

Similar to the way that Damian Barrett only represents one form of journalism.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

As an aside, the aim of tanking is to get a premiership in the shortest possible time frame within the broader rules of the game. Even back in the Melbourne tanking days I wondered why the AFL thought that was cheating.

You are genuinely wondering why deliberately losing games like Carlton and Melbourne were clearly found to have done to manipulate the draft is cheating?

 

[unitedhawk]

Apologies if this has already been posted in another thread but the irony of he-who-can't-be-named's 'uneducated' view of the Hawks being openly laughed at by former Essendon and Geelong greats (and a media bloke) is, as the great Bruce would've put it: Delicious!

 

[peetoo]

No, every single trade or delisting to enable recruitment of a player that will not be better than the outgoing player in the first year is a tank. If you traded, you tanked

in 1997 Adelaide cleared out stars and tanked their way to their first premiership

 

[peetoo]

As an aside, the aim of tanking is to get a premiership in the shortest possible time frame within the broader rules of the game. Even back in the Melbourne tanking days I wondered why the AFL thought that was cheating.

All the while they used teams which got priorit picks around 2000 as evidence tanking works

If the aim is to get lots of early picks in a short time, gws and Gold Coast is evidence to the contrary

There’s no priority picks now and there are other avenues to recruiting.

For mine, it fails more than it succeeds, bit there are 17 failures to one success every year.

 

[Argy]

You are genuinely wondering why deliberately losing games like Carlton and Melbourne were clearly found to have done to manipulate the draft is cheating?

The ultimate aim in football is to win premierships. The aim of tanking was to win a premiership in as short a time as possible. What's the difference between that and, say, a long distance runner who strategically paces themselves and positions themselves in the pack to win the race and if they don't try try to lead all the way they're cheating?

 

[Ned Ryerson]

The ultimate aim in football is to win premierships. The aim of tanking was to win a premiership in as short a time as possible. What's the difference between that and, say, a long distance runner who strategically paces themselves and positions themselves in the pack to win the race and if they don't try to lead all the way they're cheating?

It’s draft tampering which is absolutely cheating. Dress it up all you like - it’s cheating.

Note that I don’t think cutting back your list and naturally losing games is tanking, I mean out and out willingly losing games like Melbourne and Carlton have done to ensure lower finishes. See also the Dallas Mavericks this year deliberately benching fit players to avoid the play-in tournament.

 

[HedgeFund]

Imagine if Lewis Day Sicily don’t miss games

Well that would mean we had pretty much our best 22 running out there each week,

As it stands we have had a dream run with player availability all season anyhow.

A sensible analysis of our list management is that we felt we had to move on several seasoned players who weren’t going to be part of our next successful period.

That was to enable our current young players to get valuable experience. End of story.

Not to ensure we lost games and ended up with high draft picks - which is BS.

If we were trying to tank, we would have multiple gun players “managed” each week due to “general soreness”. It ain’t happening.

 

[Argy]

It’s draft tampering which is absolutely cheating. Dress it up all you like - it’s cheating.

Note that I don’t think cutting back your list and naturally losing games is tanking, I mean out and out willingly losing games like Melbourne and Carlton have done to ensure lower finishes. See also the Dallas Mavericks this year deliberately benching fit players to avoid the play-in tournament.

If you know that cutting back your list will naturally lead to more games lost, why is that not tanking?

I cant find any AFL rules on tanking, the best I could do is this Wiki entry...

There are a wide variety of behaviours which could be considered to be tanking. These include:

• Instructing the players to deliberately lose matches
• Employing unusual tactics in matches, including using players in positions where they do not usually play[6]
• Resting star players with minor injuries, who would likely not be rested if the team were contesting finals[7]
• Playing younger players who do not yet have much experience at AFL level[8]

By this definition, we tanked.

For what it's worth, I agree 100% that tanking is not in the spirit in which we want the game to be played, but I don't see a philosophical difference between that and strategic positioning during the wider competition.

Don't get me wrong, I fully understand why it's frowned on - if all clubs did it it would make the week to week competition a farce. However, from a philosophical view, winning games is just a means to an end - the ultimate prize; a premiership. In a philosophical sense I don't see why a club that takes a wider view than just week to week is doing anything worse than a long distance runner.

Short term pain for long term gain.

 

[eldorado]

If you know that cutting back your list will naturally lead to more games lost, why is that not tanking?

I cant find any AFL rules on tanking, the best I could do is this Wiki entry...



By this definition, we tanked.

For what it's worth, I agree 100% that tanking is not in the spirit in which we want the game to be played, but I don't see a philosophical difference between that and strategic positioning during the wider competition.

Don't get me wrong, I fully understand why it's frowned on - if all clubs did it it would make the week to week competition a farce. However, from a philosophical view, winning games is just a means to an end - the ultimate prize; a premiership. In a philosophical sense I don't see why a club that takes a wider view than just week to week is doing anything worse than a long distance runner.

Short term pain for long term gain.

You're describing 'rebuilding' not tanking.

Rebuilding is replacing deadwood, with the motivation of improving as as soon as possible.

Tanking is actually wanting to finish at the bottom edge of the ladder, purely for picks.

The end result may look similar, but the word 'tanking' questions the motivation, honour and integrity of all people involved at the club.

No-one would have questioned Barrett if he said, as many rightly did, that Hawthorn are doing a heavy rebuild.

Tanking is just cheating by another name. Tanking is a slur. He accused us of cheating in other words, that's the issue