Griffin

[macca23]

Re: Griffen

Well if they were gonna offer him a contract like that you have to wonder what they'd give us for Griffin.

As I've posted above I cannot see that happening. He's very much a required player.

However let's speculate for the sake of it.

Griffin has already shown that he is an AFL ruckman and is going to be a good one as he matures. That beats the shitter out of using picks like we did for Meesen at pick 8 that turned out to be nothing more than an over sized ballet dancer.

Griffin is not a speculative trade.

If Freo wanted Griffin and he wanted to go, I would not trade him for less than either:

their first round draft pick

or

an exchange of first round draft picks and their second round draft pick.

However, the fact remains is that I don't want to see him traded.

 

[Viva la Mattner]

Re: Griffen

Schammer + 3rd rounder for Griffin ????

 

[Sanguinarius]

Re: Griffen

Schammer + 3rd rounder for Griffin ????

dont trade big's for smalls.

especially when we have a heap of smalls with questionable disposal as it is...

 

[Campbell's Chunky]

Re: Griffen

It is understood Crows ruckman Jonathon Griffin is keen to return home to Western Australia and he could be traded to the Dockers.

As part of that arrangement, Fremantle would pass on Warnock to Carlton, which in turn would have to satisfy Adelaide, possibly with its first selection in the second round of the national draft, overall pick No24.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24331971-5012432,00.html

Interesting times ahead.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Re: Griffen

Interesting times ahead.

Id be pretty darn pissed off if we traded griff for pick 24, considering Wood got a first rounder last year, and has shown less imo.

 

[NTRabbit]

Re: Griffen

Pick 24? Pass.

Put Gibbs on the table, and I'll be interested.

What's he going to do at Fremantle anyway? Warnock already gets no game time, and Griffin is not even close to being an around the ground ruckman to play a complimentary role to Sandilands. He'll just languish in the WAFL for the next 4 years, only playing when Sandilands is injured.

 

[Crow-mo]

Re: Griffen

As I've posted above I cannot see that happening. He's very much a required player.

However let's speculate for the sake of it.

Griffin has already shown that he is an AFL ruckman and is going to be a good one as he matures. That beats the shitter out of using picks like we did for Meesen at pick 8 that turned out to be nothing more than an over sized ballet dancer.

Griffin is not a speculative trade.

If Freo wanted Griffin and he wanted to go, I would not trade him for less than either:

their first round draft pick

or

an exchange of first round draft picks and their second round draft pick.

However, the fact remains is that I don't want to see him traded.

ah look, I tend to agree with most of this.

but as you have kinda implied, I think we all know there might be a smidgen of truth here - but plenty of players don't get trades they want.

I don't have a problem if Freo want to tempt him (they should, and probably are) and I don't have a problem if Griffin is feeling a bit star struck and flattered (perhaps he should) - my only concern is my club does what's right for itself. which is either hold onto him, or extract strong value.

either is fine by me, but as he is contracted I would be unhappy with any other outcome.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Re: Griffen

BUT consider this: if you were Freo, and you were losing Warnock, what would you do? would you sit on your hands waiting to be ravaged by the PSD, or would you look around for similar young ruck replacements who might be interested in coming home?

Bit of a give away of who they think they might be getting with pick 3 then isnt it?

 

[seababoon]

i agree with ntrabbit.. if you gonna have someone to support sandilands.. you'd most likely want a mobile ruckman.. if warnock wasnt getting games.. id assume gilmore would be ahead of him still if griffin went there

 

[dplggr47]

Re: Griffen

ok, i came into this thread and read the first post thinking...omg, does Griffen want out and wants to head home...ie to Adelaide. what is it with people not knowing how to spell common AFL players names. you'd think if you watched the sport and read about it, you'd have some idea.

yep, pretty obvious who Freo would pick up now with pick 3 (with Warnock walking out)...unless West Coast pick him up first. you wouldn't think Freo would want Griffin if they're gonna get Nauitini, otherwise Griffin would have a harder time breaking into that ruck structure (Sandilands, Gilmore and Nautini) than the crows one.

...and those asking for Freo's first rounder, lol, Griff is not worth pick 3...perhaps a late first rounder at best, but even still unlikely if the scenario came up...Freo might as well pick up Nautini instead, who probably has greater athleticism and flexibility than Griffin (i haven't been reading much into draft prospects). i mean, if i could trade Griffin for Nautini, i'd think, why not. so yeh, highly doubtful there'd be an offer of Griffin's true value (which is a late first rounder or very early second rounder), so might as well keep him. he's a good player, and definitely no Meesen. Wood did attract pick 14 last year, but i think that was above his value.

 

[Crow-mo]

Re: Griffen

Bit of a give away of who they think they might be getting with pick 3 then isnt it?

yeah maybe. but equally consider the 1997 draft.

aside from being the greatest draft class ever, and it was hyped as such at the time too, there were 2 prospects:

Brad Ottens - who was projected as a can't miss ruck superstar.
Travis Johnstone - who was described as the best midfield prospect of the decade (and talent wise, that's still probably true).

There was a lot of speculation about what melbourne might do. they had the no.1 pick. The feeling was that they should pick Johnstone, but they needed Ottens more.

then they picked up Jeff White on a PSD contract offer (contentiously as they were over the cap at the time, and were later penalised), and they took johnstone.

effectively they got both.

Freo's targeting of Griffin might be a reflection of who they think will be available at no.3 - or it might be an attempt to add a young ruckman and a Daniel Rich (say) type midfielder.

Griffin for Warnock could well be seen as a like for like, and they can continue with their draft plans as if nothing happened?

This could be a great opportunity for us, but time will tell as always.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Re: Griffen

Freo's targeting of Griffin might be a reflection of who they think will be available at no.3 - or it might be an attempt to add a young ruckman and a Daniel Rich (say) type midfielder.

But thats my point...

Most people think West Coast either take Rich, or Nick Nat. It wont be freos choice between the two.

If they're pursuing a ruckman, its a pretty clear sign they think they're getting Rich.

 

[dplggr47]

Re: Griffen

yeah maybe. but equally consider the 1997 draft.

aside from being the greatest draft class ever, and it was hyped as such at the time too, there were 2 prospects:

Brad Ottens - who was projected as a can't miss ruck superstar.
Travis Johnstone - who was described as the best midfield prospect of the decade (and talent wise, that's still probably true).

There was a lot of speculation about what melbourne might do. they had the no.1 pick. The feeling was that they should pick Johnstone, but they needed Ottens more.

then they picked up Jeff White on a PSD contract offer (contentiously as they were over the cap at the time, and were later penalised), and they took johnstone.

effectively they got both.

Freo's targeting of Griffin might be a reflection of who they think will be available at no.3 - or it might be an attempt to add a young ruckman and a Daniel Rich (say) type midfielder.

Griffin for Warnock could well be seen as a like for like, and they can continue with their draft plans as if nothing happened?

This could be a great opportunity for us, but time will tell as always.

but the fact that Warnock is out of contract and Melbourne have first pick in PSD means if Freo want Griffin, it will disrupt their draft plans slightly...as no way would Melbourne offer a draft pick for Warnock when they can get him for free. thus Freo would have to offer a draft pick/player if they want to secure Griffin.

...in saying all this, it's all still rumour to me, so in my mind, Griffin still wants to stay. hope so.

 

[Crow-mo]

Re: Griffen

But thats my point...

Most people think West Coast either take Rich, or Nick Nat. It wont be freos choice between the two.

If they're pursuing a ruckman, its a pretty clear sign they think they're getting Rich.

could do, it could also reflect their view on Nick Nat in general?

personally, I think it is a function of 2 things:
1. the unpredictability of the draft (who knows what will happen)
2. a pro-active attempt to remove the risk of not getting a ruck replacement

by getting Griffin (if they can!?!) they eliminate the drafting for need risk, and can take best available as it happens.

in 2001, they needed KPP types, and wanted Polak, by trading for Croad and McPharlin they actually achieved a near perfect return for their draft value. they got the guy they wanted at no.1, and still returned 2 grade A kpp prospects.

now we know hindsight was not kind to them, but given their needs this was a great, great return. 3 tip top KPP prospects, when there was only 1 in the draft pool.

Griffin could just be a risk play. If I were Freo, I'd try and do that too.

 

[NTRabbit]

Re: Griffen

...and in saying all that, Warnock has nominated Carlton as his destination of choice, effectively meaning that any deals Fremantle do will be with Carlton or noone.

The only way Melbourne comes into the frame now is if Fremantle cannot come to an agreement with Carlton, and lets him slip to the PSD on principle. Guarantee the Demons will use pick #1 for him, because he won't be able to nominate a salary high enough that they cannot afford.

 

[Crow-mo]

Re: Griffen

but the fact that Warnock is out of contract and Melbourne have first pick in PSD means if Freo want Griffin, it will disrupt their draft plans slightly...as no way would Melbourne offer a draft pick for Warnock when they can get him for free. thus Freo would have to offer a draft pick/player if they want to secure Griffin.

that's not a significant factor. yeah they'd pay a price for Griffin, but their draft plans will be about no.3. the rest is gravy.

its not like for like, because they could use the warnock compensation to pay for griffin, its like for like in terms of player development, type and where they would sit in the profile of their list.

plug Griffin into Warnock's place on the list, and it is more or less unaltered structurally.

...in saying all this, it's all still rumour to me, so in my mind, Griffin still wants to stay. hope so.

it could just be a rumour but he has a WA manager, and the WA press seem fairly well briefed...

but if he wants to go, it doesn't mean he gets to.

 

[Crow-mo]

Re: Griffen

...and in saying all that, Warnock has nominated Carlton as his destination of choice, effectively meaning that any deals Fremantle do will be with Carlton or noone.

The only way Melbourne comes into the frame now is if Fremantle cannot come to an agreement with Carlton, and lets him slip to the PSD on principle. Guarantee the Demons will use pick #1 for him, because he won't be able to nominate a salary high enough that they cannot afford.

Melbourne are very much in the frame. they are the leverage that his manager will be using to get Freo to accept a trade from Carlton.

Just like Carlton wasn't Nick Stevens first choice, Melbourne are far from out of the running. they are looming in the shadows ready to pounce in the same way.

what's more, Melbourne could also do a veale deal to convince Freo not to trade him to Carlton....

the demons are front and centre relevant here still.

 

[dplggr47]

Re: Griffen

if Melbourne can guarantee that Watts will still be available at pick 3...they could swap pick 1 for 3...in a deal of faith that Freo won't trade him to Carlton and let him go via the PSD, which would guarantee Freo can pick up Nautini (because he'd make a great replacement for Warnock).

...i wonder why Warnock wants to go to Carlton? Melbourne don't exactly have great ruck stocks, esp with White gone, whereas Carlton have youngsters like Kreuzer and Hampson fighting for spots. at Melbourne, he'd probably only have to contend with the Meese himself. plus, he'd get to play alongside his brother.

 

[NTRabbit]

Re: Griffen

Melbourne are very much in the frame. they are the leverage that his manager will be using to get Freo to accept a trade from Carlton.

Just like Carlton wasn't Nick Stevens first choice, Melbourne are far from out of the running. they are looming in the shadows ready to pounce in the same way.

what's more, Melbourne could also do a veale deal to convince Freo not to trade him to Carlton....

the demons are front and centre relevant here still.

Which is exactly what I said? That's the only relevance the demons have, the threat of picking him up for free if Carlton and the Dockers fail to agree to terms. They won't ever be a part of the negotiations.

 

[NTRabbit]

Re: Griffen

if Melbourne can guarantee that Watts will still be available at pick 3...they could swap pick 1 for 3...in a deal of faith that Freo won't trade him to Carlton and let him go via the PSD, which would guarantee Freo can pick up Nautini (because he'd make a great replacement for Warnock).

...i wonder why Warnock wants to go to Carlton? Melbourne don't exactly have great ruck stocks, esp with White gone, whereas Carlton have youngsters like Kreuzer and Hampson fighting for spots. at Melbourne, he'd probably only have to contend with the Meese himself. plus, he'd get to play alongside his brother.

Money Money Money

Noone wants to go to the Demons. Terrible on field and will be for some years, their club facilities border on imaginary, and there's no guarantee the club will even exist as an AFL team by the time Warnock reaches his planned career end in just under a decade. Same for the Kangaroos really, except for the terrible on field part.

Carlton has a lot of proven money, to be thrown not only at Warnock as a "Visy Amabassador", but to build genuinely good club facilities that will probably be ready by next season, and to have a sizeable back room support staff.

 

[beartoo]

Re: Griffen

Check this article in The Australian this morning. Makes sense, but I think Griff is worth more than pick 24.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24331971-2722,00.html

 

[Encanto]

Re: Griffen

Was Griffin's operation a success ?

 

[Elite Crow]

Re: Griffen

Reid has stated Griffin is contracted and a required player is not up for trade.

 

[The Crows Truth]

Re: Griffen

if Melbourne can guarantee that Watts will still be available at pick 3...they could swap pick 1 for 3...in a deal of faith that Freo won't trade him to Carlton and let him go via the PSD, which would guarantee Freo can pick up Nautini (because he'd make a great replacement for Warnock).

...i wonder why Warnock wants to go to Carlton? Melbourne don't exactly have great ruck stocks, esp with White gone, whereas Carlton have youngsters like Kreuzer and Hampson fighting for spots. at Melbourne, he'd probably only have to contend with the Meese himself. plus, he'd get to play alongside his brother.

but how can they possibly do that when they dont have both picks 1 and 2?

 

[slippery crow]

Re: Griffen

I am currently in Perth for Worl

the talk on the street is that Griffin has already advised adelaide of his wish to return home to WA

Froe is his first choice, given that he is a East Fremantle lad