Hardwick and Clarkson - AFL Legends?

[PhatBoy]

I just saw this article today on abc.com

Man jailed for fatally injecting partner with heroin during anniversary celebration in Canberra

Christopher Weaver claimed in court his partner had requested she be injected with the heroin, but the judge found "he has to be accountable for his offending".

www.abc.net.au

Bloke was jailed for manslaughter because he injected his 40yo partner with heroin and she died of an overdose.
The thing is, she asked him to do it. She told him not to water it down because she wanted a good hit.

So this guy gets to spend the next decade in jail... while Ablett was never even charged for giving a line of heroin to Alisha Horan after he lied to her and told her it was cocaine and she died as a result.

You seem to gloss over this and act as though Alisha Horan did it to herself.

She didn't make a conscious choice to snort a line of heroin and put her life in danger. She was told it was coke. Had she known it was heroin, there is no fricken way she would've done it. It was Ablett's lie & supply which led to the tragic consequences. Her death should absolutely 100% be placed at Ablett's feet.

Like I said, it was incredible miscarriage of justice. A terrible finding by the coroner who no doubt absolved Ablett due to his profile as a recently retired AFL superstar. If it was Joe Bloggs, they would've locked him up.

I haven’t glossed over anything. I’m fully cogniscent of the fact that he lied and the part he played in it if that’s how it took place. And maybe he should have gone to jail. That’s not for me to say. Saying ‘he killed her’ however, and drawing a conclusion based on her age and simply saying that she had no role in the whole situation is not really painting the full picture.

And in the case mentioned above I don’t think the person in question if that’s indeed how it played out should be held to that level of accountability for someone else’s decision.

 

[cutterman]

As much as I love Hardwick, and how revered he will be forever in Richmond circles, there is a long list of players/coaches ahead of him to be acknowledged as Legends. He's obviously a walk-up starter for a Hall of Fame spot, as is Clarko, when combining the playing and coaching, but a long way off Legend status.

Legend criteria: "Individuals are selected for Legend status if they have caused the game to change significantly for the better. The committee considers candidates on the basis of record, ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character."

Playing career - 207 games, 2 flags, 1 All-Australian. Good player in two very good teams
Coaching career - 312 games with Richmond, 3 flags. Took us from a basket case to a powerhouse over a 4 year period. Significant credit also needs to go to Gale, Peggy and everyone involved at the club.

But did he change the game "significantly" for the better, no. He had a very successful career but that's the end of the influence.

At the risk of starting an absolute s***fight, scrolling through the Hall of Fame members who aren't legends, just a handful who I think would be further up the line than Hardwick (even with the case of a GC flag): Simon Black, Graham Cornes, Chris Judd, Stephen Silvagni, Jim Stynes, Tom Hafey, Allan Jeans, Mick Malthouse, David Parkin

 

[Tarkyn_24]

If we’re talking AFL Legends and 21st century coaches I think Paul Roos is best credentialed across his playing, coaching and contributions to the growth of AFL - even if he doesn’t have the same coaching results Hardwick and Clarkson achieved.

 

[Belnakor]

As much as I love Hardwick, and how revered he will be forever in Richmond circles, there is a long list of players/coaches ahead of him to be acknowledged as Legends. He's obviously a walk-up starter for a Hall of Fame spot, as is Clarko, when combining the playing and coaching, but a long way off Legend status.

Legend criteria: "Individuals are selected for Legend status if they have caused the game to change significantly for the better. The committee considers candidates on the basis of record, ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character."

Playing career - 207 games, 2 flags, 1 All-Australian. Good player in two very good teams
Coaching career - 312 games with Richmond, 3 flags. Took us from a basket case to a powerhouse over a 4 year period. Significant credit also needs to go to Gale, Peggy and everyone involved at the club.

But did he change the game "significantly" for the better, no. He had a very successful career but that's the end of the influence.

At the risk of starting an absolute s***fight, scrolling through the Hall of Fame members who aren't legends, just a handful who I think would be further up the line than Hardwick (even with the case of a GC flag): Simon Black, Graham Cornes, Chris Judd, Stephen Silvagni, Jim Stynes, Tom Hafey, Allan Jeans, Mick Malthouse, David Parkin

Tbh I think you are over thinking how much is required for legend. 10% of the hall of fame is a large amount than most other sports with a similiar setup. We already have “legends” like Royce Hart or Ted Whitten. Hardwick is easily in the picture.

 

[Jables]

AFL Hall of Fame yes, legends no chance. David Parkin coached 4 flags and captained one, so if he's not, neither will Hardwick or Clarkson.

But Sheedy is a legend, reality is Parkin should be as well, he is even more highly regarded at two clubs than Sheedy is. Even got Fitzroy of all teams to a prelim. I think it's just an era thing as to why Sheedy even got in before Parkin.

Clarkson more debatable due to not succeeding for two clubs or having a notable playing career, probably lean towards no if a team establishes itself as significantly better than Hawthorn in the next era or two. Hopefully not anyway, the idiot doesn't deserve it.