NO TROLLS Homophobia in the AFL - 4 Corners

[ashep]

Its amazing how all the straight players can so comfortably share their lives including their families and partners lives in social media, take them along on Brownlow night etc.

Yeah but all the gay players could do that too.

They just don't wanna....

 

[ashep]

Genuine question. What is it the AFL needs to be doing? What specific actions?

That's really not for anyone here to have to detail.

The point is that they're clearly not doing enough.

 

[kickazz]

Before my time but I remember reading that Australia did pretty well in how AIDS was responded to comparatively to many other countries. Government bodies recognised and responded to it quickly and put in place a lot of disease prevention programs and public health advertisements that treated it as a medical issue.

Very different to somewhere like the US where the governement at the time were openly calling it the natural consequence of the gay lifestyle.

Ronald Reagan refused to even say it for quite a while there.

 

[00Stinger]

To be fair in 1992 Gazey wouldnt have been alone in thinking that.

Wasn't catching AIDS around then almost considered a near certain death sentence?

If so, I could understand players trepidation at the time. I mean 3 years ago 95+% of people would look at someone with covid as a leper

I kind of remember it as a kid but not really tbf

 

[Toump Ass]

Id say pretty much every country in 1992.

So why didn't every country sook about Magic Johnson? Just Australia.

You never seen Philadelphia or read anything about the AIDS crisis.

I don't care for schmaltzy American Tom Hanks films sorry. Dallas Buyers Club, Milk more interesting movies I think.
Read many things, seen plenty of documentaries, lost friends to the disease even
Not one to brag much here, but I think I'm pretty knowledgeable on this one.

In 92 and through a decent chunk of the 90s mass hysteria about AIDS was off the charts

Of course, my point is Australia was just a little bit more hysterical than others, a little less civilized.
Whole reason we have the Blood Rule in AFL isn't it? (Which is obviously a smart move, took the AIDS crisis to make it happen though).

 

[Percel]

I thought it was Shane Heal

Borner, Smyth and Bradtke

 

[00Stinger]

That's really not for anyone here to have to detail.

The point is that they're clearly not doing enough.

Seriously though, what should they be doing exactly?

 

[Gough]

Wasn't catching AIDS around then almost considered a near certain death sentence?

If so, I could understand players trepidation at the time. I mean 3 years ago 95+% of people would look at someone with covid as a leper

I kind of remember it as a kid but not really tbf

Becoming HIV+ from sweat or a bit of blood is pretty much impossible though. Those arguments being made back then came straight from ignorance.

 

[phantom13]

Before my time but I remember reading that Australia did pretty well in how AIDS was responded to comparatively to many other countries. Government bodies recognised and responded to it quickly and put in place a lot of disease prevention programs and public health advertisements that treated it as a medical issue.

Very different to somewhere like the US where the governement at the time were openly calling it the natural consequence of the gay lifestyle.

There was a show on the ABC not too long ago that detailed it, "In our blood" (think they did the same show in the UK).

Was really really good.

Genuine question. What is it the AFL needs to be doing? What specific actions?

The report noted that not one of the current clubs has implements the recommendations of the consolidate anti discrimination review from 2000 (i think). So actually implementing their own requirements would be a start.

The broader question is pretty big and i dont have the answers but there are really well educated and engaged people who the AFL could engage (Angie Greene being one). A few made recommendations in the report (pride round, grassroots education etc etc).

The report really noted that the AFL isnt just not doing enough, theyre really doing SFA.

 

[ashep]

Seriously though, what should they be doing exactly?

Dunno mate, but I don't know exactly how to fix the cost of living crisis either but it needs to happen

 

[00Stinger]

So why didn't every country sook about Magic Johnson? Just Australia.

Of course, my point is Australia was just a little bit more hysterical than others, a little less civilized.
Whole reason we have the Blood Rule in AFL isn't it? (Which is obviously a smart move, took the AIDS crisis to make it happen though).

Maybe the hysteria over here helped get the message and education out to people quicker and avoided bi case numbers like other countries?

Plus I guess the world wasn't as connected back 31 yeasr ago either

 

[Dazzler9]

That's really not for anyone here to have to detail.

The point is that they're clearly not doing enough.

I'm not sure about that. They advocated for marriage equality, they've got any number of vilification policies, inclusive policies, etc. What more should they be doing? Ultimately they're a sports organisation that is run for the benefit and promotion of sport.

 

[Toump Ass]

How's Charles Barkley though, when asked about playing with Magic Johnson.
"We're just playing basketball. It's not like we're going out to have unprotected sex with him"

What a legend.

 

[The Sultan]

Ive said to my three daughters for as long as they are able to under stand, I will alwasy support you, i dont care if you are gay, bi, get marrired or not, change your sexuality at a whim, or have kids or dont, as long as you are happy..... just dont change your footy team.

 

[Toump Ass]

Derailed this one nice and proper, sorry friends.

 

[PhatBoy]

In terms of 'brand' impact, surely it'd be gold for them personally and from a team perspective. Corporations are falling over themselves to profess their LGBTQI credentials to customers, and they'd only be doing that if there were money in it.

Surely the biggest disincentive is less about homophobia, and more about the fact that for the first player that comes out, their private life instantly becomes national news, and they become a political football. All this when they probably just want to play football on the weekends and have some semblance of a private existence.

Another thing, it's interesting that she targets the AFL as somehow unique. Show me a male sporting league anywhere on earth where gay men are openly 'out', attending award ceremonies, etc?

She writes as though other Australian codes have somehow laid out a template the AFL needs to follow.

Look at RL. Ian Roberts is the only one, and he was vilified incessantly by players and fans after he came out. He was targeted with physical on-field violence. He put up with a lot of sh*t and in no way was supported at the time by his code of the wider public (though to be fair, it was nearly 30 years ago).

Look at soccer. An A-League player comes out only a few years ago, and is targeted by fans of the league's biggest club with homophobic chants! Wow! In no other sport in Australia would this be allowed happen, even RL.

And somehow, the message out of that is that the AFL needs to 'catch up'.

Roberts copped it more before he came out, at least that’s how it seemed at the time. It was an open secret among the footy community. Didn’t take long for other players to learn not to f**k with him.

 

[phantom13]

Wasn't catching AIDS around then almost considered a near certain death sentence?

If so, I could understand players trepidation at the time. I mean 3 years ago 95+% of people would look at someone with covid as a leper

I kind of remember it as a kid but not really tbf

Yeh, i can certainly understand it, there was alot of misinformation and misunderstanding.

So why didn't every country sook about Magic Johnson? Just Australia.


I don't care for schmaltzy American Tom Hanks films sorry. Dallas Buyers Club, Milk more interesting movies I think.
Read many things, seen plenty of documentaries, lost friends to the disease even
Not one to brag much here, but I think I'm pretty knowledgeable on this one.


Of course, my point is Australia was just a little bit more hysterical than others, a little less civilized.
Whole reason we have the Blood Rule in AFL isn't it? (Which is obviously a smart move, took the AIDS crisis to make it happen though).

Are you sure they didnt?

Yeh im not sure we were more hysterical than any other country, im not even sure how youd measure it. As mentioned "In our blood" actually showed how hard many people (including some passionate politicians) worked to help educate and assist in this space. If i recall correctly Australia was pretty leading edge. One random basketballer might not be quite the sample size you think.

 

[Toump Ass]

Maybe the hysteria over here helped get the message and education out to people quicker and avoided bi case numbers like other countries?

What exactly was the message in trying to boycott basketball matches? That you can get AIDS from Magic Johnson's sweat?

 

[phantom13]

I'm not sure about that. They advocated for marriage equality, they've got any number of vilification policies, inclusive policies, etc. What more should they be doing? Ultimately they're a sports organisation that is run for the benefit and promotion of sport.

Except that the report noted the AFL (including all 18 clubs) havent properly implemented the policies.

 

[00Stinger]

Becoming HIV+ from sweat or a bit of blood is pretty much impossible though. Those arguments being made back then came straight from ignorance.

Yeah once the virus is airborne is practically dead isn't it?

Having said that, in 1992 was the general population as educated around the possibility of contracting the disease as they are today? Accusing someone of being ignorant today is much more plausible as everyone has the internet as has a wealth of knowledge at their fingertips

I mean in 1992 having a set of Encyclopedia Britannica was considered having a vast wealth of knowledge

 

[00Stinger]

What exactly was the message in trying to boycott basketball matches? That you can get AIDS from Magic Johnson's sweat?

No idea, did people even know that wasn't the case 31 years ago?

I didn't even know Magic played basketball after being diagnosed with AIDS until 40 mins ago

 

[JackOutback]

Ive said to my three daughters for as long as they are able to under stand, I will alwasy support you, i dont care if you are gay, bi, get marrired or not, change your sexuality at a whim, or have kids or dont, as long as you are happy..... just dont change your footy team.

Why would you inflict that on people you claim to love?

 

[Enviable Tradition]

I feel like they would be treated very similarly to indigenous footballers.

I.e. universally recognised and celebrated by the vast majority but also vilified horribly by a small minority.

That small minority has such a devastating impact on our indigenous footballers and I am sure fear of similar is what causes players not to come out.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[schneebly111]

Yeah but all the gay players could do that too.

They just don't wanna....

Ask yourself why don’t gay players feel comfortable walking down the Brownlow red carpet with a same sex partner?

For all the talk of equality it’s obvious they have trepidation to display a same sex partner publicly whereas a straight person doesn’t.

It’s a industry for female WAGs to display themselves as openly, publicly and widely as possible. Same sex attracted female sportspeople are more willing (although maybe not yet fully comfortable) to be open about same sex partners - just a sign the male dominated sports world has less of a problem with lesbian women than gay men.

Someone in my workplace brought up a news article detailing the lesbian Matilda players and their partners. The reaction from my masculine workmates was “jeez which one of those girls would you like to have for a threesome?”

For traditional straight male sexuality gay men are repulsive but lesbian women only exist to satisfy straight male sexual desires.

 

[Gough]

Yeah once the virus is airborne is practically dead isn't it?

Having said that, in 1992 was the general population as educated around the possibility of contracting the disease as they are today? Accusing someone of being ignorant today is much more plausible as everyone has the internet as has a wealth of knowledge at their fingertips

I mean in 1992 having a set of Encyclopedia Britannica was considered having a vast wealth of knowledge

A lot of it was wilful ignorance back then, AIDS was still a punchline for some comedians.