Is our future bright?

[fitzroybowiedog]

Our future is bright, i hope.
i have to think it is, or there isn't much point.

I get the feeling next year will still be tough.
I don't see Goodes as a replacement for Cooney, i was really surprised that Goodes was re-rookied tbh. struggled to get a game last year, he's simply just cover. He's a known quantity, rather than an unknown.

 

[go you pups]

I actually think that Austin wasn't ahead of them. Talia clearly had some discipline issue with the coaching staff early in the year. Plus I think they were trying to get them to play together in the VFL for an extended period, so that once they come in, they are in together and have a good working relationship. Austin was always going IMO ... he was just coverage (and bad at that) to give them more time.

That's what I think too, they were huge in helping Footscray win the premiership even though Roberts was put in for surgery early.

 

[JJHunter]

You guys saying we are bottom 4 next year are nuts

7 wins last year with 7 losses under 12 points with one of the worst match day coaches I've seen pushing a poor gameplan

We will miss Griff but he was poor due to injury for most of the year with Libba copping the hard tag most weeks which will further develop him.

cooney deserved to be dropped quite a few times during the year and needed to come back from his hammy through the vfl.

Higgins was decent

jones played 3 decent games and never played after about round 12

I also heard a rumour after the brisbane game macca was that pissed he said to go out against collingwood and just play.....look what happened lol

we will win up to 10 and will no doubt miss Griff as he is a star but no the other 3

Love your optimism.

Do you think our ability to win close games will go up when we lose experience, and have one of the youngest most inexperienced teams in the AFL?

And will we keep winning the four out of seven games we won by 16 points or less (3 by 8 points or less)?

Personally can see GWS going ahead of us this year, they got Griff and Patful, and their youngsters will continue to improve.

So tell me, who is going to be worse than us? I'll give you Saints, Blues and Melbourne (but lineball)?

I was seriously half way responding with exact same question !
Agree 200000%

Check out the best 22 article on today's afl page.
I have us definite bottom 4 in that with injuries to affect that and fixture which I haven't analysed

 

[cleveland]

Love your optimism.

Do you think our ability to win close games will go up when we lose experience, and have one of the youngest most inexperienced teams in the AFL?

And will we keep winning the four out of seven games we won by 16 points or less (3 by 8 points or less)?

Personally can see GWS going ahead of us this year, they got Griff and Patful, and their youngsters will continue to improve.

So tell me, who is going to be worse than us? I'll give you Saints, Blues and Melbourne (but

I was seriously half way responding with exact same question !
Agree 200000%

Check out the best 22 article on today's afl page.
I have us definite bottom 4 in that with injuries to affect that and fixture which I haven't analysed

who are we seriously going to miss apart from Griff?

cooney has become a major down hill skier due to.injuries

Gia was poor for the entire season

Griff was poor for most of the season

Higgins was ok but imo isnt in our top 10

willams hardly played

Jones played 2-3 decent games and played a lot of poor ones not playing from round 12

Why are we going to miss them?

 

[JJHunter]

who are we seriously going to miss apart from Griff?

cooney has become a major down hill skier he to his

Brwb and myself have gone through it over and over so I don't wish to keep harping. - look away for those sick of these comments.

But for those that think we would be able to win 10 games and findin around where we did last hear ..Personally

- I think you are under estimating other lists and their growth in the off season

- I think your are over estimating what a kid who has played 9 games of footy can do. 15 games and 30 be a massive pass mark imo.

- I think you under estimate the flow on affect from being without Griffen every week. Who gets shut down in his absense ? Who fills that hole offensively. Who is the 23rd player now becoming a regular senior player and is his up to it

- I think your are underestimating the contributions of experienced and hardened bodies over the course of a long year. And I don't mean just any hardened body - guys who impact games

- I think you underestimate how long it takes a young side learning how to play afl as individuals / to learn and implement a game plan from a new coach.

- I think you are quick to detail close losses in 2014 but quick to ignore many close wins

But that's just me and my opinions.

Keen on hearing which 5 teams will finish below us and reasons why we are better than those sides,

 

[cleveland]

sorry my ipad shit itself and didnt realise my part post was successful so i edited it

 

[cleveland]

Brwb and myself have gone through it over and over so I don't wish to keep harping. - look away for those sick of these comments.

But for those that think we would be able to win 10 games and findin around where we did last hear ..Personally

- I think you are under estimating other lists and their growth in the off season

- I think your are over estimating what a kid who has played 9 games of footy can do. 15 games and 30 be a massive pass mark imo.

- I think you under estimate the flow on affect from being without Griffen every week. Who gets shut down in his absense ? Who fills that hole offensively. Who is the 23rd player now becoming a regular senior player and is his up to it

- I think your are underestimating the contributions of experienced and hardened bodies over the course of a long year. And I don't mean just any hardened body - guys who impact games

- I think you underestimate how long it takes a young side learning how to play afl as individuals / to learn and implement a game plan from a new coach.

- I think you are quick to detail close losses in 2014 but quick to ignore many close wins

But that's just me and my opinions.

Keen on hearing which 5 teams will finish below us and reasons why we are better than those sides,

as i stated above we had one of the worst natch day coaches ive seen coaching us so imo bringing in a stronger tactical coach although unproven being a head coach is a big step in the right direction. Macca cost us games due to poor mat h selection and tactics.

As for Boyd im not having any unrealistic expections on him but i do think he should kick 20-30 goals if he remains injury free.

We will see major improvement in fitness and ball movement.

 

[BRWB]

as i stated above we had one of the worst natch day coaches ive seen coaching us so imo bringing in a stronger tactical coach although unproven being a head coach is a big step in the right direction. Macca cost us games

He might have.

But we have just lost a genuine superstar of the game, a top 20 mid. We have lost hardened bodies in Higgins and Cooney, both whom were two of our more creative and run players. And while I don't disagree with what has happened, we are going to be lucky to tread water in our position from last year, let alone somehow improve markedly, the rest is as JJ said.

Again I admire your optimism but for next year I just don't see who is worse than us other the Saints and Carlton. If you want to say who is I'd be interested.

 

[AFDogs]

Higgins was massively underrated this season. It's just a shame his contract was expiring, when he finally hits some good form. Good pickup by North.

Of course I feel optimistic about the future, but it is a bit of a downer with how far off it we are.

 

[BRWB]

Higgins was massively underrated this season. It's just a shame his contract was expiring, when he finally hits some good form. Good pickup by North.

Of course I feel optimistic about the future, but it is a bit of a downer with how far off it we are.

We have the makings of a very good team. Personally, I will enjoy the development of Stringer, Bont, Boyd, Libba and Macrae (plus the rest). Who knows maybe they will surprise us - there is talent, but its young and a little thinly spread.

 

[_Mike_]

not much you can do about players who lost their way with the club and decided that for whatever reason they'd be better off else where. With the few exceptions there comes a time to let go.

Sure, we're in for another year of pain before things will get better but could they get any worse with the list we have.. Time... Time is what is needed and how long have we waited so far, in contrast to a few more years of waiting. We better not make the same mistake twice though and renew Beveridges contract should he not improve our standing after the first 3 seasons.

 

[BRWB]

not much you can do about players who lost their way with the club and decided that for whatever reason they'd be better off else where. With teh few exceptions there comes a time to let go.

Sure, we're in for another year of pain before things will get better but could they get any worse with the list we have.. Time... Time is what is needed and how log have we waited so far, in contrast to a few more years of waiting. We better not make the same mistake twice though and renew Beveridges contract should he not improve our standing after the first 3 seasons.

I'd expect improvement after two seasons, hope that isn't setting the bar too high!

 

[cleveland]

He might have.

But we have just lost a genuine superstar of the game, a top 20 mid. We have lost hardened bodies in Higgins and Cooney, both whom were two of our more creative and run players. And while I don't disagree with what has happened, we are going to be lucky to tread water in our position from last year, let alone somehow improve markedly, the rest is as JJ said.

Again I admire your optimism but for next year I just don't see who is worse than us other the Saints and Carlton. If you want to say who is I'd be interested.

gws
Melbourne
Carlton
Brisbane
Collingwood
Stkilda

 

[cleveland]

Higgins was massively underrated this season. It's just a shame his contract was expiring, when he finally hits some good form. Good pickup by North.

Of course I feel optimistic about the future, but it is a bit of a downer with how far off it we are.

with good reason...he is slow with overrated disposal!!!

 

[the dog's kennel]

I used to feel we were on track for finals appearances in 2016 and PF-level teams in 2017/18. But now I am way way less optimistic.

In fact I would say my answer to the question "Is our future bright?" is "I have no idea".

I still feel we certainly have the potential to be a good team sometime after 2016 (I feel last year's exodus pushes us back a year or two). But I also feel we have the potential to max out as an also-ran 6th-8th finals team like Carlton circa 2011-12. It really all depends on the next few years of drafting and development.

There are two reasons I'm so much less positive than I was:

1. Over the last 12 months there have been a lot of extra question marks placed on players for mine.

I would say since this time last year there are more question marks on Grant, Roughead, Smith, Roberts, Talia, Wallis, Campbell, JJ, and Hunter. I'm not saying they're rubbish - there are good reasons for many of them. I'm just saying that I have less confidence in all of them 12 months on - and could see the potential for all of them to not be good players in 3 years time. However, they may all turn it around and go onto great things and our draftees will go gangbusters, and we will have no worries. I just don't know - there is just a lot of uncertainty about our list. (Oh, and add the loss of Jones and Tutt to the equation, who obviously will not be improving for us in 2015!)

2. Our competition has stepped it up bigtime. Port, Brisbane, GWS and GC are all looking miles ahead of us for the forseeable future. Melbourne and St Kilda have their own question marks, just like us - but I would say both teams have at least as much cause for optimism as we do right now, if not more. And I'm getting increasingly nervous about Collingwood. (I also wouldn't be writing off Essendon, North and Richmond as medium term threats either.) The bottom line is we are going to have do a LOT right to make the Top 6, let alone Top 4 over the next 4 or 5 years.

So I would say that right now I have no expectations, a bit of hope, and a lot of anxiety going forward. The actions that have just been taken and are about to be taken in the next 24 months will decide all.

 

[Ozimandas]

I'd expect improvement after two seasons, hope that isn't setting the bar too high!

Wow. 2 more years as a bottom 4 team!

Woohoo!

 

[stefoid]

Goodes a replacement for Cooney??? Wow

Also given we'll need a long term injury for Goodes the rookie to play, you may well be being unduly pessimistic?

Yeah I reckon Goodes and Cooney would play a similar role to a similar level for us. Goodes is no star, but neither is coons anymore. We picked up Goodes so we can play him, not so he can sit on the rookie list all year - he'll play as soon as someone gets injured.

 

[AFDogs]

with good reason...he is slow with overrated disposal!!!

Well he was one of the better users of the ball in our team last year. So if he's overrated then the rest of our team must be shocking.

 

[paul scholes]

He might have.

But we have just lost a genuine superstar of the game, a top 20 mid. We have lost hardened bodies in Higgins and Cooney, both whom were two of our more creative and run players. And while I don't disagree with what has happened, we are going to be lucky to tread water in our position from last year, let alone somehow improve markedly, the rest is as JJ said.

Again I admire your optimism but for next year I just don't see who is worse than us other the Saints and Carlton. If you want to say who is I'd be interested.

Agree. I thought we'd be okay in 2011 even though we lost experience , they were non contributors, but games out hurt us immensely that year.
I fear after a bright start a long year ahead

 

[Hrovat24]

We had plenty of choice with Cooney and Higgins. Both were pushed out.

Looked like higgins wouldn't sign and wanted out , cooney probably was pushed out but don't think he was to fussed

 

[yebiga]

BMac pushed very hard against Shaun. He challenged him, questioned his game, character and Shaun did not like it . He hated being dropped but he put together his best season. He may never have a better.

But of course bmac was unable to coach had no game plan and was leading us to oblivion

Fortunately we now have quality coach to help us stay in the bottom 4

 

[BRWB]

I used to feel we were on track for finals appearances in 2016 and PF-level teams in 2017/18. But now I am way way less optimistic.
...

There are two reasons I'm so much less positive than I was:

1. Over the last 12 months there have been a lot of extra question marks placed on players for mine.

I would say since this time last year there are more question marks on Grant, Roughead, Smith, Roberts, Talia, Wallis, Campbell, JJ, and Hunter. I'm not saying they're rubbish - there are good reasons for many of them. I'm just saying that I have less confidence in all of them 12 months on - and could see the potential for all of them to not be good players in 3 years time. However, they may all turn it around and go onto great things and our draftees will go gangbusters, and we will have no worries. I just don't know - there is just a lot of uncertainty about our list. (Oh, and add the loss of Jones and Tutt to the equation, who obviously will not be improving for us in 2015!)

2. Our competition has stepped it up bigtime. Port, Brisbane, GWS and GC are all looking miles ahead of us for the forseeable future. Melbourne and St Kilda have their own question marks, just like us - but I would say both teams have at least as much cause for optimism as we do right now, if not more. And I'm getting increasingly nervous about Collingwood. (I also wouldn't be writing off Essendon, North and Richmond as medium term threats either.) The bottom line is we are going to have do a LOT right to make the Top 6, let alone Top 4 over the next 4 or 5 years.

So I would say that right now I have no expectations, a bit of hope, and a lot of anxiety going forward. The actions that have just been taken and are about to be taken in the next 24 months will decide all.

This is a really good post and sums up my sense of things pretty well. The stalled development of Hunter, etc is key. If Bevo can unlock the potential of most of the guys listed we are in business.

Still think our top end young talent is as good or better than anyone else in the league. Libba, Bont, Stringer, Macrae and Boyd are/will be as good as it gets.

The drafting and trading and FAing next couple of years is crucial. This year's draft is vital. Guess that is why I've been going off tap about it. I saw this draft as a key plank for our success in the future and while ball use is important, how so many small players can all play in the one team still defeats me...shouldn't go there again

Wow. 2 more years as a bottom 4 team!

Woohoo!

Sorry mate, I meant improvement in Season 2. if that's depressing, just read Cleveland who has us winning 10 and just about knocking on the door of the 8!

gws - beat us last year with a half strength team, nett effect of them getting Griffen and us losing him.....with natural development of their youngsters plus Patfull as well...can't see them as the easy beats they once were and have them ahead of us now (although our top end young talent is better than theirs now)
Melbourne - we only just defeated last year, and we have lost Griffen, etc since
Carlton - who smashed us last year but agree they will be shit
Brisbane - who beat us last year and have picked up Beams, Christenson and have Rich back
Collingwood - continue to lose experience, but have a better balanced list than us when fit (ie Mature key backs and forwards, Pendles and a fit again Swan...
Stkilda- just a shit team that is worse than everyone

Guess we have pretty different views on footy

 

[_Mike_]

who are we seriously going to miss apart from Griff?

Cooney has become a major down hill skier due to.injuries

Cooney didnt want to go, he was told he wasnt required next year, however on your comment - yes IMO he was more of a liability than anything else.

Gia was poor for the entire season

Was always going to reqtire

Griff was poor for most of the season

We had Macrae in the middle who was covering for Griffen throughout the season.

Higgins was ok but imo isnt in our top 10

A downhill skiier IMO, no defensive aspect to his game. We have to build someone up to replace him, with the ability to generate forward play and have a strong defensive aspect

Williams hardly played

Cant blame Tom for that, his shoulders were shot. Potentially could have retired 12 months ealier but tried to give it another crack

Jones played 2-3 decent games and played a lot of poor ones not playing from round 12

Only through laziness more than anything else. I still think this one could come back to haunt us

 

[BRWB]

Cooney didnt want to go, he was told he wasnt required next year, however on your comment - yes IMO he was more of a liability than anything else.



Was always going to reqtire



We had Macrae in the middle who was covering for Griffen throughout the season.



A downhill skiier IMO, no defensive aspect to his game. We have to build someone up to replace him, with the ability to generate forward play and have a strong defensive aspect



Cant blame Tom for that, his shoulders were shot. Potentially could have retired 12 months ealier but tried to give it another crack



Only through laziness more than anything else. I still think this one could come back to haunt us

We have lost Griffen, Cooney, Higgins and Gia, who were all first 22 players for much of the year. Even though Griffen was down last year, he still finished high in our B and F.

Its always the question, who is going to step up from outside the best 22 and replace these guys....??

Griffen - I have no-one even close to replacing him in the midfiled, you just don't easily replace these guys
Cooney - some have suggested Goodes which I don't get at all since he's a rookie and a shit kick of the football...who else...?
Higgins - Biggs? Darley? Are these guys virtual delistees from other clubs... how will that go?
Gia - His experience is retained as a coach, his lack of run won't be missed, Hunter, Dickson, Honey etc should replace comfortably

Yes we have young guys but I don't think any of them are ready to step in at Cooney, Higgins (even though they were defensive liabilities) and particularly Griffen's level.

 

[LondonBulldog]

Its best to be positive. Anything can happy from one year to the next. Anyone predict our rise to prelim final in 1997 or 2007?

Sides like Port did, with a fresh coach and positive game plan can get on a run and go with it.