Opinion Jackson Thurlow

[Biscut]

Been completely mismanaged since returning from the reco. I may be wrong but has he played 2 games in a row this year?? As pointed out, other have been gifted games when not warranted with poor form in the VFL. This guy is clearly a confidence player who needs a run of games, yet never given a chance to prove himself. And the problem is, I think he could be a bloody good player for us so yeah I’m pissed off about this.

 

[Daniel McL]

Been completely mismanaged since returning from the reco. I may be wrong but has he played 2 games in a row this year?? As pointed out, other have been gifted games when not warranted with poor form in the VFL. This guy is clearly a confidence player who needs a run of games, yet never given a chance to prove himself. And the problem is, I think he could be a bloody good player for us so yeah I’m pissed off about this.

Exactly, returning from knee reco we played him in the seniors like 6-8+ games in a row when he was working his way back and his confidence was low.

Now he has more confidence in his body and is dominating VFL we only give him 1 or 2 senior games before dropping him because he might’ve made one mistake or because we lost and they like to take it out on him by dropping him.

Should’ve been the other way around, returning from knee reco start in VFL to get confidence back and until you’re dominating VFL, then bring him into the seniors and give him 6-8+ senior games to settle in.

I’d have him in the seniors ahead of O’Connor and Cuthrie in terms of half back flankers.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Comes in after way too much time in the VFL considering some of the players who continuously get games for lesser form.

Plays well against Richmond and stuffs up one crucial kick by trying to be attacking when we're chasing arse as usual.

Get's drops for guys like Parsons and O'Connor who's VFL form didn't warrant selection.

Once again another player who's been poorly handled by the MC IMO.

I can't agree with you that Thurlow played 'well' against Richmond.
11 disposals on the night, including one great kick into F50 and one howler that contributed to our loss. 0 tackles.
Thurlow was given a 5-game block of senior games from Rd 5-9 but didn't grasp his chance - needs to make the most of any further opportunities given to him by the club.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Been completely mismanaged since returning from the reco. I may be wrong but has he played 2 games in a row this year?? As pointed out, other have been gifted games when not warranted with poor form in the VFL. This guy is clearly a confidence player who needs a run of games, yet never given a chance to prove himself. And the problem is, I think he could be a bloody good player for us so yeah I’m pissed off about this.

Yes; played Rounds 5,6,7,8 & 9 - you probably don't recall because he just didn't do all that much of anything. Mr Anonymous on the field.

 

[Cronin]

I can't agree with you that Thurlow played 'well' against Richmond.
11 disposals on the night, including one great kick into F50 and one howler that contributed to our loss. 0 tackles.
Thurlow was given a 5-game block of senior games from Rd 5-9 but didn't grasp his chance - needs to make the most of any further opportunities given to him by the club.

He's an outside player and runner who get's poorly utilised when he plays because we move the ball so slow and play with such a negative mindset.

On the occasions when we do move the ball quick we look great and players like Thurlow come into their element.

Players like him get crucified because of the way we play.

 

[Cursed Cat]

He's an outside player and runner who get's poorly utilised when he plays because we move the ball so slow and play with such a negative mindset.

On the occasions when we do move the ball quick we look great and players like Thurlow come into their element.

Players like him get crucified because of the way we play.

You might be right.

Prior to doing his knee he seemed to be heading in the right direction, but since coming back from that injury I don't reckon he's played many - maybe any - really strong games for the club at senior level.
Last years indifferent form was understandably given a pass, as there have been many examples of players taking up to a full season to find their feet again at senior level.
This year has been disappointing, you could argue that the game plan doesn't suit his talents but I think if anything that is even more concerning than Thurlow simply struggling to find form - if he doesn't suit the game plan then there may be little use for him at the club.

I do remember that at his best he has a raking right foot and is handy overhead - as things stand though we've seen very little of those attributes since 2015.

 

[OddYears]

Yes; played Rounds 5,6,7,8 & 9 - you probably don't recall because he just didn't do all that much of anything. Mr Anonymous on the field.

It's interesting that if you compare Thurlows 5 games with Guthries last 5, Thurlow actually had 7 more disposals and 2 less turnovers than him. But somehow Guthrie is a lock in the 22 and Thurlow can't get a game.

 

[Larry Donohue]

It's interesting that if you compare Thurlows 5 games with Guthries last 5, Thurlow actually had 7 more disposals and 2 less turnovers than him. But somehow Guthrie is a lock in the 22 and Thurlow can't get a game.

Perfectly pointed out.
Guthrie has been a liability this season. We need a real backman in the side not a mid trying to break lines unsuccessfully.
I would have thought with blitz stewart henderson kolo taylor bews tuohy and thurlow we had this covered.
Some weird stuff going down this year.
Smith and Thurlow have fallen off the radar. Both very useful footballers. How to dent confidence and influence people

 

[Cronin]

You might be right.

Prior to doing his knee he seemed to be heading in the right direction, but since coming back from that injury I don't reckon he's played many - maybe any - really strong games for the club at senior level.
Last years indifferent form was understandably given a pass, as there have been many examples of players taking up to a full season to find their feet again at senior level.
This year has been disappointing, you could argue that the game plan doesn't suit his talents but I think if anything that is even more concerning than Thurlow simply struggling to find form - if he doesn't suit the game plan then there may be little use for him at the club.

I do remember that at his best he has a raking right foot and is handy overhead - as things stand though we've seen very little of those attributes since 2015.

It absolutely doesn't suit his talents, along with a host of other players both current and past.

Don't get me wrong, some of the defensive efforts and work rates of these players have poor and contributed to a lot of loses, but so has some of our structures and a very loose zone that's been implemented.

IMO I'd rather see a change in game style before letting players like Thurlow go.

 

[Fyre]

Gone.

Lots of interest. 6 clubs in recent weeks have inquired again from what I understand. Frustrated with lack of opportunities. Writing was on the wall after the 2nd qualifying final last year.

Such a waste as the kid has the talent just not utilised under the Cats game plan.

 

[Cursed Cat]

It absolutely doesn't suit his talents, along with a host of other players both current and past.

Don't get me wrong, some of the defensive efforts and work rates of these players have poor and contributed to a lot of loses, but so has some of our structures and a very loose zone that's been implemented.

IMO I'd rather see a change in game style before letting players like Thurlow go.

Disagree - do we constantly change the game style to accommodate every underperforming player?
What if a new game style is implemented only for the club to discover it doesn't work for Stanley, Stewart or whoever? Change back? Come up with a new one, again?

IMO you set the game plan and get the players to 'buy in' - if they can't find a way to contribute under that plan then they're surplus to requirements.

However, if the game plan itself is the issue, then we're in big trouble and no one will truly thrive.

I have my doubts as to whether Chris Scott has the game plan to take the club to the promised land again, but then again I do agree with his recent assessment that the biggest current issue is some of the deplorable skills our players have shown over the past few weeks.
For mine it doesn't matter what game plan we employ; if the players are unable to execute basic skills then they're gonna struggle to win games.

Anyway, I'd be happy to see Thurlow regain his spot in the 22 and contribute strongly; on exposed form over the past two seasons though I'm certainly not expecting it.

 

[Daniel McL]

Yes; played Rounds 5,6,7,8 & 9 - you probably don't recall because he just didn't do all that much of anything. Mr Anonymous on the field.

Round 5 - 12 touches (3 contested) at 75% efficiency. Didn’t get as much of the ball as we would’ve liked but I remember that was a very scrappy game. Other defenders had low possessions too with Blitz 11, Bews 9, Kolo 8, Henry 7 below him, with Tuohy 16 and Stewart 16 the two defenders ahead of him which you’d expect from those two.

Round 6 - 17 touches (9 contested) at 65% efficiency. More touches than Tuohy & Stewart that game too plus a better efficiency than Tuohy who went at 38% ew. Jackson built his form a bit more after returning in Rnd5.

Round 7 - 22 touches (6 contested) at 68% efficiency as well as a goal. Continued building that good form.

Round 8 - 16 touches (5 contested) at 75% efficiency including a goal. Less touches but still a solid performance using the ball well.

Round 9 - 13 touches (3 contested) at 77% efficiency. The game against Essendon when they absolutely dominated us & pressured us a lot. Definitely less touches than he would’ve liked, still used it quite well considering the pressure we were under. Only had 3 touches less than Stewart and had a better efficiency than Stewart.

Then because we got smashed we dropped Thurlow even though he wasn’t actually that poor himself, it’s just the whole team was poor and we like to drop him as soon as we lose.

So while I definitely agree in a couple of those games he was a bit of a Mr Anonymous and just did his role okay but not much else I felt like he was building his form quite well, then all of a sudden gets dropped, and we continue to overlook him even though he dominates the VFL pretty much every week.

To be fair when we dropped Thurlow after the Essendon game we did bring in Aaron Black to replace him which ended up being a great decision as Black’s form was very good until he got injured, but then once Black got injured we decided to bring in Z. Guthrie instead of Thurlow which was the mistake.

Currently we’ve got C. Guthrie playing a role Thurlow plays and usually performing poorly but it looks like we’ll never drop him, so he’s getting a run of games Jackson deserves but has never gotten himself.

Hope Thurlow comes back in for O’Connor this week but not expecting it.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Round 5 - 12 touches (3 contested) at 75% efficiency. Didn’t get as much of the ball as we would’ve liked but I remember that was a very scrappy game. Other defenders had low possessions too with Blitz 11, Bews 9, Kolo 8, Henry 7 below him, with Tuohy 16 and Stewart 16 the two defenders ahead of him which you’d expect from those two.

Round 6 - 17 touches (9 contested) at 65% efficiency. More touches than Tuohy & Stewart that game too plus a better efficiency than Tuohy who went at 38% ew. Jackson built his form a bit more after returning in Rnd5.

Round 7 - 22 touches (6 contested) at 68% efficiency as well as a goal. Continued building that good form.

Round 8 - 16 touches (5 contested) at 75% efficiency including a goal. Less touches but still a solid performance using the ball well.

Round 9 - 13 touches (3 contested) at 77% efficiency. The game against Essendon when they absolutely dominated us & pressured us a lot. Definitely less touches than he would’ve liked, still used it quite well considering the pressure we were under. Only had 3 touches less than Stewart and had a better efficiency than Stewart.

Then because we got smashed we dropped Thurlow even though he wasn’t actually that poor himself, it’s just the whole team was poor and we like to drop him as soon as we lose.

So while I definitely agree in a couple of those games he was a bit of a Mr Anonymous and just did his role okay but not much else I felt like he was building his form quite well, then all of a sudden gets dropped, and we continue to overlook him even though he dominates the VFL pretty much every week.

To be fair when we dropped Thurlow after the Essendon game we did bring in Aaron Black to replace him which ended up being a great decision as Black’s form was very good until he got injured, but then once Black got injured we decided to bring in Z. Guthrie instead of Thurlow which was the mistake.

Currently we’ve got C. Guthrie playing a role Thurlow plays and usually performing poorly but it looks like we’ll never drop him, so he’s getting a run of games Jackson deserves but has never gotten himself.

Hope Thurlow comes back in for O’Connor this week but not expecting it.

I've looked at the stats too Daniel McL; however they only tell part of the story.
Those 'efficient' disposals no doubt include the many times Thurlow would gain possession under pressure and squeeze out a handpass to a bloke standing flat-footed under just as much pressure. Technically he's found a target, but in reality he has done little better than pass responsibility for lack of inspiration.

I'd be surprised if he was named among our best players in any of those 5 games (while Tuohy and Stewart, who you have brought up by way of comparison, at least had some actual strong games to counterbalance the quiet/poor ones).

Happy to agree to disagree; I just don't think Thurlow grabbed the opportunity to make himself 'undroppable' in that 5-game block. I do vaguely recall him playing one solid game, if I were more invested in this debate then I'd trawl through my own posts to identify the game (I do remember writing something about a solid game he played) - but overall I wasn't gnashing my teeth when he was dropped, nor clamouring for his recall - because I don't think he makes much a difference.

I honestly don't have a preference as to whether he is selected or not, if he is selected though I do hope he performs well.

 

[Cronin]

Disagree - do we constantly change the game style to accommodate every underperforming player?
What if a new game style is implemented only for the club to discover it doesn't work for Stanley, Stewart or whoever? Change back? Come up with a new one, again?

IMO you set the game plan and get the players to 'buy in' - if they can't find a way to contribute under that plan then they're surplus to requirements.

However, if the game plan itself is the issue, then we're in big trouble and no one will truly thrive.

I have my doubts as to whether Chris Scott has the game plan to take the club to the promised land again, but then again I do agree with his recent assessment that the biggest current issue is some of the deplorable skills our players have shown over the past few weeks.
For mine it doesn't matter what game plan we employ; if the players are unable to execute basic skills then they're gonna struggle to win games.

Anyway, I'd be happy to see Thurlow regain his spot in the 22 and contribute strongly; on exposed form over the past two seasons though I'm certainly not expecting it.

I'll leave you with this;
We're at our best when we move the ball quick and we look insipid when we go slow.

If our game plan is to move the ball quick and we can't execute then for me that's on the players.

But if our game plan is to go slow and protect our defence while occasionally breaking rank and moving it quick then for me this MC have a lot to answer for.

I will leave it at that and see what transpires over the next two weeks and hopefully beyond....

 

[Down at K Park]

He certainly hasn’t done enough to be best 22. And obviously there are other things coaches rate players on that we are oblivious to. We don’t know wether they actually do the things they are asked or expected to do.

 

[Footy Smarts]

It's interesting that if you compare Thurlows 5 games with Guthries last 5, Thurlow actually had 7 more disposals and 2 less turnovers than him. But somehow Guthrie is a lock in the 22 and Thurlow can't get a game.

Guthrie's a defender first who plays on a man and often has lock-down roles. Thurlow needs to be doing way more offensively than Guthrie to justify his spot and he's not. 1 possession more per game doesn't justify the lack of defensive side to his game (can't play on a man, Guthrie's had 22 tackles to Thurlow's 7 in that time). Right now Thurlow's a backman who can't defend and can't hurt teams the other way.

 

[Cursed Cat]

I'll leave you with this;
We're at our best when we move the ball quick and we look insipid when we go slow.

If our game plan is to move the ball quick and we can't execute then for me that's on the players.

But if our game plan is to go slow and protect our defence while occasionally breaking rank and moving it quick then for me this MC have a lot to answer for.

I will leave it at that and see what transpires over the next two weeks and hopefully beyond....

fair enough, good post Cronin - don't agree %100 but I understand your preference for fast ball movement - I'd argue that either way, the players need to be able to execute basic skills.

 

[Footy Smarts]

As much as I can't agree with people saying he's been unlucky or mistreated I wouldn't mind seeing him and O'Connor both get a game while we shift Thuoy forward and Guthrie through midfield for guys like Parsons and Fogarty.

 

[Daniel McL]

I've looked at the stats too Daniel McL; however they only tell part of the story.
Those 'efficient' disposals no doubt include the many times Thurlow would gain possession under pressure and squeeze out a handpass to a bloke standing flat-footed under just as much pressure. Technically he's found a target, but in reality he has done little better than pass responsibility for lack of inspiration.

I'd be surprised if he was named among our best players in any of those 5 games (while Tuohy and Stewart, who you have brought up by way of comparison, at least had some actual strong games to counterbalance the quiet/poor ones).

Happy to agree to disagree; I just don't think Thurlow grabbed the opportunity to make himself 'undroppable' in that 5-game block. I do vaguely recall him playing one solid game, if I were more invested in this debate then I'd trawl through my own posts to identify the game (I do remember writing something about a solid game he played) - but overall I wasn't gnashing my teeth when he was dropped, nor clamouring for his recall - because I don't think he makes much a difference.

I honestly don't have a preference as to whether he is selected or not, if he is selected though I do hope he performs well.

I agree that he definitely didn’t make himself undroppable, and that’s where the bias comes in because C. Guthrie hasn’t made himself undroppable at all and in my opinion Thurlow has been better this year at that half back role than Cuthrie has but we all know Cuthrie won’t be dropped anyway.

I reckon if we kept Jackson in after that 5 game block he would’ve continued building and improved to the point where he’s getting 20 or so touches each week and using it well setting up attacking plays as the 3rd sort of flanker behind Stewart & Tuohy.

 

[OddYears]

Guthrie's a defender first who plays on a man and often has lock-down roles. Thurlow needs to be doing way more offensively than Guthrie to justify his spot and he's not. 1 possession more per game doesn't justify the lack of defensive side to his game (can't play on a man, Guthrie's had 22 tackles to Thurlow's 7 in that time). Right now Thurlow's a backman who can't defend and can't hurt teams the other way.

Can’t really say Guthrie is doing a great job of defending or hurting teams the other way right now either. Just highlighting that their output this year has been similar but they’re seen in a very different light by the MC and Scott.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Comes in after way too much time in the VFL considering some of the players who continuously get games for lesser form.

Plays well against Richmond and stuffs up one crucial kick by trying to be attacking when we're chasing arse as usual.

Get's drops for guys like Parsons and O'Connor who's VFL form didn't warrant selection.

Once again another player who's been poorly handled by the MC IMO.

Disagree on the bold. His lowest possession tally of the year and just 54% disposal efficiency. 0 tackles.
I thought he was decidedly poor against the Tigers, droppable levels of poor, in fact.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I have my doubts as to whether Chris Scott has the game plan to take the club to the promised land again, but then again I do agree with his recent assessment that the biggest current issue is some of the deplorable skills our players have shown over the past few weeks.
For mine it doesn't matter what game plan we employ; if the players are unable to execute basic skills then they're gonna struggle to win games.

Bingo CC!
Agree wholeheartedly on Thurlow too. He had a 5 week block to show what he's got and fluffed it.

I don't buy this club mismanaged him pish. He's just not in form.
People will mention Parsons, Jones, Murdoch, Fogarty etc as players giving not much and getting heaps of chances. Well, for all but Murdoch they play in the forward half and that's a dysfunctional mess atm with only Hawkins and Menzel looking AFL standard.

Thurlow, on the other hand, plays back half and that's where we're strong. Henry, Stewart, Blicavs, Tuohy, Bews, Kolo, Henderson have all performed far better than Jackson. I don't think he's a wingman's a-hole either, Cunico and Duncan are much better than him. Kelly and Menegola too.

He simply hasn't grasped his chances this year and is in the magoos.
As it stands he's been given a reprieve tonight. Let's hope he takes this opportunity.

 

[Leeds17]

Disagree on the bold. His lowest possession tally of the year and just 54% disposal efficiency. 0 tackles.
I thought he was decidedly poor against the Tigers, droppable levels of poor, in fact.

Yep didn't play well & had some mates, liked that after the big screw up he went and took a contested mark through the middle, he has skills that could be very helpful in the 1s, but he clearly has no confidence & I don't the GFC 1s is a place where almost anyone out of form is going to find form.

I think he'll be lost to us unfortunately, plug him into Geelong circa 2007 in place of Mackie and every chance he plays 250 games, footy's a funny game.

 

[Cursed Cat]

Bingo CC!
Agree wholeheartedly on Thurlow too. He had a 5 week block to show what he's got and fluffed it.

I don't buy this club mismanaged him pish. He's just not in form.
People will mention Parsons, Jones, Murdoch, Fogarty etc as players giving not much and getting heaps of chances. Well, for all but Murdoch they play in the forward half and that's a dysfunctional mess atm with only Hawkins and Menzel looking AFL standard.

Thurlow, on the other hand, plays back half and that's where we're strong. Henry, Stewart, Blicavs, Tuohy, Bews, Kolo, Henderson have all performed far better than Jackson. I don't think he's a wingman's a-hole either, Cunico and Duncan are much better than him. Kelly and Menegola too.

He simply hasn't grasped his chances this year and is in the magoos.
As it stands he's been given a reprieve tonight. Let's hope he takes this opportunity.

Thurlow got called up?
Fair enough; genuinely hope he can turn it around - not expecting huge things by any means, but just getting involved in some positive passages of play would almost be enough at this stage.
As I've been at pains to make clear, I have no axe to grind with Thurlow apart from the fact that (to me) he hasn't been producing.
I would love to see him show the kind of kicking skills (and occasional marking prowess) that had the majority of us feeling more positive about his future a few years ago.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Thurlow got called up?
Fair enough; genuinely hope he can turn it around - not expecting huge things by any means, but just getting involved in some positive passages of play would almost be enough at this stage.
As I've been at pains to make clear, I have no axe to grind with Thurlow apart from the fact that (to me) he hasn't been producing.
I would love to see him show the kind of kicking skills (and occasional marking prowess) that had the majority of us feeling more positive about his future a few years ago.

He has been.

Same, at one point I loved Thurlow as a young player, he's just not doing much and it is sad to see.