James kelly or Nick Dal Santo?

[geelong_crazy26]

kelly easily dal santo is overrated something shocking.Kelly is a gun that dosent get the recognition he deserves because he plays for geelong , if he wasnt in the shadows of ablett,bartell,scarlett,johnson etc he would be much more highly rated

 

[Generalissimo]

Kelly may not have a halo around his head, but he goes in and gets his own ball. More than I can say for Dal Santo.

 

[Claude Balls]

I can understand most people thinking Dal Santo is better, given that he is a flashiy type with fantastic skills, however in my opinion Kelly is the more versatile and complete player.

Kelly's form has slipped over the last four weeks, though prior to that, and during last year's finals series, he showed how well he can play, particularly in big games. He has the edge over Dal Santo in terms of hardness, marking ability, tackling ability, and can play as an inside or outside mid. He also doesn't go completely missing in big games.

It's not so much that I'm biased, but that I've always though Dal santo was overrated.

 

[darylfromnoblepark]

Pretty sure hes a bloke with a premiership medal hanging around his neck! So if that gives you a clue.... unlike the collingwood players of last yr. But i suppose you will bring up that you smashed us 2 wks ago... i know wat id rather win!

hey, we smashed you 2 weeks ago

 

[Silvagnis]

Kelly>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dal Santo.

Dal Santo, Italian for downhill skier.

 

[Claude Balls]

And Headland was one of Brisbane's best midfielders in '02.

Kelly only played 13 games in '04, and was nowhere near as good as Bartel, Corey or even Ling, so that's complete rubbish.

Geelong was pretty good in '04 anyway - Saying that he was good that year doesn't really remove evidence that he might have been propped up by better players doing harder work.

Geelong was pretty good in '04 and '05, ordinary in '06 and good again in '07 and '08... Hmm... I wonder which year James Kelly was so ordinary that Geelong tried to pawn him off for a 2nd round pick and couldn't find any takers... Oh, that'd be 2006, the one bad year Geelong has had in the last 5.

It's nothing against him - Every team has players that perform better in winning sides due to the nature of the way they play. However, it means that he is not in the same stratosphere as Nick Dal Santo, who is a legitimate star of this league.

Geeze Vinnie, I usually find what you post to be reasoned and near the mark, though you really haven't distinguished yourself in this case. Your quick glance at formline Vs year, is especially simple and ignorant, totally failing to factor circumstances and finer details.

Let me give you a quick summary of things you evidently are unaware of:

- Kelly played only 13 games in 2004 because he broke his leg - up until that point he WAS our best performed from the '01 draft, and was frequently amongst our top two performed mids, being named in the best almost every week.

- He was awarded the best first year player in 2002, when Geelong missed the finals. We know how strongly Geelong drafted in 2001 don't we?

- Despite completely lacking fitness going into 2005, he regained form toward the end of the year and was our best performed in the finals. Including BOG for Geelong in the losing final to the Swans, in Sydney.

- He has for a long time now shown an inclination to play his best football in finals and big games.

- He is a 'contested' player, in that he has always been one to get his own ball, get clearances, lay tackles, put his head over the ball. These are not the attributes of a player who only looks good in a good team.


If there was ever a player to earn the front running tag, or the only plays well in a good team tag, despite having an abundance of natural talent, it would be Nick Dal Santo. To follow your method of hastily juxtaposing formline and year, we can see that Nick's best years were arguably in 2004 and 2005, when the Saints were a top outfit. Since those years, it has become fairly clear that he (a) doesn't perform in big games, and (b), doesn't cope well with a bit of attention.

And I won't even bother with the Des Headland thing. That was really lame.

 

[jimmy.h]

Kelly only played 13 games in '04, and was nowhere near as good as Bartel, Corey or even Ling, so that's complete rubbish.

As has been said, when Kelly broke his leg he had progressed at a faster rate than Bartel, Ablett and Johnson. At that stage of the season Bartel was struggling to get a game and Kelly was in our top 3 midfielders so I'm not sure how you could make the argument that he was "nowhere near as good as Bartel".

In fact I remeber after the PF loss to Brisbane someone (Michael Turner perhaps?) saying that if Kelly had been out there the cats might have won. Whilst the comment is nonsense, it shows just how highly Kelly was regarded by Geelong until his injury.

I'm not claiming Kelly is better than Dal but to dismiss the ability that he showed before his injury is laughable.

Geelong was pretty good in '04 and '05, ordinary in '06 and good again in '07 and '08... Hmm... I wonder which year James Kelly was so ordinary that Geelong tried to pawn him off for a 2nd round pick and couldn't find any takers... Oh, that'd be 2006, the one bad year Geelong has had in the last 5.

Nearly everyone to play for Geelong in 2006 was terrible. Mooney, Steve Johnson, Mackie all looked like they weren't AFL material. The reason Kelly was trade bait is he (like Johnson) was actually considered to be worth something due to his level of potential.

Given the other player we offered to clubs at the end of 06 went on to be the best small forward in the comp in 07, I'm not sure how much worth you can give to Geelong's actions at the time.

 

[gocats88]

so is nick dal santo still heads and shoulders above kelly or is it starting to look more even

 

[GordonGecko]

James Kelly is far superior.

Has the class, consistency and the heart of a champion.

Dal Santo is, has been and always will be a vanilla outside midfielder with a nice left boot who you would not like to go to war with come the last day in September.

The Leon Davis of St Kilda.

 

[AxelFoley]

James Kelly is far superior.

Has the class, consistency and the heart of a champion.

Dal Santo is, has been and always will be a vanilla outside midfielder with a nice left boot who you would not like to go to war with come the last day in September.

The Leon Davis of St Kilda.

Terrible assessment. Didnt watch much of the game on Sunday?? (be it against Port).

Dal Santo easily for me...

 

[Donakebab]

Kelly has come on massively, but I still feel Dal has more runs on the board. Different kind of players though so meh.

 

[GordonGecko]

Terrible assessment. Didnt watch much of the game on Sunday?? (be it against Port).

Dal Santo easily for me...

I gauge the worth of a player in big games against quality opposition.

Dal can be a flat track bully all he wants.

Saw all I needed to in last years Grand Finals.

 

[The Finger]

I gauge the worth of a player in big games against quality opposition.

Dal can be a flat track bully all he wants.

Saw all I needed to in last years Grand Finals.

Didnt DalSanto have 30 in the the replay with a bung leg?

 

[Donakebab]

29, a goal, 6 tackles, not fantastic but yeah one of the only half decent players. Has a fairly decent finals record and one of the only Saints to stand up this year during their slump this year.

 

[GordonGecko]

Didnt DalSanto have 30 in the the replay with a bung leg?

This is what makes me laugh.

Stats are great but they do not highlight stutter steps, not committing to contests and a half efforts.

A player who picks and chooses Which contests he wants to commit to.

Kelly is a warrior.

 

[pebblestone]

Dal Santo a more skilled player than Kelly? Probably.
Kelly harder at it and more aggressive? Definitely.

I will take a slightly less skillful (and I think kelly is only slightly less skillful) player who works his guts out, throws himself at every contest and follows up every time.

Dal Santo does none of those with enough regularity.

Yes inside type mid vs outside type mid, but for me it is Kelly every day of the week. Effort will often make up for other slight deficiencies, but a lack of effort just leaves you short.

 

[STC]

Tough to compare because they're not very similar players, but I definitely would prefer Kelly, much more versatile, courageous, hard at it and even consistent. Kelly can play on an opposition forward in defence too (ask Stephen Milne if he's any good)

 

[Churros]

This is what makes me laugh.

Stats are great but they do not highlight stutter steps, not committing to contests and a half efforts.

A player who picks and chooses Which contests he wants to commit to.

Kelly is a warrior.

Agree with you. Probably one of my favourite players

Hey haters! Who is the #1 tackler in the comp?

Who had 27 tackles combined in his last two games, despite a leg injury beforehand?

Who goes hard at the ball EVERY single game?

Who racks up 20+ disposals in a bad game?

Who is ranked in the top 5 of Geelong's players, with the amount of handballs, amount of disposals and amount of tackles?

Who can play anywhere on the field and succeed? This person has played as a ruckman, defender, midfielder and forward at separate times this year, and is yet to have a bad game.


The answer to all the question is James Kelly

He has a huge impact on our side. He has won us matches. Yet Dal Santo's talent can't even lift his team into the top 8 I'll take Kelly any day.

 

[Donakebab]

The only hate currently seems to be towards Dal Santo, mainly from yourself.

Your post stinks, lol @ Kelly the ruckman and his massive game high of 1 HO and career total of 14. Epic.

 

[Churros]

The only hate currently seems to be towards Dal Santo, mainly from yourself.

Your post stinks, lol @ Kelly the ruckman and his massive game high of 1 HO and career total of 14. Epic.

Never said anything dissing Dal Santo at all. I'm actually a fan. All I said was that he wasn't able to lift his team up into the top 8.

Your post was crap too, because it was meant to direct the finger at someone with absolutely no evidence to back it up. All I was doing was praising Kelly, but I entertain the thought and willingly await the day you tell me how I indicated that I hate Dal Santo and for whatever reason you accused me of so doing.

Oh, and in case you were only looking at my posts and ignoring everyone else's, there's been a lot more Kelly hate. But excuse me for sticking up for one of my favourite players. I don't know. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

I thought that ruck effort was pretty fair for someone who almost never plays there. It's usually in the middle or down back for him and has been for almost a decade. But whatever. I'm happier with #1 tackler in the comp and consistent performances. You might not agree, but that's what I think.

 

[TBoyleSuperstar]

For me, Kelly comfortably. Can play as both an inside and outside mid, has been great as a tagger and in 2008 was a fantastic back pocket replacing Hunt.

Dal is a wonderful user of the footy, a great mid, but I think Kelly offers you more as an overall package.