Myth; Tendulkar hasn't performed against Australia

[Dr Pangloss]

Hi Folks, this is my first time posting in a non-footy thread. Please forgive me if i breach any conventions of the board.

In the thread covering the most recent one day game between the aussies and india, I came across a few posts expressing doubts over Sachin's performance against the Aussies. I've seen so much cricket over and my gut response was that his performances have been excellent against the Aussies. So I did a quick dig around on Cricinfo's excellent statsguru to find out how he has fared against the world's best side in his 20 year career.

In test matches (29 of them) against Australia, he averages 56.08 with 10 centuries and close to 3000 runs. That is astonishing. What's more, this is higher than his career average of 54.6.

Ah, but he must make most of his runs in India? No, in fact his average against the aussies in Australia is 58.53 over 16 test matches.

In one-day matches, his average against Australia is 46.79 against a career average of 44.59.

The best do their best against the best.

I have run out of time, but it would be interesting to see how well other world-class batsmen have fared against the aussies. From India, VVS Laxman and Dravid have done alright. From England, Michael Vaughan always batted out of his skin against the Aussies, likewise Mahela Jayawardena of Sri Lanka.

What do you think? Is my analysis too shallow to bust this myth?

 

[Camps05]

I think this myth - if it even exists - is brought on by his massive choke in the world cup final against us. Very soft dismissal.

Fair or not, people remember the big games the most. And he failed.

 

[Alpha1]

A typical response above, fact is Sachin is a legend and he loves playing the Aussies. Like the op has said in his 20 years in cricket (that in itself is amazing) Australia have been the best side by a distance and he has always performed against them when they have had their great players. Fact is the that a lot of Australian fan boys have no idea of anything beyond their little world.

 

[Camps05]

A typical response above, fact is Sachin is a legend and he loves playing the Aussies. Like the op has said in his 20 years in cricket (that in itself is amazing) Australia have been the best side by a distance and he has always performed against them when they have had their great players. Fact is the that a lot of Australian fan boys have no idea of anything beyond their little world.

Typical response how? I never stated my feelings on the guy, I just stated on if there was indeed a myth, that the world cup final could be the reason behind it.

I personally think the guy is obviously top 10 batsmen of all time and always know that when we play him, we have to get him out early or game over. Hes a legend no doubt.

Next time, learn to read.. and dont make assumptions.

 

[Kim Hagdorn]

He's a gun, almost as good as Ponting.

 

[TorresIsGod]

... and Ponting is almost as good as Hodge.

 

[Cooldude]

I'm not a big fan of stats, but if you look at his stats against Aus in all forms of the game home and away, you see someone who performs. Particularly with all the ridiculous lbw decisions he's gotten over the years everytime he's toured here

Chennai 155, Sharjah, 3rd Test 2001, last VB series India had here. The man's proven time and time again that he performs. Didn't score in one World Cup final, so what?

 

[TorresIsGod]

I'm not a big fan of stats, but if you look at his stats against Aus in all forms of the game home and away, you see someone who performs. Particularly with all the ridiculous lbw decisions he's gotten over the years everytime he's toured here

Chennai 155, Sharjah, 3rd Test 2001, last VB series India had here. The man's proven time and time again that he performs. Didn't score in one World Cup final, so what?

The problem is Cooldude, all the 'Australian sporting fans' watched the WC Final, they see some bloke who is supposed to be the worlds premier batsman fail in the big game, a soft dismissal at that, while our captain and our best batsman plunders 144* in the same match.

These aren't real cricket fans, but fans who just jumped on because Australia had the chance to win something.

They all remember that, and that's where the myth (which should be busted by now) comes from and will always linger around unfortunately.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

The are no myths so far as Tendulkar is concerned, a great player. The only thing that used to annoy me is when people rated him ahead of Lara, and IMHO, I just couldn't see it.

 

[Cap]

I don't believe anyone suggested he hadn't performed against Australia,this thread is the first suggestion I have ever heard of the like.

Tendulkar lifts a notch playing Australia, everyone knows that, but like every good player your judged on the big games, another nothing ODI is hardly a big game

 

[Dr Pangloss]

The problem is Cooldude, all the 'Australian sporting fans' watched the WC Final, they see some bloke who is supposed to be the worlds premier batsman fail in the big game, a soft dismissal at that, while our captain and our best batsman plunders 144* in the same match.

These aren't real cricket fans, but fans who just jumped on because Australia had the chance to win something.

They all remember that, and that's where the myth (which should be busted by now) comes from and will always linger around unfortunately.

Good point there. I think a contributing factor maybe that Sachin doesn't play the 20/20 format. Frankly I think this is the right thing, and that Ponting should do the same to prolong his career.

 

[ILY Leonard]

who doesn't reckon he performs against australia? maybs they were talking about this series alone where he did nothing in the first 4 games.

 

[Dr Pangloss]

who doesn't reckon he performs against australia? maybs they were talking about this series alone where he did nothing in the first 4 games.

A few posters in other threads, whose opinions I wrongly assumed to be representative of all cricket followers.

 

[Santana]

Thread Fail

 

[Alpha1]

Thread Fail

Why?

 

[Dr Pangloss]

Thread Fail

According To Terry Pratchett, The Use Of Capital Letters Bestows Upon An Opinion Greater Validity Than It Deserves.

 

[Alpha1]

According To Terry Pratchett, The Use Of Capital Letters Bestows Upon An Opinion Greater Validity Than It Deserves.

I Did Not Know ThaT.

 

[jo172]

While I agree with the general premise, I'd wager that Tendaulkar's average against Australia in Australia is significantly lower than his career average (as with most players of the moder era). This is what contributes to this perception IMO as rightly or wrongly our matches in India will never get the equivalent attention of say Boxing Day.

 

[Alpha1]

While I agree with the general premise, I'd wager that Tendaulkar's average against Australia in Australia is significantly lower than his career average (as with most players of the moder era). This is what contributes to this perception IMO as rightly or wrongly our matches in India will never get the equivalent attention of say Boxing Day.

I highly doubt that, I think Sachin's average in Australia over the last 20 years would be higher that his overall average. He has also copped a lot of dodgy decisions in Australia over the decades. That is why he is the greatest player of our generation. He had to face the best team of the modern era over this whole career.

 

[Dr Pangloss]

While I agree with the general premise, I'd wager that Tendaulkar's average against Australia in Australia is significantly lower than his career average (as with most players of the moder era). This is what contributes to this perception IMO as rightly or wrongly our matches in India will never get the equivalent attention of say Boxing Day.

I thought this might be the case as well, but I think that I included his average in Australia, which in test matches is significantly higher than his career average.

I remember his centuries at Perth and Sydney in the 1991/92 series. Merv is reported to have said to Allan Border 'This little prick's going to make more runs than you AB'. I was amazed at how ballsy he was, against a fierce aussie attack featuring Merv, Bruce Reid (or Breece Rude as Bill calls him) and McDermott. So my anecdotal recollections of him are confirmed by the statistics. Indeed, his average against Australia in Australia is higher than his average against them in India.

He's also only the second batsman (since Jack Hobbes) to ton up 10 times against Australia.

 

[Alpha1]

I remember that first tour for his to Australia I think he was only 18, he made a 148 not out at the SCG and I was like so what. I want to see this kid handle Perth which in those days was the fastest track in the world. This kid came out there and took the Aussie attack apart, just blew me away. But he has always had a ton of courage remember him batting without a helmet when he was 16 against Younis, Akram and Imran in Pakistan, and boy did they give it to him. He copped a broken nose, I think it was his first or second test match he only made 20. But I remember a interview with Akram and he said that Imran told them to go after him, they were shocked and amazed when with a broken nose he continued to bat, although he got out a few overs later. Akram said that they had just bowled to a kid who was going to become a legend.

 

[Cousin Jed]

 

[Power King]

Never heard of this myth and obviously don't agree with it if it exists.

 

[Cooldude]

While I agree with the general premise, I'd wager that Tendaulkar's average against Australia in Australia is significantly lower than his career average (as with most players of the moder era). This is what contributes to this perception IMO as rightly or wrongly our matches in India will never get the equivalent attention of say Boxing Day.

Don't think that's even correct. He averages high 50s in Australia, and that's amazing considering there's always some serious outrage in the media about the lbw decisions he cops in Australia. Happens every tour. Some of the lbws he get in this country are just disgraceful

 

[Alpha1]

Here is another article on his stats against Australia this in the ODI form of the game http://www.cricinfo.com/indvaus2009/content/current/story/433228.html and I agree with cooldude some of the shocking decisions he has copped in Australia make what he has does even more amazing.