Oppo Camp Non-Essendon Thread X

[Doss]

In some cases, it is their identity.

And it's immensely crippling for them.

 

[raskolnikov]

As a landlord whose meth addicted tenant just destroyed my house to the tune of 20,000 worth of damages I have no sympathy for them.

 

[Nifft]

In some cases, it is their identity.

And it's immensely crippling for them.

As Old Man Fletch said, thanks for sharing Doss. I have a couple of family members that are affected, and also have a good friend whose wife has it so badly that she had shock therapy, which unfortunately hasn't helped.

 

[Nifft]

I don't think addiction is a disease.

As Doss touched on, people are definitely more predisposed to particular things due to their genetic makeup or life experiences.

However I think that ultimately, every able minded person has the responsibility for their own decisions and actions.

I know two brothers who both had a really unpleasant upbringing. Born within a year of each other, both suffered the same horrors and social injustices; both of the same background and genetic makeup.

One chose to wallow in self pity and to make stupid decisions that led to making his life even worse.

The other acknowledges that he's been dealt a bad hand, but is conscious that he still controls his own life now. He focuses on what he can do to make a situation better; how he can improve his life. He's now married, has a well paid and stable job, and is a model citizen.

The tl;dr of it: I'm not a fan of people making excuses for themselves. Take responsibility for your own life.

I get where you're coming from, but I don't think it's that cut and dry. Mental illness is still very much misunderstood in society. We can accept and make allowances for people who are physically disabled, because we can easily see how they're affected, it's not usually hidden. It's not that easy with a mental illness.

I'm not sure what drives people, but there are plenty of able-bodied/minded people that also don't achieve in life. Obviously part of a person's makeup determines how "driven" they are, and this can be separate to anything else that affects them. Which is why we see some people fail to achieve even though they seem to have it all, and yet others can excel under duress.

 

[Harlequin]

The other element here is, when people allow themselves to be defined by an illness or handicap they have, and make little to no effort to fix things that are eminently fixable.

My own mother is a depression sufferer and it becomes the excuse for all manner of self destructive behaviour- "can't help it".

It's eminently harrowing for her to live through but, looking on, it can be simultaneously, as her son, saddening and immensely frustrating.

Seeing someone you love go through this is so bloody hard. My eldest son also suffers depression and there are times I wait for the worst of news.

Depression effects all. My youngest son misses his brother for no other reason that he wants to have a kick of the footy.

Your comment about being an excuse for all manner of destructive behaviour struck a cord. I guess in a lot of ways I make excuses for my son.

 

[Old Campaigner]

I don't think addiction is a disease.

As Doss touched on, people are definitely more predisposed to particular things due to their genetic makeup or life experiences.

However I think that ultimately, every able minded person has the responsibility for their own decisions and actions.

I know two brothers who both had a really unpleasant upbringing. Born within a year of each other, both suffered the same horrors and social injustices; both of the same background and genetic makeup.

One chose to wallow in self pity and to make stupid decisions that led to making his life even worse.

The other acknowledges that he's been dealt a bad hand, but is conscious that he still controls his own life now. He focuses on what he can do to make a situation better; how he can improve his life. He's now married, has a well paid and stable job, and is a model citizen.

The tl;dr of it: I'm not a fan of people making excuses for themselves. Take responsibility for your own life.

People have very little control over their reactions when dealing with shit like mental health issues or family breakdown. The idea of a rational actor who can think their way out of even the most distressing situations is wrong outside of deluded libertarian fantasies. As with all things there is a spectrum of responses, due to luck or individual psyche or personal situations, so you do get scenarios like the one you describe where two people exposed to the same thing end up taking different paths. However, that attitude that all someone has to do is stop pitying them-selves, take control, get some sun on them and get some exercise is reductionist, unhelpful and in some cases actively harmful to people.

 

[Old man fletch]

People have very little control over their reactions when dealing with shit like mental health issues or family breakdown. The idea of a rational actor who can think their way out of even the most distressing situations is wrong outside of deluded libertarian fantasies. As with all things there is a spectrum of responses, due to luck or individual psyche or personal situations, so you do get scenarios like the one you describe where two people exposed to the same thing end up taking different paths. However, that attitude that all someone has to do is stop pitying them-selves, take control, get some sun on them and get some exercise is reductionist, unhelpful and in some cases actively harmful to people.

Well thought out discussion in the past page or so.

The bold is what would help a lot of people suffering from depression, but agree 100%. It's not that simple for them, otherwise they'd obviously do it themselves

 

[Phone]

the other aspect is that clearly being in an AFL environment on AFL wages was not good for Garlett, but do you really expect him to pre-emptively make that decision.

 

[raskolnikov]

the other aspect is that clearly being in an AFL environment on AFL wages was not good for Garlett, but do you really expect him to pre-emptively make that decision.

Probably. People make decisions and career choices all the time based on weighing up the variables and deciding what the right course of action would be.

 

[Old Campaigner]

I have pretty different views on "mental illness" to most, particularly depression.

I'm happy to agree to disagree.

Why? It is a well researched field and clinical psychologists have a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't. Psychology/mental illness (like any other science) isn't something people get to have 'views' or 'opinions' on. There are researched, verified facts and there is bullshit.

 

[Old Campaigner]

Sure, a few changes such as lifestyle, eating habits, exercise etc can make a big difference to some people. But it doesn't mean that every sufferer can drag themselves out of a cycle of depression in a similar way, especially when some of the symptoms can act as a barrier to self-initiated change. There are many different subsets of depression, caused by different things, with different symptoms and best treated using a range of methods. Approaching all cases with the solution that helped you as if it is the only solution is dangerous and dumb.

 

[Nifft]

My views differ in how people can deal with it, not its existence

I agree it's not cut and dry. Everyone can benefit from clean living (removing additives, increasing exercise etc), but some people do need medication and therapy. Unfortunately there are too many people with a vested interest, such as pharmaceutical companies, who are more interested in your money than your health.

Interesting study a while ago showed that kids with ADHD have smaller brains. Then someone found that kids taking ADHD medicine Ritalin appeared to have brain shrinkage, so it must be the medication. Of course the big pharma company denied this (as they get billions from sales) and the issue has been clouded so there's no definite answer.

I think the moral is to find what works best, but definitely look at cleaner and healthier living first before going for medication.

 

[VelvetSledge]

Geelong with a major announcement at 2.30pm.

New major sponsor perhaps? Considering Ford are leaving Australia.

 

[Stopher]

Geelong with a major announcement at 2.30pm.

New major sponsor perhaps? Considering Ford are leaving Australia.

Bomber to coach again?

 

[Old Campaigner]

I agree it's not cut and dry. Everyone can benefit from clean living (removing additives, increasing exercise etc), but some people do need medication and therapy. Unfortunately there are too many people with a vested interest, such as pharmaceutical companies, who are more interested in your money than your health.

Interesting study a while ago showed that kids with ADHD have smaller brains. Then someone found that kids taking ADHD medicine Ritalin appeared to have brain shrinkage, so it must be the medication. Of course the big pharma company denied this (as they get billions from sales) and the issue has been clouded so there's no definite answer.

I think the moral is to find what works best, but definitely look at cleaner and healthier living first before going for medication.

A good shrink will work up from the least invasive treatment (starting at something like a simple counselling session working all the way up to hardcore meds and ECT) to find the best possible option with the least side effects. But because there is such a number of ways mental illness can present it is really important to approach it with a very open mind; as mentioned earlier telling someone that is caught in its grips that the reason they are depressed is because they are not 'living clean' or taking enough responsibility for their own lives can be seriously counterproductive, and is an example of society's common misunderstanding of depression and mental illness in general.

 

[Kronos]

Geelong with a major announcement at 2.30pm.

New major sponsor perhaps? Considering Ford are leaving Australia.

Chappy doing a Lebron

 

[Old Campaigner]

Geelong with a major announcement at 2.30pm.

New major sponsor perhaps? Considering Ford are leaving Australia.

Neil Balme apparently
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/neil-balme-joins-collingwood-20141110-11jq93.html

 

[Pevers-Legend]

Neil Balme apparently
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/neil-balme-joins-collingwood-20141110-11jq93.html

Is Eddie going to pass on the money he got from GC to the Cats?

 

[Doss]

Is Eddie going to pass on the money he got from GC to the Cats?

Not a chance. I hope Geelong raise hell about Collingwood poaching him just to ram home his hypocrisy too.

 

[Yoda_]

Feeling like we may have a similar situation to that of the Demons after looking at the Dogs deli stings this off season.

 

[Doss]

Dogs deli stings, Yoda_?

Do tell me more about this, sounds fascinating!

Sorry, don't mind me. Reckon the Dogs are headed for some real pain, eh?

 

[Yoda_]

Dogs deli stings, Yoda_?

Do tell me more about this, sounds fascinating!

Sorry, don't mind me. Reckon the Dogs are headed for some real pain, eh?

Auto correcting my rushed typing.



Maybe not AS bad as what Melbourne has endured. They, like Melbourne have put all there eggs in the current young group.

 

[yaco55]

Balme's appointment indicate that he had a falling out with Malthouse. Seeing that the other major players are still at Collingwood.

 

[Kong]

Yeah I have a good feeling about Hinkley. A very good one.

My pick would be Hinkley, but I don't think it will happen.

H2F predicted Knights, I predicted Hinkley.

 

[Doss]

H2F predicted Knights, I predicted Hinkley.

And now your keenness to work out the searching old posts problem makes sense!