News Official Carlton Delistings 2015

[La Dispute]

Shiels and Duryea aren't super talented players though. Just good solid role players who have developed in the best football system in the AFL.

Holman may not be a star but he has qualities which are needed in a developing side with his hardness, kicking skills and perseverance.

I wonder what Bolton and SOS' view on Graham is?

 

[thylacine60]

It better be positive. Or me and Snoozer will be down there looking for someone to talk us out of cancelling our membership. Pretty sure..........

 

[P_Crippy]

There will be non-members ringing and telling them they don't want to join.

 

[The Bunyip]

Carlton FC is entering unchartered territory in regards to embracing the draft and trade options. So with this rebuild we are going to question some more decisions which are going to be made over the next couple of years.
What we might be overlooking is that you didn't have to be an A grader to get given a game at the Blues, and the reality is probably close to 50% of our list would not get on another AFL list.
What we consider to be a player with potential May in fact only be a VFL grade player.
I say let SOS shape this list as I am sure so far he has been very aggressive and seems to be a smooth operator., 4 picks inside top 20 is a fantastic start.
As for Bolton, very early days but have faith that the club is finally doing things the right way.
It comes down to being able to identify real talent, developed talent and establishing a good strong culture that every player buys in to.

This is without doubt the best comment I've read for some time. Change is imminent, change that us diehards have never seen before. But we're at the bottom of the ladder with the worst AFL list by a country mile. Maybe hereafter we need to compare our players to other lists with a view to whether they'd get a game at another AFL club, rather than looking at them through a Northern Blues / Carlton prism?In all honesty is Holman worth persisting with? Possibly but not definitely. Would that improve be good enough for him to play in a top side, I'd say definitely not & I reckon that's the rationale behind the clubs decision, tough as it may seem to some. Maybe we should aspire to be a top side in every way from this point onward.

 

[Prem17]

What a crock of s**t !!

He's as soft as butter if that is his response.

And if that is true, then why didn't we punt him years ago because this injury or illness would not have been a recent revelation ??

It's true Sheik - he can't play with a pulled heart muscle.
Who cares why he's gone - just rejoice in the fact that he has!

 

[Prem17]

Foster and Smith would want to show something this year.

Holman is 10 times better than Smith - and that is coming from someone that backed him in when he was drafted (Smith).

 

[mediumsizered]

Holman is 10 times better than Smith - and that is coming from someone that backed him in when he was drafted (Smith).

If Smith wants it badly enough, he will be so much better than Holman will ever be. My fear is he doesn't want it badly enough.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

If Smith wants it badly enough, he will be so much better than Holman will ever be. My fear is he doesn't want it badly enough.

Perhaps Smith will improve without Yarran's bad influence

 

[Iamcarlton]

It better be positive. Or me and Snoozer will be down there looking for someone to talk us out of cancelling our membership. Pretty sure..........

That's childish I'm not a fan either of chopping players holman and giles who obviously do have some talent and have not been given a chance to fully see how good they can be by letting them go after just 2 seasons, in which the first season for most rookies is simply a learning experience .
But best to reserve our judgment on Silvagni Bolton and the club after the savage cuts to the list for a couple of years and see where we stand then . I'm tipping we will be a long way from the bottom of the ladder .
Get behind them and support no matter what not threaten to rip your membership up .
Go Blues!!

 

[Iamcarlton]

Love

Carlton FC is entering unchartered territory in regards to embracing the draft and trade options. So with this rebuild we are going to question some more decisions which are going to be made over the next couple of years.
What we might be overlooking is that you didn't have to be an A grader to get given a game at the Blues, and the reality is probably close to 50% of our list would not get on another AFL list.
What we consider to be a player with potential May in fact only be a VFL grade player.
I say let SOS shape this list as I am sure so far he has been very aggressive and seems to be a smooth operator., 4 picks inside top 20 is a fantastic start.
As for Bolton, very early days but have faith that the club is finally doing things the right way.
It comes down to being able to identify real talent, developed talent and establishing a good strong culture that every player buys in to.

Love your post and you are exactly right however not a fan of chopping guys after just 2 years on a list unless it's totally obvious they are not up to it or . Which is not the case with Holman he was very raw in his first year and showed significant improvement this year and I'm quite sure that improvement will continue if he ends up at another club .
Doesn't make sense to cut a guy where the ceiling on his or any players improvement has certainly not been reached compared to a Jones where you could be confident in saying there's no more or minimul improvement to be made there .
But as posted in another message should hold fire and as you've suggested on criticism of the club for a couple of years until we see where we sit then .
Cheers .

 

[Aphrodite]

That's childish I'm not a fan either of chopping players holman and giles who obviously do have some talent and have not been given a chance to fully see how good they can be by letting them go after just 2 seasons, in which the first season for most rookies is simply a learning experience .
But best to reserve our judgment on Silvagni Bolton and the club after the savage cuts to the list for a couple of years and see where we stand then . I'm tipping we will be a long way from the bottom of the ladder .
Get behind them and support no matter what not threaten to rip your membership up .
Go Blues!!

Whoooosh

 

[La Dispute]

You want to give every player a chance but I reckon Smith will be one of the first cut next year.

He's got good endeavour and he seems like a great kid but he's a shocking kick, doesn't get enough of it, doesn't do enough with it and he's not a natural crumbing forward; the position we'd like him to play.

 

[Azul]

I thought Smith was a small defender in U18s?

Clem was thrown in too early by Malthouse, I reckon. If we're judging him by 2015 form, well I wouldn't have expected him to play at all.

 

[BlueTongue]

This is without doubt the best comment I've read for some time. Change is imminent, change that us diehards have never seen before. But we're at the bottom of the ladder with the worst AFL list by a country mile. Maybe hereafter we need to compare our players to other lists with a view to whether they'd get a game at another AFL club, rather than looking at them through a Northern Blues / Carlton prism?In all honesty is Holman worth persisting with? Possibly but not definitely. Would that improve be good enough for him to play in a top side, I'd say definitely not & I reckon that's the rationale behind the clubs decision, tough as it may seem to some. Maybe we should aspire to be a top side in every way from this point onward.

This is the part that annoys me the most. In the limited game time he had, he showed something, and like one tweeter said, he showed more ticker than a few still on our list. I thought he was worth another contract at least, but the club have been careless with contracts like Warnock, so unfortunately it looks like Holman & Walsh have to bare his cross. We as the General Public don't know them enough to evaluate their attitudes, and they may have been real head-cases, but football-wise they look to have been hard-done by. Anyway, I've moved on as we can't undo what's done.

 

[Lace_Out]

Nick Holman has apparently been reduced to this now...


Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

 

[PhatHQ]

Left foot was a weapon.. but we actually didn't see the best of his kicking at AFL level.

Turning circle and agility was pretty poor. Critisised for not enough intensity once the ball hit the deck.

Reasonable contested mark. Never really got a proper crack at it with an extended run of games. Then again didn't really do himself many favours in the games he did get. Who knows in a different system, different development etc he may have made it. Could be worth a rookie spot at another club if they think they see something in him.

Hi. I'm after a little more inside information on Watson if anyone is interested.
I've been banging the Watson drum on the Hawks page & I would be better served banging my head on a brick wall.... As I see it from the outside he has been stitched up in his development & never really given a fair crack especially under Mick.
He has said himself that he hasn't worked hard enough so you would have to think that there is improvement to be made; not necessarily in his skill set as I see it but, as I read earlier a reference to the Titanic, his agility, speed ( I would look at burst speed as a forward) & second efforts are all things that CAN be trained. From what limited exposure I've had watching him he looks a ripper & from what I've been reading he has a high ceiling based on his potential. I guess what I'm asking is does he have a club first attitude & is it just me that can see what this kid has to offer? There isn't a lot of discussion on him on this thread.... But you guys have probably had a Watson thread every year
I did preach the speed & agility thing & told a guy to compare player profiles to tex walker, Tom Hawkins, Trav Cloke & Anthony Rocca....
Am I kidding myself as to this guys capabilities???
Cheers

EDIT:
This was my reply to a fellow Hawks supporter on why the Hawks should go for Watson... It was an early morning answer...
**

basically I see Watson as have beencompletely under developed by Carlton & what they have conditioned him for has made him slow & stagnant. Here are a couple of player profile names to look up & compare sizes to :
Tex walker
Travis Cloke
Tom Hawkins
Anthony Rocca
I think that the Hawks would love to have a big 'power forward' that gives them that chop out kick, that has been a staple of the fwd line for a few years, that can hold his ground & take a contested mark. Buddy & roughy were earmarked as the big forward but.... Franklin couldn't really mark over head but his athleticism more than made up for his short comings & Rough is more a lead up/ pinpointed target, who I think needs to be a fwd pocket that rotates through the midfield as his best work is around the ground.
So... In in the true sense of a power fwd like the 4 mentioned above I believe that with a massive overhaul of the conditioning training for Watson he could play that role given a preseason under Hawthorn to see if that is possible. He would be sprint training & agility training every time he is not doing structural work & drop if possible 3-5kg to help his burst speed. He already has a great thumping kick & a strong overhead/contested mark so that's where I see his change starting.
Does that warrent a senior spot??? I would take that risk, does it warrent a rookie spot??? Absolutely! Given a rookie spot he has a preseason to develop & could be the nominated rookie to start the year or he will get the preseason & half a season to become the player I think he can be when the est of the rookies are allowed to play senior footy.
Basically a 1 year deal gets him & gets him cheep. Stockpiling salary cap is happening to accomodate 1 if not 2 guns next season which is why I think there will be 3 taken in the draft only & the rest of the list will be compiled of minimum wage, ready made players. So... Sorry mate it's a kind why/how/why.. As far as having a tilt again next year I think the best possible list is topped with AFL ready players & not 17/18 year old kids as that have no value, next season, on filling a list with kids that are NOT going to play anyway in aiding in 4 in a row. & that's it why I think wattson gets a look in & we top our list with so called spuds to go again next year. I hope it all makes some sense as I think I've just had a mini meltdown & need a coffee! Cheers mate

 

[Navy Cream]

Nick Holman has apparently been reduced to this now...
View attachment 189972

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

Gee Nick has aged!! The delisting was tough on him.
BTW- I kinda hoped we'd keep him. Good luck Nick and may your garden remain fruitful.

 

[Lace_Out]

So thems the green shoots of growth Juddy was on about. ..!

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[ShanDog]

Hi. I'm after a little more inside information on Watson if anyone is interested.
I've been banging the Watson drum on the Hawks page & I would be better served banging my head on a brick wall.... As I see it from the outside he has been stitched up in his development & never really given a fair crack especially under Mick.
He has said himself that he hasn't worked hard enough so you would have to think that there is improvement to be made; not necessarily in his skill set as I see it but, as I read earlier a reference to the Titanic, his agility, speed ( I would look at burst speed as a forward) & second efforts are all things that CAN be trained. From what limited exposure I've had watching him he looks a ripper & from what I've been reading he has a high ceiling based on his potential. I guess what I'm asking is does he have a club first attitude & is it just me that can see what this kid has to offer? There isn't a lot of discussion on him on this thread.... But you guys have probably had a Watson thread every year
I did preach the speed & agility thing & told a guy to compare player profiles to tex walker, Tom Hawkins, Trav Cloke & Anthony Rocca....
Am I kidding myself as to this guys capabilities???
Cheers

I'm going to take the path of only saying nice things about Watson:

He's a nice kick.

That's all.

 

[thylacine60]

Hi. I'm after a little more inside information on Watson if anyone is interested.
I've been banging the Watson drum on the Hawks page & I would be better served banging my head on a brick wall.... As I see it from the outside he has been stitched up in his development & never really given a fair crack especially under Mick.
He has said himself that he hasn't worked hard enough so you would have to think that there is improvement to be made; not necessarily in his skill set as I see it but, as I read earlier a reference to the Titanic, his agility, speed ( I would look at burst speed as a forward) & second efforts are all things that CAN be trained. From what limited exposure I've had watching him he looks a ripper & from what I've been reading he has a high ceiling based on his potential. I guess what I'm asking is does he have a club first attitude & is it just me that can see what this kid has to offer? There isn't a lot of discussion on him on this thread.... But you guys have probably had a Watson thread every year
I did preach the speed & agility thing & told a guy to compare player profiles to tex walker, Tom Hawkins, Trav Cloke & Anthony Rocca....
Am I kidding myself as to this guys capabilities???
Cheers

PM this to a poster called Cringle for the unbiased truth.

 

[Chalky Blues]

If Smith wants it badly enough, he will be so much better than Holman will ever be. My fear is he doesn't want it badly enough.

My fear is Smith will kick 50 goals and get kicked outer the club quick sticks!

 

[PhatHQ]

PM this to a poster called Cringle for the unbiased truth.

Cheers but I don't seem to be able to :/

 

[thylacine60]

Never mind, he'll find it here.

 

[PhatHQ]

Never mind, he'll find it here.

Cool. I'll edit my post... There is more!

 

[ferrisb]

Cool. I'll edit my post... There is more!

It's an interesting one, PHQ.

Watson I feel is a case of poor development and a player with serious limitations.

He was drafted as a CHB. He has the build for the position, but not the agility to play on modern forwards. He never got a good, consistent run at things and often only played when 1st choice KPD were injured, effectively throwing him to the wolves as key defender. His confidence I believe was shot early due to poor development.

Having said that I think he lacked game sense to make it as a backman. And I was not overly impressed with his one on one body positioning, so he wasn't even suited to play on the 'gorillas'.

About 18 months ago, we decided to trial him as a forward. He has played most of that time in the VFL, where he is a consistent but not dominant goal kicker. From reports, he has given his new position his all and has not dropped his head at training. I think the 'I could have got more out of myself' comment was PR - it sounds better than 'I just wasn't good enough'.

The rare times he has played up forward in the AFL, he has looked half decent although I don't think he is a natural forward. I think he spends much of the time watching the play. And it's not out of laziness, perhaps he doesn't know where to lead. I think he has to be fed the ball to be involved in the play.

He will never be a high output player. I think you get 10-12 touches a game. But he could kick a few goals from that. The one-trick forwards are not popular in modern footy.

He has a lovely, accurate (genuinely) 60m kick on him. So you just need to maximise that with players that deliver it onto his chest (he is a neat, but not brilliant mark).

Overall he has some tools, but I think is ultimately probably too limited to be successful at AFL. he is very one dimensional but I guess could flourish in the right team that can have accurate delivery, well drilled players that can bring him into the game and successful key forwards to the the pressure off him. Sounds that sounds nothing like hawthorn....