Business & Finance Owning stuff is nice

[Caesar]

But I still remain confident that some people, alot of people, like to present themselves as 'doing well' and it generally involves owning nice things - and in most cases, it's because they can afford to.

I'm sure you're right, particularly in western society which is theoretically meritocratic and we're trained to equate material wealth with personal worth. I guess people are just saying it's not the healthiest mentality.

You'd probably find Alain de Botton's book 'Status Anxiety' quite interesting.

 

[The Dice Man]

I apologise for my opinion, its becoming more and more obvious that it was taken way out of context.

But I still remain confident that some people, alot of people, like to present themselves as 'doing well' and it generally involves owning nice things - and in most cases, it's because they can afford to.

No its lame to think you buy possessions in order to make other people envy you. Classic example of the things you think you own owning you. Advertising owns you. You've lost yourself man.

Tell me... what can you play on your strat?

 

[Caesar]

I think its interesting that a lot of the criticism in this thread is of the things chaos chooses to buy, but not the implicit assumption that material wealth equates to personal success (which is the root cause of conspicuous consumption).

If you concede that financial worth is the measure of a person then it does seem slightly odd to criticise their desire to show it off. Perhaps it displays a degree of insecurity, but then we all seek the validation of our peers in one way or another.

 

[The Dice Man]

I think its interesting that a lot of the criticism in this thread is of the things chaos chooses to buy, but not the implicit assumption that material wealth equates to personal success (which is the root cause of conspicuous consumption).

If you concede that financial worth is the measure of a person then it does seem slightly odd to criticise their desire to show it off. Perhaps it displays a degree of insecurity, but then we all seek the validation of our peers in one way or another.

No I dont at all. It has nothing to do with a persons measure or value. To me happiness is a measure of success.

 

[checkraiseulite]

No I dont at all. It has nothing to do with a persons measure or value. To me happiness is a measure of success.

and what's a measure of happiness?

 

[The Dice Man]

Obviously owning more expensive useless shit than you.


Did I do it right?

 

[Poetic Justice]

I bought a strat to make think people I could play guitar.

Am I doing it right?

 

[bunsen burner]

I was going to make a similar thread to this the other day. I don't understand why people are so money driven and materialistic these days.

You have a house right? Maybe people who rent or live in a trailer park perceive you as being money driven and materialistic?

Wonder what toys you own and why you think you have hit the right level of materialism?

The way I see it if I turned my house into a million dollar mansion with the most expensive furniture and changed my car to a Ferrari would I be any happier?

Sure you would and you're kidding yourself if you don't think that you would. It's the exact same reason why you have a house in the first place - it makes you happier than renting or living in a trailer park.

I wonder if you ever buy lotto tickets? It would seem a person who can't be any happier has no use for a few million free dollars.

The answer is no I would feel exactly the same.

Seriously, get your hand off it. if someone came to you and said they would pay for an extension to your house for a theatre and games room with bar you'd be pretty damn happy with it.

Don't understand why people work rubbish hours/jobs to earn more money just to spend it on stuff they don't need.

I see, so you don't own stuff that you don't need? How many TVs you got? How many pairs of jeans you got?

You know some people have jobs they like and work 40 hours per week and get paid very well? Not everyone who has all the mod cons is a corporate ladder and money slave.

Maybe I'm in the wrong generation who knows.

Or maybe you just lack perspective.

 

[bunsen burner]

I bought a strat to make think people I could play guitar.

Am I doing it right?

You said you bought it to impress people. One would have thought you buy a fender because of one or a combination of you like the sound, you like the look, they have a reputation of making good guitars.

Buying it because you want your buddies to think you're successful is a bit lame.

 

[Scotland]

I've never understood the 'if I had a Ferrari would I be happier?' thing.

Ceteris paribus, I'd absolutely be happier than I am now with a Ferrari. Likewise I'm not unhappy living in the house I do, but I'd absolutely prefer to live in a waterfront mansion in Applecross. Doesn't mean I'd trade my friends/family/career/dog/etc. for said items.

Money doesn't buy happiness, but it affords opportunity.

 

[bunsen burner]

I've never understood the 'if I had a Ferrari would I be happier?' thing.

Ceteris paribus, I'd absolutely be happier than I am now with a Ferrari.

Therefore it makes you happier.

Likewise I'm not unhappy living in the house I do, but I'd absolutely prefer to live in a waterfront mansion in Applecross.

Therefore it makes you happier.

Seeing a theme yet?

 

[Scotland]

Maybe I wasn't clear.

What I don't understand is people who use the 'would I be happier with a Ferrari' thing to conclude that money = happiness. Money =/= happiness, but it's a big bloody help.

I could quit my job and go and work in some 3rd World country or do long stints of 12 hour days on a remote mine site and be able to buy more stuff, but that wouldn't make me happy.

 

[Falchoon]

The reason I asked is this (and I'm not necessarily accusing you of doing this):

Smart People: buy appreciating assets like shares and property

Dumb arses: they buy shit like nice cars, nice clothes, and depreciating consumer goods. Why a nice a car and nice clothes:

yes and no

smart people live, dumb people wait to live.

It's literally about finding a happy balance.

 

[bunsen burner]

Maybe I wasn't clear.

What I don't understand is people who use the 'would I be happier with a Ferrari' thing to conclude that money = happiness. Money =/= happiness, but it's a big bloody help.

I don't think I know anyone who thinks money = happiness.

The worst I see is small dick types who are competitive and think the person with the most toys wins, and more common people who need to keep up with the Joneses and are competitive in their little exclusive suburbs worlds. Often women are worse than the men.

I could quit my job and go and work in some 3rd World country or do long stints of 12 hour days on a remote mine site and be able to buy more stuff, but that wouldn't make me happy.

But no one is saying it would. Yourself and WCErevival has made some assumption that to get more you have to do some sort of sell out whether than be giving up lifestyle, friends, or doing some shit job.

This may be true for yourselves as individuals but you have both made assumptions about other people, ie "I don't understand why OTHER people....

You both seem to miss the point that it's generally relative. For you to get to where "rich person X with riverfront and fez" you have to sell out. But for this person maybe he's a supersmart trader or consultant and he's only doing what you guys are doing - except he make more money.

All I see from you guys is resentment in other people who have more.

 

[bunsen burner]

smart people live, dumb people wait to live.

That's funny because out of all the people I know with different levels of education and intelligence, smart people wait. Smart people are much more likely to be able to delay gratification.

You can live it up when your young without spending much money but try doing it when you're older. The older you get the more money you need to live a comfortable existence. And for most people that means some sort of sacrifice at some point and delayed gratification.

 

[Caesar]

No I dont at all. It has nothing to do with a persons measure or value. To me happiness is a measure of success.

A fine sentiment, if somewhat meaningless. Happiness is an entirely subjective and highly nebulous measure, which renders it useless as a yardstick for social evaluation. Most people seek to accumulate some degree of wealth or influence to afford themselves greater opportunities for happiness so therefore relative success at that endeavour tends to be the main measure.

A ostensibly meritocratic society assumes that the best people are capable of obtaining money and power if they desire it. It's therefore natural people wish to display their degree of success at this to demonstrate their worthiness to the rest of the community.

If you buy into capitalistic notions of meritocracy like bunny, there's a fair bit of cognitive dissonance in mocking someone for wishing to display their success under that system.

 

[WCErevival]

You have a house right? Maybe people who rent or live in a trailer park perceive you as being money driven and materialistic?

Wonder what toys you own and why you think you have hit the right level of materialism?

Yeah I have a unit in a good location. Never said anything about not living comfortable and within your means. Just not going overboard to the extent people do. I own one car.

Sure you would and you're kidding yourself if you don't think that you would. It's the exact same reason why you have a house in the first place - it makes you happier than renting or living in a trailer park.

Having a house is about having a place to live. Its a necessity. I used to rent but there are restrictions and people interfering with your personal space. I think most people would rather have their own home than borrow someone elses.

I wonder if you ever buy lotto tickets? It would seem a person who can't be any happier has no use for a few million free dollars.

I don't buy lotto. Also I never said I was overly happy. I said materialistic things wont improve my happiness.

Seriously, get your hand off it. if someone came to you and said they would pay for an extension to your house for a theatre and games room with bar you'd be pretty damn happy with it.

Why? I don't need either of those things. They wouldn't get used. Also not too sure I'd be comfortable taking money off a stranger for nothing.

I see, so you don't own stuff that you don't need? How many TVs you got? How many pairs of jeans you got?

I have what I need to get by. No I dont have 20 pairs of brand name jeans clogging up my closet.

You know some people have jobs they like and work 40 hours per week and get paid very well? Not everyone who has all the mod cons is a corporate ladder and money slave.

There is nothing wrong with getting paid well for something you like doing. My comment was more to do with things like FIFO. Guys giving up their jobs to chase the dollars. Watching their relationships die just to have that extra 100k.

The point I was making is that financial security isn't enough for most anymore. They think more money will solve all their problems. Its your family, friends, relationships, experiences that make your life what it is. Money will help to a degree but shouldn't be the be all and end all.

 

[bunsen burner]

Yeah I have a unit in a good location. Never said anything about not living comfortable and within your means. Just not going overboard to the extent people do. I own one car.

But why is where you draw the line the correct one?

A guy who lives in a trailer park thinks you are being a slave to money and materialism by buying a unit in a good location. In turn you think the guy who has a quarter acre block in Dalkeith is a slave to money and materialism.

What makes you think you have the right balance and others don't? And why do you assume people who have heaps more than you are compromising any more than you are? It just could be that they earn more more for the same effort and inconvenience.

Having a house is about having a place to live. Its a necessity. I used to rent but there are restrictions and people interfering with your personal space. I think most people would rather have their own home than borrow someone elses.

You don't seem to be able to see outside your own world. Here you are in a nice unit accusing people with big houses of being indulgent.

I said materialistic things wont improve my happiness.

Yet in the paragraph above you strongly imply buying a unit makes you happier. You're contradicting yourself.

Also not too sure I'd be comfortable taking money off a stranger for nothing.

Hypothetically if there were no strings attached you'd take it. Anyone who says they wouldn't is lying to themselves.

I have what I need to get by. No I dont have 20 pairs of brand name jeans clogging up my closet.

No, you have more than you need. Yet you're here preaching to others who are doing exactly what you're doing.

The point I was making is that financial security isn't enough for most anymore. They think more money will solve all their problems.

I've never met anyone who thinks this execpt for people who are on the bones of their arse.

Its your family, friends, relationships, experiences that make your life what it is. Money will help to a degree but shouldn't be the be all and end all.

That's quite obvious but the way you have made your point is "anyone who's loaded is money hungry, thinks money will solve their problems, and puts money in front of family and friends".

Essentially all you're doing is justifying to yourself that people who are more cashed up than you are somehow inferior.

 

[checkraiseulite]

 

[Poetic Justice]

So what makes you happy, bunsen?

My initial point was to imply that I chose better things sometimes because they're nice. Some times they serve a purpose. But perhaps my other guitars would be better serving me than choosing to buy a fender.

Sure, I said that it was to invoke envy, but all I was saying that I didn't want people to view me as living cheaply, because as a matter of fact I don't personally believe that I have to. Again, my choice. Whether it's right or wrong is subjective.

 

[WCErevival]

Bunsen I dont think you understand where I am coming from. I have no issues with people that earn a lot of money. If they are working and enjoying their life then good on them. I earn enough myself so I am not poor and am comfortable with where I am at.
What I don't understand is people that let money rule their life. Sacrificing their life just to have more. Like myself for example. I have enough to do everything I want to do now so why do I need more? People say to me why dont you go work up North and earn the big bucks. Why would I? I can live comfortably with what I'm on now because I dont waste it on materialistic junk and I have a much better work/lifestyle balance which I value more than the money itself.
Now if someone earns loads with little hours then that's great. Even more rewarding if you have worked your way up to that point. My posts aren't about those people.

 

[Poetic Justice]

But I suppose the question is, would you choose to buy a brand new nice couch a piece of shit because they do the same thing?

 

[bunsen burner]

My initial point was to imply that I chose better things sometimes because they're nice. Some times they serve a purpose. But perhaps my other guitars would be better serving me than choosing to buy a fender.

Dude, your initial point was you chose stuff to make others envious. You seem to regret those comments and are distancing yourself. This is a good thing.

But don't try and argue with me over your new stance.

 

[bunsen burner]

Bunsen I dont think you understand where I am coming from.

I agree with your whole premise I just don't think you're communicated it that well.

 

[Poetic Justice]

I've said several times that perhaps what I was saying didn't come across the way I meant it, so I can definitely argue with you over my stance.

I'm defending what I said because you're being a douche bag and trying to attack one sentence out of everything I've said.