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[Cold Sober]

Chasing info, does anyone know if STK Seb Ross has a relation who played VFL in the fifties, name was Noel or Norm Ross


Old man and uncle played country football with him late in his career and say he was brilliant.
Realise it's a long shot, thank you in advance.

 

[Yawkey way]

Game of thrones don't read if you haven't watched it spoiler below.


































I'm going to call that bastard Jon slow, is he ever going to get a leg over.

 

[bergholt]

I remember when parties had bipartisan positions on some issues, it appears that is largely a thing if the past. Adani who the hell thinks that's a viable proposition even excluding other factors, yet government appears intent on handing them a billion plus of our money WTF.

I reckon the problem is:

- the system says everyone should be employed
- so people need jobs
- government can't do much useful to create jobs
- (the public sector is rarely a solution because it's all white-collar jobs)
- so the private sector has to create jobs
- so if a company goes to the government and asks for money to make jobs, the government has to say yes

I don't know much about the Adani situation, looks bad to me, but I wonder if there would be any way for the government to actually spend that billion dollars on creating jobs in the middle of Queensland? If not, maybe it makes sense that they give it to Adani. From their perspective, some jobs are better than none.

 

[Yawkey way]

I reckon the problem is:

- the system says everyone should be employed
- so people need jobs
- government can't do much useful to create jobs
- (the public sector is rarely a solution because it's all white-collar jobs)
- so the private sector has to create jobs
- so if a company goes to the government and asks for money to make jobs, the government has to say yes

I don't know much about the Adani situation, looks bad to me, but I wonder if there would be any way for the government to actually spend that billion dollars on creating jobs in the middle of Queensland? If not, maybe it makes sense that they give it to Adani. From their perspective, some jobs are better than none.

From what I know of Adani their more likely to pocket our money and never turn a shovel than create jobs if that project swings on government funding then it's a no go. It's interesting that they can't seem to get finance in place and there is pretty much zero activity there for such a huge project.

This government under Abbott killed the car industry in some kind of deal with the Nationals. Despite what you hear the subsides to our car industry were modest compared to most other countries less than germany more than US and the jobs were quite productive around $100,000 per job compared to about $85,000 being the average. It also cost us the associated component parts manufacturers etc it really was a disaster still being felt .

We now have the distinction I think of being 1 of 2 or 3 G20 countries with no car industry, the skills that industry had are the exact ones we would need in a time of war for instance. Once that capacity is lost for example the production of tools and dyes for parts etc it's hard to get back.

If you use the argument that we just can't compete then what are we but an open cut mine and holiday destination, unless of course we want to work for a couple of dollars a day. Mutlinationals run the world they couldn't give a rats about people it's all about profit they have no morality or loyalty at all.

Free trade is a way to transfer more wealth to the wealthy, tarriffs were in fact a fair and resonable thing for countries to protect local industry and jobs. When all is said and sifted what did the Australian people get out of it a slight increase in agricultural exports?.

This is the sort of economic argument that helped get trump elected, make America great again, rip up nafta and other lousy deals and bring back jobs, no wonder people voted for him.

China is an interesting case they have pinched all our IP and at one point of the companies that had set up over there in joint ventures not one including mobs like BHP had been able to repatriate any profits, that was an admission made at a meeting between government and industry some time back.

I'm not really in favor of a bloated government sector but our utilities should never have been sold off. They were better run and the services were cheaper as there was no imperative to achieve higher and higher profits for shareholders.

I don't really know what the answer is but you won't find any joy in this country with free trade and open borders, nor will a big Australia do anything but lower our living standards and provide more consumers for business.

You can't get around the fact that we are the driest continent with poorest soil, they say Melbourne at current growth rates will be out of water in 10 years even with the desal plant.

I don't no where to start so I'll back dick smith with his push for an immigration debate and a target of 70,000 a year which would see us stabilise at around 30 million at least it's a start.

 

[gringo2011]

From what I know of Adani their more likely to pocket our money and never turn a shovel than create jobs if that project swings on government funding then it's a no go. It's interesting that they can't seem to get finance in place and there is pretty much zero activity there for such a huge project.

This government under Abbott killed the car industry in some kind of deal with the Nationals. Despite what you hear the subsides to our car industry were modest compared to most other countries less than germany more than US and the jobs were quite productive around $100,000 per job compared to about $85,000 being the average. It also cost us the associated component parts manufacturers etc it really was a disaster still being felt .

We now have the distinction I think of being 1 of 2 or 3 G20 countries with no car industry, the skills that industry had are the exact ones we would need in a time of war for instance. Once that capacity is lost for example the production of tools and dyes for parts etc it's hard to get back.

If you use the argument that we just can't compete then what are we but an open cut mine and holiday destination, unless of course we want to work for a couple of dollars a day. Mutlinationals run the world they couldn't give a rats about people it's all about profit they have no morality or loyalty at all.

Free trade is a way to transfer more wealth to the wealthy, tarriffs were in fact a fair and resonable thing for countries to protect local industry and jobs. When all is said and sifted what did the Australian people get out of it a slight increase in agricultural exports?.

This is the sort of economic argument that helped get trump elected, make America great again, rip up nafta and other lousy deals and bring back jobs, no wonder people voted for him.

China is an interesting case they have pinched all our IP and at one point of the companies that had set up over there in joint ventures not one including mobs like BHP had been able to repatriate any profits, that was an admission made at a meeting between government and industry some time back.

I'm not really in favor of a bloated government sector but our utilities should never have been sold off. They were better run and the services were cheaper as there was no imperative to achieve higher and higher profits for shareholders.

I don't really know what the answer is but you won't find any joy in this country with free trade and open borders, nor will a big Australia do anything but lower our living standards and provide more consumers for business.

You can't get around the fact that we are the driest continent with poorest soil, they say Melbourne at current growth rates will be out of water in 10 years even with the desal plant.

I don't no where to start so I'll back dick smith with his push for an immigration debate and a target of 70,000 a year which would see us stabilise at around 30 million at least it's a start.

Yep all pretty accurate. We could keep bringing in people if we want to invest in ways to keep the living standards high. The auto industry was crazy the amount of tax we earned on the investment were more than we spent. It was dumb arse ideology. The railways and SEC were huge apprenticeship bearers who trained huge numbers of kids in all sorts of trades and once they were privatised and outsourced all that went and now we import 457 visa tradies to fill shortages. The best thing that Trump did was to kill off the TPP, that was insane with companies able to sue governments for loss of profits if they legislate in favour of the electorate.

The most ridiculous thing I heard was Matt Canavan stepping down thanked the mining industry and said it was an honour to represent them in parliament. Last time I looked he was meant to represent us?

 

[Glen Buterol]

Game of thrones don't read if you haven't watched it spoiler below.

I'm going to call that bastard Jon slow, is he ever going to get a leg over.

Nice gag but

Spoiler

he's not a bastard. He's legitimate & the rightful heir to the thrown.

He'll get a leg over in the final episode before he finds out its his Aunty.

 

[bergholt]

Free trade is a way to transfer more wealth to the wealthy, tarriffs were in fact a fair and resonable thing for countries to protect local industry and jobs. When all is said and sifted what did the Australian people get out of it a slight increase in agricultural exports?.

This is the sort of economic argument that helped get trump elected, make America great again, rip up nafta and other lousy deals and bring back jobs, no wonder people voted for him.

Agree with all of this, especially this bit. I don't think Trump has any real idea how to bring back jobs, but I completely understand why people would vote for him on the promise. The talk of "globalists" and "nationalists" is a bit crude but has something to it.

If, as seems likely, there are less jobs in the future, jobs are going to be the entire battleground of the next 50 elections. Unless we get a "universal basic income" or something, which I think is worth considering.

But in the absence of that, the politician who gets elected is the one who can most credibly say they create jobs. And seeing as government doesn't really know how to create jobs, maybe handouts and subsidies to the private sector are going to be increasingly more important, rather than less?

No idea. Interesting times!

 

[StFly]

Well, starting the reinstalling process since the drive died in attempting to copy data.

At least now I can boot into windows on a refresh though, so yay!

 

[Yawkey way]

Agree with all of this, especially this bit. I don't think Trump has any real idea how to bring back jobs, but I completely understand why people would vote for him on the promise. The talk of "globalists" and "nationalists" is a bit crude but has something to it.

If, as seems likely, there are less jobs in the future, jobs are going to be the entire battleground of the next 50 elections. Unless we get a "universal basic income" or something, which I think is worth considering.

But in the absence of that, the politician who gets elected is the one who can most credibly say they create jobs. And seeing as government doesn't really know how to create jobs, maybe handouts and subsidies to the private sector are going to be increasingly more important, rather than less?

No idea. Interesting times!

There was a trial in Canada I believe it was decades back of a universal wage and the outcome was very positive and also very interesting. I believe there is a plan to trial a similar plan in again in Canada and Finland, it will be interesting to see how it turns out, but it's definitely a plan with some merit.

I'm a nationalist in the context that governments are elected by us for us. I look at the UN and I just can't believe that people still turn up and pay their dues, a money pit of corruption where some pigs are more equal than others.

Handouts to the private sector in there various forms are at historic levels aren't they, the most put upon worker of our day is paye taxpayers. It just doesn't work when you hand money to business even people like warren buffet are embarrassed by personal and company tax breaks and rates, by the way I see he's sitting on $100 billion in cash looking for a place to invest and doesn't like anything at present.

Back in the day tax rates both business and personal would make people go pale I think in jfk's day it was 52% and 91% we've been cutting ever since pretty much. How has that worked out, the divide between the top and the bottom is at historic levels so I think that idea has pretty much had it's day although that's pretty much still the go to plan on the right.

Probably one of the most interesting and worrying things is the impact new media/communication will have in the future. I think trump won't be the last guy to speak directly to his audience cutting out tradional media, imagine reading turnbull's Twitter for your take on events.

 

[Yawkey way]

Yep all pretty accurate. We could keep bringing in people if we want to invest in ways to keep the living standards high. The auto industry was crazy the amount of tax we earned on the investment were more than we spent. It was dumb arse ideology. The railways and SEC were huge apprenticeship bearers who trained huge numbers of kids in all sorts of trades and once they were privatised and outsourced all that went and now we import 457 visa tradies to fill shortages. The best thing that Trump did was to kill off the TPP, that was insane with companies able to sue governments for loss of profits if they legislate in favour of the electorate.

The most ridiculous thing I heard was Matt Canavan stepping down thanked the mining industry and said it was an honour to represent them in parliament. Last time I looked he was meant to represent us?

We thought the tpp was great, makes you want to weep.

 

[nitewalker13]

Game of thrones don't read if you haven't watched it spoiler below.


I'm going to call that bastard Jon slow, is he ever going to get a leg over.

The North Remembers

 

[Yawkey way]

The Republicans have Gerrymandered the electoral college system allowing them to win without a majority. The Democrats need to win the state elections and reset the boundaries in a fairer distribution to have fair elections again.

The reason the Republicans are so dodgy is because the Koch brothers have interfered by supporting the more Right candidates over the more moderate candidates. This has stripped the party of its more reasonable people and reduced its ability to compromise.

Interesting article on Fox News talking about dems mid term wish list, what's interesting is the article talks about the extent and sophistication of the gerrymandering.

I han't realised how widespread it had become or how high tech.

I'd be more worried about gorge soros than the kock bothers.

 

[StCicatriz]

Heart breaking:-(

 

[Kilroy]

Chasing info, does anyone know if STK Seb Ross has a relation who played VFL in the fifties, name was Noel or Norm Ross

Old man and uncle played country football with him late in his career and say he was brilliant.
Realise it's a long shot, thank you in advance.

There's been Dean, Gower, Jim, Lester and Ray Ross. Jim Ross was the most prominent around then although Lester Ross played 10 games in '59.

Jim was a Saints Hall-of-Famer, played 139 games as a 183cm ruck/CHF from 1946 to 1954.

• St Kilda Best and Fairest 1949, 1951–1952
• St Kilda Leading goalkicker 1954
• St Kilda Team of the Century member
• Victorian state representative four times

We would have heard all about any family connection to Seb.

Seb is Jobe's cousin though.

 

[VDS66]

From what I know of Adani their more likely to pocket our money and never turn a shovel than create jobs if that project swings on government funding then it's a no go. It's interesting that they can't seem to get finance in place and there is pretty much zero activity there for such a huge project.

This government under Abbott killed the car industry in some kind of deal with the Nationals. Despite what you hear the subsides to our car industry were modest compared to most other countries less than germany more than US and the jobs were quite productive around $100,000 per job compared to about $85,000 being the average. It also cost us the associated component parts manufacturers etc it really was a disaster still being felt .

We now have the distinction I think of being 1 of 2 or 3 G20 countries with no car industry, the skills that industry had are the exact ones we would need in a time of war for instance. Once that capacity is lost for example the production of tools and dyes for parts etc it's hard to get back.

If you use the argument that we just can't compete then what are we but an open cut mine and holiday destination, unless of course we want to work for a couple of dollars a day. Mutlinationals run the world they couldn't give a rats about people it's all about profit they have no morality or loyalty at all.

Free trade is a way to transfer more wealth to the wealthy, tarriffs were in fact a fair and resonable thing for countries to protect local industry and jobs. When all is said and sifted what did the Australian people get out of it a slight increase in agricultural exports?.

This is the sort of economic argument that helped get trump elected, make America great again, rip up nafta and other lousy deals and bring back jobs, no wonder people voted for him.

China is an interesting case they have pinched all our IP and at one point of the companies that had set up over there in joint ventures not one including mobs like BHP had been able to repatriate any profits, that was an admission made at a meeting between government and industry some time back.

I'm not really in favor of a bloated government sector but our utilities should never have been sold off. They were better run and the services were cheaper as there was no imperative to achieve higher and higher profits for shareholders.

I don't really know what the answer is but you won't find any joy in this country with free trade and open borders, nor will a big Australia do anything but lower our living standards and provide more consumers for business.

You can't get around the fact that we are the driest continent with poorest soil, they say Melbourne at current growth rates will be out of water in 10 years even with the desal plant.

I don't no where to start so I'll back dick smith with his push for an immigration debate and a target of 70,000 a year which would see us stabilise at around 30 million at least it's a start.

A ton of man like be for this post.

Car industry outcome was a disgrace.

Add the NBN to that list.

Unfortunately I'm not optimistic because any change has to come from the people and as long no as the middle class think they are getting ahead, they'll do nothing.

Apathy is our worst enemy. Let's face it, and population that cannot appreciate that a government acted quickly and kept us out box recession during the GFC deserves what they get IMO.

We have pretty much a monopoly on media ownership so our access to credible news us highly controlled to protectvthe status quo of the elites.

We fed a daily serve of fear and scarcity that pits people against each other and fosters a dog eat dog survival instinct.

My hope is that the pendulum has swung too far across and people are fed up and realise what's going on.

 

[VDS66]

Agree with all of this, especially this bit. I don't think Trump has any real idea how to bring back jobs, but I completely understand why people would vote for him on the promise. The talk of "globalists" and "nationalists" is a bit crude but has something to it.

If, as seems likely, there are less jobs in the future, jobs are going to be the entire battleground of the next 50 elections. Unless we get a "universal basic income" or something, which I think is worth considering.

But in the absence of that, the politician who gets elected is the one who can most credibly say they create jobs. And seeing as government doesn't really know how to create jobs, maybe handouts and subsidies to the private sector are going to be increasingly more important, rather than less?

No idea. Interesting times!

The funny thing is that if you look at that great empire of capitalism, it was one of the highest subsidised nations.

Who paid for the roads and rail? It wasnt GM or Ford. A classic case of the wealthy using tax payer money to build roads so they could get rich from selling cars.

Sugar industry... same. Industry donates, law passed that sugar us a health food and has to be included in food.

Even now, the big banks got bailed out by the tax payer after the GFC instead of sending them to jail.

Socialise the debt, privatise the profits.

Talking to a few friends, one reason Trump got elected was because people were fed up with candidates bank rolled by banks etc. He was seen as the outsider, self made.

Obama offered hope but by his own admission he didn't realise how hard it was to change the culture.

In terms of systems. I think you need a middle ground between progressive socialism and capitalism.

Essential services should be public owned and operated for the public good.

Bottom line though is that Australians have to decide what services they want the Government to provide and pay tax accordingly. Do we really want a race to the bottom line the USA?

Or do we demand better?

 

[gringo2011]

The funny thing is that if you look at that great empire of capitalism, it was one of the highest subsidised nations.

Who paid for the roads and rail? It wasnt GM or Ford. A classic case of the wealthy using tax payer money to build roads so they could get rich from selling cars.

Sugar industry... same. Industry donates, law passed that sugar us a health food and has to be included in food.

Even now, the big banks got bailed out by the tax payer after the GFC instead of sending them to jail.

Socialise the debt, privatise the profits.

Talking to a few friends, one reason Trump got elected was because people were fed up with candidates bank rolled by banks etc. He was seen as the outsider, self made.

Obama offered hope but by his own admission he didn't realise how hard it was to change the culture.

In terms of systems. I think you need a middle ground between progressive socialism and capitalism.

Essential services should be public owned and operated for the public good.

Bottom line though is that Australians have to decide what services they want the Government to provide and pay tax accordingly. Do we really want a race to the bottom line the USA?

Or do we demand better?

Yeah I read a good article on how people like Packer and Reinhard pay nearly zero tax but in order for them to increase their wealth it costs the tax payers a huge amount of money to subsidise everything from their diesel to building roads and infrastructure for their operations.

Las Angeles had a New York style underground rail system that was bought by one of the car companies them boarded up and the town planners helped them create a motor city with access for cars given priority over public transport.

The way they operate the utilities requires we buy it all back once it becomes too old anyway. The government already pays for turbines and solar to be build but then hand them over to private operators who are then profit. Once the coal fired power stations get too old they close them down rather than rebuild and once we have shortages the government will buy them new ones to stop having a crisis on their hands.

 

[Cold Sober]

There's been Dean, Gower, Jim, Lester and Ray Ross. Jim Ross was the most prominent around then although Lester Ross played 10 games in '59.

Jim was a Saints Hall-of-Famer, played 139 games as a 183cm ruck/CHF from 1946 to 1954.

• St Kilda Best and Fairest 1949, 1951–1952
• St Kilda Leading goalkicker 1954
• St Kilda Team of the Century member
• Victorian state representative four times

We would have heard all about any family connection to Seb.

Seb is Jobe's cousin though.

thanks heaps, not bad lineage.

 

[George]

What's the drop of choice for today lads & ladettes?

 

[Pardon me]

Double jack and cokes - I ran out of starward scotch
Et vous George?

What's the drop of choice for today lads & ladettes?

 

[gringo2011]

What's the drop of choice for today lads & ladettes?

I've never been a rum fan but my wife bought some Mount Gay for cooking and I had a couple last weekend. It's not a bad drop....or maybe I'm just a drunk. Anyway, I'm making a stand for the yes voters by only drinking alcohol with camp names until it's law.

 

[Kilroy]

What's the drop of choice for today lads & ladettes?

 

[gringo2011]

View attachment 408154

Nice topical drop.

 

[cartel]

Grand Ridge Gippsland Gold

 

[PoppedCorn]

Atm a cuppa tea.
ahhhhhh