Roos and Eade:punch for punch.

[Wollongong Represent]

Another thread got me thinking about the part that both men played in Sydney's success. I was glad the Swans let Eade go in 2002, but only because his ideas were a bit stale. He is however responsible for recruiting and developing 15 of the 22 premiership players from 2005. He was in charge when the Swans recruited 4 of the top 5 figures at the club (Roos, Hall, Goodes, Kirk) with Barry being the exception.

Under Eade:
2001 - LRT, Hall, Schneider, Kennelly (elevated).
2000 - Buchanan (first time round), Ablett, Williams (now retired obviously)
1999 - O'Keefe, Ball, Kirk
1998 - Fosdike, Bolton
1997 - Goodes
1995 - Roos, Crouch, Matthews

So is Rodney Eade the forgotten man in Sydney's success or has Paul Roos done far better than Eade would of if he had stayed on???

 

[Ed_Gein]

In hindsight i guess you can say the recruiting under Eades looks very good now. Although would he have gotten the best out of them like Roos has in the last couple of years had he stayed on as Swans coach? Doubtful.

Eade was a good coach, but like you said, he went a bit stale.

 

[Wollongong Represent]

Yeah, I feel like they've complemented each other quite well. I think there's no doubt that Roos is responsible for the magnitude of our success. I don't think we would of won a comp under Eade, but he certainly took the club to new level in terms of exposure and performance. Roos redrafted Kirk and Buchanan after Eade didn't have much luck with them. Two useful players in anyones book.

 

[Tuco]

Eade's contribution to footy in this state should never be forgotten. He took a cellar dwelling team to a GF. Pretty good effort. His defensive set ups and masterful use of the interchange bench made any visit to the SCG a headache for opposition coaches and he left a strong enough legacy for Roos to take the team to the next level in short order. Also it was fun to turn away from a bad bit of play and seconds later see Rocket on the big screen smashing his phone around.

It was sad when he "quit". But he had definitely lost the group and had to go. So I guess to answer your question I'd have to say 'no' Eade wouldn't have taken the team where Roos took it IMHO. The change came just in time. And there were almost instant results. The last ten rounds of 2002 with Roos at the helm were a revelation. Even Roos was surprised. Instead of butchering the list as he mooted might happen, he ended up giving almost everyone a chance to prove what they were capable of.

Results speak for themselves.

 

[GGOOAALL]

Eades=good coach, & has done HEAPS for the swans during his time with us!!
Roos=even better, & will do the same, maybe even more for the swans!!


it's all good to have tactics & out think other coaches.
but at the end of the day you need your players playing for their coaches.
no need for a team of superstars coached by a supercoach.

just a passionate professional team with level headed coach.
can't go wrong... WE ARE PROOF OF THIS...

 

[GGOOAALL]

Eades=good coach, & has done HEAPS for the swans during his time with us!!
Roos=even better, & will do the same, maybe even more for the swans!!


it's all good to have tactics & out think other coaches.
but at the end of the day you need your players playing for their coaches.
no need for a team of superstars coached by a supercoach.

just a passionate professional team with level headed coach.
can't go wrong... WE ARE PROOF OF THIS...

oops.... in adition.... i believe eades lost the commitment from his men towards the end of his time at sydney... whereas now, roos has 100% support behind him.

 

[nico]

Eade's contribution to footy in this state should never be forgotten. He took a cellar dwelling team to a GF. Pretty good effort. His defensive set ups and masterful use of the interchange bench made any visit to the SCG a headache for opposition coaches and he left a strong enough legacy for Roos to take the team to the next level in short order. Also it was fun to turn away from a bad bit of play and seconds later see Rocket on the big screen smashing his phone around.

It was sad when he "quit". But he had definitely lost the group and had to go. So I guess to answer your question I'd have to say 'no' Eade wouldn't have taken the team where Roos took it IMHO. The change came just in time. And there were almost instant results. The last ten rounds of 2002 with Roos at the helm were a revelation. Even Roos was surprised. Instead of butchering the list as he mooted might happen, he ended up giving almost everyone a chance to prove what they were capable of.

Results speak for themselves.

Sorry, Ron Barassi handed a ready made team to Eade. Still can't fathom why Kickett started on the bench and didn't come on until almost Half Time of GF. Was in scintillating form at centre bounces leading up to the GF.

He failed to develop players such as top 10 drafts in Fosdike and Bolton, choosing to fling them between Swans and Port Melb, and when with the Swans gave them limited time off the bench. Ball also played his best footy under Roos. We also got flogged in finals. Apart from those listed above he also drafted some shocking so called "established" players.

Clearly Roos was the saving grace for our club that was once again headed for oblivion under Eade. From 1996 onwards we slowly faded away.

Does Eade's first year at the Bulldogs sound familiar to his first year with us?

The Melbourne press in all quarters were all over Eade like a cheap suit in 2006, will it be the same in 2007?

 

[Shake down the thunder]

Sorry, Ron Barassi handed a ready made team to Eade. Still can't fathom why Kickett started on the bench and didn't come on until almost Half Time of GF. Was in scintillating form at centre bounces leading up to the GF.

He failed to develop players such as top 10 drafts in Fosdike and Bolton, choosing to fling them between Swans and Port Melb, and when with the Swans gave them limited time off the bench. Ball also played his best footy under Roos. We also got flogged in finals. Apart from those listed above he also drafted some shocking so called "established" players.

Clearly Roos was the saving grace for our club that was once again headed for oblivion under Eade. From 1996 onwards we slowly faded away.

Does Eade's first year at the Bulldogs sound familiar to his first year with us?

The Melbourne press in all quarters were all over Eade like a cheap suit in 2006, will it be the same in 2007?

Bit harsh on Rocket there. In his first few years we were without doubt the dominant team - minor premiers in 1996 and until late in 97 were flying then in 98 we finished 3rd in the home and away before again falling to eventual premiers Adelaide. We consistently made the finals and he improved the team over and above Barassi.

Bolton was developed well and I suggest the reason Fosdike took a while is the simple fact he isn't a world beater and still needs work. My thoughts on Fossie are well documented in a previous thread.

As for Derek Kickett - half way through the 2nd qtr the game was ours to win. That decision had no baring on the game and like 2006 - the ruckman won the day for the other mob.

 

[Wagamama]

Sorry, Ron Barassi handed a ready made team to Eade. QUOTE]

You could probably level the same at Roos of the team handed over from Rocket in all fairness.

Both Roos and Eade have contributed enormously to the club.

The premiership tips the see saw into Roos favour tho'

 

[nico]

Sorry, Ron Barassi handed a ready made team to Eade. QUOTE]

You could probably level the same at Roos of the team handed over from Rocket in all fairness.

Both Roos and Eade have contributed enormously to the club.

The premiership tips the see saw into Roos favour tho'

We were playing good footy under Barassi and lousy footy under Eade. That drawn game against St Kilda at Colonial Stadium was the pits and an absolute testament to how bad Eade was coaching. He was making some weird moves in that year. The souless footy we were playing under Eade made me peuck.

To bring Plugger back to try to resurrect a structure of a few years earlier was that of a desperate man who had no idea of what to do with the team when Plugger retired.

 

[Tuco]

Sorry, Ron Barassi handed a ready made team to Eade. Still can't fathom why Kickett started on the bench and didn't come on until almost Half Time of GF. Was in scintillating form at centre bounces leading up to the GF.

He failed to develop players such as top 10 drafts in Fosdike and Bolton, choosing to fling them between Swans and Port Melb, and when with the Swans gave them limited time off the bench. Ball also played his best footy under Roos. We also got flogged in finals. Apart from those listed above he also drafted some shocking so called "established" players.

Clearly Roos was the saving grace for our club that was once again headed for oblivion under Eade. From 1996 onwards we slowly faded away.

Does Eade's first year at the Bulldogs sound familiar to his first year with us?

The Melbourne press in all quarters were all over Eade like a cheap suit in 2006, will it be the same in 2007?

Eade made many mistakes. But he was one of the best coaches (and still the longest serving coach) our club has ever had. He had 3 good years, a few mediocre ones, and an absolutley shocking half year in 2002. By then he had lost the group, which finished him in Sydney as I mentioned. But I won't forget the good times either.

Bit harsh to slam his finals record. His run in the finals were impaired by injuries every season. Including 96 where we limped into the GF and then lost O'brien early in the first qtr.

Our trades - particularly for the 99 season - were sometimes farcical. But he did manage to get Schwass, Schauble, Maxfield, Ball, Williams and Hall so they weren't all duds.

We were playing good footy under Barassi and lousy footy under Eade. That drawn game against St Kilda at Colonial Stadium was the pits and an absolute testament to how bad Eade was coaching. He was making some weird moves in that year. The souless footy we were playing under Eade made me peuck.

The quality of that game against St Kilda was not Eade's fault. The true story was this:

1) St kilda's list was decimated with injuries
2) They were on a terrible losing streak. They had only won 6 games in the previous 2 years and already they were sitting on 1 win and 4 losses when we went down to play them.
3) St Kilda had lost their previous two games by a combined total of 205pts!!.
4) The last time we'd played them (only 6 Premiership games earlier) we had beaten them by 87 points.

The Saints didn't care about the footy at at that point. They were a team on the verge of implosion. They wanted a result so badly that they were prepared to do anything to get it. So Grant's answer was the super flood.

Anyway. IMHO we currently have the best coach in the league, so no complaints from me. The Dogs can have him.

 

[CharlieG]

Another thread got me thinking about the part that both men played in Sydney's success. I was glad the Swans let Eade go in 2002, but only because his ideas were a bit stale. He is however responsible for recruiting and developing 15 of the 22 premiership players from 2005. He was in charge when the Swans recruited 4 of the top 5 figures at the club (Roos, Hall, Goodes, Kirk) with Barry being the exception.

Under Eade:
2001 - LRT, Hall, Schneider, Kennelly (elevated).
2000 - Buchanan (first time round), Ablett, Williams (now retired obviously)
1999 - O'Keefe, Ball, Kirk
1998 - Fosdike, Bolton
1997 - Goodes
1995 - Roos, Crouch, Matthews

So is Rodney Eade the forgotten man in Sydney's success or has Paul Roos done far better than Eade would of if he had stayed on???

Recruiting, yes. Developing, no.

LRT, Schneider and Ablett had not played a game under Eade. Buchanan had played two. None of them are Rocket's players, in my opinion.

Barry Hall had only been there for half a season, but he was nowhere near the leader he is today. Goodes was an erratic floater who'd been told to do so many different things he had no idea of what his role was - Roos actually told him to do what he thought best, and since then he's won two Brownlows. If you'd said in round 12, 2002 that Kirk would become a captain and b&f winner, you would have been laughed at.

Jude Bolton and Nic Fosdike were promising kids, but both were behind where they should have been after nearly 60 games. Tadhg Kennelly had played less than 20 games and Roosy's first game as coach was probably the breakthrough game for him. Ryan O'Keefe had played about twenty games and, (to be fair to Rocket) due to family tragedy, was not exactly on Planet Football at the time Roos took over.

At the other extreme, Jason Ball and Paul Williams were accomplished players before they arrived at the Swans to play under Rocket. I'll give Rocket his due with some players. He got more out of Mathews than Roos could, and he turned Micky into a star and gave Leo a sense of purpose in 2001 after years of floating around the forward line. But his development record was at best patchy and at worst downright poor.

 

[CharlieG]

Bit harsh on Rocket there. In his first few years we were without doubt the dominant team - minor premiers in 1996 and until late in 97 were flying then in 98 we finished 3rd in the home and away before again falling to eventual premiers Adelaide. We consistently made the finals and he improved the team over and above Barassi.

The 1996-8 team underachieved. It was good enough to win a premiership... maybe even two.

 

[Tuco]

The 1996-8 team underachieved. It was good enough to win a premiership... maybe even two.

After the 96 GF I felt sure a Premiership was close, too. But Lockett's Groin held him to a standstill in the 96 finals, and he could only contribute 35 goals (I think?) in 97. Kelly and number of players were walking wounded by the finals in 97, too. And the Dogs absolutely slammed us in the first week of the finals on their way to the Prelim.

I really thought our chance would come in 98. We secured the home final, and had been playing with the sort of form we'd shown in 96. But Kelly's knee injury hurt us badly and the brilliance of that underrated Adel side (despite being the Premiers) showed we were still off the pace.

Once you start knocking on the door of a Premiership it's amazing how hard that last step into the history books actually is.

 

[nico]

Tuco, that game against StKilda was almost predictable given how bad we were going.

If everyone else was flogging them no excuse under the sun can get Eade off for our deplorable effort. Eade had no idea how to combat the ultra flood and consequently nor did his players. It wasn't until a brave Cresswell ran the lines in one desperate effort to get us in front. Then enter one Benny Mathews to hand the draw to the Saints.

Charlie mentioned a number of players who blossomed under Roos and I will never forget his statement when he was appointed, "I am going to teach these players how to play the game".

I actually thought that Mathews grew some sort of a heart muscle under Roos. He possessed no such thing under Eade. Although it has shrunk somewhat in latter years.

What about Mr "second to the ball' Crouch who became a player under Roos. Great tackler under Eade but lacked the heart to be first to the footy under Eade.

 

[CharlieG]

I actually thought that Mathews grew some sort of a heart muscle under Roos. He possessed no such thing under Eade. Although it has shrunk somewhat in latter years.

I don't know about that.

In 2000-01 I thought that Mathews would develop into a star and could well be a future captain. I wasn't alone in that belief - most at the club held it including Rocket. The fact that he was given the number four was evidence of the esteem in which he was held at this time.

Then he lost his way. The cracks had already started to appear in the first half of 2002, although to be fair with the exception of Hall, Dunkley, Williams, Kelly and Nicks (who promptly fell apart the moment Eade left) the whole club was a mess. He managed to tread water for the first couple of years, but by 2005 he had clearly gone backwards and by last year he reached rock bottom. How he was selected during the finals series ahead of Vogels or Grundy I'll never understand.

 

[nico]

I don't know about that.

In 2000-01 I thought that Mathews would develop into a star and could well be a future captain. I wasn't alone in that belief - most at the club held it including Rocket. The fact that he was given the number four was evidence of the esteem in which he was held at this time.

Then he lost his way. The cracks had already started to appear in the first half of 2002, although to be fair with the exception of Hall, Dunkley, Williams, Kelly and Nicks (who promptly fell apart the moment Eade left) the whole club was a mess. He managed to tread water for the first couple of years, but by 2005 he had clearly gone backwards and by last year he reached rock bottom. How he was selected during the finals series ahead of Vogels or Grundy I'll never understand.

Sorry Charlie I cant agree. This bloke was an imposter almost from day 1. The number of times he was completely unaccountable for opponents that tore him apart was lamentable. The people that I have watched the footy with for a couple of decades all agree that he has never been any good. When I said one day at the MCG that gee he might have found a bit of heart under Roos when he backed into a pack, I was quickly labelled a lunatic. The club might have hoped that he was going to be a leader because at that time we were running pretty low on genuine ones, but they were so wrong.

I have always seen Mathews as one of those blokes who is always last on the top of a pack on the ground - as an after thought because he is always the freshest in the observers eyes. Has he ever got a Brownlow vote. Sorry mate, I agree with much of what you post but this is one person I will never agree on.

 

[Tuco]

Nico, I understand what you're saying about the St kilda game (personally I rated that infamous Freo game in Syd a slightly worse match). But when a team just shuts up shop on you it's pretty hard to do much about it.

But whenever the question of Roos vs Eade arises I'll always give the points to Roos by a country mile if only because Rocket saw no role for Kirk at the club and had smashed Goodsey's confidence so badly that he was openly thinking about leaving Sydney to get a fresh start in football elsewhere. I still get a little sick thinking about what might have happened if Eade had coached on another season or two.