Autopsy Round 7, 2020: Adelaide v St.Kilda *BYRNES DEBUT*

[Impatient Saint]

From an Adelaide perspective I think they have found a player in Ben Keays (very cheaply). He has reinvented himself and his physique after being delisted by Brisbane and did a great job as their grunt player the role Rory Sloan usually plays.

Brad Crouch had no hurt factor and looks disinterested. I still believe if we can get him for not too much $$$ as a free agent he will add to our midfield group.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Absolutely loved the passion from Howard. You don't want 22 players with that level of vocal aggression but we've had a very passive team in terms of calling each other out since Roo and Goddard.

I reckon he's been pretty good all year and has been criticised harshly but last night was definitely his best game. Looked fantastic.

 

[kernelT]

I'm relieved we won, but a good team would have put Adelaide to the sword… they are terrible.

Byrnes is not ready for AFL footy, but I feel for young guys coming into our side, the pressure from fans for them to be stars out of the blocks is pretty unrealistic, that said I hope Bytel is closer to AFL level and we get a look at him soon.

Zak Jones 14 kicks, 6 effective… his turnovers are magnified when he's kicking the ball in the backline. Just handball it.

Steele, Gresham, Carlisle, Howard - all leaders last night, dragged us over the line.

Hill & Ross still MIA, they are fortunate that a win masks how poor they were again.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Lonie is playing like a guy who knows his days are numbered.
A handful of possessions means he needs to kick goals. His desperation in stealing the free kick & his no-hope 50m shot, not to mention his exuberant celebration after the one he did kick, all scream desperation to stay relevant.
For mine his time is up. We need someone, anyone who can contribute more & less focus on the individual.

*his over the head tap in the first qtr was great.


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Lonie always plays like he is desperate. I wish they all would.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

How good was Battle’s steamrolling tackle in our forward 50 in the opening moments
He hasn’t had a solid run at it this season, but his aggression combined with skill is an arousing combo

 

[gringo2011]

Lonie is playing like a guy who knows his days are numbered.
A handful of possessions means he needs to kick goals. His desperation in stealing the free kick & his no-hope 50m shot, not to mention his exuberant celebration after the one he did kick, all scream desperation to stay relevant.
For mine his time is up. We need someone, anyone who can contribute more & less focus on the individual.

*his over the head tap in the first qtr was great.


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I thought apart from the dumb stuff you mentioned he was pretty decent. Kent is average apart from his goal kicking Lonie is better with his work without the ball. I thought particularly early the pressure from Lonie and Butler was outstanding. He was probably trying to over compensate to keep his spot. That's easy to coach out of him though. To me Membrey was much more of a concern, he couldn't impact at all and looked disinterested for 3 quarters. Marshall looks all at sea for the last 2 weeks too. It wasn't just Paddy that made him play badly, he dropped easy marks and didn't seem to be able to find any space. He was great against Carlton but hasn't looked anywhere near the player he was in 2019 this year.

 

[BrutThough]

Can't imagine they would drop byrnes after 1 week.

He didnt look ready for senior football last night.
He got a taste and there is no shame going back to work on things he needs too.

 

[The Punter]

Have to go back a while to think of a better game by a Saint than Steele last night. He was excellent.

Byrnes didn't look anywhere near it, but I don't want a kid to get dropped after one game. Having said that, Sinclair would have provided more production last night than Byrnes.

Don't think Battle will get up - Marsh in for him, or perhaps considering it'll be another greasy night in Adelaide, Hind.

Hannebury should come in if fit, and unfortunately Byrnes would be the candidate.

I'd expect perhaps another one or two rotations considering the short break.

 

[hayes]

Byrnes was clearly overawed but you’re not meant to do what Rowell and Rankine did in their first games, I really hope we give him a run of games to pick up the pace. Ratts said before the game doesn’t matter how many possessions he gets he’s going to be a good player so you have to back him. Hannebery can come in for Battle, doubt he gets up five days after a concussion.

Steele’s game was awesome but the last time he played a game like that was three years ago. Need to see games close to that more consistently, though it does feel like he’s building.

Billings hasn’t fired a shot for a few weeks, Ross has barely fired one all year. There must be something going on with the latter because you don’t go from a 30 disposals a game player to what he’s dishing up now.

Absolutely stoked with that win. Thought we’d crumble but we held up.

 

[gringo2011]

Morning all, watched the replay late last night.

Wowee. That umpiring.
That umpire that looks a little bit like Hawkeye gone wrong was the worst culprit.
I've heard lots of people saying "It went both ways" e.t.c. Jesus, most of their bloody goals came from umpiring decisions that were either BS or dubious.
We got one back with the Hill HTB, just as well.

Anyway, I'm sure there's been lots of love for Steele, Doogs and Coff. I hope people are giving Carlisle some love. People are quick to pan him when he has an ordinary one. He was an absolute boss last night.

About the rucks. I'm seeing heaps of Ryder/No Ryder on social media this morning. Does it have to be so black and white? All the commentators and half the posters seem to be discussing Ryder or no Ryder. How about 'sometimes Ryder'? Marshall struggled alone last week, so Ryder came in yesterday. Gives Marshall some support, takes some pressure off, helps us win the game, especially with his dominance in Q4. Maybe that dominance in Q4 was partly because the Crows ruck started to tire after taking on 2 rucks all game. We might have a lot of games crammed in this season, so I'm all for Ryder playing about 1/3 up to 1/2 of our games, with Marshall being given the solo duties in the rest.

Ryder (and this dilemma) won't be around forever, and we need games in him to keep him fit and sharp and motivated. If Marshall goes down, he's our #1 ruck so give him some runs, I say.

I thought Ryder was better than just wearing down ROB. He did it to us in their come from behind win a few years back. He lists when the side needs some ruck domination. I thought he was huge last night and I have been totally against playing 2 rucks. It almost looks like you need to rest one of them though at the moment. Perhaps Marshall will get a bit more forward craft with time so make it work better.

 

[The Punter]

I thought apart from the dumb stuff you mentioned he was pretty decent. Kent is average apart from his goal kicking Lonie is better with his work without the ball. I thought particularly early the pressure from Lonie and Butler was outstanding. He was probably trying to over compensate to keep his spot. That's easy to coach out of him though. To me Membrey was much more of a concern, he couldn't impact at all and looked disinterested for 3 quarters. Marshall looks all at sea for the last 2 weeks too. It wasn't just Paddy that made him play badly, he dropped easy marks and didn't seem to be able to find any space. He was great against Carlton but hasn't looked anywhere near the player he was in 2019 this year.

I thought Lonie wasn't involved enough but what he did was really good (except for the shot from the boundary, which should have been a left foot banana or given to a right footer), Membrey was interested but just beaten (you play an opponent, it happens occasionally), and hardly anyone took a contested mark apart from Carlisle so it's a bit harsh on Marshall. Marshall's problem is he becomes a bits and pieces player when playing with Ryder when last year, he would get better as games went on with his clearance work and around the ground stuff. Ryder is clearly a better tap ruckman and instantly makes our centre clearance work elite.

 

[Saintos The ITK]

What a great win, a different style of play to what we have seen & thought the team battled it out well.
Below is my view on how I saw the players through the night, some of you may disagree but as I said it is my view.

Josh Battle. Injured early

Jack Billings. Quiet, but in his defence there was a lot of traffic on the wings during the night, hard to get away when that occurs.

Dan Butler. Started the game well & was dangerous throughout the game to keep the Crows on their toes.

Ryan Byrnes. All at sea in first game at top level, will be better for the run.

Jake Carlisle. Mr. Ever Reliable, seems to be enjoying footy this season with him & Howard turning into a formidable duo.

Hunter Clark. Quieter than normal, but when every player is out on the wing/flank hard to be a star.

Nick Coffield. Absolute stunner of a game, marked anything that came near him, amazing what a bit of confidence can do.

Jarryn Geary. Another great stopping role, love him or hate him, you cannot question his courage. Thought he stood up as a leader tonight.

Jade Gresham. Great game from Gresh all night,never stopped running, his only downfall is his kicking.

Bradley Hill. Thought Hilly played a pretty good game tonight, stats may not add up but he was up & about for most of the night.

Dougal Howard. Would have missed out on any Brownlow votes for giving the umpire a serve, but who cares backmen dont win Brownlows, an exceptional game.

Zak Jones. Got us up & running early, eased off after 1/2 time but was thereabouts all night

Dean Kent. Hardly sighted early, but came alive when he needed to late in the game.

Max King. If his name was Tex Walker, he would have had a dozen free kicks dead in front. First quarter great, double teamed & scragged remainder of game.

Jack Lonie. Does some good things off the ball that goes unnoticed, may need a break

Rowan Marshall. Hard to judge on last nights form, struggled up front.

Tim Membrey. Beaten on the night, but when the game had to be won he stepped up to the plate.

Ben Paton. Couldn’t see why everyone raved about him, but has turned into a very reliable defender, another who has been given a chance & now confident that he belongs.

Sebastian Ross. Was put on notice the week before. Disappointing

Jack Steele. Wow!!! What a solid game, but I suppose we all expect that from Jack. BOG

Callum Wilkie. One of the most reliable defenders in the league, another solid performance.

Agree with all of that except I thought Clarko had a blinder.

 

[gringo2011]

King will rip a game to shreds at some point this season... the hard part is getting into the right spot in the contest, he just needs some confidence in his dukes.

There were a couple of times tonight where he made an All Australian full back in Talia look second rate.

Drop it out in front of him in some space and he's scary good. If we had some elite delivery he'd look amazing. He dropped a couple of ones he'd usually take but when it all clicks it will be a pretty incredible sight. They molested him to stop it and if he'd been a more prominent player, he'd have had half a dozen free kicks.

 

[Ducky Tie]

Drop it out in front of him in some space and he's scary good. If we had some elite delivery he'd look amazing. He dropped a couple of ones he'd usually take but when it all clicks it will be a pretty incredible sight. They molested him to stop it and if he'd been a more prominent player, he'd have had half a dozen free kicks.

Yeah he's getting absolutely manhandled when the ball is in flight at times. Has had a total of three free kicks for the year. Poor umpiring, again.

 

[BrutThough]

Byrnes was clearly overawed but you’re not meant to do what Rowell and Rankine did in their first games, I really hope we give him a run of games to pick up the pace. Ratts said before the game doesn’t matter how many possessions he gets he’s going to be a good player so you have to back him. Hannebery can come in for Battle, doubt he gets up five days after a concussion.

Steele’s game was awesome but the last time he played a game like that was three years ago. Need to see games close to that more consistently, though it does feel like he’s building.

Billings hasn’t fired a shot for a few weeks, Ross has barely fired one all year. There must be something going on with the latter because you don’t go from a 30 disposals a game player to what he’s dishing up now.

Absolutely stoked with that win. Thought we’d crumble but we held up.

Billings was good against both Carlton and Freo. Last night his production was down but it also wasn't the game for outside running.

Ross is a mystery. He must be carrying something? It looked like he was staring in the backline for most of the night.
His disposal count was probably the lowest he's ever had but still managed 5 intercepts and 2 goal assists which isn't bad.
I'd give him a tagging role next week just to get him around the ball. He did that in 2015/16 which helped him become a good player.
Maybe he just needs a simple task to get him out of this form slump.

 

[FQFjt]

Marshall Ryder debate is a genuinely difficult one and I'm glad the coaches are open minded enough to give both options a decent chance to see what's best.

Riewoldt made an interesting point on the broadcast last night that although Marshall plays a whole lot better when he plays alone, the tap domination that Ryder can provide leads to more inside 50s from stoppage, and given how efficient we are once inside 50, that makes Ryder's contribution especially valuable to the team as a whole.

One thing I have always been tempted to trial is when Ryder is in the team playing Marshall in a Roughhead role of part time forward, part time ruck rover. It's a pretty left field option, but Marshall's clearance and stoppage work is his number one strength, and I would love to see if he can replicate that when he is a non-rucking midfielder. His size and agility would really be a point of difference, that's for sure.

 

[Ricmel]

It's the ones not our way that were the same. King would have had 3 shots on goal if they were.

Well I think you can play swings and roundabouts all day long. We actually got 4 free kicks that were shots on goal....we just missed them all and one was certainly Gresham taking a dive. If you support a club you are highly sensitive to decisions against that club during a game. You are not so sensitive and often are blind to decisions against the opposition. If you want to see the worst decision of the night...it was the non-holding the ball that should have been paid against Hill.

But as I said, we could play this game all day.

 

[cooperrules]

The brightside is we won with passengers.

Billings same old same old dissapears
Hill overpaid lazy soft
Membrey been crap all year bar 1 game
Marshall might have started believing his own publicity
Ross put a fork in him

Forward line functional in stages.

Defence fantastic.

Lones and steele carried us over the line.

Gresh worst kick in afl besides casboult.

 

[st_trav_ofWA]

ok so my observations ..

1. yes Roma plays a better game without Ryder in the side but this is a team sport and the team benifits much more from Ryders hit outs to advantage so i would sacrifice the stats Roma misses out on for the centre clearances Ryder provides ... watching ryder tap it down to hit Gresh on the tit as he runs at full speed out of the centre is a thing of beauty and that kind of tap out late against Freo would have won us the game..

2. Lonie is playing selfish footy .. the pressure is on him to perform but i think he would win more support to hold his spot by doing the team thing more often and im not just talking about those two goal attempts he had no right taking but some of the simple things like knowing when its your turn to move out of the way to let your team mate run at it ...

3. Seb is totally lost out there ... the task is now on the coaching team to find a role for him to be effective or he needs to sit out .. he is trying hard so i cant fault him for that but he needs to play within his limits of ability .. he isnt dusty so trying to be that burst through player isnt his dice. i would be tempted to give him a run with role for a game let him get his hands dirty and develop a taste for tackling again.

4. People will bag out Hill but that performance was 100% on what it was last week (i think that mainly highlights how bad last week was) i do feel he is still finding his feet in this team and perhaps isnt as embraced into the team as some of the other recruits have become .. there is a lot to work on but as i said befor he is a far better player than he is showing so im going to give it some time .. from memory his return to Freo took a while to get going as well so maybe there is a level of settling in with him that needs to be done.

5. King is special .... he just gets to the right spots and he has some quick footy smarts about him ... he will tear teams apart once he gets the body for the role ..

6. Members is a pure class leader ... he was having a very quiet game but his work rate never dropped and he willed himself into the game when he was needed

7. Dooougs is a super great pick up for us ... heart , agression, speed and a good kick on him im a huge fan ..

8. The SA supporters ... well done to our SA saints they were loud and passionate all game .. them singing the song at the end was magic !! well done crew !

 

[gringo2011]

Byrnes was clearly overawed but you’re not meant to do what Rowell and Rankine did in their first games, I really hope we give him a run of games to pick up the pace. Ratts said before the game doesn’t matter how many possessions he gets he’s going to be a good player so you have to back him. Hannebery can come in for Battle, doubt he gets up five days after a concussion.

Steele’s game was awesome but the last time he played a game like that was three years ago. Need to see games close to that more consistently, though it does feel like he’s building.

Billings hasn’t fired a shot for a few weeks, Ross has barely fired one all year. There must be something going on with the latter because you don’t go from a 30 disposals a game player to what he’s dishing up now.

Absolutely stoked with that win. Thought we’d crumble but we held up.

Ross is being pushed out of the midfield and wings and moved to less damaging positions. He was okay despite not getting huge numbers. I thought he was serviceable and was actually trying this week. Last week he shat the bed and looked like he'd stopped working when the club needed leaders. He wasn't outstanding by any means but people are looking for him to be shit now.

 

[Ricmel]

Billings was good against both Carlton and Freo. Last night his production was down but it also wasn't the game for outside running.

I think Billings has been Ok this year. Would be in the top 10 in BF so gets a pass. Is that good enough? Hill has been really disappointing. So far Jones, Butler and Ryder have had more impact and Howard is coming fast.

Billings and Hill (along with Marshall) are probably the 2 of the players in the team that are A-grade or close. For me, they are not doing enough and we are lucky other players have stepped up and played beyond expectations.

But you look at our results - or what could have been - 10% improvement from Billings and Hill and we would probably be 6-1 and in second place on the ladder.

 

[Impatient Saint]

I'm relieved we won, but a good team would have put Adelaide to the sword… they are terrible.

Byrnes is not ready for AFL footy, but I feel for young guys coming into our side, the pressure from fans for them to be stars out of the blocks is pretty unrealistic, that said I hope Bytel is closer to AFL level and we get a look at him soon.

Zak Jones 14 kicks, 6 effective… his turnovers are magnified when he's kicking the ball in the backline. Just handball it.

Steele, Gresham, Carlisle, Howard - all leaders last night, dragged us over the line.

Hill & Ross still MIA, they are fortunate that a win masks how poor they were again.

I think you have under rated the game being their first home game in front of 30k factor. They were up for the game and had belief and had they kicked straight on goal in the 3rd, the result may have been reversed. I think they played quite well so as Ratts said "sometimes you have to take the scrappy wins"!

Having said that there is room for improvement but its a positive stepping block for the next game.

 

[gringo2011]

The brightside is we won with passengers.

Billings same old same old dissapears
Hill overpaid lazy soft
Membrey been crap all year bar 1 game
Marshall might have started believing his own publicity
Ross put a fork in him

Forward line functional in stages.

Defence fantastic.

Lones and steele carried us over the line.

Gresh worst kick in afl besides casboult.

Casboult is now one of the best ironically. Hardly ever misses a shot after years of whipping boy status. Gresham should go back to playing-on instead of lining up. It used to work for him. Looks embarrassing when it doesn't work but not as bad as missing sitters repeatedly.

 

[The Punter]

Normally in a game there is only so much possession to go around. 20% less game time this year means ... 20% less possession.

I think Ross is just being forced to play a less prominent role by the improvement and inclusion of others.

 

[The Punter]

Gresham's set shot was dead straight last night. He ran out to the right, and the ball continued on the trajectory he was running on.