Science/Environment Science - What is hypothesis, what is theory, what is fact, what is the difference?

[Gralin]

I’m agnostic on the basic theory.

I note various scientists who do subscribe to the theory have pointed out multiple times that weather events attributed to anthropogenic climate change are natural and regular occurrences and such attribution is damaging their efforts to properly explain and act to prevent the long term consequences of the theory.

You could just say no I'm an anti science deadshit

It takes a lot less effort

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

You could just say no I'm an anti science deadshit

It takes a lot less effort

Why don’t you just say that science for you is an issue of faith?

It’s take a lot less effort.

I should add that there are more streams of science than merely climate.

Edit: See how I managed to do that without the derogatory label? Try it.

 

[Gralin]

Why don’t you just say that science for you is an issue of faith?

It’s take a lot less effort.

I should add that there are more streams of science than merely climate.

Edit: See how I managed to do that without the derogatory label? Try it.

Well Bruce the thing is, I'm not a scientist.

So when scientific issues above my level of knowledge are discussed by experts in that field I tend to think if the vast majority of them agree on something its much more likely to be correct than what some right wing flog with who views everything through the lens of their political beliefs and whatever shite being spouted on sky or fox thinks

So yeah I'm putting faith in the fact that the people who have studied this for decades know more than a presenter on TV that thinks pronouns are the reason Russia invaded Ukraine

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Well Bruce the thing is, I'm not a scientist.

So when scientific issues above my level of knowledge are discussed by experts in that field I tend to think if the vast majority of them agree on something its much more likely to be correct than what some right wing flog with who views everything through the lens of their political beliefs and whatever sh*te being spouted on sky or fox thinks

So yeah I'm putting faith in the fact that the people who have studied this for decades know more than a presenter on TV that thinks pronouns are the reason Russia invaded Ukraine

But what about 20 years later when all of the dire predictions that your chosen side made have failed to come to fruition? Do you then begin to question them? Do you consider that maybe at that point you should have a listen to what the (let’s call it) “minority” of scientists in that particular field think?

 

[Gralin]

But what about 20 years later when all of the dire predictions that your chosen side made have failed to come to fruition? Do you then begin to question them? Do you consider that maybe at that point you should have a listen to what the (let’s call it) “minority” of scientists in that particular field think?

Well I assume at that point you'll still be acting like you were right

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Well I assume at that point you'll still be acting like you were right

The Greenland ice sheet is still there.

The polar bears are still there.

Coastal cities aren’t inundated.

 

[Gralin]

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Again with the insults. To keep it simple, let’s just stick with those three. Why haven’t they come to pass?

 

[Gralin]

Again with the insults. To keep it simple, let’s just stick with those three. Why haven’t they come to pass?

Who said they were going to happen by now?

 

[Chief]

Again with the insults. To keep it simple, let’s just stick with those three. Why haven’t they come to pass?

Why did you pick those three?

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Who said they were going to happen by now?

“The Science”. Don’t you dare now try to bring it back to specifics. You were the one running the “profession of faith” bit. You’re the one running with the collective argument.

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Why did you pick those three?

I’m working north to south.

 

[Gralin]

“The Science”. Don’t you dare now try to bring it back to specifics. You were the one running the “profession of faith” bit. You’re the one running with the collective argument.

What's the science Bruce

 

[Chief]

I’m working north to south.

Scientific.

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

What's the science Bruce

You tell me. You asked if I “believed” in it.

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Scientific.

Would you prefer more Pacific?

Those more frequent and ferocious cyclones?

Those inundated islands?

The dams and rivers that would never fill again?

 

[Gralin]

I don't recall the science making any of the claims Bruce

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I don't recall the science making any of the claims Bruce

You don’t?

I don’t presume to know your age, of course. And perhaps it was in many ways the “progressive” representation of “the science”.

But this is sounding very much like never having been at war with Eurasia.

 

[Gralin]

You don’t?

I don’t presume to know your age, of course. And perhaps it was in many ways the “progressive” representation of “the science”.

But this is sounding very much like never having been at war with Eurasia.

The science was at war with Eurasia?

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

You don’t understand that reference?

 

[kranky al]

Again with the insults. To keep it simple, let’s just stick with those three. Why haven’t they come to pass?

Theres a worst case and a best case scenario.

Al gore didnt do anyone any favours when he presented the worst case scenario as being “the case”

But i have to ask people, how many one in a hundred year events do you need to happen on a yearly basis, when the modelling predicts this is exactly what is going to happen before it is out of control.

At what stage do you say hmmm this aint normal.

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

Theres a worst case and a best case scenario.

Al gore didnt do anyone any favours when he presented the worst case scenario as being “the case”

But i have to ask people, how many one in a hundred year events do you need to happen on a yearly basis, when the modelling predicts this is exactly what is going to happen before it is out of control.

At what stage do you say hmmm this aint normal.

They’re not 1 in 100 year events.

Edit: Here's an article from a year ago.

What astounds about floods in Brisbane is that they continue to take us by surprise

A decade ago, as Brisbane's record floods receded, many residents were left shocked and awed that such a devastating inundation could happen to a modern city. But Brisbane had flooded before — and it will flood again.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Gralin]

You don’t understand that reference?

I don't understand your point because you're refusing to explain it

 

[BruceFromBalnarring]

I don't understand your point because you're refusing to explain it

"Everything we said before we actually didn't say."

Edit: Or alternatively, ""The Science" is whatever you decide it to be given the political objectives of the time."

 

[Gethelred]

I don't understand your point because you're refusing to explain it

Bruce is quoting 1984.

I also kind of take issue with your use of the word 'belief' as far as it pertains to climate change science, even if it's a commonplace use of the word. Science is not a matter of belief, it's a matter of a theory upon which all observable evidence has verified up to this point. 'Belief' denotes a static thing, something which cannot be moved; Michael Faraday is attributed the quote, "I hold my theories on the tips of my fingers, so that the merest breath of fact will blow them away."

I'm not a scientist either, but I respect the work and the process by which they've arrived at their conclusions. The point of the scientific review process is to place enough weight behind a theory that it can be relied upon as though it were almost a fact via repeated testing of a theory by many people over time, in different ways and with different methods in order to increase what is known; that others seem to use that slightest of ambiguities to justify a cavalcade of ignorance or grift demonstrates the degree to which this is misunderstood.