Prediction Should We Rookie Jonty Scharenberg?

[marty36]

Sorry Marty but the Under 18 are leaving Football, As mentioned the under 18 turnover 112 kids every year, how many of them are staying in the Game.
Again I am talking football as a whole not restricting to SANFL or AFL,
While the best of the best will go onto AFL and the best will play SANFL it others we are losing. As it stands now we even shortchanging the kids, because we are restricting their chances of making the AFL or SANFL due to bad development. which flows onto a skill loss in the SANFL.

Maybe if the SANFL reduce its Cap inline with the rest of the country and with the money they will then get from the AFL spend it on a better competition for the under 18 and under 16, that develop Kids to play football for the AFL, SANFL, Ammos and country leagues. instead of losing over half to football.

I know one lad who was interviewed by an AFL club, he isn't playing next year he has finished year 12 wants to concentrate on his career and is concerned injury could cost him. He has an A1 club chasing him but doesn't want to play

The bulk of kids and that would 95% plus play for clubs like aldinga, nurioopta, hemley sharks! Salisbury , Mitchum , country leagues metro leagues

Pretty much none of these kids will be going into AFL very very minute percentage might get to play SANFL

If you wNt to retain players for participation forget development squads put all of that cash into grass roots in an effort to retain numbers

But you will lose a lot as do all sports at that age bracket because of life changes

 

[marty36]

There is a different model to the TAC system as well, which is the NSW/ACT and Queensland academies. This allows to focus elite development for a very few in these academies.

edit: I should say different to the VIC model.

Where are the bulk of footballers in this graph? Have they been forgotten those metro leagues, ammo clubs, country leagues which equate to pretty much 95 % of junior players?

 

[Shaz2012]

Where are the bulk of footballers in this graph? Have they been forgotten those metro leagues, ammo clubs, country leagues which equate to pretty much 95 % of junior players?

Of course. Thats exactly what the model is. Whats the point of funding the 95% anyway. Who cares if your mate doesnt play for the A1 team. If he didnt make the AFL then it really doesnt matter what he does next. If he did scrape onto a list, he would most likely be delisted in a couple of years anyway. But if he spent 4 years in an professional development environment he may have had an outstanding AFL career.

You are underestimating playing for the love of the game. People will always play for the love of the game even out of their own pockets and if they can afford it, let their kids play for their love of the game. If an adult player has a choice between a SANFL career and a better paying career path, he should probably choose the latter anyway.

What would be wrong with a model where the entire bottom right of that graphic is self-funded, by parents, community fundraising and local sponsors. That is the 95% you are talking about. Plenty of clubs around SA already have to fend for themselves. Then if any kids in those programs show talent they could be invited into subsidised/funded programs, eventually to an SA or Crows academy.

 

[marty36]

Of course. Thats exactly what the model is. Whats the point of funding the 95% anyway. Who cares if your mate doesnt play for the A1 team. If he didnt make the AFL then it really doesnt matter what he does next. If he did scrape onto a list, he would most likely be delisted in a couple of years anyway. But if he spent 4 years in an professional development environment he may have had an outstanding AFL career.

You are underestimating playing for the love of the game. People will always play for the love of the game even out of their own pockets and if they can afford it, let their kids play for their love of the game. If an adult player has a choice between a SANFL career and a better paying career path, he should probably choose the latter anyway.

What would be wrong with a model where the entire bottom right of that graphic is self-funded, by parents, community fundraising and local sponsors. That is the 95% you are talking about. Plenty of clubs around SA already have to fend for themselves. Then if any kids in those programs show talent they could be invited into subsidised/funded programs, eventually to an SA or Crows academy.

Then if the AFL want this elite talent, pay for it! Quite simple

But problem is they don't have the $$$$$$$$$


Dangerfieeld is accusing the AFL of disrespecting the players for not paying them enough, clubs are going broke.

If the AFL want to develop talent they better sought themselves out

 

[ad victoriam]

I know one lad who was interviewed by an AFL club, he isn't playing next year he has finished year 12 wants to concentrate on his career and is concerned injury could cost him. He has an A1 club chasing him but doesn't want to play

The bulk of kids and that would 95% plus play for clubs like aldinga, nurioopta, hemley sharks! Salisbury , Mitchum , country leagues metro leagues

Pretty much none of these kids will be going into AFL very very minute percentage might get to play SANFL

If you wNt to retain players for participation forget development squads put all of that cash into grass roots in an effort to retain numbers

But you will lose a lot as do all sports at that age bracket because of life changes

Problem is that 95% figure is wrong are not they are leaving the under 18 and not playing, That why clubs are struggling to get players country clubs are shutting down due to a lack of players. The Growth in SA is not climbing with the population increase.

 

[marty36]

Problem is that 95% figure is wrong are not they are leaving the under 18 and not playing, That why clubs are struggling to get players country clubs are shutting down due to a lack of players. The Growth in SA is not climbing with the population increase.

no your right so should the AFL and SANFL forget trying to develop elite talent and concentrate on the masses where 99% of those lads have no chance what so ever if playing AFL as we know about 10 to 15 each year get drafted and a few more will go onto SANFL

Grow the game is a better option you think?

 

[Shaz2012]

Then if the AFL want this elite talent, pay for it! Quite simple

But problem is they don't have the $$$$$$$$$


Dangerfieeld is accusing the AFL of disrespecting the players for not paying them enough, clubs are going broke.

If the AFL want to develop talent they better sought themselves out

The AFL are developing talent themselvse mate. Just not in SA. That suits them. If it suits you as well, then case closed we can all go home.

Like I said from the beginning. I am saying that we as a state can make the decision to change our system in order to get more pathways for our youngsters to become elite AFL players. If the system is not broken then there is no need to fix it. If the system is broken then we can choose to fix it. At the moment, the SANFL takes its money from owning AFL licenses and stadium management and the SANFL fee the crows pay and any other money it gets and then divides that up some how. They have to use this money to run the SANFL competition as well as administration of all footy in the state.

I am suggesting that the SANFL restructure the way it spends the money to prioritize talent development pathways and introduce an academy system. I dont care who wins next years premiership in the SANFL. But I would like us to rival victoria in the number of draftees every year including say half of the top 20 picks. Someone would still win the SANFL grand final regardless of how much money the SANFL tops up that competition with.

 

[ad victoriam]

no your right so should the AFL and SANFL forget trying to develop elite talent and concentrate on the masses where 99% of those lads have no chance what so ever if playing AFL as we know about 10 to 15 each year get drafted and a few more will go onto SANFL

Grow the game is a better option you think?

Read what I have been saying, What we are doing now is turning the kids away from the game, Development in not just about improving skills, its also about developing the person, making an environment that they enjoy, leaving a lasting impression, understand what these words mean. - work for the Team, Teamwork, Mateship, Fun, Enjoyment, But no the current system does not develop players, they are taking the enjoyment out of the game and focusing 100% on winning,
Here something to ponder -Have you ever wonder why the AFL clubs interview the players and their families these days, Why they hang around after the game to see the players reactions, why they go to training session to watch players
Kids today are a different species to what we were, you need a different approach in developing them, old school will not work does not work and that is correct for most sports.
Winning the game is important, but developing the kids to win the game is more important. And I afraid some cannot tell the difference, which is what wrong with the current system.


One thing about me I am not an AFL, SANFL supporter I am an Aussie Rule Football supporter, who is just as happy going to watch a country game as SANFL games. I would see about 80 games of football a year, and hate the offseason.

 

[Bicks]

 

[marty36]

Read what I have been saying, What we are doing now is turning the kids away from the game, Development in not just about improving skills, its also about developing the person, making an environment that they enjoy, leaving a lasting impression, understand what these words mean. - work for the Team, Teamwork, Mateship, Fun, Enjoyment, But no the current system does not develop players, they are taking the enjoyment out of the game and focusing 100% on winning,
Here something to ponder -Have you ever wonder why the AFL clubs interview the players and their families these days, Why they hang around after the game to see the players reactions, why they go to training session to watch players
Kids today are a different species to what we were, you need a different approach in developing them, old school will not work does not work and that is correct for most sports.
Winning the game is important, but developing the kids to win the game is more important. And I afraid some cannot tell the difference, which is what wrong with the current system.


One thing about me I am not an AFL, SANFL supporter I am an Aussie Rule Football supporter, who is just as happy going to watch a country game as SANFL games. I would see about 80 games of football a year, and hate the offseason.

They simply don't have the cash to do what you want they live and breathe on volunteers and some sponsors to keep them a float and that's just not SANFL that's all leagues

If the afl want to create a pathway they will have to pay for it but I think they aren't rolling in it either with everyone with their hand out

They see the northern states far more important to the game than anything in SA

 

[Shaz2012]

They simply don't have the cash to do what you want they live and breathe on volunteers and some sponsors to keep them a float and that's just not SANFL that's all leagues

If the afl want to create a pathway they will have to pay for it but I think they aren't rolling in it either with everyone with their hand out

They see the northern states far more important to the game than anything in SA

Forget about the AFL Marty. Dont look to them for the answer. I agree the SANFL doesnt have much money. But its about prioritising what little money they do have. Footy is and will continue to live and breathe on volunteers and local sponsors. For a start, let the SANFL clubs fend for themselves. They will have more volunteers and sponsors than anyone else as well as game day income. The TV rights and sponsorhip rights for the league itself can also be divided up amongst the clubs. If that is not enough and means they have to return to being a semi-professional league then so be it.

 

[marty36]

Forget about the AFL Marty. Dont look to them for the answer. I agree the SANFL doesnt have much money. But its about prioritising what little money they do have. Footy is and will continue to live and breathe on volunteers and local sponsors. For a start, let the SANFL clubs fend for themselves. They will have more volunteers and sponsors than anyone else as well as game day income. The TV rights and sponsorhip rights for the league itself can also be divided up amongst the clubs. If that is not enough and means they have to return to being a semi-professional league then so be it.

Hahahaha what TV rights they pay three qtrs of a million to have the game televised

 

[Shaz2012]

Hahahaha what TV rights they pay three qtrs of a million to have the game televised

Your proving the point Marty. The SANFL competition is being subsidised. There is not enough interest to warrant it being topped up with money that the SANFL (the administrator of all footy in the state) gets into its coffers. I doubt that $750k makes a lick of difference to the league. Just make the games available live and replay from the SANFL website and youtube and anybody who is interested will be able to watch it. How many new supporters or new interest do you think they get by televising on the ABC? This looks to be one example of how the SANFL is mismanaging money that it gets.

 

[marty36]

Your proving the point Marty. The SANFL competition is being subsidised. There is not enough interest to warrant it being topped up with money that the SANFL (the administrator of all footy in the state) gets into its coffers. I doubt that $750k makes a lick of difference to the league. Just make the games available live and replay from the SANFL website and youtube and anybody who is interested will be able to watch it. How many new supporters or new interest do you think they get by televising on the ABC? This looks to be one example of how the SANFL is mismanaging money that it gets.

If you think the SANFL should do things differently put your money where your mouth is volunteer your time, instead of sitting on your high horse and tell people how they should do things better with the time they are volunteering

My god how people who don't volunteer would dare suggest anything

 

[Shaz2012]

If you think the SANFL should do things differently put your money where your mouth is volunteer your time, instead of sitting on your high horse and tell people how they should do things better with the time they are volunteering

My god how people who don't volunteer would dare suggest anything

How in the least would that accomplish what I am suggesting. And I can suggest what ever I like.

 

[marty36]

How in the least would that accomplish what I am suggesting. And I can suggest what ever I like.

You certainly can but coming from someone who does volunteer, you can say what you like you are a hypocrite who wants to make suggestions but is to lazy to get off their fat bum to do anything about it. Don't stress the world is full of people like you! Hahahaha

 

[SellarStardom]

We should have an elite pathway in SA and the best option would be for the SA Football Commission to develop a model that the AFL will want and then charge them accordingly for the developed players as transfer fees. This notion of SANFL or SA FC developing and paying for a system that the AFL benefits from who in turn provide bugger all in transfer fees when recruiting is a joke.

But the bigger issue here is kids turning away from the game that can only be put down to poor envirinments and lack of opportunity. The latter is key here. Even in a good year there might be 8 players drafted. If they are not drafted what are the other choices.

Thats why they need a second division.

 

[marty36]

We should have an elite pathway in SA and the best option would be for the SA Football Commission to develop a model that the AFL will want and then charge them accordingly for the developed players as transfer fees. This notion of SANFL or SA FC developing and paying for a system that the AFL benefits from who in turn provide bugger all in transfer fees when recruiting is a joke.

But the bigger issue here is kids turning away from the game that can only be put down to poor envirinments and lack of opportunity. The latter is key here. Even in a good year there might be 8 players drafted. If they are not drafted what are the other choices.

Thats why they need a second division.

Wasnt there 16 drafted this year? as is most years!

But I agree if the SANFL commision want to do it and get the AFL to subsidise it away friom the normal junior footbal that they coordinate, more than happy, But will the AFL do that, they have the players wanting more, they pour millions into the northern states, it was written 14 of the 18 clubs are struggling financially. Pretty sure its not high on their agenda

 

[Team DJ]

Also have to remember that there are 10 Victorian Clubs, so if it came down to a toss of the coin, the majority of Clubs are going to select the home grown talent. No relocation costs or risk of go home factor.

 

[Shaz2012]

We should have an elite pathway in SA and the best option would be for the SA Football Commission to develop a model that the AFL will want and then charge them accordingly for the developed players as transfer fees. This notion of SANFL or SA FC developing and paying for a system that the AFL benefits from who in turn provide bugger all in transfer fees when recruiting is a joke.

But the bigger issue here is kids turning away from the game that can only be put down to poor envirinments and lack of opportunity. The latter is key here. Even in a good year there might be 8 players drafted. If they are not drafted what are the other choices.

Thats why they need a second division.

Yeah. Thats an interesting idea. The AFL system is already similar to the transfer fee system that soccer has, except instead of money the currency is draft picks. In soccer there is also a training compensation fee that is paid down and divided amongst a player's junior clubs according to some formula, payable with each transfer until the player reaches a certain age.

I had an idea for a similar model that could be tied to the total pool of money paid to AFL players. A small percentage of each AFL player's salary would need to be set aside and paid out to that players junior clubs as a development fee. Kind of like super. Clubs that produce better players would be rewarded with more money. This would provide income and incentive for say a crows academy, as well as the existing clubs around SA. So if a player started at U/8s at club A and then moves to the crows academy 7 years later and joins the crows U/14s and then is drafted 4 years later a formula is applied and both club A and the crows academy would share a development royalty for that player each year that that player is on an AFL list.

 

[SellarStardom]

Yeah. Thats an interesting idea. The AFL system is already similar to the transfer fee system that soccer has, except instead of money the currency is draft picks. In soccer there is also a training compensation fee that is paid down and divided amongst a player's junior clubs according to some formula, payable with each transfer until the player reaches a certain age.

I had an idea for a similar model that could be tied to the total pool of money paid to AFL players. A small percentage of each AFL player's salary would need to be set aside and paid out to that players junior clubs as a development fee. Kind of like super. Clubs that produce better players would be rewarded with more money. This would provide income and incentive for say a crows academy, as well as the existing clubs around SA. So if a player started at U/8s at club A and then moves to the crows academy 7 years later and joins the crows U/14s and then is drafted 4 years later a formula is applied and both club A and the crows academy would share a development royalty for that player each year that that player is on an AFL list.

What i would like to see the players association do is to think through their salaries, systems of management for players post retirement and support for their development system. The first two are being covered but the players should push for a better transfer fee structure.

Clubs are struggling whilst the AFL gets bigger every year. I would love to see the AFL Players Assocuation tie up with the SANFL and WAFL versions and push for outcomes across the top leagues.

I will always be in favour of creating a State League Championship as a second tier comp to the AFL but few administrators appear willing

 

[GreyCrow]

My god how people who don't volunteer would dare suggest anything

Do you volunteer anywhere?

 

[marty36]

Do you volunteer anywhere?

Have all my life,coaching, umpiring being on comittees, both footy and other sports

How about you?

 

[GreyCrow]

Have all my life,coaching, umpiring being on comittees, both footy and other sports

How about you?

Same. Not so much the last 5 years due to age and family issues.

 

[Bicks]

Just to give you an idea what the Ballarat Rebels do to select their players for the 2017 TAC season.....Over 300 players in the South West of Victoria will be tested in coming weeks to make up the 2017 Roster..