Smacking Kids: Is It Really Abuse? Or Does It Help Them Learn?

[Jean Claude Vas Deferens]

If my son ever comes home and tells me he's being bullied or if I ever get wind of it, this what he will be told:

1. Smash the main tormentor. Wait til he's right in your face and not expecting and smash him. If he goes down, jump on him and keep smashing him

2. He's probably bigger than you and has mates, so there's a good chance you'll cop a beating. Grin and bare it. Don't cry. Don't run to the teachers. Just try to defend yourself whether that means a bear hug or whatever.

3. If you get hauled up in front of the teachers, say nothing. They'll know what happened (they know who the bullies and their victims are) but will try use threats of punishment to get you to dob. Do not do it. Cop the punishment.

You'll never be bothered again. Bullies pick on weak people. You have just shown them they even though they can beat you, you're not weak.

A much better solution than being mentally ****ed over indefinitely.

You're not Chopper Read by any chance?

 

[Dont be a lemon]

If my son ever comes home and tells me he's being bullied or if I ever get wind of it, this what he will be told:

1. Smash the main tormentor. Wait til he's right in your face and not expecting and smash him. If he goes down, jump on him and keep smashing him

2. He's probably bigger than you and has mates, so there's a good chance you'll cop a beating. Grin and bare it. Don't cry. Don't run to the teachers. Just try to defend yourself whether that means a bear hug or whatever.

3. If you get hauled up in front of the teachers, say nothing. They'll know what happened (they know who the bullies and their victims are) but will try use threats of punishment to get you to dob. Do not do it. Cop the punishment.

You'll never be bothered again. Bullies pick on weak people. You have just shown them they even though they can beat you, you're not weak.

A much better solution than being mentally ****ed over indefinitely.

Terrible advice.

 

[Monkster]

Terrible advice.

Good advice, something I should have done instead of being too scared of getting hurt (which was happening anyway).

 

[Ripper]

There comes a time when it is the only action available.

I remeber one time when my two eldest were at eachother all the time on a trip to Perth.

After all the usual things were tried :

Trying to reason
Putting them apart only created grief for the one in between.

Once I stopped the car dragged them out and whacjed them , there was no more trouble and if it did look like starting up again all I had to do was lift of the gas.

We have known many parents who have taken the soft option and many times the Parents have been abused once the children reach adolecence as I believe there were not enough boundaries set early on.

I remember one time We were having a barby out bush with another family where the boys 11-13 showed absolute disrespect to their new age parents.

Kids pick things up and before you knew it My boys were talking to us the same way.

I politely explained that though those children may talk to their parents that way , if they persisted there would be trouble.

Some times you have to assert who is the biggest dog in the pack.

I could count on one hand the number of times I actually had to do it in 20 years.

Now I am pleased to say that my children are among my best mates.

 

[bunsen burner]

Terrible advice.

so what's your suggestion?

 

[Chief]

Ripper this is the deceptive part of it - it works sometimes. Like I said when it happened to us as kids it was more a transfer of power to the kids than an effective assertion of authority.

Advocating non-violent methods does not mean advocating no behavioural control.

As for your example of the car trip my sister has a great method. She just stops the car and says "we're not going anywhere until this stops". It works. Sometimes it takes a bit of time, but it works EVERY time.

I'm going to sound pompous again when I ask you: Why did your kids think it was acceptable to get at each other like they were in the car? The root of a problem like that lies in their inability to handle boredom properly and, maybe, your refusal to stop the car and engage with them with for a short while to get their minds off the long trip.

The Pavlovian response to the car slowing linked with a violent correction sounds effective to some. After all one belting isn't going to scar them for life. To me it sounds more like a missed opportunity to do something more creative to release their frustration and energy and teach them how to do this for themselves in the future. A sacrifice of your longer term goal of raising happy kids into secure, self-reliant adults for the short-term goal of a smoother car journey.

Sounds "new age" but diversionary tactics work, save you grief in the future and most importantly give the kids a new skill and make them happier and more confident people.

This isn't just me, a guy with one kid, talking. It's a large body of experts (and not just the ones flogging a get-happy-quick book) with extensive psychological study and experience under their belts.

 

[Ripper]

Ripper this is the deceptive part of it - it works sometimes. Like I said when it happened to us as kids it was more a transfer of power to the kids than an effective assertion of authority.

Advocating non-violent methods does not mean advocating no behavioural control.

For sure, There are other ways to skin a cat, and We tried most of them as both of us had voilent upbringings with an alcoholic parent and We Vowed we would never put our children through that.

As for your example of the car trip my sister has a great method. She just stops the car and says "we're not going anywhere until this stops". It works. Sometimes it takes a bit of time, but it works EVERY time.

Time is something We didn't have a lot of on that day. We had an 8 hour trip trying to get down into the farm country before dark.

I'm going to sound pompous again when I ask you: Why did your kids think it was acceptable to get at each other like they were in the car? The root of a problem like that lies in their inability to handle boredom properly and, maybe, your refusal to stop the car and engage with them with for a short while to get their minds off the long trip.

Kids will be kids especially when you get four together, they often egg one another on and will push the boundaries on occassion. On this occasion I think the eldest had just come home from Boarding school and they were intent on re establishing the pecking order.

The Pavlovian response to the car slowing linked with a violent correction sounds effective to some. After all one belting isn't going to scar them for life. To me it sounds more like a missed opportunity to do something more creative to release their frustration and energy and teach them how to do this for themselves in the future. A sacrifice of your longer term goal of raising happy kids into secure, self-reliant adults for the short-term goal of a smoother car journey.

They are all happy well adjusted adult's now. Getting off the Gas worked for years without having to say a word.

Sounds "new age" but diversionary tactics work, save you grief in the future and most importantly give the kids a new skill and make them happier and more confident people.

This isn't just me, a guy with one kid, talking. It's a large body of experts (and not just the ones flogging a get-happy-quick book) with extensive psychological study and experience under their belts.

Sounds good, but I am not so sure, The new age parents We mixed with got treated like Crap from their own children as they had no respect for them as they got older causing the parents great pain.

And some of them have tried to be the best parents there are.

You know how it goes.

When you are a kid you think your parents know everything.
When you are an adolecent you think your parents know nothing.
When you get older you realise that your parents wen't perfect but did know a few things after all.


I ask you why then in this new age of enlightenment that We have so many more adolecents running off the rails.

 

[teams]

I ask you why then in this new age of enlightenment that We have so many more adolecents running off the rails.

Think it is respect for other people that is missing. Do you think corporal punishment meted out by parents is the answer to that?

 

[Ripper]

I would like to add that it vitally important to have something that you have in common with your boys if you are a Father.

Over the years we have built killer PC's together, built killer racecars and gone away racing together, and gone to the footy together.

One actually did his trade here.

Once we had 12 friends come for a long weekend from Boarding school to meet His "really cool" parents which was a bit of a shock but flattering all the same.

We were tripping over bodies throughout the house.

 

[Ripper]

Think it is respect for other people that is missing. Do you think corporal punishment meted out by parents is the answer to that?

I think it is not having enough boundaries set early in life.

Kids reach adolecence and hit the real world and find that the boss won't put up with the nonsense that their well meaning parents allowed that and it then comes as a huge shock.

Similar thing happens when Parent belatedly try to exert control that was not there when the children were young.

That usually results in tears as well.

 

[teams]

I think it is not having enough boundaries set early in life.

Kids reach adolecence and hit the real world and find that the boss won't put up with the nonsense that their well meaning parents allowed that and it then comes as a huge shock.

Similar thing happens when Parent belatedly try to exert control that was not there when the children were young.

That usually results in tears as well.

Boundaries doesn't ring true. Have to make them aware of a need to be able to function outside the hunky-doryness of the family, fights and all within the frame work of that gizmo. Suppose boundaries if you mean don't go killing strangers but respect is more than performing an adverse effect on another.

It is letting another go first in a queue, listening, not thinking of what you want to say while someone else is talking, sharing on their birthday, etc.

Dunno.

 

[Chief]

I ask you why then in this new age of enlightenment that We have so many more adolecents running off the rails.

Do we really? Or do we have a new set of challenges, temptations and a whole lot of information being thrown at them and we're expecting them to behave like we did with the same input our parents gave us?

 

[Dont be a lemon]

I ask you why then in this new age of enlightenment that We have so many more adolecents running off the rails.

I think the teens who "run off the rails", as you put it, are doing so because they have lousy parents or other factors in their life affecting them (both probably).

Being a "smacker" parent or a "non-smacker" parent is not what determines whether a parent is 'good, 'so-so', or 'bad'. Neither is the amount of smacking what determines whether a child is 'good', 'so-so', or 'bad'.

It seems to me that parents who smack are doing it to save time/energy, NOT because it's actually nessacary.

 

[Ripper]

Do we really? Or do we have a new set of challenges, temptations and a whole lot of information being thrown at them and we're expecting them to behave like we did with the same input our parents gave us?

As far as I can make out the only thing that is different is that kids have more information, the challenges and temptations were always there.


My children were certainly better informed from us than We were from our parents.

That in theory should make them better equipped to not run off the rails.

I admire you ideals, but just remember these new age experts are contradicting what has served humanity well since the year dot.

They are trying out their theorys on you & your children.

 

[Dont be a lemon]

I admire you ideals, but just remember these new age experts are contradicting what has served humanity well since the year dot.

A lot of the "bad things" about society were not discussed in years, centuries before. Things were swept under the carpet and ignored and those who 'spoke out' were shuned. It's only in fairly recent times in human history that we've become so open about the errors and problems of our ways.

 

[bunsen burner]

A lot of the "bad things" about society were not discussed in years, centuries before. Things were swept under the carpet and ignored and those who 'spoke out' were shuned. It's only in fairly recent times in human history that we've become so open about the errors and problems of our ways.

Are you going to answer my question?

 

[Ripper]

A lot of the "bad things" about society were not discussed in years, centuries before. Things were swept under the carpet and ignored and those who 'spoke out' were shuned. It's only in fairly recent times in human history that we've become so open about the errors and problems of our ways.

That is a good thing IMHO. I think smacking should not be used as a regular measure as it loses it's "shock" value.

But there are time when it is the best and most effective option.

I reckon more damage to a childs's self worth can be done with badly chosen words from a parent.

Growing up, I got some horror floggings ,got the cane at school but the thing that effected my self esteem growing up the most and has lingered is the Verbal abuse from an alcoholic Father.


Rippers parenting tips.
Some of these are easier said than done too.


i. Always present a united front from you and your spouse (even if you disagree at the time . sort it out in private)


ii. Never argue in front of the children

iii; Don't let the children play one parent off against the other

iv; Talk openly to your children, as they reach their teen year tell them the things you have stuffed up (giving truthful examples) that if you had your time over you would not do.

This is particularly relevent for boys,if they grow up thinking that their Dad is perfect , they get a real shock and think that they have been dudded when they get to the age where one day they suddenly realise that their Dad isn't perfect.

They go from idolising to hating almost imediately with the confused Parent wondering WFT has happened.

It is a sad day when Dad suddenly becomes not the most important Male in a Daughters life as well.

So be prepared for it , don't take it personally and understand that it is normal.

v; Encourage them to bring their friends home , so You know who they are mixing with.

vi; Try to find something in common with every child and take a genuine interest in it.

vii; Do not tolerate any abuse under any circumstances form a child to either parent.

viii; Continually warn about the dangers of peer group pressure , pointing out that it takes more balls to say no to something stupid than to go along with it. (examples of where you failed this and the consequences help here as well).

Cheers , As I have said before my job is fairly well done and all that is left is to spoil the Grandchildren rotten (when they arrive).

Hope this is of help.

 

[Jean Claude Vas Deferens]

That is a good thing IMHO. I think smacking should not be used as a regular measure as it loses it's "shock" value.

But there are time when it is the best and most effective option.

I reckon more damage to a childs's self worth can be done with badly chosen words from a parent.

Growing up, I got some horror floggings ,got the cane at school but the thing that effected my self esteem growing up the most and has lingered is the Verbal abuse from an alcoholic Father.


Rippers parenting tips.
Some of these are easier said than done too.


i. Always present a united front from you and your spouse (even if you disagree at the time . sort it out in private)


ii. Never argue in front of the children

iii; Don't let the children play one parent off against the other

iv; Talk openly to your children, as they reach their teen year tell them the things you have stuffed up (giving truthful examples) that if you had your time over you would not do.

This is particularly relevent for boys,if they grow up thinking that their Dad is perfect , they get a real shock and think that they have been dudded when they get to the age where one day they suddenly realise that their Dad isn't perfect.

They go from idolising to hating almost imediately with the confused Parent wondering WFT has happened.

It is a sad day when Dad suddenly becomes not the most important Male in a Daughters life as well.

So be prepared for it , don't take it personally and understand that it is normal.

v; Encourage them to bring their friends home , so You know who they are mixing with.

vi; Try to find something in common with every child and take a genuine interest in it.

vii; Do not tolerate any abuse under any circumstances form a child to either parent.

viii; Continually warn about the dangers of peer group pressure , pointing out that it takes more balls to say no to something stupid than to go along with it. (examples of where you failed this and the consequences help here as well).

Cheers , As I have said before my job is fairly well done and all that is left is to spoil the Grandchildren rotten (when they arrive).

Hope this is of help.

Some good commonsense advice in there.

 

[carntheroos4eva]

so what's your suggestion?

Do what Chief does because what he does is the right way. Hitting your son is just plain wrong all he will do when he is older will punch you in the face or in the arm or do some damage to you. He will even do that to other kids.
My niece hits you if you hit her and we have said to her that she isn't allowed to have her favourite movie on or play on the computer. She gets told that she has to go straight to her bedroom and find something else to play with.

 

[Macca19]

I only rarely was smacked as a child, only when I did something seriously wrong and it taught me not to do that again. My mum does family day care and isnt allowed to smack the children (obviously) but uses every other method. She is quite good at controlling the children and has taken over quite a few bad eggs that other carers couldnt control and shes turned them around into decent children.

I dunno...I wouldnt want to smack my children but I dont have any problem with it. In my opinion, sometimes a short shrap smack on the butt is necessary. I never had a problem that I sometimes got a smack when I did something wrong.

This will be a question that will never ever get resolved as every kid is different. What works for one kid wont work for the next one.

 

[Captain Sensible]

My kids are bashing each other as I type.



Something about musical tastes.

 

[Catfish Jake]

My kids are bashing each other as I type.



Something about musical tastes.

Who's winning?

 

[Captain Sensible]

Who's winning?

The argument was over whether The Pogues were more punk than folk.


The punk faction won because he could yell louder.

 

[Catfish Jake]

The argument was over whether The Pogues were more punk than folk.


The punk faction won because he could yell louder.

Your children are wise in the ways of the world.

 

[Chief]

I think you could argue that on a song-by-song basis then tally up punk vs folk. Then the punk faction would stomp on the heads of the weedy folk faction and claim victory.