Team of Champions vs Champion Team?

[RUNVS]

I would honestly love to see this happen. I would love to see a Team of Champions game vs the team that just won the flag.

So Collingwood vs the All Australian team, obviously taking out the Collingwood players from the AA team.

So something like

All Australian
B: Sicily, Wilkie, Stewart
HB: Jack, Weitering, Houston
C: Gulden, Bontempelli, Dawson
HF: Rozee, Walker, Petracca
F: Cameron, Curnow, Greene (c)
Foll: English, Butters Serong
Int: Martin, Larkey, Merrett, Green

vs

Collingwood
B: Murphy, Moore (c), Howe
HB: Maynard, Frampton, Quaynor
C: Sidebottom, Pendlebury, Markov
HF: Hill, Mihocek, Elliott
F: McCreery, De Goey, J.Daicos
Foll: Cox, N.Daicos, Crisp
Int: Mitchell, Cameron, Hoskin-Elliott, Ginnivan

Either set after the Grand Final, a few weeks after, or set during the preseason the following year.

The AA team is given a week to train together and no practice games together.

Would you be curious to see a game such as this?

Also who do you think would win and why?

 

[Colonial]

Champion team.
No good having stars everywhere, if it isn’t a balanced side.

 

[lordbob]

2008 GF says hello

 

[PhatBoy]

It can go either way, tactics have a lot to do with it.

Year after year in the NRL Queensland proved that an inferior team on paper can trump a better looking unit but eventually it became apparent that their side had better players in positions that counted and they could pretty much put who they wanted in the other spots and as long as they bought into the team culture and gave their all for the game plan, they would win more often than not. Some of their more recent victories however have been more ‘champion team’ based but rugby league is a game that allows that to happen.

The ‘dam wall’ doesn’t HAVE to crack, and the lower scoring system means 1-2 scoring plays are all that champion team needs to ensure victory if their determined dedicated group can hold fast.

I don’t think the same is as true in AFL and while there are exceptions I think over a decent sample size you would see a team of champions win more often than not

 

[PhatBoy]

2008 GF says hello

Absolutely a worthy point and in no way is this taking away from the hawks who fully deserved their win, but a genuine question, if that game was played numerous times do you think the result would be replicated often?

 

[RUNVS]

2008 GF says hello

Add Cox, Judd, Sandilands, Fevola, N.Reiwoldt, Pavlich etc to the Geelong side and Hawthorn would not have won in 2008. That is no criticism of Hawthorn, but even the 6 players I just listed would have made a huge difference.

 

[lordbob]

Absolutely a worthy point and in no way is this taking away from the hawks who fully deserved their win, but a genuine question, if that game was played numerous times do you think the result would be replicated often?

Yes, they were slightly better throughout the final series. They timed their preparation that year to peak specifically during the finals. Geelong just dominated all season. If the GF was played in the middle of the season, eelong would have won 8-9/10. They were incredibly consistent and dominant throughout the season. But come finals, i think the hawks of 08 took it up a notch and would have probably won 6-7/10.

Both sides had a very dominant finals series, both with similarly large wins over st kilda, but the hawks demolition of the doggies in the QF was a more dominant display than when the cats beat them in the PF.

I guess you could argue that if the GF was 10 games long like how NBA finals are 7 games long, then the cats would win more simply due to the fact that they were more consistent and the hawks built up to that burst in the finals series. In which case id see the hawks taking an early lead in the series and the cats coming back strong to win over all. But i assume when you say if you "played numerous times" then you mean just 1 GF game, in which case hawks for mine.

If it were 10 games, i think cats would win 8-9/10, simply due to hawks losing croad in the GF who was our main key back and we lacked anyone else really to play on the big opponent forwards, as was evident in the following years until Lake's recruitment.

This was the year of clarko's cluster, the dawn of the zone whole ground defense that the rest of the competition hadnt woken up to yet.

 

[PhatBoy]

Yes, they were slightly better throughout the final series. They timed their preparation that year to peak specifically during the finals. Geelong just dominated all season. If the GF was played in the middle of the season, eelong would have won 8-9/10. They were incredibly consistent and dominant throughout the season. But come finals, i think the hawks of 08 took it up a notch and would have probably won 6-7/10.

Both sides had a very dominant finals series, both with similarly large wins over st kilda, but the hawks demolition of the doggies in the QF was a more dominant display than when the cats beat them in the PF.

I guess you could argue that if the GF was 10 games long like how NBA finals are 7 games long, then the cats would win more simply due to the fact that they were more consistent and the hawks built up to that burst in the finals series. In which case id see the hawks taking an early lead in the series and the cats coming back strong to win over all. But i assume when you say if you "played numerous times" then you mean just 1 GF game, in which case hawks for mine.

If it were 10 games, i think cats would win 8-9/10, simply due to hawks losing croad in the GF who was our main key back and we lacked anyone else really to play on the big opponent forwards, as was evident in the following years until Lake's recruitment.

This was the year of clarko's cluster, the dawn of the zone whole ground defense that the rest of the competition hadnt woken up to yet.

There’s merit in your argument, that’s fair. I think the way you look at it, ie. if it was played ‘on that day, with that build up and on that form’ 10 times, yep. I can cop that.

 

[juss]

I would honestly love to see this happen. I would love to see a Team of Champions game vs the team that just won the flag.

So Collingwood vs the All Australian team, obviously taking out the Collingwood players from the AA team.

So something like

All Australian
B: Sicily, Wilkie, Stewart
HB: Jack, Weitering, Houston
C: Gulden, Bontempelli, Dawson
HF: Rozee, Walker, Petracca
F: Cameron, Curnow, Greene (c)
Foll: English, Butters Serong
Int: Martin, Larkey, Merrett, Green

vs

Collingwood
B: Murphy, Moore (c), Howe
HB: Maynard, Frampton, Quaynor
C: Sidebottom, Pendlebury, Markov
HF: Hill, Mihocek, Elliott
F: McCreery, De Goey, J.Daicos
Foll: Cox, N.Daicos, Crisp
Int: Mitchell, Cameron, Hoskin-Elliott, Ginnivan

Either set after the Grand Final, a few weeks after, or set during the preseason the following year.

The AA team is given a week to train together and no practice games together.

Would you be curious to see a game such as this?

Also who do you think would win and why?

If given enough time and some sort of reason to care, that team of champions obviously give every team a bath.

But with a week to train after the season, they probably don't give a s**t in an exhibition match compared to guys playing with more pride, cohesion and chemistry for their club.

 

[Randall Stevens]

Absolutely a worthy point and in no way is this taking away from the hawks who fully deserved their win, but a genuine question, if that game was played numerous times do you think the result would be replicated often?

I reckon if it had been a best of 5 series Cats win 3-2, assuming both sides remain in the form they were in during the ‘actual’ finals.

I don’t think I’ve ever been more optimistic after a loss than after the game when Geelong won narrowly in Round 17 that year. In my mind that night Hawks went from the second best team in the comp but a long way behind Geelong to being absolute contenders.

Over the entire season Geelong were clearly the best team in it, but of couse as many teams have found - including the Hawks 4 years later - that doesn’t matter!

 

[Randall Stevens]

To answer the OP, familiarity and motivation would be with Collingwood, but clearly overall class would be with the all stars.
Back in the 80’s there were occasional pre season games between the reigning premier and the ‘Sun’ newspaper all stars. I can’t comment on the intensity of the matches, but to my recall the all stars always won.

 

[PhatBoy]

I reckon if it had been a best of 5 series Cats win 3-2, assuming both sides remain in the form they were in during the ‘actual’ finals.

I don’t think I’ve ever been more optimistic after a loss than after the game when Geelong won narrowly in Round 17 that year. In my mind that night Hawks went from the second best team in the comp but a long way behind Geelong to being absolute contenders.

Over the entire season Geelong were clearly the best team in it, but of couse as many teams have found - including the Hawks 4 years later - that doesn’t matter!

I actually put money on the hawks in the Gf.

Because everyone we played was at long odds I got into the habit of backing the opposition over the last 6-7 weeks as a bit of a saver just in case we slipped up and I genuinely gave you guys a chance and that game was part of my rationale

 

[Randall Stevens]

I actually put money on the hawks in the Gf.

Because everyone we played was at long odds I got into the habit of backing the opposition over the last 6-7 weeks as a bit of a saver just in case we slipped up and I genuinely gave you guys a chance and that game was part of my rationale

Can you remember now what the odds were? And how much did the betting win dull the pain of the footy loss? ( I have a - clearly stupid - superstition of never betting on or against the Hawks).

 

[PhatBoy]

Can you remember now what the odds were? And how much did the betting win dull the pain of the footy loss? ( I have a - clearly stupid - superstition of never betting on or against the Hawks).

Yeah it was about $3.80 or thereabouts from memory

 

[lordbob]

Add Cox, Judd, Sandilands, Fevola, N.Reiwoldt, Pavlich etc to the Geelong side and Hawthorn would not have won in 2008. That is no criticism of Hawthorn, but even the 6 players I just listed would have made a huge difference.

Would have been hilarious watching Fevola in that type of game, in the same season where the hawks flooded him to stop him getting to 100 goals in the last game of the season.

As said above, give them a week to gel together and they lose. Give them a decent chunk of time and games together to learn each others game styles and running patterns and maybe its a different story.

Just because they are all australians doesnt necesarily mean they are a well balanced team. AA teams notoriously dont select the best wingers of the year on the wing for instance. So id argue the sum of the parts would be less than the whole.

Whether they would beat the premiers would depend on the type of team the premiers were.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Absolutely a worthy point and in no way is this taking away from the hawks who fully deserved their win, but a genuine question, if that game was played numerous times do you think the result would be replicated often?

The same logic applies to the 09 flag, would St Kilda have beaten you more times out of 10 and thus be considered a better team? They did better in H&A than you.

 

[PhatBoy]

The same logic applies to the 09 flag, would St Kilda have beaten you more times out of 10 and thus be considered a better team? They did better in H&A than you.

They beat us on the final kick of the game in the home and away match. If Gardiner doesn’t take that mark, the two sides finish 19-3 apiece.

I personally think the team of champions wins more often than not. I think that’s borne out by the fact that Geelong stayed up for longer than St Kilda did. But in that particular timeframe at that moment, maybe not. The Saints were formidable and maybe around that compressed period if we met them 10 times they win more often than not.

 

[Mr Meow]

The same logic applies to the 09 flag, would St Kilda have beaten you more times out of 10 and thus be considered a better team? They did better in H&A than you.

Geelong were favourites heading into the 2009 grand final while in 2008, Hawthorn were $3.80 underdogs.

As per usual, you are breathtakingly wide of the mark.

 

[Warwick]

I would honestly love to see this happen. I would love to see a Team of Champions game vs the team that just won the flag.

So Collingwood vs the All Australian team, obviously taking out the Collingwood players from the AA team.

So something like

All Australian
B: Sicily, Wilkie, Stewart
HB: Jack, Weitering, Houston
C: Gulden, Bontempelli, Dawson
HF: Rozee, Walker, Petracca
F: Cameron, Curnow, Greene (c)
Foll: English, Butters Serong
Int: Martin, Larkey, Merrett, Green

vs

Collingwood
B: Murphy, Moore (c), Howe
HB: Maynard, Frampton, Quaynor
C: Sidebottom, Pendlebury, Markov
HF: Hill, Mihocek, Elliott
F: McCreery, De Goey, J.Daicos
Foll: Cox, N.Daicos, Crisp
Int: Mitchell, Cameron, Hoskin-Elliott, Ginnivan

Either set after the Grand Final, a few weeks after, or set during the preseason the following year.

The AA team is given a week to train together and no practice games together.

Would you be curious to see a game such as this?

Also who do you think would win and why?

The Lions have been absolutely shafted by your “replacements” just quietly..

 

[RUNVS]

The Lions have been absolutely shafted by your “replacements” just quietly..

I considered Harris Andrews but in all honesty I don't think he had his best season.

 

[Warwick]

I considered Harris Andrews but in all honesty I don't think he had his best season.

Yeah I reckon the Brownlow medalist could have found a spot though tbh.

 

[Cleansweep17]

Geelong were favourites heading into the 2009 grand final while in 2008, Hawthorn were $3.80 underdogs.

As per usual, you are breathtakingly wide of the mark.

That’s my point in both cases the champion team (Hawks) either won or statistically should’ve won (St Kilda). Despite having less AA selections than you over this time due to superior coaching.

Like people on bigfooty most punters like the look of the team of champions but on game day most of the time the champion team wins. Hence the saying.

 

[Sttew]

I would honestly love to see this happen. I would love to see a Team of Champions game vs the team that just won the flag.

So Collingwood vs the All Australian team, obviously taking out the Collingwood players from the AA team.

So something like

All Australian
B: Sicily, Wilkie, Stewart
HB: Jack, Weitering, Houston
C: Gulden, Bontempelli, Dawson
HF: Rozee, Walker, Petracca
F: Cameron, Curnow, Greene (c)
Foll: English, Butters Serong
Int: Martin, Larkey, Merrett, Green

vs

Collingwood
B: Murphy, Moore (c), Howe
HB: Maynard, Frampton, Quaynor
C: Sidebottom, Pendlebury, Markov
HF: Hill, Mihocek, Elliott
F: McCreery, De Goey, J.Daicos
Foll: Cox, N.Daicos, Crisp
Int: Mitchell, Cameron, Hoskin-Elliott, Ginnivan

Either set after the Grand Final, a few weeks after, or set during the preseason the following year.

The AA team is given a week to train together and no practice games together.

Would you be curious to see a game such as this?

Also who do you think would win and why?

In theory a good idea, but what happens if you get a 2007 scenario with the Premiers dominating AA with 9 selections?

 

[HavUEvaSeenTheRain]

Team of Champions easily. Champion teams still rely on their champions to win them games.
You’re talking about having 22 of about the top 27 best players on one side. That’s not comparable to any home and away/final side games.

 

[Orange crush]

I would honestly love to see this happen. I would love to see a Team of Champions game vs the team that just won the flag.

So Collingwood vs the All Australian team, obviously taking out the Collingwood players from the AA team.

So something like

All Australian
B: Sicily, Wilkie, Stewart
HB: Jack, Weitering, Houston
C: Gulden, Bontempelli, Dawson
HF: Rozee, Walker, Petracca
F: Cameron, Curnow, Greene (c)
Foll: English, Butters Serong
Int: Martin, Larkey, Merrett, Green

vs

Collingwood
B: Murphy, Moore (c), Howe
HB: Maynard, Frampton, Quaynor
C: Sidebottom, Pendlebury, Markov
HF: Hill, Mihocek, Elliott
F: McCreery, De Goey, J.Daicos
Foll: Cox, N.Daicos, Crisp
Int: Mitchell, Cameron, Hoskin-Elliott, Ginnivan

Either set after the Grand Final, a few weeks after, or set during the preseason the following year.

The AA team is given a week to train together and no practice games together.

Would you be curious to see a game such as this?

Also who do you think would win and why?

An interesting idea but that team of champions could smash the pies