Mega Thread The 2017 'Buckley's Chances' Thread

[westozpie]

Bill Jacobs was a commentator, and not a very god one.
For some never explained reason he was a selector. Believed to detest Collingwood.

Detest collingwood? In that case I hate him

 

[Roverjg]

Yeah Saintly, but what if we have another year of this. I don't think supporters can take another year of this. I am so disinterested in watching us play at the moment. Its time for a change and by being one of the biggest clubs in the land, if Buckley is coaching next year and we are as you say "competitive" but still under performing, the spotlight will be on us again and it will effect the players, the coaches, the supporters, everyone involved with the club. I'd rather bite the bullet this year and start with a clean slate and have something to look forward to in 2018 and beyond.

I agree Antz....but I am starting to have an uneasy feeling that if we are "competitive" over the next 7-8 weeks and the Review indicates that the players want Bucks to coach, that they will reappoint him for 2 years and claim there were extenuating circumstances outside the coaches control which has contributed to our situation.

The Pies will only look at experienced coaches because of our lack of success. However, they will find that Clarkson, Longmire and Lyon will stay where they are for the time being because of their teams improvement after poor starts to the season. Roos has indicated that he does not want to coach again and I have heard that Ratten is unsure of what he wants at present. Would you give Voss a go? The only other option is Scott - No thanks....but again a possibility because of his relationship with Walsh and the esteem Eddie holds him in.

I feel that the Pies will look at how the Geelong review transpired 11 years ago when they shuffled their coaching staff, tweaked their game plan and removed all the peripheral roles from Thompson which allowed him to focus solely on coaching and developing his young list. Furthermore, the Pies will note Richmond's review at the end of last season (Hardwick's contract saved him). They sacked all of the assistant coaches and development staff and completely changed there game plan. Despite the overall lack of talent on Richmond's list, a good game plan has helped them enormously (hurts me to say this as I despise them more than anything).

I feel that if they keep Bucks we will replace the Assistant coaches and development staff as they have been as useful as a fart in a spacesuit as well as our recruiting and list management staff.

If this occurs then my disinterest will deepen

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Detest collingwood? In that case I hate him

He's been dead for a while.
Related to Ken Jacobs who was in Cricket Victoria.
Bill used to call with Rex hunt back in the day.
Not much Collingwood love there

 

[jackcass]

Again I'm not saying players haven't had good seasons under Buckley many have but my point stands most are travelling backwards or stagnating.

Blair was good enough to earn a grand final spot. He now can't get a game at 27 generally the prime of a players career. I'd argue caffs best year was 2010 not 2013.

If your using Maynard as an example of someone who's improved or is a draft "win" it shows how poorly we really have done drafting because while yes I have hopes of him becoming a good player he has far from established himself as a win IMO.

You're the 1 fixated on nominating wins or misses. I think Maynard is a 3rd year kid (<50 games) still learning his craft who as you'd hope has improved year on year and projects as a very good player, time will tell.

 

[2DMB]

Collingwood very rarely ever do. We prefer mediocrity and to recruit players that were injury prone prior to coming to us (Young, Varcoe, Scharenberg, Wells) or just plain duds (Mayne, Russell, Karnezis, Armstrong) and pay them significantly more than what they are worth.

May partly explain why the Hawks have won 13 premierships in the past 55 years and we have won 2 in the same period

Again hope this is taken in the right way. But I agree, I'm always shocked that Eddie and rusted on supporters of your club want to be hated again, thinking that opposition supporters hated you for being the biggest club. Or similar.
As I've discovered in my 40 years of being a Hawk. Everyone hates us for being the best, nothing else. We were nobodies before that. We've been the best and the worst (merger, initial 35 years) but always relatively successful. When we were going for 3 in a row and then 4 the hate was awesome. Since our decline everyone is feasting on anything negative.
Your club was the benchmark for generations. That's why you're the biggest club and why people hated you.
Embrace that and you will have 200k members and be unstoppable.
Stop playing on the pantomime villain that the club portrays (everyone either loves or hates the pies) and start being a team that everyone genuinely hates for their success.... like the Hawks



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[Carringbush2010]

Aaaah yeah nah [emoji848]
I just think he has handled himself really well recently. He would make a great assistant (imo) and possibly a great coach at his second attempt (if it happens) much like Ratten has been at my club.
My opinion fwiw (not much) is that he's been learning on the job and after 6 years he deserves to be punted. Doesn't mean he can't coach.
His desire to recruit mids exclusively is mind boggling when he traded away kpp's early on.
Not that you'd bother but sen did an in depth chat with Gary Buckenara who was head of list management when Clarko started. Clarko told him he wanted the 2 best kpp then a good mid and left it to him. Bucky (with a bit of cunning)delivered rough, bud, Lewis by swapping picks with you guys.
Point being,things can change quickly if you take a punt.


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Didn't say he couldn't coach; coach us to a flag (or any team)? Highly doubtful and his record probably backs that up; his recruiting of course is just not him BUT if he did ask dekka to go heavy on mids then that would suggest he should not be in the position he is currently in

 

[Carringbush2010]

Stop playing on the pantomime villain that the club portrays (everyone either loves or hates the pies) and start being a team that everyone genuinely hates for their success.... like the Hawks

Call Eddie and tell him this!

 

[Scodog10]

Go ahead

No need to encourage him PB will be all over it!

 

[jathanas]

Sold on him leaving, he just hasn't got it.

How long did it take him to reaslise Blair was a liability, but week after ******* week he kept picking him when everyone with a functioning brain knew be wasn't up to it, it's the little things like this that all add up when you finish bottom 4.

Calling Buckley a muppet or asserting he lacks a functioning brain negates any point you make. Your posts come across as disrespectful and angry which is doing your argument a disservice. I like Buckley as a human being so it disappoints me that people can't separate that from his performance as a coach. It's posts like yours that trigger pointless arguments.

The club has an easy decision to make at the end of the year, but needs to execute it with all due respect.

 

[Anzacday]

Calling Buckley a muppet or asserting he lacks a functioning brain negates any point you make. Your posts come across as disrespectful and angry which is doing your argument a disservice. I like Buckley as a human being so it disappoints me that people can't separate that from his performance as a coach. It's posts like yours that trigger pointless arguments.

The club has an easy decision to make at the end of the year, but needs to execute it with all due respect.

Thank you.

 

[Help My Club]

Notwithstanding the current 5-10 win loss ratio, there seems to be a view that we are in good/reasonable shape because we've had no blow outs and thus have been competitive.

I know this is a hypothetical scenario however I will give it a go. If our record at the end of the season was 0-22 and we lost every game by under 3 goals, should Buckley stay? (Mind you - not so outrageous as we are currently 5-10).

You see, has anyone considered that the way we play most of the time - this ugly non-descript form of footy - results in closer matches than might otherwise be. The old "parking the bus" in soccer parlance.

 

[The Magnificent Seven]

I'm another one who has really hated watching us play this year.

But it's because I'm impatient and I want things the way they were in 2010.

I've obviously conveniently forgotten the pain of 2002-2009 where we even bottomed out to get Pendles/Daisy/Sidebum/Reid, watched Didak, Swan, Cloke and Shaw bloom and still lost the winnable matches.

I've obviously forgotten how much 'Mick's Boys' let him down time and time again. Even Nick Maxwell transgressing with his betting scandal. Didak/Shaw's massive blunder. Etc etc.

The point is, I'm just impatient and I want results now. Which doesn't necessarily mean I should get them - some things take time.

Interesting tweet today:-


Doesn't mean Bucks will be a champion coach, but it does mean that the good ones were allowed to grow and learn.

As painful as it is to say, I think the most mature approach would be to keep Bucks but to allow him to take more dictatorial control of the Football Department with Geoff Walsh and to remove Hine.

I believe during Bucks' tenure he has been eager to share responsibility and to allow others to step up to the plate. Problem is they haven't and he has had to take the brunt of the recruiting stuffups, the loss of development and - to a degree - his ability to coach on game day.

He needs to take it all on and demand more from his department. Then you can truly say he succeeded/failed. Another 2 year contract IMO.

CAVEAT: I have read the bile over last 350+ pages so don't come at me if you don't agree with me. I respectfully put my opinion forward for it to be knocked down by well thought out arguments, and if Bucks doesn't stay I also won't be outraged just disappointed.

 

[Jafo]

Not as senior coach but anyone interested in Hodge as an assistant coach at Collingwood?

 

[Countrypie]

Not as senior coach but anyone interested in Hodge as an assistant coach at Collingwood?

Would take him in a heartbeat

 

[Jafo]

Would take him in a heartbeat

Apparently we tried to get Sewell just before he retired. To go around one more year on the park then transition to an assistant coach.

 

[10571z]

I'm another one who has really hated watching us play this year.

But it's because I'm impatient and I want things the way they were in 2010.

I've obviously conveniently forgotten the pain of 2002-2009 where we even bottomed out to get Pendles/Daisy/Sidebum/Reid, watched Didak, Swan, Cloke and Shaw bloom and still lost the winnable matches.

I've obviously forgotten how much 'Mick's Boys' let him down time and time again. Even Nick Maxwell transgressing with his betting scandal. Didak/Shaw's massive blunder. Etc etc.

The point is, I'm just impatient and I want results now. Which doesn't necessarily mean I should get them - some things take time.

Interesting tweet today:-


Doesn't mean Bucks will be a champion coach, but it does mean that the good ones were allowed to grow and learn.

As painful as it is to say, I think the most mature approach would be to keep Bucks but to allow him to take more dictatorial control of the Football Department with Geoff Walsh and to remove Hine.

I believe during Bucks' tenure he has been eager to share responsibility and to allow others to step up to the plate. Problem is they haven't and he has had to take the brunt of the recruiting stuffups, the loss of development and - to a degree - his ability to coach on game day.

He needs to take it all on and demand more from his department. Then you can truly say he succeeded/failed. Another 2 year contract IMO.

CAVEAT: I have read the bile over last 350+ pages so don't come at me if you don't agree with me. I respectfully put my opinion forward for it to be knocked down by well thought out arguments, and if Bucks doesn't stay I also won't be outraged just disappointed.

That is honestly the stupidest stats ever. Buckley took over a grand final side comming off a 2 loss home and away season. The others like most coaches get the job because the side is a rabble. If anything it shows how poor Buckley has been.

 

[bunter]

I'm another one who has really hated watching us play this year.

But it's because I'm impatient and I want things the way they were in 2010.

I've obviously conveniently forgotten the pain of 2002-2009 where we even bottomed out to get Pendles/Daisy/Sidebum/Reid, watched Didak, Swan, Cloke and Shaw bloom and still lost the winnable matches.

I've obviously forgotten how much 'Mick's Boys' let him down time and time again. Even Nick Maxwell transgressing with his betting scandal. Didak/Shaw's massive blunder. Etc etc.

The point is, I'm just impatient and I want results now. Which doesn't necessarily mean I should get them - some things take time.

Interesting tweet today:-


Doesn't mean Bucks will be a champion coach, but it does mean that the good ones were allowed to grow and learn.

As painful as it is to say, I think the most mature approach would be to keep Bucks but to allow him to take more dictatorial control of the Football Department with Geoff Walsh and to remove Hine.

I believe during Bucks' tenure he has been eager to share responsibility and to allow others to step up to the plate. Problem is they haven't and he has had to take the brunt of the recruiting stuffups, the loss of development and - to a degree - his ability to coach on game day.

He needs to take it all on and demand more from his department. Then you can truly say he succeeded/failed. Another 2 year contract IMO.

CAVEAT: I have read the bile over last 350+ pages so don't come at me if you don't agree with me. I respectfully put my opinion forward for it to be knocked down by well thought out arguments, and if Bucks doesn't stay I also won't be outraged just disappointed.

Early in Buck's tenure wasn't he criticised for being too controlling and encouraged to delegate more? Maybe the club and Bucks have managed his transition to senior coach in an arse about fashion?

 

[bunter]

That is honestly the stupidest stats ever. Buckley took over a grand final side comming off a 2 loss home and away season. The others like most coaches get the job because the side is a rabble. If anything it shows how poor Buckley has been.

No research here but didn't MM inherited a virtual WA state side?

Edit:
Cancel that, forgot about his stint at Footscray!

 

[loki04]

Ever watched a couple of kinder kids sorting out an argument?

"He did it....no YOU did it...yadayadayada"

Lot like BF atm

Who ever wins these things?

So should we not discuss anything relevant to pies on the off chance it offends you? You do realise this 8s a discussion board on the collingwood footy club?


I don't get posts like yours. I am sure some people on here would only be happy with posts like go pies, collingwood rule, bucks is the best....if he can't do it no one can.

There is obviously a tough decision to be made at years end for the club both sides of the argument can mount a solid case imo.
But it needs to be made by a committee looking at all facts of the review and done independently by someone from outside the club and a respected footy head.

If they decide he is the best option fwd then they need to back him in no good comes from one year deal all that will result is a year the same as this media like pack of wolves at his door and the subsequent pressure on players stays at 11.

 

[Roverjg]

Not as senior coach but anyone interested in Hodge as an assistant coach at Collingwood?

I would. However I have heard from people who know him and his family that he plans to build his media profile.

 

[jathanas]

So should we not discuss anything relevant to pies on the off chance it offends you? You do realise this 8s a discussion board on the collingwood footy club?


I don't get posts like yours. I am sure some people on here would only be happy with posts like go pies, collingwood rule, bucks is the best....if he can't do it no one can.

There is obviously a tough decision to be made at years end for the club both sides of the argument can mount a solid case imo.
But it needs to be made by a committee looking at all facts of the review and done independently by someone from outside the club and a respected footy head.

If they decide he is the best option fwd then they need to back him in no good comes from one year deal all that will result is a year the same as this media like pack of wolves at his door and the subsequent pressure on players stays at 11.

If one is to make the decision on the information at hand, it's straightforward. There is a strong downward trend that has continued over the medium term. If it was a stock, any successful investor would have already cut their loss.

If a suitable alternative is available it would be too risky to continue with the current regime.

I'm satisfied that this hasn't worked. The problem with being this clinical is putting aside my emotional investment in the club and Bucks. Nothing would please me more than the side proving me wrong.

 

[HFF]

Apparently we tried to get Sewell just before he retired. To go around one more year on the park then transition to an assistant coach.

That's why our club is lumped in the shithole that it is in. This is diabolical list management.

Think about some of these "ideas" under Buckley's reign including Hine who I can't understand why for the life of me had no balls to stand up and say, "guys this is a bad idea"- as the List Manager.

We chased Hudson.

We wanted Sewell who was being booted from Hawks as he was finished but we wanted him to "go around again".

We tried to do the same with Maric.
Thank god both turned us down and spared us humiliation.

How can they possibly think these types of moves would have any positive result or impact on field?

It just adds to the debacle stable that is Lynch, Russell, Young, Armstrong, Mayne, Crisp, Greenwood etc.

Only one other coach springs to mind in doing an similar thing to this…Crazy Vossy.
And look how that turned out.
Wasn't afforded the same luxury and grace Buckley is being given.

 

[bucksisbest]

Interesting tweet today:-


Doesn't mean Bucks will be a champion coach, but it does mean that the good ones were allowed to grow and learn.

Just on this tweet that has been latched on to by some, yes the others grew with their lists. Most salient aspect though is that those guys were actually growing and going in an upwards trend or had already flagged in that period with those sides.

Fantasy land and skewing stats doesn't help us to look in the mirror and get genuinely better.

 

[DT_fanatic]

Notwithstanding the current 5-10 win loss ratio, there seems to be a view that we are in good/reasonable shape because we've had no blow outs and thus have been competitive.

I know this is a hypothetical scenario however I will give it a go. If our record at the end of the season was 0-22 and we lost every game by under 3 goals, should Buckley stay? (Mind you - not so outrageous as we are currently 5-10).

You see, has anyone considered that the way we play most of the time - this ugly non-descript form of footy - results in closer matches than might otherwise be. The old "parking the bus" in soccer parlance.

I've considered this. You could argue us over-possessing the ball prevents the opposition from scoring as much and hence keeps the margin close.

But I would say that it's the inevitable turnovers resulting from our over possession that has allowed the opposition teams to score more than we would like. Hence off-setting the above point imo.

In most of the close losses GWS, Dogs, Melb in particular) we have actually either been in front at various points or come close to whittling away opposition leads. You can't achieve that by 'parking the bus' I don't think.

All that was before the last month though. We've fallen away badly and even the close losses are slowly widening out so there's not much to fall back on.




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[jackcass]

Early in Buck's tenure wasn't he criticised for being too controlling and encouraged to delegate more? Maybe the club and Bucks have managed his transition to senior coach in an arse about fashion?

Not sure that has ever been anymore than footy forum speculation but you could understand a new senior coach in his early seasons wanting to have a hand in everything. I'd assume part of the learning experience is identifying where to best focus your energy and identifying those you trust to manage other aspects.