Mega Thread The 2017 'Buckley's Chances' Thread

[jmac70]

This is not the military or the Catholic Church - what has length of time on this forum got to do with it? I remember when I first joined another poster commented on how some members here seem to want to "pounce" on new members as if there is some sort of hierarchy or direct relationship between length of time on forum and quality / relevance of posts

Because it usually takes time to get to know people.

 

[TKiL]

Because it usually takes time to get to know people.

Then apply that rule to others - you introduced the highly judgmental term "presumptuous"

 

[mattys123]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.

Everyone else is guessing.

And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other w***ers in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.

I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.

Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

 

[TKiL]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.
Everyone else is guessing.
And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other ******s in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.
I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.
Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

Exactly - partly (or largely) because we don't appear to have established processes for assessing performance and recruiting key personnel. Been done on "Captain's" picks which to say the least have not all worked out.

 

[JB1975]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.

Everyone else is guessing.

And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other ******s in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.

I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.

Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

I was musing on this before, and I thought it was an impressive fact. When one could otherwise expect every journo and every other hungry rumour-monger to have the inside word, I'm genuinely impressed that the club has managed to keep everyone guessing up to now.

Another (naive?) part of me thinks that it might also be a good sign, that the club is still piecing together the bits and pieces of its reviews, and that it is carefully considering what should come next. In any case, I don't feel like they've really 'softened' the supporters for any of the possible outcomes.

 

[jmac70]

Then apply that rule to others - you introduced the highly judgmental term "presumptuous"

I did say a "little presumptuous". You don't think you were?

 

[mattys123]

I was musing on this before, and I thought it was an impressive fact. When one could otherwise expect every journo and every other hungry rumour-monger to have the inside word, I'm genuinely impressed that the club has managed to keep everyone guessing up to now.

Another (naive?) part of me thinks that it might also be a good sign, that the club is still piecing together the bits and pieces of its reviews, and that it is carefully considering what should come next. In any case, I don't feel like they've really 'softened' the supporters for any of the possible outcomes.

Yep, the impressive part is keeping it in house despite the medias attempt to derail that.

It's almost certain that Bucks has been told his fate already, his behaviour after the game seemed more relaxed then normal, just taking it all in, but once again that's totally guessing.

And yeah, there will be anger either way now, the Buckley lovers will be upset if he goes, while the Haters will be upset if he stays.

Then there's the 80% of us who just follow on, no matter what the decision is, after an initial emotional response maybe.

 

[TradeDraft]

Sounds like the Deal is that Bucks stays with a Mentor(Most Likely Paul Roos) coming in.

Showing that Bucks is a bad Coach but Ed does not want to sack his mate

 

[TradeDraft]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.

Everyone else is guessing.

And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other ******s in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.

I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.

Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

Shows how badly the club is run at ALL levels

 

[jmac70]

Sounds like the Deal is that Bucks stays with a Mentor(Most Likely Paul Roos) coming in.

Showing that Bucks is a bad Coach but Ed does not want to sack his mate

I don't think it shows he is a bad coach, just that he can use some assistance. If it results in the team improving then why not?

 

[TKiL]

I did say a "little presumptuous". You don't think you were?

Not really - seriously jmac, I have no intention of replicating some of the puerile tit for tat posts, non-stop petty squabbles that litter this site. My original point was that the book talks about passionate, emotional supporters who saw the CFC as a way out of their downtrodden misery. I made a light hearted reference to some BF posters. There's only one thing I want - that's a bunch of Pie flags. I put some posts up -mainly flinging muck at the way the club has been managed / governed in recent times, that's about it. Have a nice day .

 

[ksardog]

I don't think it shows he is a bad coach, just that he can use some assistance. If it results in the team improving then why not?

What it does show (if this is true) was that he wasnt ready when he took the role over, in a premiership window.
Thanks Ed

 

[mattys123]

I don't think it shows he is a bad coach, just that he can use some assistance. If it results in the team improving then why not?

He's not a bad coach, if he was bad we would have had a really bad season, North or Freo style.

But I ask the question, "Can you ever seeing him coaching a premiership?".

Premiership coaches have something different about them, they run the football department the way they want to run it, and take advice when they need to, not when asked to. They also innovate, they don't copy.

If Bucks stays, for god sake, stop copying other teams. Design the game plan around our list, not around what any other coach/team is doing or has done.

I just don't see Nathan Buckley as having that special extra thing that makes you an elite coach in this league.

If he's reappointed I'm so hoping I'm wrong, but that's my opinion after 4 failed years.

 

[ottoman]

Many people think a mentor means someone who will teach him how to coach.
That is not what a mentor is.
A mentor is basically someone who guides you at being better.
I have no issue with the mentor idea.
Many of the most successful people in the world have mentors. Actually many of the most successful people are successful partly because they use mentors.
Nobody knows everything. No matter who we are or how senior a position we hold we can still learn.

 

[TKiL]

Sounds like the Deal is that Bucks stays with a Mentor(Most Likely Paul Roos) coming in.

Showing that Bucks is a bad Coach but Ed does not want to sack his mate

Herein lies the problem - Ed appears totally incapable of stepping back from the situation and applying critical analysis (or allowing anyone else to - apart from the "reports" which may be released by the national archives office in 30 years). "Side by side" has a nice ring to it but it's not a management tool for a complex organisation in a competitive environment.

 

[loki04]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.

Everyone else is guessing.

And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other ******s in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.

I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.

Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

The longer it goes on the more it points to him being extended, the club is leaving itself very little time to have due process to find another coach and then have that coach have time to prepare what he wants in terms of players signed, traded in and out, what draft mandate to give preseason program he wants in place etc.

Bucks will get 2 more years imo.

 

[noideaatall]

It's staggering that here we are, the day after our final match of a season and no one, and I mean no one (maybe apart from Ed and Bucks) knows exactly what's going on.
Everyone else is guessing.
And yes, that's what Caro, Robbo, Damo and all the other ******s in the media whose nicknames end with an "O" are doing, guessing.
I've got an opinion from two journos who work around the club for their publications/sites and they both think Bucks is gone, but even they admit they are guessing.
Strange situation, hopefully it's resolved quickly either way because potential recruits, both on and off field will be making up their minds about their future clubs very soon.

Well at least it suggests the pies are not a leaky sieve. If they decide not to resign Bucks then this is appropriate, as Eddie has stated they don't sack coaches mid season. If they resign then I don't see why they couldn't have done that ages ago as nothing really new has come out of the last half of the season.

 

[TKiL]

The longer it goes on the more it points to him being extended, the club is leaving itself very little time to have due process to find another coach and then have that coach have time to prepare what he wants in terms of players signed, traded in and out, what draft mandate to give preseason program he wants in place etc.
Bucks will get 2 more years imo.

DUE PROCESS!! - seems complete anathema to CFC in recent times. Pert was appointed (and sacked?) by McGuire, Balme in and out twice?, Gubby Allan say so more, Buckley - we all know that story, etc etc. If you don't set a pattern of rigour at the top, how do you expect the rest of the place to operate?

 

[left at home]

Yep, the impressive part is keeping it in house despite the medias attempt to derail that.

It's almost certain that Bucks has been told his fate already, his behaviour after the game seemed more relaxed then normal, just taking it all in, but once again that's totally guessing.

And yeah, there will be anger either way now, the Buckley lovers will be upset if he goes, while the Haters will be upset if he stays.

Then there's the 80% of us who just follow on, no matter what the decision is, after an initial emotional response maybe.

I think most of the so called Buckley lovers realise that he could be sacked and ok with that.
They in the end follow the club, not the person

 

[76woodenspooners]

It will all come down to this ...

... what will give Collingwood the best chance of winning Premierships?

That's what Ed will be asking. That's what the board will be asking. It is Geoff Walsh who will providing the answers to that question.

-----

A few datapoints on Walsh ...

(1) It was Walsh who said back in 2009 that "Mick Malthouse is the right man to take Collingwood to its next Premiership".
(2) Walsh left in 2013, during Buckley's second year at the reins.
(3) Walsh returned at the start of this year, going into Buckley's sixth year at the reins.
(4) Walsh seems to know what he's doing - see (1)
(5) Walsh is in a position to compare (3) with (2). He has had time away from the club and is in a privileged position to assess how things have changed / progressed. Walsh will be able to see the influence that Eade, Balme, Allen, Hendy, etc, etc have had on the football department and Buckley's development.

Credit to Ed and the board where it's due ... (since the end of 2016 when Allen got banned) ... they've responded by putting the club in the best position to make the best decision about the football dept and the senior coach's future.

Whatever decision they make, it'll be an informed one.

-----

What is making the decision so contentious amongst supporters is that not everybody is using the same assessment.

(A) Some folks are asking themselves "Is Buckley a nice bloke?"

(B) Some folks are asking themselves "Does Buckley seem to know what he is doing / talking about?"

(C) Some folks are asking themselves "Is Buckley a proud Collingwood man?". And then applying/not applying the "Side by Side" response as appropriate.

(D) Some folks are asking themselves "Does Buckley have the players on side?"

(E) Some folks are asking themselves "Can Buckley win us Premierships?"

I reckon (and personally hope) that Ed and the board are going to be solely focused on (E). It's gong to be a tough decision to make (one way or the other)

-----

It is all set up for Buckley to go.

Collingwood have gone down the ladder every year for six years.

Buckley is at the end of his (third?) contract.

Nearly all of Buckley's assistants are at the end of their contracts.

The season is now over.

A football department review has been conducted by somebody who is eminently qualified, who is in a privileged position, and who is beyond reproach.

The opportunity to cut a club champion senior coach doesn't get any cleaner than this.

-----

What does Walsh think gives the Collingwood Football Club the best chance of winning Premierships?

Does Nathan Buckley have a role?

And if so, what will that role be?

And what will the rest of the football department look like?

What will the board decide?

The stage is set.

We wait ...

 

[Peter Sidorkiewicz]

I don't think it shows he is a bad coach, just that he can use some assistance. If it results in the team improving then why not?

If the team improves, Roos (or the mentor) would get the credit.

 

[JB1975]

It will all come down to this ...

... what will give Collingwood the best chance of winning Premierships?

That's what Ed will be asking. That's what the board will be asking. It is Geoff Walsh who will providing the answers to that question.

-----

A few datapoints on Walsh ...

(1) It was Walsh who said back in 2009 that "Mick Malthouse is the right man to take Collingwood to its next Premiership".
(2) Walsh left in 2013, during Buckley's second year at the reins.
(3) Walsh returned at the start of this year, going into Buckley's sixth year at the reins.
(4) Walsh seems to know what he's doing - see (1)
(5) Walsh is in a position to compare (3) with (2). He has had time away from the club and is in a privileged position to assess how things have changed / progressed. Walsh will be able to see the influence that Eade, Balme, Allen, Hendy, etc, etc have had on the football department and Buckley's development.

Credit to Ed and the board where it's due ... (since the end of 2016 when Allen got banned) ... they've responded by putting the club in the best position to make the best decision about the football dept and the senior coach's future.

Whatever decision they make, it'll be an informed one.

-----

What is making the decision so contentious amongst supporters is that not everybody is using the same assessment.

(A) Some folks are asking themselves "Is Buckley a nice bloke?"

(B) Some folks are asking themselves "Does Buckley seem to know what he is doing / talking about?"

(C) Some folks are asking themselves "Is Buckley a proud Collingwood man?". And then applying/not applying the "Side by Side" response as appropriate.

(D) Some folks are asking themselves "Does Buckley have the players on side?"

(E) Some folks are asking themselves "Can Buckley win us Premierships?"

I reckon (and personally hope) that Ed and the board are going to be solely focused on (E). It's gong to be a tough decision to make (one way or the other)

-----

It is all set up for Buckley to go.

Collingwood have gone down the ladder every year for six years.

Buckley is at the end of his (third?) contract.

Nearly all of Buckley's assistants are at the end of their contracts.

The season is now over.

A football department review has been conducted by somebody who is eminently qualified, who is in a privileged position, and who is beyond reproach.

The opportunity to cut a club champion senior coach doesn't get any cleaner than this.

-----

What does Walsh think gives the Collingwood Football Club the best chance of winning Premierships?

Does Nathan Buckley have a role?

And if so, what will that role be?

And what will the rest of the football department look like?

What will the board decide?

The stage is set.

We wait ...

I set your post to a soundtrack; needed a bit of Eminem, 'Lose Yourself'.

We do indeed wait, not much longer now...or another two years!

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Sounds like your interpreting family hugs SV

It's like watching the Olympic diving, instant expert

 

[Saintly Viewed]

LNP effed the nbn not alp

White elephant to start with

 

[jmac70]

He's not a bad coach, if he was bad we would have had a really bad season, North or Freo style.

But I ask the question, "Can you ever seeing him coaching a premiership?".

Premiership coaches have something different about them, they run the football department the way they want to run it, and take advice when they need to, not when asked to. They also innovate, they don't copy.

If Bucks stays, for god sake, stop copying other teams. Design the game plan around our list, not around what any other coach/team is doing or has done.

I just don't see Nathan Buckley as having that special extra thing that makes you an elite coach in this league.

If he's reappointed I'm so hoping I'm wrong, but that's my opinion after 4 failed years.

I can see him becoming a premiership coach but agree that he needs to be more creative in his planning.