Current The Bunker Part 2

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Wombot said:
Doubtful. He had already offended in Huntingdale prior to meeting his wife. Murder was probably mostly employed in order to avoid his victims identifying him
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Some of the seeds of his violent behavior might be so personal, that he doesn't want them ever brought into the public domain, or at least not disclosed at this point in time.

Whether someone who used to be close to him, credibly knows of any of any possible/likely underlying causes of his behavior, and wants to and is able to get it out into the public domain, is still to be seen.
 
Likeamystery said:
It's crossed my mind that one or two of those women may go or have gone to Freedom of Information to obtain the Statement they provided in 1987/1988. They'd be entitled to have it. As far as I know FOI will probably blank out the police officer's names. If statements were amongst the paperwork found in Van Tongeron's tub, which WAPOL have in their possession, that information will be heavily guarded and the public won't get to see that. Rather than keep it, they may have already shredded it. They'll be keeping very tight lipped.

I've got a feeling we'll have women who eventually come forward to reveal information, but WAPOL will just reply, something like, "Yes she did report a matter but the perpetrator doesn't fit with BREs description", or "There's no such evidence to support that theory" or another possible comeback, "As far as we're concerned the matters bought up in court were the only incidents pertaining to BRE".

WAPOL will already have organized and practiced what to say. You get my drift.
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"If statements were amongst the paperwork found in Van Tongeron's tub, which WAPOL have in their possession, that information will be heavily guarded and the public won't get to see that."

Van Tongeron's tub ? What you talking about ?
 

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metic said:
"If statements were amongst the paperwork found in Van Tongeron's tub, which WAPOL have in their possession, that information will be heavily guarded and the public won't get to see that."

Van Tongeron's tub ? What you talking about ?
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Hi Metic,
There's information in Bret Christian's book 'Stalking Claremont'. Sometime back in 2013 the CSK detectives started to look at historic sex crimes. They went to a police archive place, and began searching through tubs of old evidence. In Dec 2016 they found a tub of Van Tongeren's evidence. Van Tongeren was the one who blew up the Chinese restaurant in Ferndale. He lived in Gosnells and his campaign was ramping up in 1988. When they looked into the Van Tongeren tub they found bits and pieces of evidence, which pertained to BRE (didn't contain his name and address). The 1988 paperwork which included the break-ins, a man in a nightie, standing outside houses etc. They located the kimono on 1 Dec 2016. Amongst the evidence were some fingerprints, belonging to BRE, which matched the ones from the HH attack.

We know in 1988 the Gosnells police were looking for BRE, because of the break-ins. It might be, the Van Tongeren problem was much bigger and they concentrated on him.
 
Likeamystery said:
Hi Metic,
There's information in Bret Christian's book 'Stalking Claremont'. Sometime back in 2013 the CSK detectives started to look at historic sex crimes. They went to a police archive place, and began searching through tubs of old evidence. In Dec 2016 they found a tub of Van Tongeren's evidence. Van Tongeren was the one who blew up the Chinese restaurant in Ferndale. He lived in Gosnells and his campaign was ramping up in 1988. When they looked into the Van Tongeren tub they found bits and pieces of evidence, which pertained to BRE (didn't contain his name and address). The 1988 paperwork which included the break-ins, a man in a nightie, standing outside houses etc. They located the kimono on 1 Dec 2016. Amongst the evidence were some fingerprints, belonging to BRE, which matched the ones from the HH attack.

We know in 1988 the Gosnells police were looking for BRE, because of the break-ins. It might be, the Van Tongeren problem was much bigger and they concentrated on him.
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some recent mentions surfacing on this thread concerning the 1988 van tongeren case, is something new to me.
i am unaware of any of the details.
perhaps it has, or should have, its own thread??
because this latest mention of "blowing up chinese restaurants" immediately brought the victorian, 1991 execution of karmein chan to my mind, as her parents ran a chinese restaurant, and at the time of her abduction, a threat issued, in relation to asian drug dealing, was written on her father's car.


imho
 
imho said:
some recent mentions surfacing on this thread concerning the 1988 van tongeren case, is something new to me.
i am unaware of any of the details.
perhaps it has, or should have, its own thread??
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The details and discussion on this are probably in the thread dedicated to Bret Christian's new CSK book which Kurve recently renamed so that it refers to his new CSK book. A thread that is now closed.
www.bigfooty.com

Solved - Hey Bret? Stalking Claremont the book.

Here is Claremont Murders - Part One Part Two and Part Three - Media - The Bunker
www.bigfooty.com www.bigfooty.com
 
Likeamystery said:
Hi Metic,
There's information in Bret Christian's book 'Stalking Claremont'. Sometime back in 2013 the CSK detectives started to look at historic sex crimes. They went to a police archive place, and began searching through tubs of old evidence. In Dec 2016 they found a tub of Van Tongeren's evidence. Van Tongeren was the one who blew up the Chinese restaurant in Ferndale. He lived in Gosnells and his campaign was ramping up in 1988. When they looked into the Van Tongeren tub they found bits and pieces of evidence, which pertained to BRE (didn't contain his name and address). The 1988 paperwork which included the break-ins, a man in a nightie, standing outside houses etc. They located the kimono on 1 Dec 2016. Amongst the evidence were some fingerprints, belonging to BRE, which matched the ones from the HH attack.

We know in 1988 the Gosnells police were looking for BRE, because of the break-ins. It might be, the Van Tongeren problem was much bigger and they concentrated on him.
Click to expand...
I read a book written by Van Tongeren (no, I’m not a supporter of his at all, I just am interested in books set in Perth), and Van Tongeren and his supporters operated at night throughout the Perth metro area in the late 80s. He was putting up racist stickers and posters. Maybe the police thought it could be related. It’s a long shot, but it’s unusual that the Huntingdale Prowler’s evidence was mixed with Van Tongeren’s. Although yeah, probably just a filing error.
 
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Likeamystery said:
Hi Metic,
There's information in Bret Christian's book 'Stalking Claremont'. Sometime back in 2013 the CSK detectives started to look at historic sex crimes. They went to a police archive place, and began searching through tubs of old evidence. In Dec 2016 they found a tub of Van Tongeren's evidence. Van Tongeren was the one who blew up the Chinese restaurant in Ferndale. He lived in Gosnells and his campaign was ramping up in 1988. When they looked into the Van Tongeren tub they found bits and pieces of evidence, which pertained to BRE (didn't contain his name and address). The 1988 paperwork which included the break-ins, a man in a nightie, standing outside houses etc. They located the kimono on 1 Dec 2016. Amongst the evidence were some fingerprints, belonging to BRE, which matched the ones from the HH attack.

We know in 1988 the Gosnells police were looking for BRE, because of the break-ins. It might be, the Van Tongeren problem was much bigger and they concentrated on him.
Click to expand...
Wow ok thanks lam, that Jack van T I remember his campaign and that was what piquied my interest. Will catch up on that asap..
 
Wombot said:
I read a book written by Van Tongeren (no, I’m not a supporter of his all, I just am interested in books set in Perth), and Van Tongeren and his supporters operated at night throughout the Perth metro area in the late 80s. He was putting up racist stickers and posters. Maybe the police thought it could be related. It’s a long shot, but it’s unusual that the Huntingdale Prowler’s evidence was mixed with Van Tongeren’s. Although yeah, probably just a filing error.
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If it was a simple filing error, that might explain why it was overlooked. As the Von Tongeran case went to court, you'd think that would have formed part of the evidence. Someone mentioned in the other forum, that it's possible, one of the CSK detectives may have recalled there was a Huntingdale prowler in 1988 and were on the look out for the kimono. When the kimono was located, priority was placed on it's DNA testing - i.e. sent by courier to the testing place.
 
Likeamystery said:
that it's possible, one of the CSK detectives may have recalled there was a Huntingdale prowler in 1988 and were on the look out for the kimono. When the kimono was located, priority was placed on it's DNA testing - i.e. sent by courier to the testing place.
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Why not just say that was the case then? Why miss an opportunity to brag about one of their officers going all hound dog on a kimono?
 
Kurve said:
Why not just say that was the case then? Why miss an opportunity to brag about one of their officers going all hound dog on a kimono?
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Don't know. If it's anything like Operation Air who were looking for Ivan Milat, the individual detectives weren't allowed any individual praise, all praise was saved for the head of the operation.
 
There's a thread here on van Tongeren, it was opened in SRP not Crime so it swings a bit differently. If anyone's interested, might give an idea of what was going on then. 2006.

His criminal career began in 1988. Wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_van_Tongeren

www.bigfooty.com

Jack Van Tongeren - Missing.....

How will we cope? Why police resources are being wasted on this human stain astounds me.
www.bigfooty.com www.bigfooty.com
 
Wombot said:
I read a book written by Van Tongeren (no, I’m not a supporter of his all, I just am interested in books set in Perth), and Van Tongeren and his supporters operated at night throughout the Perth metro area in the late 80s. He was putting up racist stickers and posters. Maybe the police thought it could be related. It’s a long shot, but it’s unusual that the Huntingdale Prowler’s evidence was mixed with Van Tongeren’s. Although yeah, probably just a filing error.
Click to expand...
I remember Van Tongeren, as a young person at the time it horrified me to know that there was not only some one with such radical views in my community, but also that they were acting on them!! (those were the days when you could be horrified at such things, its the norm now and worse !! )
As for the prowler evidence in the wrong evidence box, we can atm only put it down to human error. But it just blows me away that this case keep on coming up with mishaps/situations whereby BRE was over looked !!
 

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zedx said:
I remember Van Tongeren, as a young person at the time it horrified me to know that there was not only some one with such radical views in my community, but also that they were acting on them!! (those were the days when you could be horrified at such things, its the norm now and worse !! )
As for the prowler evidence in the wrong evidence box, we can atm only put it down to human error. But it just blows me away that this case keep on coming up with mishaps/situations whereby BRE was over looked !!
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Yes, another mishap in BREs favour. We should probably list all the mishaps.
 
Just got rid of Foxtel (doh!) so didn't get to watch "Catching the Claremont Killer - the Untold Story" (or should that be, The Never-ending Story?), but did find this 3 minute snippet from the show which shows a re-enactment of the actual attack. What a terrifying experience for this poor woman!

Like she said, BRE is a coward!

www.skynews.com.au

Sky News presents ‘Catching the Claremont Killer: The Untold Story’ tonight at 8pm

Sky News Australia will premiere a gripping new investigative documentary, Catching the Claremont Killer: The Untold Story tonight at 8pm.
www.skynews.com.au www.skynews.com.au
 
Just watching it now.
Starting with Huntingdale - Liz, single mum off 2 said she'd just bought her first house & had the phone newly connected. She thinks the events are linked. Told her father she thought Telstra guy was weird, asking her questions & didn't feel comfortable with him in the house. She thinks it was him that installed her phone.
She'd heard of the Huntingdale prowler, knew he'd been breaking into houses and stealing clothes off lines etc.
Didn't know all attacks were within 1km from her house. Only feeling about that is it meant he should have been caught. Wasn't aware there were 8 victims total or that she was the last. She hopes it was the knee she gave him in the balls that made him stop prowling. That night, she'd just got home at 8pm, had a shower & came out to find him in the toilet wearing a nightie, undies on his head, with eyes exposed. She fought back & he ran, bolted out back door & jumped the fence.
She got a knife & went to the backdoor with the intention of killing him if he came back. Then she called the police. She doesn't recall getting physical with him, said her recollection is that it was like he was petting her like you would a cat yet her face was so swollen afterwards, it didn't look like her. 2 black eyes, bruised allover despite not feeling it at all at the time.
She moved straight away. Slept with a knife under her pillow and said it took about 10 years before it started to get easier. Said she received no support whatsoever, being thats the way it was at the time.
She doesn't think he would have killed her, likely just sexually assaulted her.
She moved on, remarried & had another child. Said she was shocked to learn around the same time we all did, that her attacker was the CSK. She said she'd have preferred to have never known who attacked her.
Mentioned HH incident but no details, just that it occurred & they now had his details on file. Same with KK which obtained a DNA profile.
Went onto the murders, mostly just rehashing footage seen already on CI episode. Paul Ferguson features without saying anything I dont think we didnt already know. Confirmed MM had still never been ID'd, to his knowledge.
New footage with Kimdelia Cole speaking about Jane & how it impacted her. New photos of Jane.
Wellard resident Cheryle Sturcke who heard Jane scream said you never forget that scream. She doesnt talk about it, but said she can still hear it. After Janes body was found & realising it was her they probably heard that night, they sold up & moved. Regrets never calling the police at the time and still carries the guilt of not having acted or not knowing whether if she had, would it have changed anything, would CG still be alive? Despite knowing she likely couldnt have helped Jane, said she's a mum too & will always feel guilty they didn't realise what they heard at the time & called police.
Tom Percy saying how ordinary BRE was in the community & not on any radars. Michelle Roberts saying that arguably, he should have been on the radar due to his earlier crimes. Neither elaborate.
Xanthe Mallett saying DNA could identify blood grouping at the time but not identify a person.
Key breakthrough when CG fingernail samples locating unknown male DNA in UK in 2008 & it matched KK. Realised the motive was sexual, reopened old cases, found Kimono. 3 DNA matches now, still no idea whose it was. Found fingerprint in huntingdale file which matched fingerprint on file HH to get name. Tailed him, sprite bottle confirmed the DNA was his.
Footage of Hall delivering verdict.
Lee Rimmer on the media after coming out of court for the verdict. Dennis Glennons press conference revealing they werent permitted to view her body.
Back to Liz whose glad we dont have the death penalty, relieved he wont offend again whilst being happy to know he's where he is for as long as he lives.
Xanthe Mallet says he wont cope with being in jail, struggle to adjust, thought he'd got away with it for decades, used to having his freedom and his secrets and wont cope with having that taken away.
Back to Liz again who hates being referred to as a surviving victim, believes it disrespectful to the other girls, says when he was prowling Huntingdale he wasn't the CSK, he was the Huntingdale Prowler. Reporter asked what she liked to be called, she said "Liz, thats about it". Ended with his sentence written on the screen.

Thats all of it. Nothing new really aside from Liz's comments about the amount of victims and her being the last one.
One thing that did stand out to me was they were noticibly evasive of exactly when the DNA match to the Kimono was made & whether they were implying it was earlier than 2016. Cant recall exactly what was said under oath about it without looking back & although they may not have intended to appear suspicious about the detail, I rewound it to check what they said exactly & it was definitely only the fingerprint giving them the name and the sprite bottle confirming it was his DNA they spoke of specifically occuring close to arrest in 2016. I then went back over all the footage of the Kimono and didn't find anywhere they said the match was in 2016. Oversight...or a closely guarded secret...dont know, doesnt really matter as we'll never know if it occurred differently to exactly how it was said to occur in court.
Nothing to be concerned of having missed I dont think.
 
the dark knight said:
Now that we know partially of his behaviours, I’d definitely say he had it booked marked as well as websleuths. Both covered CSK case. He would’ve thought “Gee whiz aren’t I clever?”. If you search Bravincat, There are some forums (maybe re-edit) that he posted in.
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Even more likely if the stories of him asking people questions and starting discussions about the CSK are true.
If he didnt post in them, he read them.
 
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