Autopsy The "I'm actually ok with this" thread.

[Taskmaster]

To all the Negative people, do yourself a favor and go and have a look at the top 15 draft picks for the last 10 years. Only 50% have kicked on or are any good, the rest are duds. So, simply, it's the luck of the draw.

I have faith and that's all I need. People will look back on this and absolutely eat their words........

 

[Gralin]

I know, not having a go at you individually, but its a crap phrase and is getting more devalued by the day

How about a core group of elite players?
Franklin is a rare talent maybe generational.
Hodge is a generational leader if not all round
Mitch is based on longevity and consistency in the conversation and Cyril and Rough are pretty damn handy.

 

[88HawksBestEver]

HFC want to rebuild their midfield core, replacing for the next decade Mitchell, Lewis, Hodge, Burgoyne.

They have targeted particular players to fill these roles and it just so happens that 2 of these players that fit the plan are available this draft period. Mitchell and Lewis realistically would not be offered another contract at expiry of their current 1 year terms at end of 2017. So club proposes to them as part of an "unofficially" sanctioned Golden parachute, that they be traded out and secure 3 year deals for good money for their families at other clubs. The players stand to earn potentially another $5-600k each more over a couple of years than if they stayed at HFC. Cost to the HFC is some short term rough publicity and decent input from Mitch and Lewis for 2017. But this output to be exchanged for the Tom Mitchell and O'meara contribution.

Trading them this year helps frees up the salary space to get the first 2 pieces of their future midfield, Tom Mitchell and O'Meara. The 2016 draft picks are bonuses, as next year at retirement the HFC would have got nothing. Then next year when the other 2 pieces of the midfield core become available (potentially Fyfe and Dustin Martin) there will be more cap space as Hodge and Gibson retire and another year of development into some of the younger fringe players, enhancing their potential as trades to secure Fyfe/Martin.

We then have the midfield core that the club needs for another 10 years and rest of team can then be built around this.

Clarkson likes to do things in 2's, 2 retirements/trades and stagger the departure of key players.

Am betting that Lewis and Sam Mitchell are nowhere near as hurt by what has gone on, as the supporters seem to be. They will have more earning longevity than they would have staying at HFC and undoubtedly will return back to club in some capacity in the future.

No idea if this is true, I just have some faith that things are not anywhere near as unplanned and chaotic as they seem from afar......

 

[BaliHawk]

This isn't truly relevant to our club and the draft - more about how it has or is being depicted by our friends in the media
The AFL is a machine. They need controversy and will create innuendo and suggest unrest amongst their own franchises in order to keep the fans interested and some anxious (you only need to scroll around here), to keep the wheels spinning, to keep their sponsors brands on the front page of media, to keep their own data flow churning away and sometimes to justify their own existence. It's the off season and Soccer, Cricket, Horse Racing etc are still being dealt a raw deal if you check the headlines in the newspapers so it seams as the AFL machine just keeps on keeping on. So, whilst you could say the media muppets who brag about inside info they have or the whisper heard or how the Hawks are imploding, are they just doing their job - perhaps, but they do live in a glass half full world where dick measuring is paramount.
Cool heads will prevail go hawkers.

 

[ralphwiggum]

HFC want to rebuild their midfield core, replacing for the next decade Mitchell, Lewis, Hodge, Burgoyne.

They have targeted particular players to fill these roles and it just so happens that 2 of these players that fit the plan are available this draft period. Mitchell and Lewis realistically would not be offered another contract at expiry of their current 1 year terms at end of 2017. So club proposes to them as part of an "unofficially" sanctioned Golden parachute, that they be traded out and secure 3 year deals for good money for their families at other clubs. The players stand to earn potentially another $5-600k each more over a couple of years than if they stayed at HFC. Cost to the HFC is some short term rough publicity and decent input from Mitch and Lewis for 2017. But this output to be exchanged for the Tom Mitchell and O'meara contribution.

Trading them this year helps frees up the salary space to get the first 2 pieces of their future midfield, Tom Mitchell and O'Meara. The 2016 draft picks are bonuses, as next year at retirement the HFC would have got nothing. Then next year when the other 2 pieces of the midfield core become available (potentially Fyfe and Dustin Martin) there will be more cap space as Hodge and Gibson retire and another year of development into some of the younger fringe players, enhancing their potential as trades to secure Fyfe/Martin.

We then have the midfield core that the club needs for another 10 years and rest of team can then be built around this.

Clarkson likes to do things in 2's, 2 retirements/trades and stagger the departure of key players.

Am betting that Lewis and Sam Mitchell are nowhere near as hurt by what has gone on, as the supporters seem to be. They will have more earning longevity than they would have staying at HFC and undoubtedly will return back to club in some capacity in the future.

No idea if this is true, I just have some faith that things are not anywhere near as unplanned and chaotic as they seem from afar......

100% this. The last team with a threepeat dynasty didn't have our foresight to make those seemingly hard decisions or make any meaningful plans like we did; and no free agency, see how that worked out for them...

 

[Pessimistic]

Also Our guys have had a good look at GWS and maybe they rate the challenge as a lot higher than a lot of us think

 

[PenAndPaper]

In: 23yo Mitchell
Out : 23yo Hill, 34yo Mitchell, 30yo Lewis

If we can get O'meara in there without a player going to GC then I say that is a massive win for us. Picks are speculative and could end up bust, at least this way we have targeted young quality to replace old quality.
The hysteria about this trade period and particularly the picks received is ridiculous.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Big Kev's spirit found its way into my meat loaf

We are embarking on a new era for the club
It is all unknown
No expectations of 22 wins a season
No waiting for the same few players to step up and drag us over the line
This new era is more exciting than the 2004-2008 rebuild

I'M EXCITED!

 

[Siri]

There's 5 stages of the grieving process, and most of us need to endure it twice. Once for Mitch & once for Jordan. Will get back to you when I'm done ... but it's gonna take some time mate! Hopefully I've recovered by 2.00 pm this Thursday!

 

[HODGEYROAD]

Big Kev's spirit found its way into my meat loaf

We are embarking on a new era for the club
It is all unknown
No expectations of 22 wins a season
No waiting for the same few players to step up and drag us over the line
This new era is more exciting than the 2004-2008 rebuild

I'M EXCITED!

More exciting than a rebuild that netted us Franklin and Roughead in the same draft ? Are we landing Fyfe and Dusty as free agents next year or something ?

 

[flinchfree]

I've been excited for 35 years as a dees fan. You're not going to like this as much as you think you will.

Then you were highly un-realistic about your list.
You absolutely have reason to be excited this upcoming season and for the next 5. But your coaching staff will need to deliver, not just the players. It's underestimated the role of leadership from the top.....

 

[Whats a Battle]

More exciting than a rebuild that netted us Franklin and Roughead in the same draft ?

Nah that rebuild wasn't that exciting. Not like Richtank, who grabbed Tambling, Danny Meyer, Adam Pattinson and Dean Polo all in that very same draft!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yep, as the title suggests, I'm actually ok with this trade period.

Just need to land JOM and maybe the mooted Barrett from GWS and I think we'll have done some major renovations of the list with an eye on the future.

 

[Tuck In]

We needed to change a lot as we were becoming non competitive in the middle and we have attempted to do so in a climate where many don't want us to further succeed. I get the little pain for hopefully a lot of gain and as such I'm ok with it too. Thanks to the champs and let's make some more!

 

[DrEvil_]

I don't really have any problem with Mitchell and Lewis leaving. They have given the club everything and I don't think we should be concerned about getting value out of them on the trade table. Let them earn their rightful amount elsewhere instead of taking pay cuts at Hawthorn. The problem I have is getting Vickery because he's a shit truck and a campaigner.

 

[Billyc]

I will be ok with it if we get O'Meara. I'm ok with the strategy we've chosen but the execution has been poor.

 

[jpzhawk]

Just a heads up. Fyfe and Martin won't be at Hawthorn next year.
What we do need next year will be a quality young tall foward and strong key defender.
This is what we missed this year along with an ageing slow midfield.
It was the loss of Lake & Roughy.
We leaked to many goals and didn't kick enough.
We didn't get the supply, couldn't keep up with the mids of opposition teams supplying their forwards.
What Hawthorn has done this trade period is ruthless but very very smart.

 

[JustKickIt]

I love how the media tried to blow this up into it being World War 3 between Lewis and Clarko and a massive dummy spit by Lewis. Now the facts have come out from Lewis himself, it was basically. "Can't guarantee you a contract after 2017" "OK, I will go and try and get a 3 year one at Melbourne"

Not as exciting that story.....

What Clarkson says in today's video release makes perfect sense:
http://www.hawthornfc.com.au/video/2016-10-18/exclusive-clarkson-on-trades

Hawthorn couldn't guarantee Mitchell or Lewis' futures at Waverley beyond 2017 and Clarkson said tough conversations were required.

"It was really to allow them to share in the decision-making and try to control their own destiny, in a sense," he said.

"Both those guys, I don't think, would enjoy the conversation with me or anyone else at our football club if we got to round 20 next season and we marched them in and said 'I don't think we're going to re-contract you next year'.

"That sat really uncomfortably with me."

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-10-18/clarkson-breaks-silence-over-trading-mitchell-and-lewis

 

[Leather Poisoning]

A few thoughts:

1. It's better to send guys off a year too early rather than a year too late. (With the caveat that you know you won't be winning a flag).

2. Really Disappointed we couldn't get a better return for Mitchell and Lewis. I can live with them moving on with security and superannuation deals.

3. Our draftees last year all look awesome. I mean really good. Burton, Lovell and Hardwick all debuted and looked at home playing senior footy. Add JOM and Tom to these guys and we have something real to build on.

4. Clarko is one of the few premiership coaches that also was there in the bleak times for the rebuild. Last time he shunted out Thompson, hay (and Rawlings?) and gave a lot of game time to two young fellas called lance and Jarryd. Many of us had doubts of their ability to make it and play consistent footy, despite the odd glimpse of talent. (Roughy to chb, anyone?)

5. Clarkson and co make mistakes. Who can forgot Dawson, cam Bruce, shoey's formative games, Timmy Clark as a key playmaker (we played through his forward flank ALL the time). Thorp, Ellis, dowler and Muston (imagine those 4 without injuries)

But this is the price of trying to leap frog the competiton. Remember Campbell brown to the forward line? Recycling 'hacks' like guerra, gilham, Dew, hale,
Gibbo - worked out pretty well. Lake and McEvoy were both hacks/broken down as well I reckon. Other clubs wouldn't dare take those risks. (Except Richmond - but they **** it up all the time because it's random and erratic).

6. We are gonna look very different next year. It's time for the next wave to come through. Watching breust, gunston, Stratton, smith, shiels, puopolo etc develop after already seeing buddy, roughy, Cyril, birchall was awesome. We are about to see the next wave. Enjoy it. Don't expect t a flag next year, just enjoy what's coming.

 

[Mr Lizard]

Fyfe and Martin won't be at Hawthorn next year.

You know this how?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

You know this how?

He doesn't.

 

[Fluro Boots]

The problem I have is getting Vickery because he's a shit truck and a campaigner.

Being a shit truck may be an issue but being a campaigner is a positive. I think that was part of why we drafted Lewis. A little bit of campaigner goes a long way.

 

[wizzard400]

I will be ok with this once the Hawthorn facebook page uploads a photo of one Jaegar O'Meara with a brown and gold border and the caption reads: "welcome to the club"

 

[Hong Kong Hawk]

All year I thought that it was just a bit harder for the team than in the three years previous. We let teams back into games we would normally close out, we started games slowly, we looked like we would kick away only to be reeled in and fall over the line. Like a grand old racehorse we kicked two games clear at the turn, and we thought "maybe, just maybe", only to drop the Melbourne game.

Individually, Mitchell found it a bit tougher to break away. Lewis, to my eye, was struggling to get to contests as he had done in the past. Irrespective, they battled on like the absolute champions they are.

But in the back of my mind, I was looking at the potential of 5 key players retiring within a year of each other, and wondering how we would manage this without absolutely bottoming out.

I was at Mitchell's first game, and Lewis', in the old days when I lived in Melbourne. They have delivered so much, and sentiment tells me that this feels bad.

But - this is OK, because I believe that we have the right decision makers setting us up for future success. Again, in the face of all that is thrown at the club in regards to this, we're doing it "The Hard Way" - not the popular way, not the soft way.

 

[S Lawrence]

Clarko really needs to go..his time is up.

Using his own logic , We can't guarantee he'll be there post 2017.

Hodge , Burgoyne, Gibson, Roughead and Birchall also need to go - we can't guarantee they'll be there post 2017.

In fact all players need to go because we can't guarantee they'll be there post 2017.

What a load of garbage been sold to the public by a coach that's lost the plot.

Clarko can put whatever spin he likes on the most disgraceful , inept, nonsensical trade period of all time.

I'm actually going to sack 15 workers tomorrow because I can't guarantee them work post 2017, but I'll replace them with another 15 workers who I can't guarantee will be there post 2017 either.

Forget for the moment we have a shit load of work to do over the next 15 months I'm deliberately going to sabotage my own business , strengthen my competitors and get rid of my two best workers this year, who also happen to be two of my best workers over the last 10'years, who are also very happy to work in the business for the next 15 months, all because I can't guarantee them work post 2017.

The decisions made by Clarko over the last 2 weeks are nothing short of insane and negligible.

Anyone who thinks our list will be better in 2017 ( regardless of who comes in ) is delusional.

I would have thought the next premiership up for grabs is in 2017, or am I'm missing something ?

Let's just sit the 2017 campaign out shall we bcos we can't guarantee anyone will be at the club in 2018.

Lewis and Mitchell would have both found work in 2918 applying their trade wherever they wanted.

Go figure..... mic Drop

The fourth Umpire out.





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I think you my be looking for the "is it curtains" thread.