The Jamarra Thread

[Hobdog]

My father-in-law was very insistent that he wouldn't talk to anyone about his mental health because being a man means being tough and stoic. He took his life in 2018 and there's a hole in our lives where he should be.

Really sorry for your loss mate. Gee that highlights the issue in stark light. If speaking up publicly can show just one man who is struggling in silence that it’s ok to seek help and admit you’re hurting, then that’s a win.

 

[Hobdog]

I lost a brother and both parents before I was 25.

I’m mid fifties now and happily married with two kids and a good career.

I don’t know how I survived looking back at all the stupid stuff I have done under the influence. Self medicating was the only way I could deal with the pain.

I wish I was man enough to deal with it correctly back in the day but I just didn’t know how and it wasn’t talked about much back then.

I can’t imagine how hard it would have been if I was under the scrutiny Jamarra is. I don’t think I would have made it.

Such hard loss to deal with at a young age, really sorry to hear that. I hid behind booze for so much of my 20s and then I realised that it was actually making me much worse with the hangover anxiety. The fact you’re able to use introspection is a huge asset.

 

[Mutt]

Wow. We have some amazing and courageous contributors on here today. Chapeaux.

 

[MrChristo]

Wow. We have some amazing and courageous contributors on here today. Chapeaux.

There really is.

I'm not brave, and in fact, in light of what I'm reading, I feel overwhelmingly *un*brave...
...but I am a guy who's seen some stuff, done some stuff, currently live west of the river and have a fair bit of time on my hands, so if anyone, ever feels like they need a chat, some fresh air, an unbiased ear...
Use that message button. (To me or anyone else).

Don't anyone sit there and think you're alone.

 

[Doggy]

Thanks Hobdog

As someone who's life has taken some unexpected turns in the past 11 months, I plumbed the depths of despair late last year. Still not in a good space now, but better than I was. I'm pretty flippant on here, and with most other people. Apart from my lovely lady and kids, I've been lucky to have 4 close mates and a relative and her partner checking in on me regularly.

I won't lie, one day late last year one of my mates called me as I was down the back of our rural property with some very dark thoughts and overwhelmed by the apparent insurmountable challenges. I nearly didn't answer that call. But I did. And I'm still here.

This year has been only fractionally better than last, but my support crew have got me through. I'm still frustrated with life (probably reflected in some of my angry posting on here and unnecessary fights I've picked on this board and SRP). But funnily enough being angry has kept my mind on footy, world affairs, and away from what at times was an unfathomable sadness. I also use humour a lot to mask my true feelings.

But a while back, I told my family and my 6 support crew how important they all were to me. But they also told me how important I am to them. (Most of them are life-long, or as good as, friendships.)

Having those conversations was one of the best things I've ever done.

Stay strong Hobdog and keep talking openly.
You're a legend.

I'd like to think we are a community here.

If you ever need, or anyone else ever needs, please reach out. I am always happy to help and having those conversations can mean the world. You are never alone.

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

Thank you Hobdog, weltschmerz, geoffjennings79 and maddog37 for your honesty and courage sharing your experiences and showing we can all suffer from poor mental health and statistically will over our lifetime. I am no stranger to the ‘black dog’ myself over the years.

I just want to add one thing, mental health is not something other people have, we all have mental health and looking after it is just as important as looking after your asthma, or diabetes.

I did some training once with a well known expert on trauma, PTSD, from disasters, he was working with us as we grappled with the 2009 Black Saturday bushfires which virtually destroyed our shire. He gave an analogy on trauma which has always stayed with me, and I think of it as useful for any of the curve balls that life throws at us.

“trauma is like swallowing an apple whole, you can’t digest it, it just sits there. Talking through the experience is putting the experience into language which helps you break down the apple and start to digest it.”

 

[weltschmerz]

From when JUH recently spoke out about what's been going on, it sounds like alcohol and nights out have been self-medicating. Get pissed and the time passes more blurrily and you remember less of it the next day. I know people who use food or exercise or marijuana to self-medicate and it's all a symptom, not proof that they don't give a shit and only want to drink/eat/work out/smoke.

 

[BulldogMuscle]

Mental health hey? Where do I start. I can sympathize with JUH, kinda went through the same thing myself. I know what it's like to be in the spotlight , I went from a homeless street kid on the streets of Brisbane to the front man of a fairly successful signed and touring music act, engaged, stable life, to have that all ripped out from under me in the space of a month (band split, fiancee left me, lost my job) due to things in and out of my control, ended up back in Melbourne and had to rebuild my life from ground zero and honestly twenty years later I am still trying to rebuild, I'll never reach the heights of my younger years but life is comfortable enough for me that mentally I am in a better place.

Throughout that whole period I self medicated with drugs and booze, as most musicians do, I couldn't imagine having the spotlight on me any more than what JUH does, specially with social media and the AFL media being as ruthless as they are.

I cut the kid alot of slack, the company he keeps certainly isn't helping but I know cutting people off when you are in his position can be one of the most difficult things to do.

Whatever the outcome is, if he plays AFL again, with us or against us, I do wish him all the best luck and I do hope he recaptures what drew him to AFL in the first place and I hope for his sake he does drop some of these shithead friends who want to drag him down with them.

 

[Dogs Ball]

It’s taken me a while to wipe away the blurr from my eyes … Caused by catching up with a thread I usually check multiple times each day. I wish I had half the bravery to share, as some of you have been, about the state of your thoughts. Thank you.

The mental anguish that Marra has/is/will be experiencing can’t really be explained in my understanding. Especially not on an open forum! Please don’t add to it. Please consider that words do have power.

I, like most (I, wish/trust all) of you, hope that this person is able to heal.

He has access to the best support I could imagine and believe that the club (backed by the AFL/AFL-PA) will take his wellbeing as a priority with respect to moving forward.

There is nothing for an outsider to do that is healthy except trust, in my opinion.

 

[Mofra]

For different reasons this starting look like a Tarryn Thomas trainwreck. If we cut him loose no other teams will be interested,

Not to me.

Marra's not malicious. He's a good guy. He's lost his way at the moment though, clearly.

 

[MYOB]

To the people that have spoken here about their experiences, I say bravo.

If this helps just one other person, then it will be worth the time you have spent to share your story.

 

[BigFloppa]

Mate, that is an extraordinarily courageous thing to do to tell your story so openly. It’s a huge reminder of how a conversation (that you almost didn’t have with your friend) can make a huge difference. The more men speak up and put their hand up, the more progress is made in saving lives. I think people often assume that mental illness is cured like some other health conditions but the reality is that it is not always a linear path back to health, rather it’s a day to day experience of managing it. One of the biggest things that has helped me in the last six years is running. That’s where I find my calm and the answers are always out on the running track. I hope things keep improving further you little by little and day by day. Take some comfort in the fact you’re not alone in the fight. You’re a star

Love your work mate.

I've had a pretty rough six months including my wife and I both losing jobs and an interstate relocation. Probably some of the darkest moments of my life and at my lowest point early this year I found running. It allowed me to get out of my head for a while and into my body. Just to have that break from the dark thoughts was an incredible reprieve and I don't know how I'd have made it through otherwise. I kept going with it and ran the Canberra half marathon in April this year. I think the best thing about running is that it teaches you how to ignore the negative voices in your head. In my longest and hardest runs I constantly have thoughts like "this is too hard", "you can't do this", "you should just stop" and in order to complete the run you have to be really good at ignoring those voices. I think that is a skill that you can develop and then apply outside of running. I know that only able-bodied people have the luxury of running, so I'm incredibly grateful to have it as a tool. Currently rehabbing an injured knee and despite the fact that life has gotten considerably better than it was at the start of the year, I've realised I need more than running in my toolkit to deal with the demons. One thing I've had to do is stay away from the news cycle because it just leave me feeling dark and gloomy about the future. Doomscrolling is a real problem for me that I need to stamp out to maintain my equilibrium.

I'd like to share this incredible quote by Nick Cave on cynicism which has been very useful for me to meditate on:

“You are right to be worried about your growing feelings of cynicism and you need to take action to protect yourself and those around you. … Cynicism is not a neutral position—and although it asks almost nothing of us, it is highly infectious and unbelievably destructive. In my view, it is the most common and easy of evils.

I know this because much of my early life was spent holding the world and the people in it in contempt. It was a position both seductive and indulgent. The truth is, I was young and had no idea what was coming down the line. I lacked the knowledge, the foresight, the self-awareness. I just didn’t know. It took a devastation to teach me the preciousness of life and the essential goodness of people. It took a devastation to reveal the precariousness of the world, of its very soul, to understand that it was crying out for help. It took a devastation to understand the idea of mortal value, and it took a devastation to find hope.

Unlike cynicism, hopefulness is hard-earned, makes demands upon us, and can often feel like the most indefensible and lonely place on Earth. Hopefulness is not a neutral position either. It is adversarial. It is the warrior emotion that can lay waste to cynicism. Each redemptive or loving act, as small as you like … keeps the devil down in the hole. It says the world and its inhabitants have value and are worth defending. It says the world is worth believing in. In time, we come to find that it is so.”

— Nick Cave

 

[maddog37]

That is fantastic. Thanks for posting

 

[BEaston]

Love your work mate.

I've had a pretty rough six months including my wife and I both losing jobs and an interstate relocation. Probably some of the darkest moments of my life and at my lowest point early this year I found running. It allowed me to get out of my head for a while and into my body. Just to have that break from the dark thoughts was an incredible reprieve and I don't know how I'd have made it through otherwise. I kept going with it and ran the Canberra half marathon in April this year. I think the best thing about running is that it teaches you how to ignore the negative voices in your head. In my longest and hardest runs I constantly have thoughts like "this is too hard", "you can't do this", "you should just stop" and in order to complete the run you have to be really good at ignoring those voices. I think that is a skill that you can develop and then apply outside of running. I know that only able-bodied people have the luxury of running, so I'm incredibly grateful to have it as a tool. Currently rehabbing an injured knee and despite the fact that life has gotten considerably better than it was at the start of the year, I've realised I need more than running in my toolkit to deal with the demons. One thing I've had to do is stay away from the news cycle because it just leave me feeling dark and gloomy about the future. Doomscrolling is a real problem for me that I need to stamp out to maintain my equilibrium.

I'd like to share this incredible quote by Nick Cave on cynicism which has been very useful for me to meditate on:

“You are right to be worried about your growing feelings of cynicism and you need to take action to protect yourself and those around you. … Cynicism is not a neutral position—and although it asks almost nothing of us, it is highly infectious and unbelievably destructive. In my view, it is the most common and easy of evils.

I know this because much of my early life was spent holding the world and the people in it in contempt. It was a position both seductive and indulgent. The truth is, I was young and had no idea what was coming down the line. I lacked the knowledge, the foresight, the self-awareness. I just didn’t know. It took a devastation to teach me the preciousness of life and the essential goodness of people. It took a devastation to reveal the precariousness of the world, of its very soul, to understand that it was crying out for help. It took a devastation to understand the idea of mortal value, and it took a devastation to find hope.

Unlike cynicism, hopefulness is hard-earned, makes demands upon us, and can often feel like the most indefensible and lonely place on Earth. Hopefulness is not a neutral position either. It is adversarial. It is the warrior emotion that can lay waste to cynicism. Each redemptive or loving act, as small as you like … keeps the devil down in the hole. It says the world and its inhabitants have value and are worth defending. It says the world is worth believing in. In time, we come to find that it is so.”

— Nick Cave

Your post about negative thoughts and and cyncism vs hope made me think of this fantastic piece of music:

 

[Mojorisin]

Your post about negative thoughts and and cyncism vs hope made me think of this fantastic piece of music:

Ren has alot of great music about mental health.

 

[Hobdog]

Love your work mate.

I've had a pretty rough six months including my wife and I both losing jobs and an interstate relocation. Probably some of the darkest moments of my life and at my lowest point early this year I found running. It allowed me to get out of my head for a while and into my body. Just to have that break from the dark thoughts was an incredible reprieve and I don't know how I'd have made it through otherwise. I kept going with it and ran the Canberra half marathon in April this year. I think the best thing about running is that it teaches you how to ignore the negative voices in your head. In my longest and hardest runs I constantly have thoughts like "this is too hard", "you can't do this", "you should just stop" and in order to complete the run you have to be really good at ignoring those voices. I think that is a skill that you can develop and then apply outside of running. I know that only able-bodied people have the luxury of running, so I'm incredibly grateful to have it as a tool. Currently rehabbing an injured knee and despite the fact that life has gotten considerably better than it was at the start of the year, I've realised I need more than running in my toolkit to deal with the demons. One thing I've had to do is stay away from the news cycle because it just leave me feeling dark and gloomy about the future. Doomscrolling is a real problem for me that I need to stamp out to maintain my equilibrium.

I'd like to share this incredible quote by Nick Cave on cynicism which has been very useful for me to meditate on:

“You are right to be worried about your growing feelings of cynicism and you need to take action to protect yourself and those around you. … Cynicism is not a neutral position—and although it asks almost nothing of us, it is highly infectious and unbelievably destructive. In my view, it is the most common and easy of evils.

I know this because much of my early life was spent holding the world and the people in it in contempt. It was a position both seductive and indulgent. The truth is, I was young and had no idea what was coming down the line. I lacked the knowledge, the foresight, the self-awareness. I just didn’t know. It took a devastation to teach me the preciousness of life and the essential goodness of people. It took a devastation to reveal the precariousness of the world, of its very soul, to understand that it was crying out for help. It took a devastation to understand the idea of mortal value, and it took a devastation to find hope.

Unlike cynicism, hopefulness is hard-earned, makes demands upon us, and can often feel like the most indefensible and lonely place on Earth. Hopefulness is not a neutral position either. It is adversarial. It is the warrior emotion that can lay waste to cynicism. Each redemptive or loving act, as small as you like … keeps the devil down in the hole. It says the world and its inhabitants have value and are worth defending. It says the world is worth believing in. In time, we come to find that it is so.”

— Nick Cave

Another amazing and courageous post. Reading your reflections on running resonated so much for me. Running is my mindfulness too. While on a run, I’ve actually tried to think about the things that are worrying me and it’s physically impossible. I read more about it and there’s science at play. The part of the brain responsible for worry and rumination is disabled while exercising. I often to talk to non-runners about the voice and how I can still remember the day early on when I hadn’t been running for long that day and I waited for the voice “you’re buggered, you need to stop”. It never came. That day I went from running only a short distance and needing to stop, to running 10km without stopping. That was the day I experienced my first ‘runners high’ and I was hooked. After that it was about challenging myself more. So it was 12km, 15km, half-marathons. I really don’t know where I’d be without running. But I always say to people, find what works for you, it doesn’t have to be running.

 

[Unorth]

Not to me.

Marra's not malicious. He's a good guy. He's lost his way at the moment though, clearly.

I agree but I think there’s two separate issues really.

Marras own battles and journey as a person and how much he may or may not want to commit to life as a professional footballer.

The risk that Marra presents to the club and how much that impacts our willingness to hand him another contract.

And the risk may not be about Marra himself as it is the company he’s unfortunately chosen to surround himself with. And that aspect of his life is something the club or afl has no real control over.

Not to directly compare the individuals or situations but it does recall a bit the time Jake Kings mates visited the Tigers and the PR nightmare that was. There’s just too much smoke around the company he proudly displays he keeps on social media. And some of the incidents he hasn’t been directly involved in but have created unwanted attention for all. As can happen in any professional sport really, you get bad influences latching on to young men making lots of money before they’re mature enough to really handle or process it appropriately.

My personal preference would be for Marra to be a Bulldog long term if that’s what he wants. I just don’t see the club willing to accept that risk beyond 2026 given we were denied other avenues of, for example, withholding pay this year. Taking emotions out of the long term equation (as it should be for the people in the club making these decisions) i find it difficult to see us accepting the risk. Some clubs would, to an extent.

I’m sure (would hope) there’s a lot of sympathy within the club towards Jamarra as a person and what may have led him down certain paths. That’s just kind of separate to the decisions the club has to make around his future.

 

[BrisDog]

Love your work mate.

I've had a pretty rough six months including my wife and I both losing jobs and an interstate relocation. Probably some of the darkest moments of my life and at my lowest point early this year I found running. It allowed me to get out of my head for a while and into my body. Just to have that break from the dark thoughts was an incredible reprieve and I don't know how I'd have made it through otherwise. I kept going with it and ran the Canberra half marathon in April this year. I think the best thing about running is that it teaches you how to ignore the negative voices in your head. In my longest and hardest runs I constantly have thoughts like "this is too hard", "you can't do this", "you should just stop" and in order to complete the run you have to be really good at ignoring those voices. I think that is a skill that you can develop and then apply outside of running. I know that only able-bodied people have the luxury of running, so I'm incredibly grateful to have it as a tool. Currently rehabbing an injured knee and despite the fact that life has gotten considerably better than it was at the start of the year, I've realised I need more than running in my toolkit to deal with the demons. One thing I've had to do is stay away from the news cycle because it just leave me feeling dark and gloomy about the future. Doomscrolling is a real problem for me that I need to stamp out to maintain my equilibrium.

I'd like to share this incredible quote by Nick Cave on cynicism which has been very useful for me to meditate on:

“You are right to be worried about your growing feelings of cynicism and you need to take action to protect yourself and those around you. … Cynicism is not a neutral position—and although it asks almost nothing of us, it is highly infectious and unbelievably destructive. In my view, it is the most common and easy of evils.

I know this because much of my early life was spent holding the world and the people in it in contempt. It was a position both seductive and indulgent. The truth is, I was young and had no idea what was coming down the line. I lacked the knowledge, the foresight, the self-awareness. I just didn’t know. It took a devastation to teach me the preciousness of life and the essential goodness of people. It took a devastation to reveal the precariousness of the world, of its very soul, to understand that it was crying out for help. It took a devastation to understand the idea of mortal value, and it took a devastation to find hope.

Unlike cynicism, hopefulness is hard-earned, makes demands upon us, and can often feel like the most indefensible and lonely place on Earth. Hopefulness is not a neutral position either. It is adversarial. It is the warrior emotion that can lay waste to cynicism. Each redemptive or loving act, as small as you like … keeps the devil down in the hole. It says the world and its inhabitants have value and are worth defending. It says the world is worth believing in. In time, we come to find that it is so.”

— Nick Cave

I think BigFloppa may have seen Nick here - on Steven Colbert.



It is a remarkable interview. Nick Cave is an incredible man. It is worth noting that Colbert and Cave have both suffered through the loss of family members through tragedy. Thanks to all those above sharing their experiences.

 

[House_of_Dahl]

If nothing else this thread is a great reminder that we have no idea of the challenges any person may have faced. In a world so full of rage and strong opinions it's easy to forget how easy the solution (choosing kindness) is.

 

[Norm De Guerre]

If nothing else this thread is a great reminder that we have no idea of the challenges any person may have faced. In a world so full of rage and strong opinions it's easy to forget how easy the solution (choosing kindness) is.

Its yet another reminder not to rush to judgement about things we only know fragments of information about.

In a thread that is predominantly filled with people doing exactly that.

 

[House_of_Dahl]

Its yet another reminder not to rush to judgement about things we only know fragments of information about.

In a thread that is predominantly filled with people doing exactly that.

There is a PHD thesis inside this thread!

 

[JTCWBFC]

You know he’s going to leave for peanuts, can see it a mile off

 

[Munnez]

Your post about negative thoughts and and cyncism vs hope made me think of this fantastic piece of music:

That song is amazing my wife showed it too me. My wife has her struggles with Bipolar so it has significant meaning. The honesty of people sharing in here has really been moving.

I feel that we are a diverse community in here that shares a common ground of the Dogs. Having said that I see a care for others that goes beyond that and it is reassuring that we have such great people on this board.

 

[Bald]

Tom Morris reporting on FC:

D-day is tomorrow. Hopeful he’s at training tomorrow but the club doesn’t know.

 

[iambrilliant]

Has he not been showing up to training again ?