The Manager Merry-go-Round

[Cruyff14]

Our problem is not in management but ownership. Arsenal backed Arteta with €300m in the last two summer windows. Ar one point backing him after a 12 game run with 1 win.

Our philosophy absolutely has to change. Ownership need to behave like the big club they purport to be, and tell the world they are with top management appointments.

Playing “our way” hasn’t worked for a couple of decades at least. Earning and spending more money is the way to win. Happy to adopt that philosophy

I have said this to you for years.

Spending = success

 

[SM]

I have said this to you for years.

Spending = success

Strange from a supporter of a team who has nurtured young talent from their Academy into key players in their side.

 

[Cruyff14]

Strange from a supporter of a team who has nurtured young talent from their Academy into key players in their side.

Yes but we also spend.

 

[Jatz]

You can't do it without spending big.

Except us, but we're special.

 

[SM]

Yes but we also spend.

Of course but I would have thought you'd know there's more to success than just spending. If spending equalled success then Chelsea would be leading the league right now.

 

[Cruyff14]

Of course but I would have thought you'd know there's more to success than just spending. If spending equalled success then Chelsea would be leading the league right now.

Have a won a lot though from spending large though, more than us - comparatively.

There obviously needs to be a balance, but investment is key

 

[SM]

Have a won a lot though from spending large though, more than us - comparatively.

There obviously needs to be a balance, but investment is key

Agree to disagree, rather surprised you think that's the case.

Development of players, having a key style, and recruiting smartly is key.

As someone said the other day, for years United has signed players and seen them play worse at United, only this season have they actually improved in the side, and that's down to having a competent manager and a clear style of play. Ironically even this season United's big spending hasn't resulted in much, Antony hasn't done all that much.

 

[Jatz]

Have a won a lot though from spending large though, more than us - comparatively.

There obviously needs to be a balance, but investment is key

There needs to be investment but I don't think it's key. Chelsea at the moment is the perfect example.

It's necessary but it's not the most important aspect in being successful.

 

[jd2010]

At what point do you shift philosophy though? At that point you have to change the squad significantly.

For smaller clubs, if they suffer relegation they would also need to overhaul their squad.

A philosophy can be broad enough to cover relegation. Set piece focused. Defensive. Counter attacking. High pressing and attacking. Etc. Something that flows from manager to manager.

What we've seen fail us is the strategy be signing players to play attacking pressing football, with the odd manager specific signing like Hojberg for Mourinho. Yet we sign managers whose style is the opposite of that. All 3 of Nuno, Mourinho and Conte are low-mid block managers who give up possession in midfield, yet we've signed only 1 capable defender across all of those windows who can play that way. And a midfield that also doesn't suit it. We have the escape route in the past of Kane and Son to paper over that crack.

From PL to championship a style can be carried forward. Many championship sides play good football that matches the quality dished up above them. Maybe back to back relegation would make that struggle? But clubs should stick to the philosophy until an unforeseen event makes it redundant.

 

[jd2010]

Our problem is not in management but ownership. Arsenal backed Arteta with €300m in the last two summer windows. Ar one point backing him after a 12 game run with 1 win.

Our philosophy absolutely has to change. Ownership need to behave like the big club they purport to be, and tell the world they are with top management appointments.

Playing “our way” hasn’t worked for a couple of decades at least. Earning and spending more money is the way to win. Happy to adopt that philosophy

Did I hack this account?

 

[Art Vandelay_]

I have said this to you for years.

Spending = success

Yes but like your mate you don’t care where it comes from. If the money is from human rights abusing oil sovereignties then I’d rather pass.

And I have stated in the last 12-18 months your methodology is far more praise worthy than your City/PSG types.

Like Arsenal? Have spoken numerous times about how I respect how they operate and how they’re, how Wenger was insistent on self sufficiency. I just laugh at their failures due to being s**t at football. s**t because clubs with blank cheque cheat codes have ruined football.

but can respect your operating structure of spending within the constraints of what you earn. Building from within a well thought out plan and incorporating youth into the setup and not abusing the academy system through mass loans.

 

[jd2010]

Of course but I would have thought you'd know there's more to success than just spending. If spending equalled success then Chelsea would be leading the league right now.

Spending well + time = success

Who knows if Chelsea are spending well. But it's way too early to know

United have spent "okay" under ETH and in little time have gone well but won't win the league this year. But could next year.

Arsenal have spent well for a number of years on the same plan and the gradual gains add up to this version of arsenal

 

[SM]

Spending well + time = success

Who knows if Chelsea are spending well. But it's way too early to know

United have spent "okay" under ETH and in little time have gone well but won't win the league this year. But could next year.

Arsenal have spent well for a number of years on the same plan and the gradual gains add up to this version of arsenal

United's improvement this season has come from implementing a strong playing style and ditching Ronaldo. Their spending has largely added little to that outside of Martinez.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

United's improvement this season has come from implementing a strong playing style and ditching Ronaldo. Their spending has largely added little to that outside of Martinez.

Lol Casemiro has been key.

 

[SM]

Lol Casemiro has been key.

And he was a relatively cheap signing. I meant the big money on Antony. Wasn't Casemiro 30m or something?

 

[Bojan KantKick]

And he was a relatively cheap signing. I meant the big money on Antony. Wasn't Casemiro 30m or something?

£60m plus 10 in bonuses.

 

[SM]

£60m plus 10 in bonuses.

Geeze I take it back. Thought he was cheap.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Geeze I take it back. Thought he was cheap.

Not cheap but he's fantastic.

 

[jd2010]

Even the overspend on players like Antony and Malacia who haven't been great but align with what ETH is going for at an overall level works because the clubs pulling in the right direction. Throw in the eventual backing of his Ronaldo stance and this is the outcome.

As opposed to our strategy of signing what appeared to be good money deals in Bissouma at 25m and Spence who eother don't fit Contes 343 in one case, or is too young and untried in the other

 

[SM]

Even the overspend on players like Antony and Malacia who haven't been great but align with what ETH is going for at an overall level works because the clubs pulling in the right direction. Throw in the eventual backing of his Ronaldo stance and this is the outcome

Which was precisely my point. Spending is nothing if you don't have the vision and culture to go with it.

 

[jd2010]

Which was precisely my point. Spending is nothing if you don't have the vision and culture to go with it.

Agreed it needs to be part of it. But without spending even the culture and vision can't do enough at a top 6 club

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Even the overspend on players like Antony and Malacia who haven't been great but align with what ETH is going for at an overall level works because the clubs pulling in the right direction. Throw in the eventual backing of his Ronaldo stance and this is the outcome.

As opposed to our strategy of signing what appeared to be good money deals in Bissouma at 25m and Spence who eother don't fit Contes 343 in one case, or is too young and untried in the other

Malacia is young and inconsistent. His best more than justifies his fee.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

 

[Bradesmaen]

 

[chef]

So we have the El Sackico and the El Shitico(Pool and Us) this weekend.