Mega Thread The Random Thoughts Thread Part 3: Try Hard with a Kengeance

[JimmyBeerCans]

Was she 'working'?

Climbing the ladder

 

[Doctor Feel]

Right? The greatest MMORPG was built on it.

You dig a hole...
..You bury the bones.

 

[ScooterBrother]

No we aren't getting into nitty gritty - you are generalising by saying x yrs at uni for both courses meaning they are both equally difficult - this is false. Its a fact of life some courses are more difficult than others academically - and it not the duration that's the deciding factor. Just like at high school in yr 12 you could do Maths 1 & 2 or Business maths.

Yes, we are. You just don't know it.

You're implying that what you think is difficult is what others also think is difficult. I cannot add up the scores in a dartboard game, barely know my times tables, have the EQ of a inanimate carbon rod and struggle with communication. I can however do some pretty good math, write a mean report, program a computer and analyse some stuff.

So we get back to - which of those skill sets has has more value? And why?

Invariably, the skills that women bring to the workplace are valued less monetarily than the skills men bring. When women learn the skills men bring, we then devalue them. When men learn the skills women bring, we increase the value.

Hence, we're back into the nitty gritty of my post waaaay back when.

I'd argue the higher paying job as you get the opportunity to save more money over time to extend your leave if you need, but in reality it depends on the individual employer.

You're such a man hahaha

Trust me - i'm not

Yeahhh you kinda are.

Who pays for parental leave is a whole other ballgame that I don't want to get into here.

Who pays for it is irrelevant.

Equal time in and out of the workforce and the home when raising a baby for both sexes is what I am arguing for.

 

[Papa G]

There's been a "workforce" for thousands of years?

Of course there has been, although Computer programmers and HR Managers were fairly few and far between until relatively recently.

 

[Steve Dore]

I'm always curious as to why some people scoff at JavaScript?

For the same reason that people scoff at other people's taste in music and cargo pants.

 

[Malibu#27]

Yes, we are. You just don't know it.
You're implying that what you think is difficult is what others also think is difficult. I cannot add up the scores in a dartboard game, barely know my times tables, have the EQ of a inanimate carbon rod and struggle with communication. I can however do some pretty good math, write a mean report, program a computer and analyse some stuff.

So we get back to - which of those skill sets has has more value? And why?

I'm not making the decision on what is difficult or not. Testing throughout our schooling systems coupled with University entrance requirements are what I'm pointing to, as it points to either difficulty or demand. Look at the trends - not the individual - as you say.

Invariably, the skills that women bring to the workplace are valued less monetarily than the skills men bring. When women learn the skills men bring, we then devalue them. When men learn the skills women bring, we increase the value.

You're such a man hahaha

I'd argue my answer was a raw analytical answer based on available $$$ - not a man answer

Who pays for it is irrelevant.

No - its very relevant, but not something related to this topic, its a much broader issue. Should a company pay for 5 years off - 5 kids over 5 years ? I'd argue no, government on the other hand.........
But as I said, that's a different issue.

Equal time in and out of the workforce and the home when raising a baby for both sexes is what I am arguing for.

And I'm arguing for freedom of choice, although it appears under the covers we agree on this bit.

 

[Magus]

Of course there has been, although Computer programmers and HR Managers were fairly few and far between until relatively recently.

Damn those ancient Egyptians!

 

[Steve Dore]

Damn those ancient Egyptians!

Egyptian HR manager in action

 

[ScooterBrother]

I'm always curious as to why some people scoff at JavaScript?

Its brilliant. I use it all the time.

But it's brilliance is its simplicity so propellor heads tend to get defensive.

 

[Papa G]

http://www.smh.com.au/business/work...p-50-highest-paying-jobs-20161204-gt3uzx.html

Pretty big discrepancy in these pay scales for both men and women, but I dare say you did this analysis in say 1990, it would have been way bigger and in 1970 it wouldn't have even probably been worth measuring (for women) My point, it may never be equal, but as it year passes, it'll get closer.

 

[bomberclifford]

I cant tell if you're laughing because its absurdly true or because you think its inaccurate.

These women programmed and implemented the first fully electronic computer for the US military which calculated ballistic trajectory with complicated calculus. They had to troubleshoot and fix problems on the fly. They had to work out how the "Brain" was structured and solve sorting algorithms
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betty_Holberton went on to work on the development of COBAL and FORTRAN with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grace_Hopper

They were amazing people and make script kiddies playing around in web development today look like pea brains.

I have no doubt they were amazing, I was laughing at the use of javascript as a benchmark.

 

[BornPort]

Its brilliant. I use it all the time.

But it's brilliance is its simplicity so propellor heads tend to get defensive.

What do you use it for? Do you use Angular or React? Or back-end with Node.js?

 

[bomberclifford]

I think when a couple has a baby, they amount of time spent at home raising that baby should be equal. Thus, the amount of time missed at the workplace, would also be equal.

That's an ideal and it is good to use as a guide for how we approach things, but in the real world people make choices based on their own personal circumstances. Some will choose a method that doesn't fit with the ideal.

 

[bomberclifford]

So I'm driving along Hanson road Davoren Park about 9:00 this morning when I glimpse a fairly pregnant woman pushing a pram whilst sucking on a ciggie.

It's a good look.

Did you get her number?

 

[edgie]

I coded a series of board games with Pascal for my HSC. Was a pretty easy language to pickup but **** me I was just about ready to destroy things with the amount of syntax errors.

 

[Doctor Feel]

lol my first programming exposure was creating Snake using python. Then it was creating a car registration system in Java, then interactive websites using Javascript and JSON.

 

[bomberclifford]

HR Managers were fairly few and far between until relatively recently.

Still have the same job description though ...

 

[ScooterBrother]

What do you use it for? Do you use Angular or React? Or back-end with Node.js?

Phew, a whole bunch of stuff... data validation/processing, web service integration, logic QA. Bit of front end work with jQuery. Lots of OpenLayers. Effectively I create web based applications to connect the field to the office. Probably need to refresh it all actually but its not really my core role.

 

[ScooterBrother]

That's an ideal and it is good to use as a guide for how we approach things, but in the real world people make choices based on their own personal circumstances. Some will choose a method that doesn't fit with the ideal.

Well yeah, I'm not saying we should enforce people to stay at home with batons, just provide adequate amounts of leave to both sexes to enable natural balance to occur.

As it is now, women have to take time off for obvious reasons, so men keep working. By offering paid parental leave to men as well, over time, Men will slowly spend more time at home, and in turn Women more time at work, closing the gap.

 

[Andre]

What do you use it for? Do you use Angular or React? Or back-end with Node.js?

It's not like you can just use Javascript alone on anything much beyond 'Hello world!'. You've got the back end to do as well, so unless you're sitting on a simple data structure you'll have a fair degree of SQL to play around with as well (unless you're just a front end developer). The current project working on is an AngularJS migration of an existing Client / Server app. against a complex back end database. Work with a decent set of third party components and libraries / frameworks and Javascript is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[Andre]

Well yeah, I'm not saying we should enforce people to stay at home with batons, just provide adequate amounts of leave to both sexes to enable natural balance to occur.

As it is now, women have to take time off for obvious reasons, so men keep working. By offering paid parental leave to men as well, over time, Men will slowly spend more time at home, and in turn Women more time at work, closing the gap.

I like the Scandanavian approach here, where father's get paid the leave as well, but it's totally separate from whether the mother takes any or all of hers. So it's 3 months or so, either take it or it's just lost. Unsurprisingly most do, not just because they want to, but when it's been paid for it'd be pretty hard to say 'nah, I'll keep working and you do it all at home'.

Where it'd break down here is, in order to not have men skipping it, is tying to their wage (up to a decent level, $100k at least), which would immediately bring every Lefty out that it's subsidising the rich. I certainly wish when my boys were born that 3 months each time at my wage, to be there full time the first 3 months, was available.

 

[ScooterBrother]

I like the Scandanavian approach here, where father's get paid the leave as well, but it's totally separate from whether the mother takes any or all of hers. So it's 3 months or so, either take it or it's just lost. Unsurprisingly most do, not just because they want to, but when it's been paid for it'd be pretty hard to say 'nah, I'll keep working and you do it all at home'. Where it'd break down here is, in order to not have men skipping it, is tying to their wage (up to a decent level, $100k at least), which would immediately bring every Left out that it's subsidising the rich. I certainly wish when my boys were born 3 months each time at my wage, to be there full time the first 3 months was available.

Totally agree and the Scandinavian model was the one I had in mind when posting.

 

[ScooterBrother]

It's not like you can just use Javascript alone on anything much beyond 'Hello world!'. You've got the back end to do as well, so unless you're sitting on a simple data structure you'll have a fair degree of SQL to play around with as well (unless you're just a front end developer). The current project working on is an AngularJS migration of an existing Client / Server app. against a complex back end database. Work with a decent set of third party components and libraries / frameworks and Javascript is nothing to sneeze at.

Yeah exactly.

For an application and for what I'm doing id say:

50% SQL DB Admin
20% JavaScript (and associated libraries)
15% HTML
10% CSS
5% Web Service development

does depend on what you're trying to do though. Some of the JavaScript required gets pretty full on pretty quickly.

 

[edgie]

Still have the same job description though ...

Historically inaccurate. Workers on the pyraminds were well paid with 4 litres of boozah a day. Much more progressive than modern day renumeration.

 

[Portology]

Haven't even left Narita yet. You too can have a pet capsicum, or weirder

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