List Mgmt. The Reid situation

[CasuallyDressed]

It has dawned to me that we either need Reid back or we need another big defender. I'm probably pointing out the obvious.

What is the best answer to this? Do we go as hard as possible at getting Boyd? Are there any big defenders or big forwards in the league that we could chase and get?

We need a defender with genuine pace. I like Keeffe but he was exposed by Franklin for pace last night. I think Brown would have been the exposed aswell, and Reid hasn't exactly been great on Buddy himself.

It's a glaring hole, for mine. They score to easily against us.

 

[JackoSpades]

It has dawned to me that we either need Reid back or we need another big defender. I'm probably pointing out the obvious.

What is the best answer to this? Do we go as hard as possible at getting Boyd? Are there any big defenders or big forwards in the league that we could chase and get?

We need a defender with genuine pace. I like Keeffe but he was exposed by Franklin for pace last night. I think Brown would have been the exposed aswell, and Reid hasn't exactly been great on Buddy himself.

It's a glaring hole, for mine. They score to easily against us.

Reid is an AA defender, only playing forward as last resort.
As a defender he attacks the ball, plays in front when he should and contests in the air.

We need another forward IMO. How we do it and who, is the question.

 

[Jonno94]

Reid is an AA defender, only playing forward as last resort.
As a defender he attacks the ball, plays in front when he should and contests in the air.

We need another forward IMO. How we do it and who, is the question.

I agree with this, Reid is much better as a defender and I would like to see him, Keeffe and Brown all down there at the same time. However it looks like we are out of time and options regarding another tall forward.

We could get someone like White for cheap at the end of the year..

 

[SnakePlisskin]

Chris Dawes

 

[Jonno94]

Chris Dawes

As poor as he was last year you cant ignore the fact that he left a massive hole in our team. After watching some 2011 games it was noticeable how much more Cloke was moving up the ground and winning contests which would result in a forward 50 entry or goal. Now it just seems he is stuck in the goal square since he doesn't a big forward to kick it to.

Dawes may not have marked every ball but at least he would make a contest and bring it down for smalls, which allowed Cloke to move up the ground and dominate.

 

[mattys123]

I was so frustrated last night at Reid, he really struggled at times up forward and a lot of it was his fault.

Yes the delivery was poor but some of his kicks were just dumb. He needs to learn how to play as a forward, which probably takes at least 20 games up there, so we need to make a decision at the end of this year whether we keep him down back or permanently leave him as a forward.

It probably depends on who we can get in the trade period, if there's a class defender or forward available, then the problem is solved somewhat, if not we have to improve from within, and I don't know if we have a replacement for Reid at either end at the moment.

 

[loki04]

Reid in 2013 is much more important to our team as a forward, 1 poor game against a scragging holding cheat in Gibson does not justify him needing to go back.

Buddy got off the leash a bit in the 1st half but keefe eventually fought back and held his own after half time.

Brown smashed Roughhead.

It was actually the bevy of smalls getting front and centre that smashed us then a KPP taking marks and scoring, speaking of that (genuine crumbing small fwds) how good would it be to see our small forwards crumb like the Hawks counter parts zzz one can dream.

 

[tazzawazza]

It has dawned to me that we either need Reid back or we need another big defender. I'm probably pointing out the obvious.

What is the best answer to this? Do we go as hard as possible at getting Boyd? Are there any big defenders or big forwards in the league that we could chase and get?

We need a defender with genuine pace. I like Keeffe but he was exposed by Franklin for pace last night. I think Brown would have been the exposed aswell, and Reid hasn't exactly been great on Buddy himself.

It's a glaring hole, for mine. They score to easily against us.

Trade him, Sidebottom for Boyd?

 

[Jelly Bean]

Where Reid plays this year and then where he plays beyond is two different question.

Reid must stay forward this year. The next best alternative for that role is Paine, and he is a long way off AFL football. We simply need more than just Cloke and Lynch, as Lynch's form is horrible.

As to next year, Reid stays forward until we have another alternative. That means trading for a key forward - which we might try, butwe will need to overpay as the market will be (and always is) red hot for key forwards.

We will not get Boyd.

 

[Obese Arachnid]

Where Reid plays this year and then where he plays beyond is two different question.

Reid must stay forward this year. The next best alternative for that role is Paine, and he is a long way off AFL football. We simply need more than just Cloke and Lynch, as Lynch's form is horrible.

As to next year, Reid stays forward until we have another alternative. That means trading for a key forward - which we might try, butwe will need to overpay as the market will be (and always is) red hot for key forwards.

We will not get Boyd.

As long as we beat Carlton to the best KPF out there & steal him from under their nose.

If we are going to overpay at least lets piss Carlscum off.

 

[HFF]

To be honest I thought Gibson got away with plenty of holding on Reid which was clearly evident at the game.

IMO, we won't find another tall forward to bring in who is a gun.

Reid has the ability to be a gun forward IMO. We know he is a gun footballer regardless but he is building a very good relationship with Cloke. He is crucial to our setup IMO as a forward. If it is just Cloke or bust then we can kiss our premiership aspirations beyond this year goodbye.

Our defence however is one paced. All the Hawks forwards looked so much sharper and quicker from there talls to their smalls.

Our tall defenders in Brown and Keeffe are actually ok IMO, its our mediums/smalls that is the worry. Maxy can no longer defend and is slow. Shaw always blames others, despite his poor ability to defend and his constant brain fades that are team deflating. Williams is ok but he tries to always take on everyone and is a poor kick of the footy. Harry whilst has speed, always over does it and his disposal is ordinary. His ability to defend is also rubbish.

Goldsack and Toovey are two who can actually defend and offer some leg speed.

This is why I have been a huge advocate to trade Shaw and Harry. We need to improve our defence. These two just don't cut it anymore. Shaw should be what Birchall is to Hawthorn. He is nowhere near it anymore.

 

[Lord Wilberforce]

I have little doubt that the Club will find a forward replacement in the off season and Reid will go back to being a defender. It's been a short term solution to a long term problem.

 

[TheFreshBanana]

We don't need Reid back. But last night we did.

Players like Franklin probably do need Reid's attention. I think the next time we face them, Reid MUST go down back.

In the meantime, we've shown that we can handle most key forward duo's with Brown and Keeffe.

 

[forwardflanker]

It has dawned to me that we either need Reid back or we need another big defender. I'm probably pointing out the obvious.

What is the best answer to this? Do we go as hard as possible at getting Boyd? Are there any big defenders or big forwards in the league that we could chase and get?

We need a defender with genuine pace. I like Keeffe but he was exposed by Franklin for pace last night. I think Brown would have been the exposed aswell, and Reid hasn't exactly been great on Buddy himself.

It's a glaring hole, for mine. They score to easily against us.

We don't need another big defender it is probably the area where we have the best depth on our list. Keefe, Reid, Brown and Frost are all AFL quality tall defenders imo. Toovey can also take tall forwards if need be and is as good as anyone playing on the medium-tall category of forwards.

In fact if we were to look at creating a trade to get the no 1 pick I'd first be looking to offload a defender since we have that depth. i.e. Reid or Brown.

Hawthorn score heavily against us because they get through our press too easily and because our midfielders don't defend well enough. On an even playing field the lock down aspects of our defence are in a pretty good place atm.

Keefe's pace is fine, Franklin is going to burn all tall defenders for pace so to stop him you need to defend the ball movement into their forward line better either by putting more pressure on the ball carrier when their moving through the press or by flooding their forward line. If there were a tall defender in the AFL who could keep up with Franklin then I doubt they'd be a tall defender for very long.

 

[millsy29gopies]

I thought Keeffe was exceptional last night. Playing on Buddy you knew he was always going to get beaten as he is one of if not the best forwards in the game but Franklin kicked 2 of his 4 on Shaw. Why was Shaw on him?

Brown also beat Roughead well and truly which must be a big confidence boost.

Reid will stay forward until at least the end of the year, Paine would not be doing a better job. We do need to go out and get someone in the off-season though.

 

[loki04]

We don't need Reid back. But last night we did.

Players like Franklin probably do need Reid's attention. I think the next time we face them, Reid MUST go down back.

In the meantime, we've shown that we can handle most key forward duo's with Brown and Keeffe.

Then who do you kick too? a severely outnumbered Cloke? You know he struggled to beat Lake let alone Lake plus Gibson with Hodge 3rd in which is what will happen if Reid goes back.

Keeffe did well enough in the end, Franklin had his kicking boot on which he seems to do a lot vs us.

Franklin kicked 4 on Reid a few season back too.

Reid must stay forward and really he should of kicked 2 and also was giving us an option on the wing throughout the night.

We were beaten by the Hawks mediums and smalls.

 

[TheFreshBanana]

I would have sent Goldsack up forward.

The fact is, if you're conceding 40 points in the first quarter, something is seriously wrong. First priority is defence, then you start thinking about offence.

 

[loki04]

I would have sent Goldsack up forward.

The fact is, if you're conceding 40 points in the first quarter, something is seriously wrong. First priority is defence, then you start thinking about offence.

The fact is Reid has played in the same defence that was smashed off the park the previous 4 times.

Doesn't matter how good your defence is if you can't kick a winning score you lose.

 

[Swooop]

Agree with those who say at this stage that we need Reid forward.

A Trav-centric forward line, where we kick to him hopelessly scragglwd and outnumbered is so frustrating and pointless that it's mind numbing and virtually unwatchable.
Certainly it's untenable from a success viewpoint against any moderate level of opposition.

So unless we snare another decent option, Reid has to stay forward unless match ups or injury demand otherwise.

Brown and Keeffe are looking pretty solid overall, Goldy to help out, though last night the match ups just didn't seem right.

 

[loki04]

Agree with those who say at this stage that we need Reid forward.

A Trav-centric forward line, where we kick to him hopelessly scragglwd and outnumbered is so frustrating and pointless that it's mind numbing and virtually unwatchable.
Certainly it's untenable from a success viewpoint against any moderate level of opposition.

So unless we snare another decent option, Reid has to stay forward unless match ups or injury demand otherwise.

Brown and Keeffe are looking pretty solid overall, Goldy to help out, though last night the match ups just didn't seem right.

The match ups were fine, to stop Franklin we need a loose man zoning 3rd in and also not allow such easy delivery by their mids they break from us into space far too easy.

Keeffe was left alone so often vs Franklin I'm surprised he did as well as he did in the end.

Where was Maxwell or Goldsack coming across as 3rd up or even blocking the space in front Franklin?

 

[Knowledge]

Franklin kicked two goals from free's (one which was soft vs shaw I think it was and the other was marginal vs Sinclair - although it was probably a free). So I think Keeffe did a good job. I thought their set up around the stoppages in the fwd half and around the ground was way better than ours and they burned us off the back of the pack. Being at the game it was amazing to see how many of their players were open in the fwd line.

I think it was the right move to keep Reid up fwd, he probably needs to stay there the rest of the year. I also thought he was a bit stiff with some free kicks that could have gone his way too. We def need to target another tall fwd.

 

[Pera]

The problem when you're a forward, and you need to remember this as a supporter, is you not going to kick goals every week. You can be consistent week in week out as a back, but going on the offensive and doing it consistently is a different kettle of fish.

Reid had one average game last night. He actually played like a backman at times, for example when the ball was kicked long down his throat in the first quarter and he simply grabbed Gibson who was coming back with the flight of the ball. A forward born in the role would have put his shoulder and forearm into Gibson and taken an easy mark. But he decided to tangle up and from there, he was always going to struggle.

Putting him back after one bad game would be crazy, as he needs to evolve and learn playing at FF. He's a fantastic player and will pick it up pretty quickly IMO.

 

[sr36]

We do need someone to cover the quick leading agile tall forwards like Buddy, Cameron, Riewoldt. From our list, Goldsack and Frost look like the best candidates. I don't think moving Reid back is the answer for this type of player.

 

[Captain Cloke]

Jack Frost says hello.

 

[Pendles!]

Only one way to see if jack paine can cut it and that's to play him.

We should look at a mature age guy from the state leagues, there are a few around.