Autopsy Jesse Hogan - Worth 220 Points

[Carnthedockers]

The problem with shopping him around is he has all the power. We can't choose where he goes. He picks his destination, and if the club doesn't want to pay what we ask they walk away. Then how do we keep a bloke on our list who most likely doesn't want to be there anymore?

 

[Moist Biscuit]

What a complete cockup his recruitment was. Buy High sell low may as well be our new catchphrase.

 

[Superkoops]

My main issue is we have exactly ******* donuts to replace him.

Taberner gets injured and we are beyond f’ed

I can only assume we have a plan for this scenario. Brodie Mihocek or another I can’t think of at present. Maybe a player swap with one of these interested clubs??

On the cheap may mean some pick upgrades or the like. With GWS for e.g. it could be something like the following (with only one compo pick incl. for consideration).

Compo pick 9 for Williams
14, 19, Esava Ratugolea

27

Esava Ratugolea

Age

25

Ht

197cm

Wt

108kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.6

2star

K

4.8

2star

HB

3.8

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

2.2

4star

MG

131.6

2star

D

8.1

2star

K

4.3

2star

HB

3.9

3star

M

2.1

2star

T

2.5

3star

MG

109.0

2star

D

9.2

3star

K

5.0

2star

HB

4.2

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

2.2

4star

MG

133.8

3star

> Cameron, 41 (or end of 1st round pick for Corr)
Hogan, 11, 29 > 9, 19 (and maybe a really late pick if not being used or we throw in a future 4th at our end and get a current fourth back now).

The value on points depending on other compo is around 40/41 so early third value. Improves our draft hand significantly.

 

[dont bowl there]

If any of thios

To be fair, it could be his manager or another team trying to force a move. Our actual position could be less desperate than its being made out.

The parts I believe are

1) We have issues with Jesse
2) At least 1 of Jesse and Freo are happy to explore a move to another club

The severity of 1 and the prospect of 2 being really strong from our side I would need to see more evidence of.

I think the lack of talk coming from the club says it all. Shocked if what is being reported isn’t close to the truth, if it was wildly off we would have surely said something.

 

[raffrox]

I think the lack of talk coming from the club says it all. Shocked if what is being reported isn’t close to the truth, if it was wildly off we would have surely said something.

Yeah, it's a bit like the Pies and Treloar.

The silence is deafening.

 

[raffrox]

The problem with shopping him around is he has all the power. We can't choose where he goes. He picks his destination, and if the club doesn't want to pay what we ask they walk away. Then how do we keep a bloke on our list who most likely doesn't want to be there anymore?

It's the case with any player at the moment. Generally speaking players have the power to determine where they will go or at the least, where they won't go.

Once free agency compensation goes I could see us going to more of a US system where players can be traded to any team unless they have a "no trade" clause.

Until then teams are consistently screwed when they lose a player.

 

[Dale147]

Freo are actively building a new culture, Jesse needs to be a part of that or hit the road.

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

The problem with shopping him around is he has all the power. We can't choose where he goes. He picks his destination, and if the club doesn't want to pay what we ask they walk away. Then how do we keep a bloke on our list who most likely doesn't want to be there anymore?

You can't stop his manager from shopping him around. And an under-contract player always has the power to reject a destination club.

The only hold the club ever has is to keep him to his contract, even if he wants to leave.

Of course, it could be that the Hogan camp is in for a rude awakening when they look at other clubs: it may be that no-one wants to offer Jesse the money he thinks he deserves. He was on 900k a year at Melbourne, and tried to get 1 million a year from us. If it is true that he is only on 650k a year that is a significant down-grade. If potential suiters don't even want to pay him that, well then that has to be a big wake-up call to him that perhaps he isn't quite the footballer that he once thought he was.

 

[Midnite65]

What a complete cockup his recruitment was. Buy High sell low may as well be our new catchphrase.

At least we put him on a fairly reasonable base and lots of incentives, imagine if we had pput him on

You can't stop his manager from shopping him around. And an under-contract player always has the power to reject a destination club.

The only hold the club ever has is to keep him to his contract, even if he wants to leave.

Of course, it could be that the Hogan camp is in for a rude awakening when they look at other clubs: it may be that no-one wants to offer Jesse the money he thinks he deserves. He was on 900k a year at Melbourne, and tried to get 1 million a year from us. If it is true that he is only on 650k a year that is a significant down-grade. If potential suiters don't even want to pay him that, well then that has to be a big wake-up call to him that perhaps he isn't quite the footballer that he once thought he was.

The $650k is only if he earns all the incentives, base would be a lot lower than that, hence the reason he wants to leave. Only thing is which other club is going to given him a high base contract again with all of the behaviour issues.

 

[salim malik]

With the Freo footy club its a dysfunctional love affair. The club stuffs up there is a redeeming factor ,ie an occasional finals appearance or a Brownlow or a rising star winner and the club is forgiven , all is well for a while then the cycle starts again.
25 years of dysfunction and I,m still hanging in there, talk about a glutton for punishment.

 

[dont bowl there]

Yeah, it's a bit like the Pies and Treloar.

The silence is deafening.

That situation is much stranger than Hogan. They were happy to give the contract last season and now are actively trying to trade him. Dogs have done it right in terms of Dunkley, he will almost certainly be traded but they will get more for him than Treloar/Hogan combined.

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

...
Hogan is THE natural leader of the tall forwards & a bona fide superstar when on song.
If we trade him for peanuts, this will bite us on the bum big time!
Minimum trade I would accept is 2 first rounders.
Nobody will pay that, but that is even better, & we keep him.

Hogan doesn't come across as a leader at all. As far as I remember, he has never been in the leadership group at an AFL club.

He is a talented forward, but no superstar. He has never made an AA team. His best accolade was Rising Star back in 2015. He hasn't even been the leading goal-kicker at an AFL club since 2016.

 

[salim malik]

Freo are actively building a new culture, Jesse needs to be a part of that or hit the road.

25 years of building this new culture, it better be bloody good..

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

It's the case with any player at the moment. Generally speaking players have the power to determine where they will go or at the least, where they won't go.

Once free agency compensation goes I could see us going to more of a US system where players can be traded to any team unless they have a "no trade" clause.

Until then teams are consistently screwed when they lose a player.

I'd like it to be that players are tied to their club for the first 6 years of their career. During that time they can be traded to any club.

After 6 years all uncontracted players become unrestricted free agents with no draft pick compensation if they leave a club. All 6 years+ contracted players can be traded to any club, but the player can nominate the state (so a young family isn't totally disrupted)

 

[Purple_Turtle]

25 years of building this new culture, it better be bloody good..

Temper your expectations a bit. I think at least ten of those years were spent learning why you need to build a culture, rather than actually doing it.

 

[Sully90]

I'd like it to be that players are tied to their club for the first 6 years of their career. During that time they can be traded to any club.

After 6 years all uncontracted players become unrestricted free agents with no draft pick compensation if they leave a club. All 6 years+ contracted players can be traded to any club, but the player can nominate the state (so a young family isn't totally disrupted)

6 years is an absurd amount of time to force someone to be at a Club. That's over half of most players' careers and more than most.

 

[Carnthedockers]

Does hogan have more baggage than what stringer did?

 

[Monument Hills]

That situation is much stranger than Hogan. They were happy to give the contract last season and now are actively trying to trade him. Dogs have done it right in terms of Dunkley, he will almost certainly be traded but they will get more for him than Treloar/Hogan combined.

I can't find any actual basis for the bolded. Yesterday: "The Herald Sun understands Fremantle will meet with his management this week ahead of next Wednesday‘s trade period kick-off.
The Dockers are adamant they have not actively shopped him around, despite reports, but it is no secret he would consider offers that would give him more contract security.
He has one season left on his initial deal and is unlikely to meet a trigger clause that would hand him two extra seasons.
Despite a raft of speculation about clubs including Collingwood registering its interest, he has no official offer."

IMO his manager is doing his job looking for the best deal given the italicized (i.e. Hogan worried about future contract and pay). Freo are "adamant" they haven't done anything (yet). And the rest of the media are going postal trying to fill pages and get clicks. As WTG said earlier, PerthNow weren't even game enough to put a name to their article today.

IMO, if Hogan leaves it will be because he pushed it for more money/job security, not the club seeking to improve culture or any such thing being suggested by others on this thread. Don't think the club was planning for this possibility at all.

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

6 years is an absurd amount of time to force someone to be at a Club. That's over half of most players' careers and more than most.

Is it more absurd than the current rules that tie a player to their club for 8 years before free agency?

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

I can't find any actual basis for the bolded. Yesterday: "The Herald Sun understands Fremantle will meet with his management this week ahead of next Wednesday‘s trade period kick-off.
The Dockers are adamant they have not actively shopped him around, despite reports, but it is no secret he would consider offers that would give him more contract security.
He has one season left on his initial deal and is unlikely to meet a trigger clause that would hand him two extra seasons.
Despite a raft of speculation about clubs including Collingwood registering its interest, he has no official offer."

IMO his manager is doing his job looking for the best deal given the italicized (i.e. Hogan worried about future contract and pay). Freo are "adamant" they haven't done anything (yet). And the rest of the media are going postal trying to fill pages and get clicks. As WTG said earlier, PerthNow weren't even game enough to put a name to their article today.

IMO, if Hogan leaves it will be because he pushed it for more money/job security, not the club seeking to improve culture or any such thing being suggested by others on this thread. Don't think the club was planning for this possibility at all.

I think that bolded bit refers to Treloar

 

[dont bowl there]

I can't find any actual basis for the bolded. Yesterday: "The Herald Sun understands Fremantle will meet with his management this week ahead of next Wednesday‘s trade period kick-off.
The Dockers are adamant they have not actively shopped him around, despite reports, but it is no secret he would consider offers that would give him more contract security.
He has one season left on his initial deal and is unlikely to meet a trigger clause that would hand him two extra seasons.
Despite a raft of speculation about clubs including Collingwood registering its interest, he has no official offer."

IMO his manager is doing his job looking for the best deal given the italicized (i.e. Hogan worried about future contract and pay). Freo are "adamant" they haven't done anything (yet). And the rest of the media are going postal trying to fill pages and get clicks. As WTG said earlier, PerthNow weren't even game enough to put a name to their article today.

IMO, if Hogan leaves it will be because he pushed it for more money/job security, not the club seeking to improve culture or any such thing being suggested by others on this thread. Don't think the club was planning for this possibility at all.

I was talking about Treloar in that instance.

 

[arsesmart]

Is it more absurd than the current rules that tie a player to their club for 8 years before free agency?

Clubs aren't "tied" to the club. They can walk out on a contract or sign or not sign contracts of varying lengths etc freely (but not without consequence). It's just the passage to other clubs is limited by the ability to get a deal done. I think it's pretty evident the introduction of free agency has opened that up a lot more, even without players having triggered that length of time (eg. Caldwell etc etc).

 

[Johnny Dalmas]

Clubs aren't "tied" to the club. They can walk out on a contract or sign or not sign contracts of varying lengths etc freely (but not without consequence). It's just the passage to other clubs is limited by the ability to get a deal done. I think it's pretty evident the introduction of free agency has opened that up a lot more, even without players having triggered that length of time (eg. Caldwell etc etc).

Sure, once a player is uncontracted they can refuse to sign a new contract and end up in the pre-season draft.

 

[G Mus]

Hogan doesn't come across as a leader at all. As far as I remember, he has never been in the leadership group at an AFL club.

He is a talented forward, but no superstar. He has never made an AA team. His best accolade was Rising Star back in 2015. He hasn't even been the leading goal-kicker at an AFL club since 2016.

He’s very similar to Walters on the track

 

[Hazelsnuts]

All this posturing player manager and club football management.
His value is being established in the open market and that is what his value will be set at - risk/talent/potential/liability/track record.
I hope we are establishing a revised contract value set by the market, created by his performance and risk assessment.....
If we can renegotiate a contract due to market perception he stays and works through this and proves he is worth his ‘ so called Contract trigger value‘.
If not we ship him off and get what we can - if he is invested to stay the course at Freo, Hogan will take a cut and prove himself - otherwise - piss off.
FWIW I really hoped he was going to be the forward we always wanted and needed, maybe Fyfe can be that if he gets over his yips IF Hogan goes - otherwise it’s a road to travel to invest in a KPF in the draft and very hit and miss.